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The Eagle RDS

Anyone noticed weird happenings on The Eagle's RDS?? It was playing "Buffalo Springfield" For What It's Worth..aka: Stop Children about 15 minutes ago but 106.9 was showing something not related to the song in its RDS - in BOTH lines! - and 107.5's RDS is not showing anything at all! Next song seems to be display right in RDS on 106.9 but still nothing on the south signal.

Weird..

The weather has killed a lot of signals from Sr Rd to the east...which confirms what I thought earlier when some 'non user' posted about KROY not making it to Alvin.

Isn't RF fun?? not called Real Freaky for nothing...(ok, some of us call it something else..and of course we know what FM stands for........------- Magic!! :) )
 
Anyone noticed weird happenings on The Eagle's RDS?? It was playing "Buffalo Springfield" For What It's Worth..aka: Stop Children about 15 minutes ago but 106.9 was showing something not related to the song in its RDS - in BOTH lines! - and 107.5's RDS is not showing anything at all! Next song seems to be display right in RDS on 106.9 but still nothing on the south signal.

Weird..

The weather has killed a lot of signals from Sr Rd to the east...which confirms what I thought earlier when some 'non user' posted about KROY not making it to Alvin.

Isn't RF fun?? not called Real Freaky for nothing...(ok, some of us call it something else..and of course we know what FM stands for........------- Magic!! :) )

KGLK HD has been down for a week as well. Considering that KHPT HD was down for a couple of weeks two months ago - it doesn't take rocket science to figure out they are doing drive tests with and without HD. I wish them luck in whatever they are planning! My hope is full time oldies on one frequency or another - because without HD, both 106.9 and 107.5 have amazing coverage and building penetration. The two station cluster isn't needed without HD.
 
it doesn't take rocket science to figure out they are doing drive tests with and without HD.

In John Wayne's voice.................. "Hardly"...........

Noone is doing "drive tests". I could drop an email to the CE (who I know)...but it would be a wasted effort

geesh give the oldies a rest.............not.gonna.happen.
 
In John Wayne's voice.................. "Hardly"...........

Noone is doing "drive tests". I could drop an email to the CE (who I know)...but it would be a wasted effort

geesh give the oldies a rest.............not.gonna.happen.

Granted it is heresy to suggest that a station would seriously considering dropping the "wonderful" HD technology. But I am not the only one who noticed when KHPT dropped HD. They were being heard way up into East Texas according to one poster - even overpowering a much closer 106.9. Why the two frequencies? That happened AFTER the conversion of both to HD. I can attest to the time that 107.5 went back and forth a few times - without HD it made it to Centerville. With HD, it barely made it to Huntsville, and there were deep dropouts even in Conroe. Of course they needed 106.9. HD destroyed their range. No HD, they never would have needed 106.9. KHPT - with HD, struggled in ratings. How much of that was the format - and how much was the coverage? These coverage issues translate directly to building penetration. Even if nobody is doing drive tests, they are probably testing building penetration which will be MUCH better without HD.

I get slammed on here for saying this, because it goes against the religion of HD - that it is the future of radio and will save radio. I get accused of being against HD. That isn't true - I have three HD radios. But then I have three C-Quam radios that don't get any use any more. I expect my HD radio to join them in a few years - I am enjoying the oldies, smooth jazz, Christian rock, and other really creative formats because stations don't have anything to lose by broadcasting them. If HD ever does get consumer acceptance - all the creative niche formats will disappear, replaced by more of the same bland corporate cookie cutter stuff we get on the main channels. My car presets - ALL HD=2 and LPFM. I love HD formats so much I put up with all the technical problems like IF image blackout (there's one the HD cartel won't tell you about).

My love for the creative HD-2 formats doesn't mean the technology is good. I can point to several problems, range, coverage, and building penetration among them. I am an engineer and a scientist - I know how to take measurements and devise experiments. The range problem with HD is real, the results repeatable - and the loss is huge. The HD cartel would love to shut me up, so far their tactics are to marginalize, insult, and ignore me. But those techniques do not negate the science - HD severely affects range and therefore building penetration. If the eagle duo owners get wise to the fact - I lose the Point and the oldies, which sucks. But I would have to be honest and say that from a business perspective, HD is a bad fit for the Eagle because it dooms both frequencies to not adequately covering the metro area. Without HD, they could pick the best one, cover the entire metro area, and sell the other for a huge profit. The decision boils down to - program oldies and the Point for Bruce and few dozen to a few hundred listeners, or sell one of the frequencies for millions of dollars. They obviously don't care about either the Point or the oldies - leaving them off for weeks at a time. I appreciate them providing them for no return, but they are a business that needs to make money. If I were the owner, HD would be off and the weaker signal on the market the first day. I'd LOVE the profit from selling a station in the Houston market! But I'm not the owner. Owner of the Eagle - all you got to do is shut down HD, those pesky complaints for HD geeks that HD isn't working are gone - and your station peels paint compared to other stations.
 
Granted it is heresy to suggest that a station would seriously considering dropping the "wonderful" HD technology. But I am not the only one who noticed when KHPT dropped HD. They were being heard way up into East Texas according to one poster - even overpowering a much closer 106.9. Why the two frequencies? That happened AFTER the conversion of both to HD. I can attest to the time that 107.5 went back and forth a few times - without HD it made it to Centerville. With HD, it barely made it to Huntsville, and there were deep dropouts even in Conroe. Of course they needed 106.9. HD destroyed their range. No HD, they never would have needed 106.9. KHPT - with HD, struggled in ratings. How much of that was the format - and how much was the coverage? These coverage issues translate directly to building penetration. Even if nobody is doing drive tests, they are probably testing building penetration which will be MUCH better without HD.

I get slammed on here for saying this, because it goes against the religion of HD - that it is the future of radio and will save radio. I get accused of being against HD. That isn't true - I have three HD radios. But then I have three C-Quam radios that don't get any use any more. I expect my HD radio to join them in a few years - I am enjoying the oldies, smooth jazz, Christian rock, and other really creative formats because stations don't have anything to lose by broadcasting them. If HD ever does get consumer acceptance - all the creative niche formats will disappear, replaced by more of the same bland corporate cookie cutter stuff we get on the main channels. My car presets - ALL HD=2 and LPFM. I love HD formats so much I put up with all the technical problems like IF image blackout (there's one the HD cartel won't tell you about).

My love for the creative HD-2 formats doesn't mean the technology is good. I can point to several problems, range, coverage, and building penetration among them. I am an engineer and a scientist - I know how to take measurements and devise experiments. The range problem with HD is real, the results repeatable - and the loss is huge. The HD cartel would love to shut me up, so far their tactics are to marginalize, insult, and ignore me. But those techniques do not negate the science - HD severely affects range and therefore building penetration. If the eagle duo owners get wise to the fact - I lose the Point and the oldies, which sucks. But I would have to be honest and say that from a business perspective, HD is a bad fit for the Eagle because it dooms both frequencies to not adequately covering the metro area. Without HD, they could pick the best one, cover the entire metro area, and sell the other for a huge profit. The decision boils down to - program oldies and the Point for Bruce and few dozen to a few hundred listeners, or sell one of the frequencies for millions of dollars. They obviously don't care about either the Point or the oldies - leaving them off for weeks at a time. I appreciate them providing them for no return, but they are a business that needs to make money. If I were the owner, HD would be off and the weaker signal on the market the first day. I'd LOVE the profit from selling a station in the Houston market! But I'm not the owner. Owner of the Eagle - all you got to do is shut down HD, those pesky complaints for HD geeks that HD isn't working are gone - and your station peels paint compared to other stations.

Wow, it's rare that you get to read so much fantasy and misinformation in one post.

Pulling HD off one of the signals in the rimshot simulcast and selling the other one is your business plan? What an awesome idea! Tell us how well that works out for you during tropo season. I don't think any of the eastern rimshots are still running HD, and they've all been sucking wind for years. They're obliterated by tropo routinely, as are 106.9 and 107.5.

I also know the chief for both of these stations, and while I haven't asked, I can make a really good educated guess as to why they were off - equipment failure. The first generation HD gear was installed most places around 2006. The first generation exporters contain PC power supplies and hard drives. They break. I'm not sure which vendor's equipment Cox is using for these stations, but the popular choice for HD with most Houston stations was Broadcast Electronics. The power supplies in the first gen transmitters are dropping like flies.

There is zero correlation between turning off HD and ratings anywhere. The 10 highest grossing stations in the country are all running HD. The top rated station in the #1 market is running elevated HD power.
 
I think IBOC on both 98.5 and 107.9 are still on...(Have to check with Mike about that)...97.5 has no need for IBOC...93.3 iirc has never ran IBOC...100.7, Im not sure of but it being a talk format, I doubt Salem has had digital on....

106.9 and 107.5's signals to the east have NOT been affected by IBOC....so if "HD" was gonna kill the signal as rbruce claims, surely it would kill it to the east as well as other directions (Or does HD only kill RF to the north??? WOW, nice technical feat).

IBOC hurts adjacent channels..I WILL grant that...but then that's a digital noise on top of an analog signal....I see that also on TV when a LP analog is fighting an out of market DTV coming in....really interesting to watch....(especially when the analog is gone and then the digital FINALLY gets hot enough to be decoded...from noise to picture!! WOW!)....

And since when did FM radios start to get AGC?? I know AMs have it....but AGC is FM is not there..by its design, FM radios do not require it.....AMs need it to keep the recovered audio at the same relative level on weak and strong signals...FM does not...

SO tell me again how AGC figures into FM HD issues???? Kinda hard to have something that is not there figure into interference :rolleyes:

As for vendors, that varied (BE was NOT the primary provider in Houston...I know KHMX had BE going back to Nationwide but a lot of the other stations had others).....Nautel seems to the choice for most major operators now....(efficiency and built in IBOC in the transmitters and PRICE!!)...

BTW, KLOL just recently replaced BOTH its Continental 816R tube transmitters with two new Nautel solid state jobs....with room left over. The Nautels can do low level combining of analog and HD and with the PAs being linear instead of Class C like the CECs were, are more eff at digital than the old CEC rock boxes....which played who knows HOW much Rock and Roll through them in the Runaway radio days...
 
ALL of the first gen HD boxes at Senior Road were BE with the exception of KKBQ. They have a little Harris rig. I think KBXX does as well.

CBS actually has a Nautel running on all four FMs now as the main. On all stations except KLOL, the separate BE HD transmitter has been abandoned in favor of low level combining on the Nautel.
 
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??? Robbie posted pics on FB about the change out...and thought both CECs were gone.....

Nope. Just one of the two - the older one on the left. The '96 model on the right is still there.

Another CEC was removed from 95.7 though. And a BE FM30A from 96.5, and a Gates 20H3 from KILT-FM. That's where each of the Nautels went.
 
Wow, it's rare that you get to read so much fantasy and misinformation in one post.

Pulling HD off one of the signals in the rimshot simulcast and selling the other one is your business plan? What an awesome idea! Tell us how well that works out for you during tropo season. I don't think any of the eastern rimshots are still running HD, and they've all been sucking wind for years. They're obliterated by tropo routinely, as are 106.9 and 107.5.

I also know the chief for both of these stations, and while I haven't asked, I can make a really good educated guess as to why they were off - equipment failure. The first generation HD gear was installed most places around 2006. The first generation exporters contain PC power supplies and hard drives. They break. I'm not sure which vendor's equipment Cox is using for these stations, but the popular choice for HD with most Houston stations was Broadcast Electronics. The power supplies in the first gen transmitters are dropping like flies.

There is zero correlation between turning off HD and ratings anywhere. The 10 highest grossing stations in the country are all running HD. The top rated station in the #1 market is running elevated HD power.

Gee - the lack of respect for you fellow board member is kind of alarming. Merry Christmas to you, too!

Yes - I am saying that it would be good business decision to pull HD off FM. Ratings are dependent on the number of potential listeners. The more potential listeners, the higher the potential ratings. HD has failed - utterly - to penetrate the consumer market. It was a solution to a problem radio never had - an overreaction to satellite. The few dozen or few hundred HD listeners generate no ratings, therefore HD-2 cannot be sold to advertisers. It isn't reliable to those of us who do listen to it. I lose the darn HD-2 whenever the car next to me is tuned to a station 10.4 to 11 MHz under the HD station I am listening to - the old 10.6 and 10.8 MHz protections do not protect against HD jamming, whether or not the other driver has an HD radio. It took me a long time to figure out what was going on, but once I did it seems to be pretty constant.

Your 6 dB power increase made me laugh. Signal fluctuates over decades, not a paltry 6 dB. Given the lock time of HD on radios - at least five seconds - the dropouts are going to be the same. Stations are wasting electricity boosting power. But one way a station really CAN boost building penetration is to shut the blasted HD kludge down. KGLK made an excellent test case years ago when they flipped back and forth several times. HD on - dropped out at Huntsville. HD off - dropped out a Centerville. How many dB does THAT translate to?! A lot I would guess. And that translates to a lot of building penetration in the city. In some ways - this is reminiscent of the border blaster era. You sounded louder, you got better ratings. Any station dropping HD is going to penetrate buildings better. If your station is the only one making into that office building, everybody with a radio tunes to you and not your competition.

As for AGC - I am looking at a schematic of my tuner right now. It has AGC. It has to. The large variation in received signal strength makes it imperative. You couldn't design a signal chain without it - the dynamic range of received signals is simply too large. And yes - it does get fooled by HD sidebands. The 6 dB increase in sidebands is only going to decrease range and building penetration because it will further confuse AGC circuits in the vast majority of radios that are not HD.

But of course this is heresy to a brainwashed industry chanting the cult mantra "HD will save radio HD will save radio". No, it won't. Only good business practices and formats people want will do that.
 
Gee - the lack of respect for you fellow board member is kind of alarming. Merry Christmas to you, too!

Merry Christmas to you too! I hope what I'm about to say doesn't alarm you too much.

Yes - I am saying that it would be good business decision to pull HD off FM. Ratings are dependent on the number of potential listeners. The more potential listeners, the higher the potential ratings. HD has failed - utterly - to penetrate the consumer market. It was a solution to a problem radio never had - an overreaction to satellite. The few dozen or few hundred HD listeners generate no ratings, therefore HD-2 cannot be sold to advertisers. It isn't reliable to those of us who do listen to it. I lose the darn HD-2 whenever the car next to me is tuned to a station 10.4 to 11 MHz under the HD station I am listening to - the old 10.6 and 10.8 MHz protections do not protect against HD jamming, whether or not the other driver has an HD radio. It took me a long time to figure out what was going on, but once I did it seems to be pretty constant.

HD Radio has always had a receiver issue. That's slowly disappearing. Almost 9% of the cars on the road in Houston now are equipped with HD Radios. As more and more HD radios hit the road, the more popular HD subchannels will become. I know for a fact that some of the AM to HD2/HD3 simulcasts in Houston have significant listenership. You wouldn't know it from the ratings because those stations utilize total line reporting from Nielsen, so the HD listenership is included in the audience estimates for the parent station - in this case the AMs. But God help the engineers at 93.7 if their 740 simulcast goes off, or the engineers for 100.3 if the 610 simulcast goes off. Complaint calls galore.

Your 6 dB power increase made me laugh. Signal fluctuates over decades, not a paltry 6 dB. Given the lock time of HD on radios - at least five seconds - the dropouts are going to be the same. Stations are wasting electricity boosting power. But one way a station really CAN boost building penetration is to shut the blasted HD kludge down. KGLK made an excellent test case years ago when they flipped back and forth several times. HD on - dropped out at Huntsville. HD off - dropped out a Centerville. How many dB does THAT translate to?! A lot I would guess. And that translates to a lot of building penetration in the city. In some ways - this is reminiscent of the border blaster era. You sounded louder, you got better ratings. Any station dropping HD is going to penetrate buildings better. If your station is the only one making into that office building, everybody with a radio tunes to you and not your competition.

Do you even know what a 6 dB power increase is? It's a 4X increase in power. That's laughable?

You're also seemingly clueless about building penetration. Have you ever been deep in a commercial building, a large steel structure, and had the opportunity to turn HD on and off while actually listening to an analog radio? I have. Zero difference. What FM HD can do is deliver programming from sister AM stations inside that type of building where AM just doesn't work.

Wasting power? The current generation FM+HD transmitters are more efficient doing FM+HD at -14 dBc than the last generation solid state or tube boxes by far. A Nautel GV30-HD fed 208 WYE doing -14 dBc pulls around 105A at 23kW analog plus -14 dBc HD. The last generation solid state boxes pulled around 115A doing just analog. A Continental 816 tube transmitter pulls around 120A at that power level doing just analog.

As for AGC - I am looking at a schematic of my tuner right now. It has AGC. It has to. The large variation in received signal strength makes it imperative. You couldn't design a signal chain without it - the dynamic range of received signals is simply too large. And yes - it does get fooled by HD sidebands. The 6 dB increase in sidebands is only going to decrease range and building penetration because it will further confuse AGC circuits in the vast majority of radios that are not HD.

But of course this is heresy to a brainwashed industry chanting the cult mantra "HD will save radio HD will save radio". No, it won't. Only good business practices and formats people want will do that.

Any relatively modern tuner does just fine with HD. HD has been around in force in the major markets since the mid 2000s. Has there been a significant drop in radio usership since 2005? No, there hasn't. Despite the proliferation of gee whiz alternatives, radio is still used by around 90% of the U.S. population. If radio had anywhere near the problems with HD that you claim, do you really think that would be the case? No, it wouldn't.

http://www.nielsen.com/us/en/insights/reports/2014/state-of-the-media-audio-today-2014.html
 
Merry Christmas to you too! I hope what I'm about to say doesn't alarm you too much.



HD Radio has always had a receiver issue. That's slowly disappearing. Almost 9% of the cars on the road in Houston now are equipped with HD Radios. As more and more HD radios hit the road, the more popular HD subchannels will become. I know for a fact that some of the AM to HD2/HD3 simulcasts in Houston have significant listenership. You wouldn't know it from the ratings because those stations utilize total line reporting from Nielsen, so the HD listenership is included in the audience estimates for the parent station - in this case the AMs. But God help the engineers at 93.7 if their 740 simulcast goes off, or the engineers for 100.3 if the 610 simulcast goes off. Complaint calls galore.



Do you even know what a 6 dB power increase is? It's a 4X increase in power. That's laughable?

You're also seemingly clueless about building penetration. Have you ever been deep in a commercial building, a large steel structure, and had the opportunity to turn HD on and off while actually listening to an analog radio? I have. Zero difference. What FM HD can do is deliver programming from sister AM stations inside that type of building where AM just doesn't work.

Wasting power? The current generation FM+HD transmitters are more efficient doing FM+HD at -14 dBc than the last generation solid state or tube boxes by far. A Nautel GV30-HD fed 208 WYE doing -14 dBc pulls around 105A at 23kW analog plus -14 dBc HD. The last generation solid state boxes pulled around 115A doing just analog. A Continental 816 tube transmitter pulls around 120A at that power level doing just analog.



Any relatively modern tuner does just fine with HD. HD has been around in force in the major markets since the mid 2000s. Has there been a significant drop in radio usership since 2005? No, there hasn't. Despite the proliferation of gee whiz alternatives, radio is still used by around 90% of the U.S. population. If radio had anywhere near the problems with HD that you claim, do you really think that would be the case? No, it wouldn't.

http://www.nielsen.com/us/en/insights/reports/2014/state-of-the-media-audio-today-2014.html


I must say the tone of this posting is vastly improved. Thank you. And Happy New Year!

107.5 HD=2 was back the other day, by the way.

I really hope your glowing hopes for HD radio come true. Those hopes are tempered by some realities, though.

First off my hopes are completely selfish - that the formats I enjoy like Christian rock, eclectic, smooth jazz, dance, indie rock, the Point, and oldies stay on the air. It is an unpleasant reality that the moment HD-2 becomes commercially successful, the creative formats will all disappear, replaced by something mundane but popular.

Another unpleasant fact is that there is no analog fall-back plan for HD-2. It simply drops to silence until lock comes back. Several seconds of silence. If it is gone too long, the radio defaults back to the analog / HD-1 audio, which is, in most cases, not only different, but perhaps actually offensive.

As for the power increase, a power increase of 4 dB is a little more than double, not four times. But assuming I got the math wrong, I was talking about decades of signal fluctuation, that won't be helped by HD, given the lock times. Any of the streets under I-10 is a good example. HD drop, HD-2 silence. Every single time I have my wife, or any other individual in my car - they find the drop to silence annoying in the extreme and pretty much demand I change to something reliable. HD-2, 3 drop to silence is untenable. The system needed a backup plan. They didn't build it in. That unreliability will make the subchannels hard to monetize. Nobody wants to put up with the dropouts. NOBODY.

Just to get HD - I've bought the best HD radios on the market, the ones likely to hold a signal. KGLK, KHPT, KSBJ and several other require an outdoor antenna. Period. I live in West Houston, along Fry road. The Mo City signals decode HD without a problem, but something rim shot like KTHT? Fine in analog, it takes an antenna for HD. Outdoor FM antennas may have been fine in the audiophile era of the 60's and 70's, but with today's anal HOA's prohibiting antennas, and consumer apathy to hifi/ stereo setups - outdoor antennas won't happen. I didn't buy junk table radios - I have the Sangean HDT-1X and the little Sony wonder tuner - some of the best DX tuners made. They need outdoor antennas - period. That won't happen. So your building penetration HD-2's for saving AM - I don't see antennas popping up in subdivisions around here so people can listen to AM. No antennas at all. And I get my radio ten feet inside my building at work - forget AM and FM both. Not going to happen between the steel structure making a Faraday cage and bunch of computers and other equipment - anybody without a window office is hosed for radio reception. They stream or do without. HD-2 listening to AM? Don't make me laugh! Its not going to happen. I have a GE Superadio - and it doesn't work ten feet from the window. Up next to the window - its fine, even WBAP comes in like a local. Move it - lose everything including KTRH. FM - same thing. By the window, I get the extremely weak KSBJ translator. Move it ten feet away - every Missouri City stick is gone, and I'm along I-10 in Katy, pretty darn close. I expect my experience is typical. I'm a DX'er, I know how to do this stuff. The guy wanting sports from some AM on HD-2? No technical expertise at all - the first time they try it and it doesn't work, they are DONE with HD sideband reception forever.
 
As for the power increase, a power increase of 4 dB is a little more than double, not four times. But assuming I got the math wrong, I was talking about decades of signal fluctuation, that won't be helped by HD, given the lock times.

Yes, your math is wrong. The ERP or what comes out of the antenna for the Senior Road stations is 1kW for HD at -20 dBc. At -14 dBc, it's 4.777kW.

Any of the streets under I-10 is a good example. HD drop, HD-2 silence. Every single time I have my wife, or any other individual in my car - they find the drop to silence annoying in the extreme and pretty much demand I change to something reliable. HD-2, 3 drop to silence is untenable. The system needed a backup plan. They didn't build it in. That unreliability will make the subchannels hard to monetize. Nobody wants to put up with the dropouts. NOBODY.

Elevated HD power addresses that. In my experience, very well.

Just to get HD - I've bought the best HD radios on the market, the ones likely to hold a signal. KGLK, KHPT, KSBJ and several other require an outdoor antenna. Period. I live in West Houston, along Fry road.

You clearly don't have the best HD radios on the market then. I live a bit further west than you in the same general vicinity (Cinco Ranch.) I have the Sony XDR-F1HD in my home office. The antenna is an 8" whip. It picks up all the -20 dBc signals from Senior Road just fine. I have a "deaf as a brick" Boston Acoustics Recepter HD in the garage and it picks up all of the stations running elevated HD just fine using the wire antenna it came with. My garage is on the opposite side of the house from Senior Road. (There are three currently running elevated HD at -14 dBc from Senior Road BTW - six by the end of next year.) I was listening to one of them in HD in College Station last night.

The Mo City signals decode HD without a problem, but something rim shot like KTHT? Fine in analog, it takes an antenna for HD.

Rimshots are rimshots. The far out ones like KTHT are a hard luck case. They're barely passable in analog, but they are what they are. Someone thought they could make money with these former small town sticks by trying to get some kind of signal into the big town. If someone put a classic country format on one of the Senior Road stations, KTHT would be dead. Not really worth considering IMO.
 
I'm excited to test KKHH, KILT, and KHMX on my next road trip...

I think you'll be impressed. I know I was.

And to expand on something I said earlier - at -14 dBc, the Senior Road stations would actually have a digital ERP of 3.98kW operating in HD MP1 mode. In MP3 mode, their ERP increases to 4.777kW.
 
HD Radio has always had a receiver issue. That's slowly disappearing. Almost 9% of the cars on the road in Houston now are equipped with HD Radios. As more and more HD radios hit the road, the more popular HD subchannels will become.

The problem I see is that only about a third of radio listening takes place in the car. So 9% car penetration translates into only 3% of all listening opportunities market-wide. Subtract the people like myself who have learned how to turn off HD to avoid the irritating fallbacks and the people who don't understand HD so can't look for it, and the audience potential is very low still.

People are not buying stand-alone radio receivers any more. And there is a definite shortage of in-home HD radios that work well. And, due to battery life, there is little in the way of HD capable portables.

In any case, consumers believe that their smartphone is their radio, and use it accordingly. There are no HD equipped smartphones.
 
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