The Most Distant TV Station COL from the Station's DMA

[RadioDaze]

In the Norfolk-Portsmouth-Newport News, VA-NC DMA, WSKY-TV (virtual 4, RF 9) is licensed to Manteo on the market's extreme south end, roughly 100 statute miles from Williamsburg and 130 or so from southern Delmarva--the market's northern reaches, and a good 70 miles from the cities of the Penninsula (Newport News, Hampton, and Poquoson)--all of this in a market that also had an analog channel 3!

Next-door in the Greenville-Washington-New Bern, NC DMA, primary Fox affiliate, Morehead City-licensed WFXI-TV 8, is about as far east as they can get without being in the ocean to protect WRIC-TV in Petersburg. Morehead City is probably 75 miles from Greenville and Washington, and the WFXI tower is 30 miles east of Morehead City. In the analog days, New Bern was about as far into the market's core cities as they made it, and likely very snowy there. Satellite WYDO-TV 14 rebroadcasts FOX to the core of the market.


Glad someone brought up the example of WNCN-TV, even though the Raleigh-Goldsboro distance pales in comparison to the examples from out west. Though licensed to Goldsboro, the relationship between WNCN (which signed on as WYED in 1988), and its city of license has been on paper only--channel 17 has never had studios or an antenna in Goldsboro. Radio conglomerate Beasley built the station from studios on US 70 in Clayton (just outside Raleigh in Johnston County) with the original 1,550 tower a few miles south of the studios (word has it that tower is now in Reno, NV. You can still see where the tower stood--complete with the original antenna--laying on the ground on Google Earth right off the new US 70 Clayton By-Pass). The station boosted its power from 2.6 million watts to 5 million watts in 1995 at the original site after Outlet bought them, only to move to an arm of the 2,000-foot digital candleabra in Auburn, as you mentioned, five years later. Several other TV stations are licensed to outlying communities in our market such as ion affiliate WRPX-TV in Rocky Mount, TCT affiliate WRAY-TV in Wilson and Fayetteville's two stations, Univision affiliate WUVC-TV and another ion affiliate WFPX-TV (which has never been seen, analog or digital, in the Raleigh-Durham portion of the market..not even a faint hint of a signal in Durham).

The Raleigh-Durham-Fayetteville DMA NBC affiliate (and formerly NBC O&O), WNCN, is licensed to Goldsboro, North Carolina, which is 55 miles from Raleigh, 70 miles from Durham, and about 60 from Fayetteville. The original station owners, Outlet Broadcasting, targeted the DMA (moving its tower to Clayton, NC) as a NBC affiliate after the network got sick of WRDC and its consistently low ratings and lack of news product. NBC soon after purchased the station and moved its studios to Northeast Raleigh in 1995. In 2000, the tower moved to Auburn, North Carolina, allowing a city grade signal in both Raleigh and Goldsboro. A very odd situation for a spatially dispersed market.

 

[OhioMediaWatch]

You aren't gonna find many examples here, where we have a lot of markets close in.

WMFD/68 (RF 12) Mansfield is the farthest-out station in the Cleveland DMA, about 75-80 miles from downtown Cleveland, but it stays on the home field...and makes no attempt to serve anything but Mansfield/Ashland/North Central Ohio. It does appear on the DirecTV and Dish Cleveland locals package, presumably for the convenience of local satellite viewers. If it were a bit further south, it'd be in the Columbus market.

WGGN/52 (RF 42) Sandusky is in New London, OH, out about 60 miles from Cleveland. The religious station doesn't target Cleveland at all, just "anyone who is watching", though their 52.2 (a simulcast of radio sister WGGN-FM/97.7 Castalia OH) does carry a slideshow including traffic well into Cleveland. Sandusky is on the western edge of the Cleveland market, but the TX site is closer to the Cleveland market.

 

[dhett]

How about KUNP-TV CH. 16 LaGrande serving the Portland TV market. 261 miles/421km

By highway. 224 miles by air.

dhett, is there a website out there that calculates distance "as the crow flies" the same way, say, MapQuest calculates driving distance?

ixnay

I got the 224 mile figure from Travelmath - http://www.travelmath.com/flight-distance/from/La+Grande/to/Portland,+OR - but in my top 10 list, I used the NOAA calculator at http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/gccalc.shtml and plugged in the translator location coordinates vs. the reference coordinates for the DMA city from Wikipedia. The extra 16 miles is due to the transmitter being located east of LaGrande.

BTW, if you select "driving distance" from the Travelmath site, you also get 261 miles.

 

[tripinva]

Anyone know of any stations that managed to locate their transmitters in the DMA's tower farm but in return do not provide an over the air signal to their city of license?

WNPX is a great example of this.

And what about stations with a city of license in one DMA yet they ignore their home market and target a different DMA? (i.e. Valdosta, GA (Tallahassee, FL DMA) has a CBS affiliate that targets the neighboring Albany, GA DMA.)

KPBI Eureka Springs, though it's not a big surprise really.

KTAJ St. Joseph.

- Trip

 

[w9wi]

Anyone know of any stations that managed to locate their transmitters in the DMA's tower farm but in return do not provide an over the air signal to their city of license?

By official definition, a station provides an over-the-air signal to its city of license.

Whether any real people living in that city can actually receive the station is a different story.

And to that end, Trip cites an excellent example in WNPX. Transmitter in the Nashville tower farm; city of license is Cookeville, 75 miles away.

And what about stations with a city of license in one DMA yet they ignore their home market and target a different DMA? (i.e. Valdosta, GA (Tallahassee, FL DMA) has a CBS affiliate that targets the neighboring Albany, GA DMA.)

WWAZ Fond du Lac, Wis. (Green Bay market) has just received permission to move their channel allotment to a tower in Milwaukee. (which is of course in the Milwaukee market)

 

[Poledo]

Anyone know of any stations that managed to locate their transmitters in the DMA's tower farm but in return do not provide an over the air signal to their city of license?

WNPX is a great example of this.

I should have known the best example would be a Paxon station.

 

[Wright County Guy]

Anyone know of any stations that managed to locate their transmitters in the DMA's tower farm but in return do not provide an over the air signal to their city of license?

Well, if Paxson's KPXM moves from COL St. Cloud to the Minneapolis tower farm in Shoreview (they have a construction permit to do so), the OTA signal will be dicey in St. Cloud.

 

[dave73]

Anyone know of any stations that managed to locate their transmitters in the DMA's tower farm but in return do not provide an over the air signal to their city of license?

By official definition, a station provides an over-the-air signal to its city of license.

Whether any real people living in that city can actually receive the station is a different story.

And to that end, Trip cites an excellent example in WNPX. Transmitter in the Nashville tower farm; city of license is Cookeville, 75 miles away.

And what about stations with a city of license in one DMA yet they ignore their home market and target a different DMA? (i.e. Valdosta, GA (Tallahassee, FL DMA) has a CBS affiliate that targets the neighboring Albany, GA DMA.)

WWAZ Fond du Lac, Wis. (Green Bay market) has just received permission to move their channel allotment to a tower in Milwaukee. (which is of course in the Milwaukee market)

At least WWAZ will provide a signal over Fond Du Lac. That station on analog was covering portions of 3 market. If it ever does go back on the air, I don't know how the station will market themselves as a Milwaukee station with a COL in the Green Bay market. I will guarantee you that people with rabbit ears won't get this station at all. They will have to have an outdoor antenna, & might be possible to get it with a directional FM antenna.

I saw the coverage for WNPX, & I don't know how the FCC allowed a station to cover the immediate metro area, but not cover the COL.

 

[stationi]

When the transition to digital took place, Ion Media used it as an opportunity to move in several of their "rimshot" stations including the previously mentioned WNPX and KPXM. Another one that comes to mind is KPXG in Portland, OR which moved 45 miles or so from the city of license of Salem, OR.

 

[azumanga]

When the transition to digital took place, Ion Media used it as an opportunity to move in several of their "rimshot" stations including the previously mentioned WNPX and KPXM. Another one that comes to mind is KPXG in Portland, OR which moved 45 miles or so from the city of license of Salem, OR.

There's also WPXS in Mount Vernon, Illinois, which is on the northern edges of the Paducah market. Early on, as indie WCEE, it practically stuck to southern Illinois as their service area, but after Paxson bought the station, it became focused on St. Louis, via a translator there. After a stint as an RTV affiliate, it is now a Daystar station.

 

[JeeperOne]

[*]KMYU St. George UT (My Network TV), also in the Salt Lake City DMA, is located about 270 miles away by air. It serves as the My Network TV affiliate for the market and airs in SLC as a subchannel of co-owned KUTV.

Well, shoot. I thought I had a better example, but KMYU beats them by 11 miles.

(KBSL-TV Goodland, Kansas, in the Wichita market. Their tower is 259 miles from Wikipedia's coordinates for the city of Wichita. Of course, KBSL is not viewed in Wichita -- it's a satellite of much closer station KWCH-TV.)

I wasn't even counting satellites; otherwise, KUED SLC satellite KUEW St. George joins KMYU at the top of the list.

Using the criteria of distance of transmitter location from DMA city coordinates from Wikipedia, here are 10 furthest full-power stations:
1. KMYU and KUEW, both licensed to St. George UT, co-located stations 270 miles from Salt Lake City,
3. KUPT Hobbs NM, 260 miles from Albuquerque,
4. KBSL Goodland KS, 259 miles from Wichita,
5. KWKS Colby KS, 243 miles from Wichita,
6. KLBY Colby KS, 242 miles from Wichita,
7. KUNP and KTVR, both licensed to LaGrande OR, co-located stations 240 miles from Portland,
9. KTEL Carlsbad NM, 231 miles from Albuquerque,
10. KCSG Cedar City UT, 223 miles from Salt Lake City

Add indie KCDO 3 to that list. Its COL is Sterling (Which is at least 100 miles from Denver). We get it OTA via a translator in Ft. Morgan as well as via cable & satellite

Cheers & 73

 

[w9wi]

At least WWAZ will provide a signal over Fond Du Lac. That station on analog was covering portions of 3 market. If it ever does go back on the air, I don't know how the station will market themselves as a Milwaukee station with a COL in the Green Bay market. I will guarantee you that people with rabbit ears won't get this station at all. They will have to have an outdoor antenna, & might be possible to get it with a directional FM antenna.

I suppose you mean people with rabbit ears *in Green Bay*, although with the station on RF channel 5 I'd bet Milwaukee rabbit-ears viewers won't have much luck either!

If they get on Time-Warner Cable in Milwaukee (and of course, that's the point) they won't have any trouble marketing themselves as a Milwaukee station. "Fond du Lac" will be buried as deeply as possible. The few viewers who notice it in the ID will probably assume it means the station is located on Fond du Lac Avenue...

I saw the coverage for WNPX, & I don't know how the FCC allowed a station to cover the immediate metro area, but not cover the COL.

I've done the math, and WNPX *does* provide the required signal over Cookeville.

It's just that I don't think the required signal is actually enough to provide service.

 

[dave73]

At least WWAZ will provide a signal over Fond Du Lac. That station on analog was covering portions of 3 market. If it ever does go back on the air, I don't know how the station will market themselves as a Milwaukee station with a COL in the Green Bay market. I will guarantee you that people with rabbit ears won't get this station at all. They will have to have an outdoor antenna, & might be possible to get it with a directional FM antenna.

I suppose you mean people with rabbit ears *in Green Bay*, although with the station on RF channel 5 I'd bet Milwaukee rabbit-ears viewers won't have much luck either!

If they get on Time-Warner Cable in Milwaukee (and of course, that's the point) they won't have any trouble marketing themselves as a Milwaukee station. "Fond du Lac" will be buried as deeply as possible. The few viewers who notice it in the ID will probably assume it means the station is located on Fond du Lac Avenue...

I saw the coverage for WNPX, & I don't know how the FCC allowed a station to cover the immediate metro area, but not cover the COL.

I've done the math, and WNPX *does* provide the required signal over Cookeville.

It's just that I don't think the required signal is actually enough to provide service.

When I talked about anyone wouldn't be able to receive WWAZ with rabbit ears, I mean that no one would get them at all with rabbit ears, with the station being on RF 5. Green Bay residents most likely never got them when they were on UHF and transmitting from the Mayville area. It would be amazing if someone could get WWAZ on RF 5 in Green Bay, if the station ever gets back on the air from Milwaukee. TV Fool shows stray coverage over Green Bay. As for marketing as a Milwaukee area station, I believe that will be the station's intent. If one of the Green Bay stations were willing to have their COL changed to Fond Du Lac, then WWAZ could easily get their COL changed to either Milwaukee, or one of the Milwaukee suburbs. They might not have a problem getting Time Warner getting the station on cable, but DirecTV & Dish Network however will not be allowed to add WWAZ to the Milwaukee lineup as long as it's licensed to the Green Bay market, due to DBS systems being required to go by DMA's, while cable usually can go by what gets picked up OTA. WWAZ will have to get something worked out with the FCC to address this issue, even if they'll let the station change the COL to the Milwaukee market, & leave Fond Du Lac without a TV station (not likely)

 

[w9wi]

If one of the Green Bay stations were willing to have their COL changed to Fond Du Lac, then WWAZ could easily get their COL changed to either Milwaukee, or one of the Milwaukee suburbs. They might not have a problem getting Time Warner getting the station on cable, but DirecTV & Dish Network however will not be allowed to add WWAZ to the Milwaukee lineup as long as it's licensed to the Green Bay market, due to DBS systems being required to go by DMA's, while cable usually can go by what gets picked up OTA. WWAZ will have to get something worked out with the FCC to address this issue, even if they'll let the station change the COL to the Milwaukee market, & leave Fond Du Lac without a TV station (not likely)[/color]

I don't think WWAZ has enough $$ to get a Green Bay station to agree to change its COL. (there are no 3rd-tier stations licensed to Green Bay, they'd have to move an ABC/CBS/Fox/NBC affiliate or WPNE)

Agreed, the FCC is unlikely to allow WWAZ to change its COL from Fond du Lac. However, it has been known to modify market boundary definitions for the purpose of must-carry. I can see them modifying the Milwaukee market to include WWAZ, which would make a COL change unnecessary.

 

[Carmine5]

Some people still scratch their heads at how Jeff Chang's station, KQSL-TV, with a COL of Fort Bragg, CA can claim San Francisco as its market. Those two cities are over a 172 miles apart and KQSL doesn't show up on any of the Bay Area MVPD's (not cable, not satellite) nor does its signal reach anywhere near San Francisco.

http://www.tvnewscheck.com/article/...oltv-lands-san-francisco-affiliate?ref=search

 

[dhett]

Add indie KCDO 3 to that list. Its COL is Sterling (Which is at least 100 miles from Denver). We get it OTA via a translator in Ft. Morgan as well as via cable & satellite

There are at least another half dozen stations I left off the list that were 200+ miles from the key DMA city - I was only giving the top 10.

As for KCDO, its transmitter is located south of Ft. Morgan, so you're not getting a translator; you're getting the main signal. I was able to receive and decode KCDO from within DIA terminal B last month.