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Poor audio and reception, FREE with every HD Radio!
According to the full NYT revue, you should consider yourself lucky if get half the HD stations in your market even with the external antennas.
Poor, fuzzy audio that is not noticeably better then analog, bad, intermittent, spotty reception, necessary large cumbersome antennas, almost no signal coverage more then a few miles from the station, difficult tuning, awkward to use, cluttered interface, and that is just for starters.
I thought these problems were the ones normal FM analog was supposed to have, and that HD Radio claimed to solve.
Why would anyone be foolish enough to spend hundreds of dollars to buy an HD Radio that does not perform as well as the analog radios they already own?
Just for the record, iBiquity HD radio has not gotten final FCC approval, and is not the only digital FM broadcasting system available. There is FMeXtra that is already pre-approved and all the station need do is to install it with their existing transmitting equipment (typically 20 minutes to an hour), plug it in, and send a notification to the FCC you are using FMeXtra. No FCC approvals, finiky adjustments, or expensive new transmitters and antennas necessary.
Here is the link for digital FMeXtra: www.dreinc.com
Here is the link to the New York Times article:
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/06/technology/circuits/06radi.html?_r=1&ref=circuits&oref=slogin
According to the full NYT revue, you should consider yourself lucky if get half the HD stations in your market even with the external antennas.
Poor, fuzzy audio that is not noticeably better then analog, bad, intermittent, spotty reception, necessary large cumbersome antennas, almost no signal coverage more then a few miles from the station, difficult tuning, awkward to use, cluttered interface, and that is just for starters.
I thought these problems were the ones normal FM analog was supposed to have, and that HD Radio claimed to solve.
Why would anyone be foolish enough to spend hundreds of dollars to buy an HD Radio that does not perform as well as the analog radios they already own?
Just for the record, iBiquity HD radio has not gotten final FCC approval, and is not the only digital FM broadcasting system available. There is FMeXtra that is already pre-approved and all the station need do is to install it with their existing transmitting equipment (typically 20 minutes to an hour), plug it in, and send a notification to the FCC you are using FMeXtra. No FCC approvals, finiky adjustments, or expensive new transmitters and antennas necessary.
Here is the link for digital FMeXtra: www.dreinc.com
Here is the link to the New York Times article:
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/06/technology/circuits/06radi.html?_r=1&ref=circuits&oref=slogin
Again I can only wonder... Did you actually read the article???
About the radios themselves...
Sounds like a failure to me...
But how about the radios. Let's just do the first sentence of each...
Well that sucks...
Just screams bad product to me.
A little more than a sentence to get a feel on that one. And they didin't like the sensitivity. Fair Enough.
They don't care for this one. It's a prototype.
And last...
And...
Overall a fair assesment. Unlike the recap from Crosley man and Soup.
On a side note. Hey Soup you're slipping. You forgot "Fraud" in you last post.
Clouseau.
Not really an HD supporter. Especially AM.
About the radios themselves...
Sounds like a failure to me...
But how about the radios. Let's just do the first sentence of each...
Well that sucks...
Just screams bad product to me.
A little more than a sentence to get a feel on that one. And they didin't like the sensitivity. Fair Enough.
They don't care for this one. It's a prototype.
And last...
And...
Overall a fair assesment. Unlike the recap from Crosley man and Soup.
On a side note. Hey Soup you're slipping. You forgot "Fraud" in you last post.
Clouseau.
Not really an HD supporter. Especially AM.
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700WLW
Guest
"Again I can only wonder... Did you actually read the article???"
Again ? Well, I don't have to wonder, looks like we have a new antagonizer in the group. If I see something related to IBOC, I post both sides. Take a look at the "HD Radio Receiver Sensitivity" thread and see all the problems people are having with multiple HD radios. The news in the article was certainly mixed, and I tend not to believe articles, such as this, because you never know their agenda. It really doesn't matter what the article says anyway, because HD Radios require loop antennas and mounting dipole antennas (preferably high-up and outside), which very few consumers are going to be willing to do.
Again ? Well, I don't have to wonder, looks like we have a new antagonizer in the group. If I see something related to IBOC, I post both sides. Take a look at the "HD Radio Receiver Sensitivity" thread and see all the problems people are having with multiple HD radios. The news in the article was certainly mixed, and I tend not to believe articles, such as this, because you never know their agenda. It really doesn't matter what the article says anyway, because HD Radios require loop antennas and mounting dipole antennas (preferably high-up and outside), which very few consumers are going to be willing to do.
Inspector clouseau:
Don't fall into the trap that IBOCRocks did. Don't talk to this guy.
If you do, you will only spur him on and he will consider you to be a worthy "adversary" and simply post more of the same stuff over and over and over again, ad nauseum, until you and the rest of us can't take it anymore. He doesn't respect you and he doesn't respect this message board.
Trust me. This message board has been down this road already. I'm sure there are a number of others from both sides of the issue who will chime in here and agree with me.
Don't fall into the trap that IBOCRocks did. Don't talk to this guy.
If you do, you will only spur him on and he will consider you to be a worthy "adversary" and simply post more of the same stuff over and over and over again, ad nauseum, until you and the rest of us can't take it anymore. He doesn't respect you and he doesn't respect this message board.
Trust me. This message board has been down this road already. I'm sure there are a number of others from both sides of the issue who will chime in here and agree with me.
The test was done in Seattle. You have your HD Radio blinders on, supplied free, along with the necessary external antennas and iBuzz interference at no extra charge.TheRover said:
The author was able to actually recieve only a few of the HD stations reliably.
The article was obviously intended to be an HD Radio promotional fluff piece, but actual tested results fell far short of HD Radio's wild claims.clouseau said:
Why are you defending a defective, destructive HD Radio system you claim not to support?
Soup said...
After alledgedly reading the article that said...
Got it. Say Soup. What is the specific "Wild Claim" that HD radio does not live up to? How about it Big Boy. A specific quote from a manufacturer or developer that is a WILD CLAIM. Let's see it in a quote from Ibiquity or a manufacturer. You say it doesn't live up to the "WILD CLAIMS"? Well here's you chance to show that claim to us now...
Class, pay attention. SUPERCASTER is now going to show us what he knows about HD Radio.
Clouseau
After alledgedly reading the article that said...
Got it. Say Soup. What is the specific "Wild Claim" that HD radio does not live up to? How about it Big Boy. A specific quote from a manufacturer or developer that is a WILD CLAIM. Let's see it in a quote from Ibiquity or a manufacturer. You say it doesn't live up to the "WILD CLAIMS"? Well here's you chance to show that claim to us now...
Class, pay attention. SUPERCASTER is now going to show us what he knows about HD Radio.
Clouseau
To prove his infallible knowledge of HD Radio, clouseau said:
Quote
Remember HD radios first became available in 2006. Yep that's THIS year.
Where have you been the last several years?
Quote
LAS VEGAS, Jan. 7 /PRNewswire/ -- International Consumer Electronics Show -- iBiquity Digital Corporation announced today that an Iowa buyer became "first in the nation" to purchase an HD Radio tuner. Nathan Franzen purchased a Kenwood KTC-HR100 HD Radio tuner from the Ultimate Electronics store in Cedar Rapids, Iowa on Monday, January 5, 2004.
Quote
The sale comes on the eve of HD Radio's commercial introduction during this week's 2004 International Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas and follows a decade of development and testing by iBiquity and its numerous industry partners with the FCC approving the technology for broadcaster use in October 2002.
On January 5, 2007, less then one month from now, that will make 3 years since the first HD Radio was sold, and almost 5 years since iBiquity/HD Radio broadcasting began.
Here is the link:
http://history.sandiego.edu/gen/recording/ibiquity.html
clouseau also said:
That was one of their earliest "wild claims".
Others are:
FM stations now with CD-quality sound
AM stations now with FM-quality sound
Crystal-clear reception with no audio distortion
New artists and new personalities
New genres, new music from abroad
New kinds of programs you’ve never listened to before
New experimental formats that no one has ever heard
New channels to play more of what you like to hear
More talk and music from the stations you’re plugged into
More complete sets and more full albums
More in-depth interviews
More lengthy talk and more detailed news
All digital, all the time
No hiss, distortion or station drop off
Get hundreds of new "stations between the stations".
This is all nonsense. Most HD stations rebroadcast their analog, main channel programming. Only a few have the usually lower quality HD2 and HD3, streams available.
Quote
Remember HD radios first became available in 2006. Yep that's THIS year.
Where have you been the last several years?
Quote
LAS VEGAS, Jan. 7 /PRNewswire/ -- International Consumer Electronics Show -- iBiquity Digital Corporation announced today that an Iowa buyer became "first in the nation" to purchase an HD Radio tuner. Nathan Franzen purchased a Kenwood KTC-HR100 HD Radio tuner from the Ultimate Electronics store in Cedar Rapids, Iowa on Monday, January 5, 2004.
Quote
The sale comes on the eve of HD Radio's commercial introduction during this week's 2004 International Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas and follows a decade of development and testing by iBiquity and its numerous industry partners with the FCC approving the technology for broadcaster use in October 2002.
On January 5, 2007, less then one month from now, that will make 3 years since the first HD Radio was sold, and almost 5 years since iBiquity/HD Radio broadcasting began.
Here is the link:
http://history.sandiego.edu/gen/recording/ibiquity.html
clouseau also said:
In Band On Channel-The iBiquity HD system is neither.
That was one of their earliest "wild claims".
Others are:
FM stations now with CD-quality sound
AM stations now with FM-quality sound
Crystal-clear reception with no audio distortion
New artists and new personalities
New genres, new music from abroad
New kinds of programs you’ve never listened to before
New experimental formats that no one has ever heard
New channels to play more of what you like to hear
More talk and music from the stations you’re plugged into
More complete sets and more full albums
More in-depth interviews
More lengthy talk and more detailed news
All digital, all the time
No hiss, distortion or station drop off
Get hundreds of new "stations between the stations".
This is all nonsense. Most HD stations rebroadcast their analog, main channel programming. Only a few have the usually lower quality HD2 and HD3, streams available.
Before we start, let me give you a "Hats Off" for answering the challenge. Lets see how you did...
OK Fair enough. Good documentataion. Accurate quote and linked. Not like you or I could buy one of these HD Receiver babies at the corner store in '04, but you are correct in quoting the release.
Although "I" (In market 150 which only has exactly "1" HD station in Dec, 2006) only had an HD radio available to me locally in the last year, You could make the case that HD is "Almost" 3 years old. However...
XM is over 5 years old And that is a "National rollout". I gave you that HD was nationally "Rolled Out" this year. We're still a little short of reality on this one. I have 20 + fm's in my marlet. And one HD. Many are in the pipe. But in the pipe isn't rolled out.
OK, I have to give this to you. And frankly on a technicality, you answered the question correctly and pass the over all test. Nice work. As I pointed out in another thread it truly IS IBAC. However on a more practical front, it "IS" Ib"O"c. As a consumer, if you want to hear the hd2 channel of 95.5, you would tune your HD radio to 95.5 . (Not to mention if you were in New York and wanted to listen to Z-100 HD2, you would tune to 100.3, which is outside of the 100.2 channel. ) [Z100 New York is "Actually" 100.3 Fm]. It's not "out of band" and it's not "Off Channel", but I'll accept your point. But it's a damn sight closer to "On Channel" than WLS -AM & FM Chicago... (I miss that, but flashing back to the present...)
Before we atart, I'd like to point out that exactly NONE of these assertions you make below come with documentation or attribution from a manufacturer or Ibiquity. (Which means beside the technicality, they dont pass the "BS detector")
The claim is "Near CD quality sound" and most of the articles you reference agree with this claim... Face it. FM HD ain't all that bad. (In Fact it IS near CD Quality sound.)
I don't have one by me, but the reviews I see and the audio files I hear show AM quality is vastly improved. Does the Computer audio file lie? I don't know. DO YOU? AM sounds like FM on HD to me based on the demos..
SOURCE??? No one ever claimed No distortion. (Cuz that ain't possible.) But FM HD sounds closer than anything else out there.
Source??? That said, I've never heard what's on my HD-2 station here (I Only got one so far) before it was on here.
Who promised "THIS" to you. I'm not saying you might not have it. I'll bet SOME hd listeners do. But where's the quote. Come on Big Boy. Don't spew BS or make stuff up. where's the info??? Manufacturer or Ibiquity, remember??? What's it that Shatner says??? "Show Me The Money!!!"
Source??? There probably will be, but...I got exactly "ONE" HD channel. And NO ONE in my town ever heard "Relevant Radio" before HD... NOE???. (Where's the quote???)
Who claimed this? Source please... (And if something has never been on before, wouldn't it be "Experimental"?) You got no source, and it's irrelevant anyway.
Again, Source??? And "Relevant radio" might be a programming source "Someone" may want to hear.
Again no source of where this came from. But all "Relevant radio" does us yak my ear off. It's not like they don't have more talk...
For he love of a divine being...Where is the reference. Did you grab a Dewar's on the rocks and make this stuff up?? What manufacturer said this? Or was it Ibiquity? Or was it that extra gulp of Bong Water? This is supposed to be an intelligent discussion. What's going on here??? Are you "Britney is Impregnated by aliens guy???" Where's the quote???
Where's the quote. And "Relevant Radio" makes me want to smash my radio with their interviews.
Source??? And I swear to freaking GOD if they give me anymore lengthy talk I'll jump out of my 6th floor office window. I hate this HD-2 station. (But I like more choice...)
(The Obligatory) Source??? That aside, when does your local HD-2 channel go analog???
Source??? That aside Hiss? In HD I got ZERO hiss. you too. Face it, in HD there is no hiss. Distortion? I would propose that everyone likes their own form of distortion.
I like tubes instead of transisitors. (I hear the difference),
I like Analog instead of digital. (I can hear the difference... because sometimes digital is better reproduction than analog.) but I "Like" analog better. Sorry, just an opinion.. Give me some slack, it's taste.
Source??? Your assertion is BS... But unlike the others, I would suspect this is true. Yo Math Guy.... If 20% of the HD stations had an HD-2 (Which I'd bet is true conservatively)and there are over 1000 stations in HD (Per Ibiquity) then accordingly there are over 200 HD-2 Channels. PUT DOWN THE CRACK PIPE AND STEP AWAY FROM THE KEYBOARD!!! It's OK. We're all here to help you recover from your case of "IlCreateBStoTrashHDradioAphobia". Drop Off? OK I admit it. I have never driven out of range of my local station. Their good from, Texas to Vermont, Right?
Close, Einstein... Actually "ALL" HD stations rebroadcast their analog, main channel programming However as they say in "Animal House" ... Don't stop him, he's on a roll...
If it's as low as 10% than according to you that makes it over a hundred total stations ... and that makes you..... Confused...
Clouseau
[/quote]
OK Fair enough. Good documentataion. Accurate quote and linked. Not like you or I could buy one of these HD Receiver babies at the corner store in '04, but you are correct in quoting the release.
Although "I" (In market 150 which only has exactly "1" HD station in Dec, 2006) only had an HD radio available to me locally in the last year, You could make the case that HD is "Almost" 3 years old. However...
XM is over 5 years old And that is a "National rollout". I gave you that HD was nationally "Rolled Out" this year. We're still a little short of reality on this one. I have 20 + fm's in my marlet. And one HD. Many are in the pipe. But in the pipe isn't rolled out.
OK, I have to give this to you. And frankly on a technicality, you answered the question correctly and pass the over all test. Nice work. As I pointed out in another thread it truly IS IBAC. However on a more practical front, it "IS" Ib"O"c. As a consumer, if you want to hear the hd2 channel of 95.5, you would tune your HD radio to 95.5 . (Not to mention if you were in New York and wanted to listen to Z-100 HD2, you would tune to 100.3, which is outside of the 100.2 channel. ) [Z100 New York is "Actually" 100.3 Fm]. It's not "out of band" and it's not "Off Channel", but I'll accept your point. But it's a damn sight closer to "On Channel" than WLS -AM & FM Chicago... (I miss that, but flashing back to the present...)
Before we atart, I'd like to point out that exactly NONE of these assertions you make below come with documentation or attribution from a manufacturer or Ibiquity. (Which means beside the technicality, they dont pass the "BS detector")
The claim is "Near CD quality sound" and most of the articles you reference agree with this claim... Face it. FM HD ain't all that bad. (In Fact it IS near CD Quality sound.)
I don't have one by me, but the reviews I see and the audio files I hear show AM quality is vastly improved. Does the Computer audio file lie? I don't know. DO YOU? AM sounds like FM on HD to me based on the demos..
SOURCE??? No one ever claimed No distortion. (Cuz that ain't possible.) But FM HD sounds closer than anything else out there.
Source??? That said, I've never heard what's on my HD-2 station here (I Only got one so far) before it was on here.
Who promised "THIS" to you. I'm not saying you might not have it. I'll bet SOME hd listeners do. But where's the quote. Come on Big Boy. Don't spew BS or make stuff up. where's the info??? Manufacturer or Ibiquity, remember??? What's it that Shatner says??? "Show Me The Money!!!"
Source??? There probably will be, but...I got exactly "ONE" HD channel. And NO ONE in my town ever heard "Relevant Radio" before HD... NOE???. (Where's the quote???)
Who claimed this? Source please... (And if something has never been on before, wouldn't it be "Experimental"?) You got no source, and it's irrelevant anyway.
Again, Source??? And "Relevant radio" might be a programming source "Someone" may want to hear.
Again no source of where this came from. But all "Relevant radio" does us yak my ear off. It's not like they don't have more talk...
For he love of a divine being...Where is the reference. Did you grab a Dewar's on the rocks and make this stuff up?? What manufacturer said this? Or was it Ibiquity? Or was it that extra gulp of Bong Water? This is supposed to be an intelligent discussion. What's going on here??? Are you "Britney is Impregnated by aliens guy???" Where's the quote???
Where's the quote. And "Relevant Radio" makes me want to smash my radio with their interviews.
Source??? And I swear to freaking GOD if they give me anymore lengthy talk I'll jump out of my 6th floor office window. I hate this HD-2 station. (But I like more choice...)
(The Obligatory) Source??? That aside, when does your local HD-2 channel go analog???
Source??? That aside Hiss? In HD I got ZERO hiss. you too. Face it, in HD there is no hiss. Distortion? I would propose that everyone likes their own form of distortion.
I like tubes instead of transisitors. (I hear the difference),
I like Analog instead of digital. (I can hear the difference... because sometimes digital is better reproduction than analog.) but I "Like" analog better. Sorry, just an opinion.. Give me some slack, it's taste.
Source??? Your assertion is BS... But unlike the others, I would suspect this is true. Yo Math Guy.... If 20% of the HD stations had an HD-2 (Which I'd bet is true conservatively)and there are over 1000 stations in HD (Per Ibiquity) then accordingly there are over 200 HD-2 Channels. PUT DOWN THE CRACK PIPE AND STEP AWAY FROM THE KEYBOARD!!! It's OK. We're all here to help you recover from your case of "IlCreateBStoTrashHDradioAphobia". Drop Off? OK I admit it. I have never driven out of range of my local station. Their good from, Texas to Vermont, Right?
Close, Einstein... Actually "ALL" HD stations rebroadcast their analog, main channel programming However as they say in "Animal House" ... Don't stop him, he's on a roll...
If it's as low as 10% than according to you that makes it over a hundred total stations ... and that makes you..... Confused...
Clouseau
[/quote]
Yes, the direct source for all but one of the "wild claims" is the iBiquity website! You didn't know?
I'm so glad you agree the "wild claims" are nothing but BS, after all, they are fresh from the HD bull, himself.
http://www.hdradio.com/what_is_hd_digital_radio.php
The last "wild claim" is from the HD Radio Alliance (often referred to as the "cartel") HD radio promotional spot campaign.
Regarding the hiss that you claim HD radio does not have, everyone can hear it on their radios. So you loose there too.
[EDIT]
If I buy a radio that claims I will get 14,000 stations, and I get it home and can only get a few, is it false advertising?
You bet it is.
[EDIT]
[EDIT---personal attacks.]
I'm so glad you agree the "wild claims" are nothing but BS, after all, they are fresh from the HD bull, himself.
http://www.hdradio.com/what_is_hd_digital_radio.php
The last "wild claim" is from the HD Radio Alliance (often referred to as the "cartel") HD radio promotional spot campaign.
Regarding the hiss that you claim HD radio does not have, everyone can hear it on their radios. So you loose there too.
[EDIT]
If I buy a radio that claims I will get 14,000 stations, and I get it home and can only get a few, is it false advertising?
You bet it is.
[EDIT]
[EDIT---personal attacks.]
Okay, I live in New York and have an HD unit...Let's break down the list:
On my Accurian, the FM does start out analog then you wait a few seconds for the HD to kick in. I don't see much of a difference on the standard side but on the HD-2 end, you hear it. AM does improve dramatically on the two stations that have HD.
It depends. Sometimes a station I had on HD2 disappears and that may be reception based. I don't hear the audio distortion
New artists, perhaps. New personalities? NO. HD-2 sounds like an iPod with sweepers.
Then WHERE THE HELL IS CURRENT DANCE MUSIC for a city like New York!?!?!?
Oh yeah, I sure enjoy hearing 1010WINS (AM - News) on my HD2.
Uhhh.....where??? They certainly are NOT experimenting in New York!
To lump this entire part....ah..new channels playing more of the SAME
No talk yet and still the same music
Full albums?? Where?
I heard an in depth interview on the Z-100 (WHTZ) HD2 feed but not much else.
News? Sure, when you can take an AM station and put it in HD2! LOL
About the only thing accurate.
Basically, HD still has to make some improvements but if this is going to exist for terrestrial as their answer to satellite, they have to come up with more innovative programming and fill format holes immediately. Or else this will be a bust.
On my Accurian, the FM does start out analog then you wait a few seconds for the HD to kick in. I don't see much of a difference on the standard side but on the HD-2 end, you hear it. AM does improve dramatically on the two stations that have HD.
It depends. Sometimes a station I had on HD2 disappears and that may be reception based. I don't hear the audio distortion
New artists, perhaps. New personalities? NO. HD-2 sounds like an iPod with sweepers.
Then WHERE THE HELL IS CURRENT DANCE MUSIC for a city like New York!?!?!?
Oh yeah, I sure enjoy hearing 1010WINS (AM - News) on my HD2.
Uhhh.....where??? They certainly are NOT experimenting in New York!
To lump this entire part....ah..new channels playing more of the SAME
No talk yet and still the same music
Full albums?? Where?
I heard an in depth interview on the Z-100 (WHTZ) HD2 feed but not much else.
News? Sure, when you can take an AM station and put it in HD2! LOL
About the only thing accurate.
Basically, HD still has to make some improvements but if this is going to exist for terrestrial as their answer to satellite, they have to come up with more innovative programming and fill format holes immediately. Or else this will be a bust.
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