The sticks

[lasunsfan]

I was on radio locator earlier today just to compare the power of some of our sticks. I looked at KKFR, KEXX( or KEDJ), KVIB, KMVA, KNRJ, and KAJM. There sticks range anywhere from 27,000 watts to 50,000 watts. Looking at their coverage area, I was impressed at first because of the location of their sticks, until i looked up KPWR. Their stick is at 25,000 watts and have a better coverage then the other ones mentioned. This is upsetting because you have 2 great stations in the making (KMVA and KAJM) and two historic stations (KKFR and KEXX). Why can't there stations realize that their wattage isn't the problem, it's there location of their sticks. Even he they just put it on thunderbird park, that would be great.

 

[w9wi]

I was on radio locator earlier today just to compare the power of some of our sticks. I looked at KKFR, KEXX( or KEDJ), KVIB, KMVA, KNRJ, and KAJM. There sticks range anywhere from 27,000 watts to 50,000 watts. Looking at their coverage area, I was impressed at first because of the location of their sticks, until i looked up KPWR. Their stick is at 25,000 watts and have a better coverage then the other ones mentioned. This is upsetting because you have 2 great stations in the making (KMVA and KAJM) and two historic stations (KKFR and KEXX). Why can't there stations realize that their wattage isn't the problem, it's there location of their sticks. Even he they just put it on thunderbird park, that would be great.

Assuming that by KPWR you mean the station in Los Angeles... Note that their antenna is roughly 75m (about 250') higher than most of the Phoenix stations you mention.

Among the Phoenix stations in question, I think you can reasonably assume that if they could have a better tower location, they would. All of these stations are second-adjacent to stations on South Mountain. (except KEXX*) This limits how close they can be to Phoenix itself. My understanding is that most mountaintop sites in Arizona are under Forest Service control, and many may not be available for tower siting. FAA requirements -- and lack of electrical power! -- limit the usefulness of other sites.

Raw coverage area may not be the best deal either, if it leaves the station weaker in the core urban area. (and that's where these stations suffer. They may have a protected-contour signal over a wider area, but due to their distance from the city they're weaker in Phoenix itself. I'll bet they'd be happy with 5,000 watts if they could do it from South Mountain -- but again, the FCC won't let them, they'd interfere with 97.9/95.5/101.5/104.7/etc...) We've seen a number of cases lately where stations have voluntarily *downgraded* in order to move to a tower site closer to the population center of their market.

* being outside the area I have to beg ignorance regarding the KLNZ 103.5 site. I would imagine that site limits KEXX's ability to move into Phoenix)

 

[davideduardo]

]

Assuming that by KPWR you mean the station in Los Angeles... Note that their antenna is roughly 75m (about 250') higher than most of the Phoenix stations you mention.

KPWR's site, Mt. Wilson, is about 5000 feet above the LA basin, and is thus about three times the height above the market as the South Mountain stations.

 

[KeithE4]

* being outside the area I have to beg ignorance regarding the KLNZ 103.5 site. I would imagine that site limits KEXX's ability to move into Phoenix)

KLNX 103.5 is on White Tank Mountain, about 30 miles west of downtown Phoenix. Being licensed to Glendale, it may be possible for it to move to South Mountain if there was room (from what I've heard, there isn't right now).

KEXX 103.9 is licensed to Gilbert, but transmits from the Pinal County section of Queen Creek, about 35 miles SE of downtown Phoenix. There is enough distance between them that there is no interference between 103.5 and 103.9, although there might be if KLNZ were ever to relocate to South Mountain.

 

[lasunsfan]

Point well taken, what i'm saying is thunderbird park in north glendale would be ideal for stations that have more static then listeners. As far as KEXX, why can't they use their old sticks on camelback?

 

[oldiesfan6479]

As far as KEXX, why can't they use their old sticks on camelback?

When did 103.9 have a stick on Camelback Road? They were originally a
a Coolidge COL that "moved in" to Gilbert.

I think the only Camelback sticks now are at 7401 West (KPXQ 1360, the
old "136/KRUX" site). Long-gone and replaced by "the car...on the ROOF!"
is the former 55/KOY site at 12th St. & Camelback.

As Keith mentioned, the 103.5 and 103.9 sites can't get much closer to
each other due to second-adjacent separation.

 

[DrAkbar]

Nothin' says total market coverage like a stick on South Mountain. All the rest have limitations.

 

[johndavis]

* being outside the area I have to beg ignorance regarding the KLNZ 103.5 site. I would imagine that site limits KEXX's ability to move into Phoenix)

KLNX 103.5 is on White Tank Mountain, about 30 miles west of downtown Phoenix. Being licensed to Glendale, it may be possible for it to move to South Mountain if there was room (from what I've heard, there isn't right now).

Considering that back in the day Channel 3 basically built 103.5 for Don Jerome, if they could have put that transmitter on South, they would have had the resources to find a way. There's probably some short-spacing issues that push them over to the White Tanks, as with KBAQ. I just don't know whose allocation they'd be butting against.

 

[johndavis]

As far as KEXX, why can't they use their old sticks on camelback?

When did 103.9 have a stick on Camelback Road? They were originally a
a Coolidge COL that "moved in" to Gilbert.

I think the only Camelback sticks now are at 7401 West (KPXQ 1360, the
old "136/KRUX" site). Long-gone and replaced by "the car...on the ROOF!"
is the former 55/KOY site at 12th St. & Camelback.

Correct. The Edge spent most of its early days at 106.3 with their studios at the old KRUX site. However, the transmitter at the time was on Shaw Butte (on STA for years, as Mazursky couldn't keep the original tower site for 106.3) The towers at that studio location were only for 1360 AM. Coverage wasn't great for 106.3, being a class A (6kw) and with the shading problems that Shaw Butte presents. The 106.3 tower moved north and got bumped up to 50kw.

Jay Brentlinger moved 103.9 in from Coolidge and sold it to Jerry Clifton's group, who sold it to Riviera. The studios remain in a building that the Brentlinger family owns. The only thing in common that the alternative format at 103.9 has with the alternative format that used to be at 106.3 is the format. [Riviera traded the intellectual property of KEDJ from Univision when Univision bought what was left of Big City Radio. Univision took the KPTY call sign from 103.9 and moved it to its now defunct "Party" station in Houston.]

 

[w9wi]

* being outside the area I have to beg ignorance regarding the KLNZ 103.5 site. I would imagine that site limits KEXX's ability to move into Phoenix)

KLNX 103.5 is on White Tank Mountain, about 30 miles west of downtown Phoenix. Being licensed to Glendale, it may be possible for it to move to South Mountain if there was room (from what I've heard, there isn't right now).

KEXX 103.9 is licensed to Gilbert, but transmits from the Pinal County section of Queen Creek, about 35 miles SE of downtown Phoenix. There is enough distance between them that there is no interference between 103.5 and 103.9, although there might be if KLNZ were ever to relocate to South Mountain.

I've done the math...

The existing KLNZ and KEXX sites are 105km apart. The required minimum distance between 2nd-adjacent class C's is... 105km. They can't move any closer.

As for the other stations "lasunsfan" mentions, they too are 105km WNW of South Mountain. So they can't move any closer either.

 

[justthenumbers]

I've done the math...

The existing KLNZ and KEXX sites are 105km apart. The required minimum distance between 2nd-adjacent class C's is... 105km. They can't move any closer.

As for the other stations "lasunsfan" mentions, they too are 105km WNW of South Mountain. So they can't move any closer either.

I know this will never happen, but in theory...if 103.5 and 103.9 both went dark, would it be possible (from a technical standpoint) to put a 100kW station on 103.7? As far as I know, there are no 103.7's anywhere in the state.

 

[w9wi]

I know this will never happen, but in theory...if 103.5 and 103.9 both went dark, would it be possible (from a technical standpoint) to put a 100kW station on 103.7? As far as I know, there are no 103.7's anywhere in the state.

There are two 103.7s in Arizona.

One is KZGL Flagstaff. The other is KXZK Vail -- licensed but from what I understand, off the air? It has applied to move to 104.5. However... another station licensed to Vail, KRDX 98.5, has applied to take over the 103.7 frequency. Either way, you have to protect previously-filed applications.

If KLNZ and KEXX both went dark, there'd still be a procedural hurdle: you'd have to remove the channel allocations. That would be a problem with regard to 103.9, as it's the only FM channel allotted to Gilbert. (however, I strongly suspect you could get one of the Phoenix or Mesa stations relicensed to Gilbert, which would allow the deletion of 103.9) It wouldn't be a problem with regard to 103.5 as 92.3 (KTAR-FM) is also licensed to Glendale.

**I think** that's all you'd have to do. I can't recall the last time the FCC has deleted a channel that was once occupied, not sure what their policy is about that.