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They preempted that for this?

Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

bpatrick said:
I can't imagine WDIV pre-empting football or WXYZ pre-empting "Desperate Housewives."
Click to expand...

NBC would pull its affiliation from Local 4 if the station pre-empted the NFL for an entertainment show. The only exception would be if the NBC game was in Detroit and not sold out.

Detroit has always been a big NFL town even when the Lions aren't good.
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

tjthedj said:
Toby, TWO sets of affilliates?

Do YOU kow what it costs to put a tv station on the air, engineering, lawyers, recruit people, get a net affiliation? (same old mantra warning) MONEY is the biggest affiliation for any station.

TWO affiliates in a market defeats the whole purpose of "exclusive" affiliations. Get cable. Have you heard? There are plenty of choices.

"If it can be picked up with an antenna, it should be offered on cable." Tell that to the zillion low-power stations NOT on cable. Cable systems have rules too.
Click to expand...

Yes, I do know and I never said a city should have two sets of affiliates, but viewers having access to one set from your city and one from the city the next over.
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

YOU SAID; "Situations like this would be a perfect argument for having two sets of affiliates to choose from."

RESPECTFULLY, WHERE does it say "adjacent markets' in your first post? You never mentioned "one set from your city and one from the city the next over" in your intital post.

Chicago and Rockford, Chicago and South Bend, Chicago and Lafayette. It would NEVER happen as (in my Chicago examnple) the network owned station in market 3 would NOT EVER go for that. In other markets it DEVALUES the affiliation because yo could watch either station and exclusivity is gone. Never happen. CBS and NBC are especially watchful of that hardly ever happening. ABC has a few like that. There are 2 PRIMARY ABC affiliates in Grand Rapids/Battle Creek, Michigan, and they seem to compete more for "my ABC" than with the other networks.
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

Couldn't the network just offer the programing to another station in the market?

For instance I know in Milwaukee WTMJ Channel 4 wanted to push Johnny Carson back a half an hour. NBC said no and gave the show to either Channel 18 or 24, (I forget which one).
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

Or the station could shift the network programming to its digital subchannel. Although those might be even less likely to be on cable.
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

* Couldn't the network just offer the programing to another station in the market?

- (unless of a special circumstance like a sports game) they'd have to swithc the WHOLE series because of network contract lingo. The program MUST also be broadcast in the SAME or BETTER time class.

Digital channels may also violate the contract NOW because there are FAR fewer viewers.
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

M.J. said:
Tonight, both WDIV and WXYZ are pre-empting network programming. Instead of Law & Order: SVU at 10, WDIV is showing an Elton John concert from England. And, instead of Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban from 8-11, WXYZ had yet another Matlock re-run (with ALF as guest star), and now a 2-hour movie, The Best of Times.

Sure, the stations probably make more money running the alternate programming (especially WDIV in this case), but one of two things should happen at the network level for the sake of viewers. One is to cut a deal with a station like WADL to clear the movie and the episode of L&O at the regular time, or force the stations to air all primetime network programming as part of the affiliation contracts.
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That all depends on what kind of deal you have with the network. Here in Pittsburgh, our CBS affiliate, KDKA, has had a storied history about either clipping certain shows or moving them to another time. CBS knows about it and is OK with it. They have been for years when they were still owned by Group W/Westinghouse. But a reason for that is because KD is one of the top-rated CBS stations in the country. Any programming changes they make will help, rather than hurt...and if they can keep those ratings consistent with the choices they make, more power to them.

As for cutting a deal with WADL, I would say don't count on that. They had what could have turned their station into a real cash cow (the deal with CBS after 2 jumped ship), but they made one demand too many for CBS. Though I admire Adell for sticking to his guns to maintain as much control over his station as possible, there are limits.
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

bpatrick said:
There used to be a thing called "option time," wherein
an affiliate would have to notify its network no less
than 56 days before a program was to air if it intended
to pre-empt, otherwise the network could exercise its
"option" and force the affiliate to carry the program.
That was declared illegal in the 1960s, although in recent
years the networks have gotten tougher about pre-emptions.
They do happen (WSB viewers know what I'm talking about),
but not with the frequency they once did.
Click to expand...

How tough? Threats of litigation?

ixnay
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

Not quite, but I believe that now it's specified in the
affiliation contracts how much time the affiliate can
pre-empt (in Fox's case, I've heard it's never, although
I'm not sure every affiliate adheres to it). Somebody
correct me on this.
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

Not positive about the total Fox deal.

I do know that Fox gives local affiliates LOTS MORE avails inside programs (Saturday night appears to be a 50/50 split) and LOTS MORE local time (daytime) so a Fox affiliate would (generally) NOT have the urge to pre-empt anyway.
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

WJBK (Detroit) and WTOL (Toledo) agreed to non-duplication in the mid-80s, whereby they shared Monroe and Livingston counties but otherwise stayed in their own DMAs. Even though WJBK flipped to FOX in 1995, the main cable company in Toledo kept WJBK off the lineup. On a side note, WJBK did carry the CBS Morning News for a while in the 80s when the Captain was relegated to weekends.

WTVG (at that time was NBC) was on my cable system in Downriver Michigan until the late 80s when it was dropped due to "poor signal". I believe it was really dropped because "we only have one VHF antenna facing towards Toledo, and it's failing, and we don't want to get a new one.". WNWO (ABC later NBC) was on Downriver cable into the late 90s until it was finally dropped. WGTE (PBS) still is while WUPW never was.
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

Mark said:
For instance I know in Milwaukee WTMJ Channel 4 wanted to push Johnny Carson back a half an hour. NBC said no and gave the show to either Channel 18 or 24, (I forget which one).
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That would be WVTV-18 that carried "Carson" after WTMJ-4 opted to pre-empt it thanks to NBC rejecting their request to delay it.
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

MikeB said:
WJBK (Detroit) and WTOL (Toledo) agreed to non-duplication in the mid-80s, whereby they shared Monroe and Livingston counties but otherwise stayed in their own DMAs. Even though WJBK flipped to FOX in 1995, the main cable company in Toledo kept WJBK off the lineup. On a side note, WJBK did carry the CBS Morning News for a while in the 80s when the Captain was relegated to weekends.

WTVG (at that time was NBC) was on my cable system in Downriver Michigan until the late 80s when it was dropped due to "poor signal". I believe it was really dropped because "we only have one VHF antenna facing towards Toledo, and it's failing, and we don't want to get a new one.". WNWO (ABC later NBC) was on Downriver cable into the late 90s until it was finally dropped. WGTE (PBS) still is while WUPW never was.
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Interesting......Buckeye CableSystem in Toledo did wind up picking up WJBK sometime later, but just dropped them this past summer. But I guess WTOL must have a similar non-duplication agreement with WWJ, as WWJ has never been carried on cable here even though I can get them (but not well) on rabbit ears. Which is too bad since WWJ often shows far better football games (i.e., not involving the Cleveland Browns) than WTOL.

WXYZ, WKBD and WDIV are the other three Detroit stations Buckeye carries, in addition to CBET from Windsor. However, all prime-time NBC programming is blacked out on WDIV (probably at WNWO's behest). Oddly enough, we get two full-fledged CW affiliates at this time thanks to cable-only "WTO5" being a holdover from the WB days.
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

IIRC, NBC allowed only two affiliates to delay Carson:
KARE/11 Minneapolis/St. Paul and WVTM/13 Birmingham,
AL; he was on a half-hour delay in the Twin Cities and
a one-hour delay in Birmingham. A couple of other
affiliates--WMAR/2 Baltimore (now ABC) and WSMV/4
Nashville--also dropped him for a time: Baltimore to
carry "Thicke Of The Night" and Nashville to carry
"Three's Company" reruns. Carson ended up on
WBFF/45 and WZTV/17, respectively, although he
later went back to WMAR and WSMV.

I'm not sure about Minneapolis, but Leno does air
in Birmingham at 10:35 (Central).
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

For a time, KARE in Minneapolis actually delayed Carson (and maybe Leno, too) by 40 minutes. The station was doing a 40-minute late newscast before it was common for stations to even do 35-minute newscasts. KARE now airs Leno at 10:35.
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

I know I would love to get either the NYC or Baltimore stations as an alternative to Philadelphia, especially when there are sports pre-emptions or pre-emptions for some stupid local event.
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

MikeB said:
WJBK (Detroit) and WTOL (Toledo) agreed to non-duplication in the mid-80s, whereby they shared Monroe and Livingston counties but otherwise stayed in their own DMAs.
Click to expand...

Don't you mean Lenawee County, not Livingston?

Livingston viewers were most likely to get Lansing's WLNS and Saginaw's WEYI (CBS at the time, now NBC).
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

azumanga said:
MikeB said:
WJBK (Detroit) and WTOL (Toledo) agreed to non-duplication in the mid-80s, whereby they shared Monroe and Livingston counties but otherwise stayed in their own DMAs.
Click to expand...

Don't you mean Lenawee County, not Livingston?

Livingston viewers were most likely to get Lansing's WLNS and Saginaw's WEYI (CBS at the time, now NBC).
Click to expand...
Yep, got my L-counties mixed up.


--Mike
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

I will say it was nice living in Maryland as not only could I get Baltimore and DC but in the summer at night I always could pick up Richmond and the UHFs from Philly too. It's nice to be given an alternative.
 
Re: Detroit pre-emptions, again

I lived in Maryland in the '80s, between D.C. and Baltimore,
and I agree, it was nice to have both; particularly when
WMAR (NBC then) was carrying an Orioles game and WRC
had the NBC network show. Likewise, WUSA pre-empted
some CBS shows (especially in daytime) that WBAL (CBS
then) carried.

For me, it was best when I attended the University of
Georgia in the '70s. At the time, the local cable system
brought in Atlanta, Greenville/Spartanburg/Asheville, and
Augusta stations. WSB was an NBC affiliate then, and much
more prone to pre-emption than it is today with ABC, so
it was nice to have NBC from Greenville, SC, which rarely
pre-empted. (It also gave us a lot of choices as to when
to watch the network news; ABC came on at 6 from Asheville,
6:30 from Atlanta and Augusta; CBS at 6:30 from Spartanburg
and Augusta, 7 from Atlanta; NBC at 7 from Atlanta and Greenville--
no Augusta NBC station on cable. But that's another story, off-
topic.)
 


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