This is not your father's 50-something

[TheFonz]

Lots of narrow niches, but still somebody else's selection of tunes. It's playlisted, it's voicetracked, it's generic.

I can only speak for XM's '50s channel, which I listen to 99% of the time. I don't know about, or care about, voicetracking. I do know that the people who play the music KNOW the music. I'm not hearing some 25 year old reading off of a script, even if he IS in the studio. And the "playlist" is one that I haven't heard on terrestrial radio since Eisenhower was president.

How much longer do you think either XM or Sirius are gonna be able to continue bleeding red ink before someone pulls the plug? Neither service is anywhere near breaking even and subscriptions have plateaued. The investors aren't gonna wait forever to see a return on investment before they start making changes and my guess is you won't like what they do.

MY guess is that the two services will merge before they "pull the plug". And that may not be such a bad idea.

 

[Oldiesaholic]

If they do merge I hope they keep the XM channels. I'm a huge fan of The '60s on 6, as well as The '50s on 5, and even Soul Street with its huge Motown and Stax library. After listening for about a year now, I can't even stand regular radio anymore. It's too depressing.

 

[RadioMan203]

... I can't even stand regular radio anymore. It's too depressing.

Frankly, does anybody really listen to terrestrial radio anymore? Other than traffic reports and a couple of talk shows I rarely listen to radio "for the hell of it".

 

[fred flintstone]

Sure they are.
The numbers decline. Time spent listening declines.
The trend is there but it will take a while.

Apologists for radio talk about radio "re-invented" itself when TV came along.
That didn't happen overnight and there was a lot of resistance in the industry.
But right now I don't see any move in the direction of radio re-inventing itself again.

Even the traffic reports are in jeopardy.
The companies that provide traffic reports to radio are really pushing to provide traffic data online, to cell phones, and to GPS systems. With these you get traffic when you want it (no waiting for traffic on the 1s, 2s, 3s, ... by which time you are already stuck). You get exactly the traffic you want (no sitting through reports for the other side of town, no big jam someplace else and so they don't have time for the slightly smaller jam on your route). And you get automatic updates.

Radio (telephony) is almost 100 years old. Except for Sarnoff, probably the wireless operators didn't like the idea of giving up Morse code either.
But new - and superior - technology has come along in the past century, and it can do things that radio does and do it better, quicker and cheaper.
The problem is the radio people did not get on board with the new technology when they had the chance (and as they did with TV).

 

[radiofriend1]

Frankly, does anybody really listen to terrestrial radio anymore?

must be they don't. just saw all the arbitrons from the summer so far and everybody has an 0.0 share in all demos

c'mon-don't be silly

 

[Anyacat]

It occurs to me that the baby boom generation, that is those people born between 1946 and 1956, may be the last generation to grow up listening to radio. You don't find today's teens doing their homework with an ear glued to the radio, rather they are listening to their IPods. As Fred noted, the numbers of radio listeners are on the decline. It could be argued that the Jack format is radio's response to the IPod. But I submit that corporate radio has contributed to its own demise by offering bland and uninteresting programming. I have read on these boards about how baby boomers don't use new technology, and yet I know that many people in their 40s and beyond have invested in IPods because there is no decent radio. As far as I can tell, the only areas of growth are in religious broadcasting, Spanish-language programming and African-American talk shows. So if radio only exists as an advertising business, maybe that's radio of the future. I honestly believe that corporate radio is partly responsible for the medium's demise. It took a lot, but eventually I moved away from radio, which I love, to IPod (10,000 songs in 10 minutes) and increasingly to formats that I like on the Web. Yes, Bill, there are those of us who really enjoyed terrestrial radio right up to the moment corporate radio made it painfully clear that they didn't want us any more.

 

[radiofriend1]

It occurs to me that the baby boom generation, that is those people born between 1946 and 1956, may be the last generation to grow up listening to radio. You don't find today's teens doing their homework with an ear glued to the radio, rather they are listening to their IPods. As Fred noted, the numbers of radio listeners are on the decline. It could be argued that the Jack format is radio's response to the IPod. But I submit that corporate radio has contributed to its own demise by offering bland and uninteresting programming. I have read on these boards about how baby boomers don't use new technology, and yet I know that many people in their 40s and beyond have invested in IPods because there is no decent radio. As far as I can tell, the only areas of growth are in religious broadcasting, Spanish-language programming and African-American talk shows. So if radio only exists as an advertising business, maybe that's radio of the future. I honestly believe that corporate radio is partly responsible for the medium's demise. It took a lot, but eventually I moved away from radio, which I love, to IPod (10,000 songs in 10 minutes) and increasingly to formats that I like on the Web. Yes, Bill, there are those of us who really enjoyed terrestrial radio right up to the moment corporate radio made it painfully clear that they didn't want us any more.

so what were radio owners supposed to do? operate with a break-even or even operate-at-a-loss mindset so advertisers wouldn't want the medium? i bet had you owned a radio station your mindset would have been, "hey, how can we operate more efficiently and maybe turn a profit here?". that's how BUSINESS works

c'mon

it's all about choices-always has been, always will be. we as consumers like lots of choices. but this is nothing new. just remember AM radio was all but pronounced dead in the 80s after all the music formats migrated to FM thru-out the '70's....................and it's still around and doing OK

 

[Anyacat]

Dear No-friend-of-radio:
I don't believe I was suggesting that radio is a non-profit medium. Clearly, you believe corporate radio with its bland cookie cutter programming is radio of the future. I believe that is the very reason why people who used to love radio are tuning out in increasing numbers. So where does that leave radio in the future? Well, the big money makers are, as I noted, Spanish-language, religion and African-American talk (euphemistically called "urban radio)--so maybe that's all radio will offer in the future if, as you suggest, the focus should be on profits rather than programming.
Live long and prosper

 

[radiofriend1]

Dear No-friend-of-radio:
Clearly, you believe corporate radio with its bland cookie cutter programming is radio of the future.

i do not believe that for one minute. i do know that people who are working in corporate radio and spending 80% of their time bitching about it is why the quality isn't where it could be. put THAT kind of devotion and energy into being a great contributor to radio in 2006 and beyond.

there is room in america for corprate-owned radio and for privately-owned radio. for some, the former is the road to hell and for others the latter is a panacea.
whatever U choose, just do it well and continue to re-invent yourself

the times are changing and great radio responds to those changes (and always have). but there are SOME PEOPLE who want radio to stay still and not evolve and be "what it used to be back in THE DAY" (whenever the heck that was).

either be part of the problem or part of the solution. people who whine and mope around that radio sucks are part of the problem

 

[Anyacat]

Dear- No-friend-of-radio:
Yo keep saying that radio is changing, but you offer nothing as to what it will become, only constant carping about those who don't like its present direction. Listeners most certainly do take proactive steps when they stop listening to radio and move on to something else. And the reason they stop listening to radio is that there is nothing worth hearing. Yes, times are changing and as I noted the most profitable formats are Spanish-language, African-American talk and religion. For that reason I believe that the ad salesmen who now make programming decisions will go where the money is and that means that those of us who want something other than Spanish-language, African-American talk and religion must also move someplace else. Corporations have contributed nothing to radio since deregulation in 1996 except to employ fewer people, to increase egregious formats such as Jack and Movin, and to search for more profits (and there never seems a profit that is large enough). Corporations have reinvented radio to suit their emphasis on greater advertising revenue, and they do not seem to understand--or care--that they have, in the process destroyed what made radio radio. It is impossible to explain to some people why corporate control of the public airwaves is downright dangerous--see, the reasons don't involve advertising revenue.

 

[radiofriend1]

Dear- No-friend-of-radio:
Yo keep saying that radio is changing, but you offer nothing as to what it will become, only constant carping about those who don't like its present direction. Listeners most certainly do take proactive steps when they stop listening to radio and move on to something else. And the reason they stop listening to radio is that there is nothing worth hearing. Yes, times are changing and as I noted the most profitable formats are Spanish-language, African-American talk and religion. For that reason I believe that the ad salesmen who now make programming decisions will go where the money is and that means that those of us who want something other than Spanish-language, African-American talk and religion must also move someplace else. Corporations have contributed nothing to radio since deregulation in 1996 except to employ fewer people, to increase egregious formats such as Jack and Movin, and to search for more profits (and there never seems a profit that is large enough). Corporations have reinvented radio to suit their emphasis on greater advertising revenue, and they do not seem to understand--or care--that they have, in the process destroyed what made radio radio. It is impossible to explain to some people why corporate control of the public airwaves is downright dangerous--see, the reasons don't involve advertising revenue.

i ain't miss cleo. i cannot predict the future for goodness sake

 

[gr8oldies]

I'm wondering what we'd all be bitching about if consolodation never took place. More than likely, the same thinsg everyoon'e's complaining about now. Voicetracking would still exist..companies like Westwood One would offer it as well as hundreds of guys in their basement studios. You still wouldn'have 50,000 song playlists and eclectic formats; in fact, in the pre-consolodation model it wasn't uncommon for a market to have six A/C stations, and sometimes no CHR. There weren't thousands of eclectic formats on the dial, you couldn't afford to do anything but go for the biggest slice of the pie..thus the multiple A/C's or BM's.

 

[radiofriend1]

I'm wondering what we'd all be bitching about if consolodation never took place. More than likely, the same thinsg everyoon'e's complaining about now. Voicetracking would still exist..companies like Westwood One would offer it as well as hundreds of guys in their basement studios. You still wouldn'have 50,000 song playlists and eclectic formats; in fact, in the pre-consolodation model it wasn't uncommon for a market to have six A/C stations, and sometimes no CHR. There weren't thousands of eclectic formats on the dial, you couldn't afford to do anything but go for the biggest slice of the pie..thus the multiple A/C's or BM's.

most of those complaining are those with security issues. people who've been truly successful in the biz are not on these board whining about how awful radio is, how they['ve been displaced or fired, how rotten voicetracking is, radio's not as good as it used to be, et al.

people who are successful at radio are out doing successful radio, not harping and crying about how lousy it is. any of us who have been in management avoid these types like the plague and don't hire them

winning radio has ALWAYS demanded professionals who want to be part of solutions vs. part of the problem

it really is that simple

 

[TheFonz]

It occurs to me that the baby boom generation, that is those people born between 1946 and 1956, may be the last generation to grow up listening to radio. You don't find today's teens doing their homework with an ear glued to the radio, rather they are listening to their IPods.

Yup, you got that right. Can you think of any other business that dumps that kind of loyalty when it reaches a certain age?

 

[OldGringo]

It occurs to me that the baby boom generation, that is those people born between 1946 and 1956, may be the last generation to grow up listening to radio. You don't find today's teens doing their homework with an ear glued to the radio, rather they are listening to their IPods.

Yup, you got that right. Can you think of any other business that dumps that kind of loyalty when it reaches a certain age?

I can not think of any commercial business that runs like a charity. There is not revenue in 55 and older, so there is no programming.

 

[semoochie]

The baby boom peaked in 1957. Most reports have it beginning with the war babies in 1945 and ending around 1964 but I've seen it go as late as 1968. That's quite awhile past 1956!

 

[radiofriend1]

It occurs to me that the baby boom generation, that is those people born between 1946 and 1956, may be the last generation to grow up listening to radio. You don't find today's teens doing their homework with an ear glued to the radio, rather they are listening to their IPods.

Yup, you got that right. Can you think of any other business that dumps that kind of loyalty when it reaches a certain age?

advertisers have products----their focus is on serving their customers in the present and in the future. there is little future gain for 55+ consumers..............they will begin to have less, spend less and listen to radio less

what do U expect these companies to do? continue to target an aging consumer cell based on what they USED TO PURCHASE? "hey, we know they won't be buying our product much longer but y'know they've been so loyal in the past. even though we'll take a bath continuing to target them, it would make them feel nice so let's keep targeting them, get our ass kicked in sales and hope we don't go out of business".

c'mon

 

[Anyacat]

Lester Mays said it best: "If anyone said we were in the radio business, it wouldn't be someone from our company. We're not in the business of providing news and information. We're not in the business of providing well-researched music. We're simply in the business of selling our customers' products."--L. Lowry Mays, Clear Channel CEO, in Fortune Magazine (2003). It's the reason why career adman Jim Hogan is head of the Clear Channel radio division and I pick on poor Clear Channel because it owns way more stations than anybody else (10% in the US) and wants more.

Prior to that the foolish public thought that radio was there to provide news, information and entertainment. Consolidation has reduced the number of people who work in radio and while voice tracking has been with us since the end of World War II, the cut back in personnel means that fewer voices are heard on the air. It has reduced the number of local news departments and local news casts; fewer technicians are needed to run robot stations. And while the corporations increase the salaries for executives, salary increases for on-air personalities have slowed (unlike executives, DJS should work for peanuts). It places salesmen in positions of creative power. I still have seen nothing to indicate that people of a certain age do not buy products or are unwilling to try something new. It's probably just another one of those adman urban legends, which becomes self-fulfilling prophecy when salesman can't make an easy sale or are out of fresh ideas. The ad salesman now have control of the medium and radio on a decline. Did you ever wonder why people turn to IPods and the Internet--did it ever occur to you that radio has become boring, bland and repetitive--and that many of the problems are the direct result of consolidation? In your arrogance, has it ever crossed your mind that really talented people, and I don't mean ad salesman, I mean people with a passion for the music and the medium, have been put out of work not because they are bad at what they do but because some other less creative person can do an adequate job for less money--and adequate is what we shoot for these days? So, be sure to only work for a station that hopes to sell products to people between 18 and 34--except that's the group that is leaving radio in greater numbers than older listeners--and there are statistics to support that claim.

 

[radiofriend1]

majority of the spot buys today are 25-54 and 18-49, period

and that isn't radio's fault.

 

[OldGringo]

I still have seen nothing to indicate that people of a certain age do not buy products or are unwilling to try something new. It's probably just another one of those adman urban legends, which becomes self-fulfilling prophecy when salesman can't make an easy sale or are out of fresh ideas. The ad salesman now have control of the medium and radio on a decline.

There is no urban legend here, and ad agency personnel do not set the demos on campaigns. An advertiser hires an agency to create advertising to reach the consumer that the client's marketing department has established. The target may go back to product design where the goods or services are researched against a particular consumer group. Packaging is created to appeal to this group, and ad agencies are told who to design the campaign for and what to target it against.

Another big factor is ROI (Return on Investment) where the client knows that it takes more ads to convert established category consumers to a different product, often meaning every sale in certain groups takes so much advertising as to create a loss!

Radio sales is totally powerless in changing tareget demos. It is not a hard sell... it is just impossible because of the nature of the product or service and the client demands.

Most agency buys are announced so stations can present rates and such. The demos are specified before the presentations so stations can try to match the CPP goal or provide value added to compensate.