Time to vent!

[mcamp]

I just stumbled across this site and has been twenty plus years in the making.
Let me just start out with; Boston radio sucks!
Let me rephrase...commercial Boston radio sucks!
A city like Boston lacks: full time jazz radio, and anything that remotely resembles what WBCN was in it's hey-day.
Lets face it, corporate radio is here to stay, but I don't have to like it.
WBCN has been split into three pieces: WBOS, WZLX, and the current WBCN. If you mixed all three into one it wouldn't be much better, but at least, maybe, you might be able to listen for 10 minutes without racing to the scan button.
Lets face it, does the world need to listen to The Eagles, Elton John, and Led Zeppelin 10 times a day, every day. Radio today has created an audience that either just likes new music, just likes old music, or people who like both, just with a softer edge.
Can someone answer this question: why is Chicago (a band that had five number one albums in a row in the 70's) not considered classic rock?
A station that plays the Clash, doesn't play Elvis Costello and Joe Jackson....have all the focus groups and demographics come down to this? In the end, it's a shame...radio used to be a source for new music I couldn't wait to get my hands on....it's become music to get my teeth drilled on.

 

[Lucylu]

There is always college radio. The music is better but the jocks are to get your teeth drilled on :

 

[Eli Polonsky]

I just stumbled across this site and has been twenty plus years in the making.
Let me just start out with; Boston radio sucks!
Let me rephrase...commercial Boston radio sucks!
A city like Boston lacks: full time jazz radio, and anything that remotely resembles what WBCN was in it's hey-day.

I also loved WBCN in it's 60's/70's heyday, but that kind of programming doesn't get ratings with the mainstream majority and younger demos anymore.

Lets face it, corporate radio is here to stay, but I don't have to like it.

You don't. But, most listeners do. Not people like us who are on a radio board and have had a radio glued to our ears for decades. We've heard it all. We're also music afficionados who have heard all the hits until we can't stand them anymore, and we want more variety. But, the casual listeners who use radio as just a background for their workday are the majority who make the ratings, and they want to hear the hits they're familiar with. If a station goes deep like WBCN in it's AOR heyday, most of todays casual listeners change the station to find something they know. Whenever a station has tried going deep here in recent years, their ratings tanked.

Lets face it, does the world need to listen to The Eagles, Elton John, and Led Zeppelin 10 times a day, every day. Radio today has created an audience that either just likes new music, just likes old music, or people who like both, just with a softer edge.

Bingo. And they're not going to go back to being like the adventurous late 60's/70's FM AOR audience who were escaping Top 40, which was then on AM radio. There is very little music on AM anymore. Mainstream music listeners all gradually migrated to FM, which replaced AM for music, and they still want to hear the hits, and just the certain type of music they tune in for.

Can someone answer this question: why is Chicago (a band that had five number one albums in a row in the 70's) not considered classic rock?

Because Chicago is considered Classic Hits and Oldies and even Gold/AC, but not Classic Rock. You'll hear them on WROR, WODS, WMJX and others, but not on WZLX. Classic Rock has a somewhat harder, more guitar oriented sound than Classic Hits or Oldies. The predominantly "horn" bands of the late 60's/early 70's like Chicago and Blood, Sweat & Tears don't fit.

A station that plays the Clash, doesn't play Elvis Costello and Joe Jackson....have all the focus groups and demographics come down to this? In the end, it's a shame...radio used to be a source for new music I couldn't wait to get my hands on....it's become music to get my teeth drilled on.

 

[Garrett]

I just stumbled across this site and has been twenty plus years in the making.
Let me just start out with; Boston radio sucks!
Let me rephrase...commercial Boston radio sucks!
A city like Boston lacks: full time jazz radio, and anything that remotely resembles what WBCN was in it's hey-day.
Lets face it, corporate radio is here to stay, but I don't have to like it.
WBCN has been split into three pieces: WBOS, WZLX, and the current WBCN. If you mixed all three into one it wouldn't be much better, but at least, maybe, you might be able to listen for 10 minutes without racing to the scan button.
Lets face it, does the world need to listen to The Eagles, Elton John, and Led Zeppelin 10 times a day, every day. Radio today has created an audience that either just likes new music, just likes old music, or people who like both, just with a softer edge.
Can someone answer this question: why is Chicago (a band that had five number one albums in a row in the 70's) not considered classic rock?
A station that plays the Clash, doesn't play Elvis Costello and Joe Jackson....have all the focus groups and demographics come down to this? In the end, it's a shame...radio used to be a source for new music I couldn't wait to get my hands on....it's become music to get my teeth drilled on.

You're right!

 

[JIBGUY]

Let me just start out with; Boston radio sucks!
Let me rephrase...commercial Boston radio sucks!
A city like Boston lacks: full time jazz radio, and anything that remotely resembles what WBCN was in it's hey-day.
==========================================================
Just about EVERY city lacks a station like WBCN in its heyday.
If you think its bad in Boston, try New York City! In NYC,
There is no full-time light jazz station....
There is no full-time country station....
There is no full-time oldies station....
There is no full-time Adult-Standards station.....
....the latter very strange since much of the adult-standards music was originated in New York City. If 1130 were to go with adult standards, it would have almost 10 TIMES the ratings it currently has. But then again, who needs an audience that buys products responsibly; who doesn't rack up debts they can't pay on credit cards? That would be un-American!

 

[Neggy]

I too was unsatisfied with the Bston radio offerings, so I got XM.... next to my internet connection it's the best $ I spend each month.

 

[Varulven]

That's why we listen to WJIB! Jibguy plays the hits! Eli talked about Connie Francis - more Connie Francis!

 

[Osama]

That's why we listen to WJIB! Jibguy plays the hits! Eli talked about Connie Francis - more Connie Francis!

Fxxk WJIB!!! Bring back WCAS!!!! And the old WNTN for that matter!!!!!!!

 

[raccoonradio]

I would think WZLX could fit 25 or 6 to 4 into its playlist.

And yes people want the artists and songs they're familiar with...WODS has had the slogan "You Know
All the Songs" in the past. Once in awhile they'll a song you haven't heard in years, though that's
more likely to happen during Lost 45s or Thu Night Countdown there, or on WBOQ, etc.

In many cities, classic rock, country, pop, etc., all sound the same. I could take a classic country station
or one that mixed some older songs in. I don't have Sirius or XM but online I can listen to a station
like US-93.7 out of Vermont (tape it as a file and listen on my mp3 player). And people who have Sirius
send me tapes of their Classic Country and Outlaw Country (Mojo Nixon! And yup, he's been known to
let a few cuss words out) stations.

 

[Eli Polonsky]

And yes people want the artists and songs they're familiar with...WODS has had the slogan "You Know
All the Songs" in the past. Once in awhile they'll a song you haven't heard in years, though that's
more likely to happen during Lost 45s or Thu Night Countdown there, or on WBOQ, etc.

I'm guessing that WBOQ and any suburban station programming oldies in the "shadow" of WODS' huge signal knows that they have to offer something a little different. If they duplicate ODS, people will just tune to ODS for the bigger signal and major-market production and personalities. By playing some different stuff and tailoring their programming and public service to their particular area (WBOQ to the North Shore, WATD to the South Shore) they can survive in their niches even with WODS omnipresent and ubiquitous.

I remember when WODS came on the air in 1987, all the AM stations that were playing similar Oldies within a 75 mile radius keeled over and died within a year or two. 1150 WMEX in Boston, 550 WICE in Providence, 1300 WORC-AM Worcester, 1250 WKBR Manchester, NH, even very briefly WKOX 1200 in Framingham, etc...

WWBB "B-101" came on as Providence's FM Oldies station shortly after that, and in the 90's Manchester, NH and Worcester got FM Oldies stations ("Cool 96.5" and WORC-FM 98.9), but they all included tunes that WODS wouldn't touch in order to differentiate themselves because WODS comes in like a ton of bricks in all those areas. (96.5 in Manchester eventually went Classic Rock as "The Mill", and "B-101" is now more like Classic Hits).

I still think WODS main competition in Boston is WMJX, and secondarily WROR.

 

[Eli Polonsky]

Fxxk WJIB!!! Bring back WCAS!!!! And the old WNTN for that matter!!!!!!!

If those stations still existed as they were then (impossible today), I'd apply to work for them even at the nearly minimum wage they used to pay back then. It's still more than I make when I do music shows at volunteer WMBR.

 

[mcamp]

Let me respond to a few comments: Chicago isn't guitar driven (Terry Kath)? Is Elton John guitar driven?

Why can't an AOR station exist today? You hear about many people, lots probably who post here, who suscribe to XM/ Sirius, who want more variety in radio. Doesn't that represent a "market"?
Is it going to draw as many people as Kiss 108....no, but more than some garbage on the dial.
Everything today in society has to be the biggest/ best....it's the business model....why have a three car garage when you can have four, but you only own one car....what is the matter with modest ratings?
You would think someone in this vast country, an individual with some money, who just happens to be a music lover, would invest in a radio station.....someone, anyone!
There IS a market out there....I'm not the only person in the Boston area who can not listen to Boston's 'More Than a Feeling' without driving my car into a tree!

 

[Oldbones]

Why can't an AOR station exist today? You hear about many people, lots probably who post here, who suscribe to XM/ Sirius, who want more variety in radio. Doesn't that represent a "market"?
Is it going to draw as many people as Kiss 108....no, but more than some garbage on the dial.
Everything today in society has to be the biggest/ best....it's the business model....why have a three car garage when you can have four, but you only own one car....what is the matter with modest ratings?
You would think someone in this vast country, an individual with some money, who just happens to be a music lover, would invest in a radio station.....someone, anyone!
There IS a market out there....I'm not the only person in the Boston area who can not listen to Boston's 'More Than a Feeling' without driving my car into a tree!

As Eli mentioned, there are some listeners who'd prefer radio as it was done 30 years ago...but that doesn't mean there are enough to support a station. XM & Sirius combined reach less than 1% of the population....and that audience is divided up among 200 or so channels....I've never seen a breakdown of the relative popularity of their channels, but I'd guess that many of them have only a handful of listeners at any given time. I hope you don't think those who post here (and on other message boards) are even remotely representative of the public at large.

 

[CTListener]

XM & Sirius combined reach less than 1% of the population....and that audience is divided up among 200 or so channels....I've never seen a breakdown of the relative popularity of their channels, but I'd guess that many of them have only a handful of listeners at any given time.

Whenever anyone involved with XM even hints at popularity of individual channels, it seems that the channels that play mainstream music get mentioned: Seventies on 7, Top Tracks, Top 20 on 20 (a VERY tight-rotation pop station targeted at teens).

When Clear Channel defeated XM in arbitration and won the right to sell advertising on the music channels it programs for XM, XM felt the need to "clone" those channels' formats in non-commercial form so it could offer those channels' playlists commercial-free. So now we have Nashville (Clear Channel, commercial) and US Country (XM, non-commercial), Mix (CC) and Flight 26 (XM), Kiss (CC) and Hitlist (XM), aping each others' playlists on redundant channels. Somehow, I don't think XM would find it necessary to fight CC this way if the CC channels had deep, esoteric playlists.

What all this means, I suppose, is that regardless of the number of musical specialists/completists/elitists who think satellite radio's business model will fail if they're not the sole focus of the medium's programming, most people who listen to satellite -- just like their "terrestrial" counterparts -- like familiar music in broadly popular genres. What a surprise.

 

[Eli Polonsky]

You would think someone in this vast country, an individual with some money, who just happens to be a music lover, would invest in a radio station.....someone, anyone!

Here's one, on the outskirts of Burlington, VT. This hippie couple runs WCLX 102.9 FM out of their house. The format is sort of a combination of Classic Rock, AOR, and AAA, and it does go deep. It's the closest commercial station that I know of nowadays to your 1970's "free-form" AOR. Stream it from their site and check it out.

They seem to run it because they love the music, they can't be making much money with it. It's owned by a guy in Connecticut named Dennis Jackson who owns a handful of small-market stations in New England and upstate New York, though the others are more conventional formats.

What's the catch? The married couple in their home studio are the only DJ's (besides one other occasional fill-in), and the rest of the time it's automated. They couldn't afford to pay a staff. There is enough of an eclectic audience in that area to float a low-overhead operation like that with some local Burlington, VT ads, but it would never fly in Boston or most any major urban market nowadays, if they could even acquire a major-market signal in the first place. The all-over-the-map format and the lack of production values and interactive programming would not get significant ratings in a major market nowadays, and major-market expenses and competition for advertisers would financially crush it.

But, I'm glad they're pulling it off and doing their thing up there. I check it out whenever I get up that way.

 

[dumber than a box of hair]

Why can't an AOR station exist today? You hear about many people, lots probably who post here, who suscribe to XM/ Sirius, who want more variety in radio. Doesn't that represent a "market"?

The combined subscriber total for XM and Sirius is still less than one day's cume for WINS (slightly larger than 3% of the US population). Not a significant blip on anyone's radar.

Is it going to draw as many people as Kiss 108....no, but more than some garbage on the dial.

The line between "garbage" and "good programming" is delieated by what will sell. Radio is a business, driven by profit. If the programming is not saleable, it goes in the hopper. We all wish it weren't so, but it is. The line between "garbage" and "good programming" is also, for each of us, delineated by our tastes. One man's garbage is another man's gold, or something like that.

what is the matter with modest ratings?

Because, again, radio is a business, driven by profit.

There IS a market out there....I'm not the only person in the Boston area who can not listen to Boston's 'More Than a Feeling' without driving my car into a tree!

No one's doubting that for a second. But, there are only so many radio stations that can be supported by the economy in any given market, and when there are too many, the unprofitable ones are the ones that die off. Thus, an owner has to be sure that he will make enough to survive, and that means programming his/her station to the largest possible number of people.

 

[Varulven]

You know, the big joke here is on us. As Bob Bittner may have mentioned, we are the hardcore radio fans here (with some professionals and at least one station owner added in to the mix). But let's take a big example of a station no one thought would have any ratings just a decade ago: WCRB.

If you told ANYONE on this board in 1991 (if this board existed in 1991) that WCRB in the current book would beat out WBCN by a country mile and would be tied for a Something of Beethoven with RKO (the number after
4), no one would believe it.

A 50,000 watt powerhouse tradition like WBCN falling to a homogenized classical music station that doesn't have the promotion power, the community support, and now that there's a new program director - golly gee the fans can actually WIN free CDs to get 104.1 some ratings -

http://www.radioandrecords.com/RRRa....3&HPER=&OPER=&NSD=8/22/2006 12:00:00 AM&CE=0

is all the proof you need. Classical Music format going to beat out WBCN? Not in Tony's wildest nightmares.
Heck - Tony would rather have dinner with me than even entertain that thought!

So it is rubbish when we hear this format can't make it and that format can't make it. For all the yapping about satellite, where has CBS gone to get their #s? They've gone to Opie & Anthony because they don't have a creative thought! David Lee Roth! Please! OOOPS, we're so dumb we'd better re-hire the guys we had to let go because with all that time to prepare for Howard's departure, duh, we wasn't ready! That's
Radio as a Business? OH, and fire Rob Barnett for coming up with that idea while you are at it!

Barnett probably only came up with the idea. Who are the numbskulls that gave him permission?

So - CBS gives us David Lee Roth - and that's indicative of what the "suits" across the board try to force-feed us with the mantra "radio is a business." Sure it is, they just aren't conducting it as well as they could be.

I remember the WZLX consultant (Gary Guthrie if my memory is correct) sitting at the Hard Rock Cafe with me telling me he is going to add more of one artist to WZLX because he loved the audience response in Texas.
My response went to Wharfield, not to Guthrie, "Why doesn't he try walking around the streets of Boston to hear what people are blasting out of their car radios and from their windows". Texas for Boston?

Radio Consultants are a big part of the problem. Another part of the problem is what the Record Labels (which hardly exist after swallowing each other up) did to radio. After the fiasco with The Hit Men

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0679730613/103-9872665-9297451?v=glance&n=283155

when a solid hit like "Another Brick In The Wall" wasn't played in one market (Los Angeles) because of the payoffs, radio wasn't able to give the listeners what they really wanted.

So Record labels and Radio gave the listeners what Records and Radio want to shove down their throats.

It's the same thing today. We live in a BLUE STATE yet WRKO pushes MIKE SAVAGE down the collective throats of the listener when WBUR has BETTER NUMBERS with a dryer presentation and little promotion.

RKO with its billboards and its giveaways doesn't see WBUR as competition - but it is a format that is absolutely their competition. Give Jones Radio Network and Air America a signal, not a WUNR out-to-sea kind of signal, and RKO would have some competition. Do you think the public likes what Greater Media is putting on WTKK - or WBOS for that matter. Everyone I know likes THE RIVER better than WBOS and XRV is a little more than a half a point under WBOS. So a station in Haverhill is giving a Boston station a huge run for its money in the ratings because that independent station plays a more popular form of the same AAA music.

WCRB has kept the same consistent format and it has found an audience where most of us never would have thought one existed.

WXRV has something special but we get fuzzy reception down here.

WJIB is making a dent without even trying. WJIB is not far behind a Worcester station, WAAF, as well as
BOS and BCN, and Bob does little or no advertising. He just does the WCRB thing - consistent good music that audiences gravitate to.

So there are some facts. Radio is a business and the businessmen shove David Lee Roth and expect "IF you build it they will come." Good for us they ain't starring in the sequel to Field Of Dreams.

There is no facilitation of great local programming; no environment for the next Howard Stern to materialize from; the college radio stations are in such disarray we see them getting fined for simple things like The Public File or not shutting down properly; the students don't care - they use radio as a chance to showoff and screwup, the community volunteers everywhere get pushed around, if they aren't arrogant and in-power like at WMBR (which, I would imagine, doesn't sit well with a pro like Eli, who should be in charge with his seniority (said in a nice way as I'm in the same age group) and his vast knowledge).

Damn right I'll vent. Any level headed person could have had WBCN in the 4s. And that's being modest.
A great P.D. should be breathing down the necks of Jamn and Kiss with the right stuff. Radio gave us
David Lee Roth. That is what they are pushing out there:

David Lee Roth vs. Howard Stern
John DePetro vs. Terry Gross

and all due respect to Carter Alan and Chuck Nowlin, the Sominex twins, ZLX is not in the 3s anymore and is fighting to stay away from a Worcester station posing as a Boston station. The Classic Rock fans do NOT get what they want on WZLX. Hey, I'm no fan of Chicago, but playing 25 or 6 to 4, the old version or the techno newer version they almost hit with, is not going to get me to tune out. I would rather hear Chicago than
Bob Seger - and guess what? A lot of other people would too. Again - I HATED CHICAGO and B S & T -
that's not the point -specific songs - 25 or 6 to 4 with its Sunshine Of Your Love kinda innovative riff, IS
a classic ROCK song by a CLASSIC HITS band. Some bands, like 3 Dog Night, did hit it out of the park with tunes like "Heavy Church" from their Joy To The World album, a huge seller that the demographic remembers.
Playing "Heavy Church" is like playing "Sky Pilot" by The Animals. You can play them once in awhile and listeners will say "wow". OR you can drop in "Celebrate" by 3 Dog Night - a classic hits band into Classic Rock,
one familiar tune to shake-up the tedium of Stairway to Freebird.

And dare we not play Stairway To Gilligan's Island. http://www.gilligansisle.com/stairway.html

Now THAT is something that should be done - or with the passing of The Cosmic Muffin, why wouldn't a
Carter "Wake me up if the record's over" Alan or Chuck "Sorry you're all half asleep like I'm your college
professor" Nowlin play Deteriorata in DM's honor http://www.mendosa.com/fluke.html

or the equally brilliant MAGICAL MISERY TOUR when WBCN was great and did the BLEEP only AFTER the F word aired! Can't do it today, but in its day it was hilarious radio that we all buckled over to.


(Hear Deteriorata and Magical Misery Tour here)
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002CHIOW/104-0500022-1810303?v=glance&n=5174

These were STAPLES of the day when WBCN was great - along with Michael Fremer bits

I CAN TAKE A JOKE on KAN'T TELL (Not K-Tel) Records
http://allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=am...99FCBEF5CF9D46C3E3B9D9FDB&sql=10:txkxlfje0cqt

These are famous Boston commercials!

A little creativity can get ratings as WCRB and WXRV and WJIB and WBUR have.

Radio is a Business. But the people in power give us John DePetro and do something vile to try to get him attention. By next week people might know the name, but if they tune in and hear him the just don't stay.
So what's the point?

Christopher Lydon built an audience:

http://www.theconnection.org/

And a closing note to Carter Alan: Play "Taurus" by SPIRIT to show people where Jimmy Page got the riff to Stairway to Heaven (with Randy California's approval). Then play Stairway to Gilligan's Island. Maybe grab some of TV's Greatest Hits while you are at it and add them in:


http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000000GOL/103-9872665-9297451?v=glance&n=5174

these are very popular records your demographic buys but does not hear.

Best Wishes,

Rock Critic Varulven

My credentials today! Not just a letter in the Herald - Stephanie Miller's producer has been sending me e mails. Guess she's trying to make a name for herself because Stephanie I've heard of, but her producer...

all these women seem to go after the guys they can't have...

 

[mcamp]

Why can't an AOR station exist today? You hear about many people, lots probably who post here, who suscribe to XM/ Sirius, who want more variety in radio. Doesn't that represent a "market"?

The combined subscriber total for XM and Sirius is still less than one day's cume for WINS (slightly larger than 3% of the US population). Not a significant blip on anyone's radar.

The line between "garbage" and "good programming" is delieated by what will sell. Radio is a business, driven by profit. If the programming is not saleable, it goes in the hopper. We all wish it weren't so, but it is. The line between "garbage" and "good programming" is also, for each of us, delineated by our tastes. One man's garbage is another man's gold, or something like that.

what is the matter with modest ratings?

Because, again, radio is a business, driven by profit.

There IS a market out there....I'm not the only person in the Boston area who can not listen to Boston's 'More Than a Feeling' without driving my car into a tree!

No one's doubting that for a second. But, there are only so many radio stations that can be supported by the economy in any given market, and when there are too many, the unprofitable ones are the ones that die off. Thus, an owner has to be sure that he will make enough to survive, and that means programming his/her station to the largest possible number of people.

Just a few comments here...if XM and Sirrius are pulling such a small listening audience, they might as well hang it up....it is all about profit margin, right?
Sorry if I offended any "More Than a Feeling" fans out there....yes it is subjective.
If the audience is so narrow minded, why does "classic rock" radio stray even one inch away from what works...i.e., China Grove, Black Dog, Another Brick in the Wall, etc...and even venture beyond a song that was not a top 40 hit? Is it to show what remaining audience holding on to the last grain of sand of classic radio, that they still have integrity?
Why bother! All hits, all the time.

 

[Varulven]

M Camp, you are correct. I wrote to WODS about adding "No Good To Cry" by Al Anderson & The Wildweeds and heard them play it once. Once! outside of Barry Scott's show. That was a Boston area classic.

Did you know "Gimme Some Lovin'" in Boston was a hit by The Jordan Brothers, NOT The Spencer Davis Group!

Knowing what Boston radio was playing back in the day would be helpful to programmers who want the ears of the people who still live here. WODS played "Tighter Tighter" by Tommy James once and it had to have been a mistake, but it was wonderful. The original hit was by Donna Summer's husband, Bruce Sudano, of course, with his band Alive 'n' Kicking, but Tommy James co-wrote and co-produced it. The solo version by Tommy James
is just delicious - the version from the 1976 In Touch album

http://allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=am...99FCBEC5CFDDE6C39349D8EDB&sql=10:ze548qbtbtn4

catch a soundbite here:

http://allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=am...99FCBEC5CFDDF6C3E3A9D8EDB&sql=10:w38e4j274wav

So WODS has dabbled with stuff outside the consultant list - Patrick Callahan's fun Countdown at nights,
but their numbers are good enough not to tweak the formula. They've got Barry Scott to do that for them.
However WZLX and Carter Alan should be clever enough to dip their foot into the water while it is still Summer...


P.S. to WRKO:

Christopher Lydon built an audience:

http://www.theconnection.org/

Can you imagine if Jason Wolfe had the guts to put Lydon on from 9 AM - Noon. "There Be Listeners" Scotty from Star Trek might say!

 

[mcamp]

I've talked to Carter and Chuck on numerous occasions, giving them my opinion...Carter just told me...it it what it is...refering to the state of 'classic rock'.
By the way, I have also bumped into Carter at Symphony Hall (BSO) on a couple of occasions...so I guess somewhere in there is still a heart.
As for WXRV....I am from Haverhill, and it comes in loud and clear...and I used to listen to them when they first began broadcasting....and it was pretty good. They actually used to play some lost nuggets from time to time, and it kept me listening.
Now they are pretty much entreched with the Norah Jones, Guster crowd. They lost me.