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Today's Arbitron trends

S

spymovie7

True, I have not worked in Dallas Radio since the early 1980s, however, in my humble opinion, the points that KVIL just picked up were pretty much at the expense of its sister station, KLUV. I listen to both these stations, myself, and KVIL has been sounding better this year than it did last year... I do prefer the DJs on KLUV, but the music on KVIL seems a little better than it was last year. Last year, I couldn't seem to listen to KVIL for an entire hour without having to turn the station because of a disappointing song in the mix-- but this year I can listen for hours without interruption...

Also, it was interesting to note that KVIL and Mix 102.9 BOTH went up, rather than trading slices of the Adult Contemporary ratings pie with each other.

When stations with similar formats compete, you'd normally expect one would go up at the expense of another with a similar format. But check out how the various Urban formats are all losing points at the same time: K104, KBFB, KRNB, KSOC... The Oasis also has a large part of its demographic in the African American community -- but it also lost a little, as well...

Meanwhile, let's look at two Classic Rock stations: KZPS and KDBN. Once again, we have two head-to-head competitors, and yet BOTH are down slightly...

Country stations KPLX and KSCS are both down, and yet the fractions of a point that the lesser Country stations pick up only accounts for about half of that...

Over on the AM side of the band, four News/Talk stations have all slightly gone UP at the same time: KRLD, WBAP, KSKY, and KLIF.

Perhaps Satellite Radio could account for some of the above abnormalities?
 
You either missed or overlooked KEGL. They shot up to number 2 in the first trends. This could account for some losses for stations like K104, etc.
 
> True, I have not worked in Dallas Radio since the early
> 1980s, however, in my humble opinion, the points that KVIL
> just picked up were pretty much at the expense of its sister
> station, KLUV. I listen to both these stations, myself, and
> KVIL has been sounding better this year than it did last
> year... I do prefer the DJs on KLUV, but the music on KVIL
> seems a little better than it was last year. Last year, I
> couldn't seem to listen to KVIL for an entire hour without
> having to turn the station because of a disappointing song
> in the mix-- but this year I can listen for hours without
> interruption...
>
> Also, it was interesting to note that KVIL and Mix 102.9
> BOTH went up, rather than trading slices of the Adult
> Contemporary ratings pie with each other.
>
> When stations with similar formats compete, you'd normally
> expect one would go up at the expense of another with a
> similar format. But check out how the various Urban formats
> are all losing points at the same time: K104, KBFB, KRNB,
> KSOC... The Oasis also has a large part of its demographic
> in the African American community -- but it also lost a
> little, as well...
>
> Meanwhile, let's look at two Classic Rock stations: KZPS and
> KDBN. Once again, we have two head-to-head competitors, and
> yet BOTH are down slightly...
>
> Country stations KPLX and KSCS are both down, and yet the
> fractions of a point that the lesser Country stations pick
> up only accounts for about half of that...
>
> Over on the AM side of the band, four News/Talk stations
> have all slightly gone UP at the same time: KRLD, WBAP,
> KSKY, and KLIF.
>
> Perhaps Satellite Radio could account for some of the above
> abnormalities?
>
It's very hard to figure out what KVIL is doing. They have a morning show that rambles forever about the most boring subjects and the rest of the "talent" might as well lay down a voicetrack and go home. They hardly ever talk. Except of course their commercial spot sets.(L-O-N-G) Their music is a little better than last year, but the loss of the call letters and the ever-so-generic presentation is so disappointing. Would it be so hard to inject some real LIFE into it? Their billboards are so "lite" you can't even read them! Go ahead. Try it at 60mph. The words "the new" look like the bottom line of an eye chart! What brilliant management executive is responsible for this? Wasn't the idea for people to SEE it? The Twister has no ratings but look at their billboards. They get the message across. If you've been in this market for a long time, it's so damn disappointing to see a legendary radio station try to market themselves as a new product and do such a poor job. Yes, it gained some numbers in the trend. They don't have any real competition anymore in the AC arena. When KLUV and Sunny were hitting them from both sides a year ago they had a 2-share. KVIL had the perfect opportunity to put a REAL radio station on the air again in Dallas and they didn't do it. They chose the cookie-cutter version that has made radio boring for years. That's sad. And MIX? Please. They've been in the low 2-share world forever now. That's not going to change. What they SHOULD change is the format, and the person behind the scenes who can't get it right.
 
You know, what a lot of people need to realize is the fact that the old KVIL we all knew and loved...IS GONE. Dead, buried, and even Easter won't resurect the corpse! It's over, now - GET over it.
And guess what? The ratings have gone UP. It may not be what you like, what I prefer, and it surely has no shadow of an image related to the past (on purpose), and many will argue they have no competition...BUT, the ratings are up and nothing speaks louder than that. On the competition front, remember too, that there is a reason there is no competition in the format - the others couldn't succeed at it. There is a pretty good argument that Lite 103.7 stayed in the format and through whatever means, were able to emerge the victor.

History is a wonderful thing and something to be cherished, attempts to repeat it will almost always fail.
 
Re: kvil

> You know, what a lot of people need to realize is the fact
> that the old KVIL we all knew and loved...IS GONE. Dead,
> buried, and even Easter won't resurect the corpse! It's
> over, now - GET over it.
> And guess what? The ratings have gone UP. It may not be
> what you like, what I prefer, and it surely has no shadow of
> an image related to the past (on purpose), and many will
> argue they have no competition...BUT, the ratings are up and
> nothing speaks louder than that.

Easily explained. Today's KVIL has Christmas music. That's it. Last week's trend was a function of Christmas music and a massive billboard campaign. We've seen this happen repeatedly since Chapman left the station. Infinity spends a ton of money on an ad campaign... gets a temporary bump in the ratings... Kurt Johnson sends out "we're back!" e-mails to the staff... and then two trends later KVIL is right back in the middle of the mediocre pack. Advertising will get listeners to sample the product, but Infinity's current version of KVIL never keeps them.

Incidentally, did anyone notice that KVIL lost Christmas music mornings to KLTY in the target demo, but then scrambled back into the lead with Ken Barnett's midday show? Not a highly publicized statistic from the Winter book.
 
C> You know, what a lot of people need to realize is the fact
> that the old KVIL we all knew and loved...IS GONE. Dead,
> buried, and even Easter won't resurect the corpse! It's
> over, now - GET over it.
> And guess what? The ratings have gone UP. It may not be
> what you like, what I prefer, and it surely has no shadow of
> an image related to the past (on purpose), and many will
> argue they have no competition...BUT, the ratings are up and
> nothing speaks louder than that. On the competition front,
> remember too, that there is a reason there is no competition
> in the format - the others couldn't succeed at it. There is
> a pretty good argument that Lite 103.7 stayed in the format
> and through whatever means, were able to emerge the victor.
>
> History is a wonderful thing and something to be cherished,
> attempts to repeat it will almost always fail.
>
Your points are well taken, however, you need to be corrected on a few things here. We assume that the "competition who couldn't succeed" that you're talking about was Sunny. At the time that station was changed to Mexican oldies it was beating KVIL in every daypart except nights where Delilah has always done well. The "victor" sounded terrible then, and they sound maybe a little better today, but the reason we have to settle for such a mediocre product on 103.7 is because they don't want to spend the money to bring the legend back to form. You telling us to "get over it" is obviously a very weak excuse for the bland, sweeper-segue-jukebox version of a station that became literally a shell of itself since the day Chapman left. Maybe his ratings weren't what they were years ago, but KVIL had FUN written all over it. They spent money for sure, but they made MILLIONS in return. It was common sense radio run by professionals. Your "victor" and their huge 3-share will never be on top again, and I think you're smart enough to already know that. So cut the crap. Infinity could bring the real KVIL back in two books. They just don't have anybody in the building capable of doing it. And unfortunately, that's not going to change.
 
> C> You know, what a lot of people need to realize is the
> fact
> > that the old KVIL we all knew and loved...IS GONE. Dead,
> > buried, and even Easter won't resurect the corpse! It's
> > over, now - GET over it.
> > And guess what? The ratings have gone UP. It may not be
> > what you like, what I prefer, and it surely has no shadow
> of
> > an image related to the past (on purpose), and many will
> > argue they have no competition...BUT, the ratings are up
> and
> > nothing speaks louder than that. On the competition
> front,
> > remember too, that there is a reason there is no
> competition
> > in the format - the others couldn't succeed at it. There
> is
> > a pretty good argument that Lite 103.7 stayed in the
> format
> > and through whatever means, were able to emerge the
> victor.
> >
> > History is a wonderful thing and something to be
> cherished,
> > attempts to repeat it will almost always fail.
> >
> Your points are well taken, however, you need to be
> corrected on a few things here. We assume that the
> "competition who couldn't succeed" that you're talking about
> was Sunny. At the time that station was changed to Mexican
> oldies it was beating KVIL in every daypart except nights
> where Delilah has always done well. The "victor" sounded
> terrible then, and they sound maybe a little better today,
> but the reason we have to settle for such a mediocre product
> on 103.7 is because they don't want to spend the money to
> bring the legend back to form. You telling us to "get over
> it" is obviously a very weak excuse for the bland,
> sweeper-segue-jukebox version of a station that became
> literally a shell of itself since the day Chapman left.
> Maybe his ratings weren't what they were years ago, but KVIL
> had FUN written all over it. They spent money for sure, but
> they made MILLIONS in return. It was common sense radio run
> by professionals. Your "victor" and their huge 3-share will
> never be on top again, and I think you're smart enough to
> already know that. So cut the crap. Infinity could bring the
> real KVIL back in two books. They just don't have anybody in
> the building capable of doing it. And unfortunately, that's
> not going to change.
>
Excellent post! You have summed it up very well. It's sad there are too many who wave the white flag and submit to mediocre radio rather than strive harder to be a tremendous success,not a minor one.
 
Re: KVIL

> > already know that. So cut the crap. Infinity could bring
> the
> > real KVIL back in two books. They just don't have anybody
> in
> > the building capable of doing it. And unfortunately,
> that's
> > not going to change.
> >
> Excellent post! You have summed it up very well. It's sad
> there are too many who wave the white flag and submit to
> mediocre radio rather than strive harder to be a
> tremendous success,not a minor one.

Actually, I think that there are people in the building with the talent and skills to make KVIL sound as good as it did 20 years ago. It's simply that
they are Air Talent -- without the authority to call the shots.

The music sounds much better now, and if the DJs were allowed the same freedoms to adlib that those at KLUV enjoy, it would be a step in the right direction.

KVIL will never have a Ron Chapman morning show again. However, there are some people in town who could do a better job than KVIL's current morning show. For example, if Kevin McCarthy did KVIL morning drive produced by Lynne Haley, and featuring her occasionally. Something like that would be quite an entertaining morning show.

The general idea is that KVIL is sounding better than it did LAST year -- but still no way near as good as it did 20 years ago. Thus, while they've made progress, there is still room for improvement. I hope that management there will continue to make those improvements, rather than simply maintain the status quo...
 
You miss the point. We'd all LOVE to hear the great KVIL of old, but it ain't gonna happen. They BURIED it. It's gone.

Sunny was beating them, okay, but THEY QUIT!...along with everyone else. When all your competitors quit - that leaves you the victor, plain and simple.

Like it or not, 103.7 is rebounding, good for them, best of luck, knock your socks off...whatever. It is what it is.

I'm ALL for bringing back fun, entertaining radio and I personally think it would still KILL in the ratings but I don't see any entity willing to try it.

KLUV is the closest thing to it right now.
 
> You miss the point. We'd all LOVE to hear the great KVIL of
> old, but it ain't gonna happen. They BURIED it. It's gone.
>
>
> Sunny was beating them, okay, but THEY QUIT!...along with
> everyone else. When all your competitors quit - that leaves
> you the victor, plain and simple.
>
> Like it or not, 103.7 is rebounding, good for them, best of
> luck, knock your socks off...whatever. It is what it is.
>
> I'm ALL for bringing back fun, entertaining radio and I
> personally think it would still KILL in the ratings but I
> don't see any entity willing to try it.
>
> KLUV is the closest thing to it right now.
>
They didn't miss the point. You validated their point in your last paragraph in regards to fun. Can KVIL come back as it was? NO! Ron's gone and you need a strong person,and talented like him,not a lukewarm corporate nominee.The pont was no one is willing to rise up and fill the gap of entertaing,creative radio..no one. Thats the problem,too many conservative, tight fisted and tight wad suits control the landscape and the view is blighted.
 
Re: KVIL

> > > already know that. So cut the crap. Infinity could bring
>
> > the
> > > real KVIL back in two books. They just don't have
> anybody
> > in
> > > the building capable of doing it. And unfortunately,
> > that's
> > > not going to change.
> > >
> > Excellent post! You have summed it up very well. It's sad
> > there are too many who wave the white flag and submit to
> > mediocre radio rather than strive harder to be a
> > tremendous success,not a minor one.
>
> Actually, I think that there are people in the building with
> the talent and skills to make KVIL sound as good as it did
> 20 years ago. It's simply that
> they are Air Talent -- without the authority to call the
> shots.
>
> The music sounds much better now, and if the DJs were
> allowed the same freedoms to adlib that those at KLUV enjoy,
> it would be a step in the right direction.
>
> KVIL will never have a Ron Chapman morning show again.
> However, there are some people in town who could do a better
> job than KVIL's current morning show. For example, if Kevin
> McCarthy did KVIL morning drive produced by Lynne Haley, and
> featuring her occasionally. Something like that would be
> quite an entertaining morning show.
>
> The general idea is that KVIL is sounding better than it did
> LAST year -- but still no way near as good as it did 20
> years ago. Thus, while they've made progress, there is
> still room for improvement. I hope that management there
> will continue to make those improvements, rather than simply
> maintain the status quo...
>
I'm totally with you here except for the Kevin McCarthy part. Kevin's an EXCELLENT interviewer and a fairly good talk show host, but he's NOT a music air talent. Kevin use to fill in for Ron quite often, but Mr. Chapman decided that Kevin was not the man for the job. That's when he gave the job to Fast Eddie Coyle, who many believe did an incredible job during the many vacation weeks where Ron was away. If he hadn't gone to Sunny to do mornings, he probably would have had a fairly good shot at being Ron's successor. Chapman thought very highly of him and I'm sure he would have had his endorsement if he had stayed.
 
Re: KVIL

> I'm totally with you here except for the Kevin McCarthy
> part. Kevin's an EXCELLENT interviewer and a fairly good
> talk show host, but he's NOT a music air talent. Kevin use
> to fill in for Ron quite often, but Mr. Chapman decided that
> Kevin was not the man for the job. That's when he gave the
> job to Fast Eddie Coyle, who many believe did an incredible
> job during the many vacation weeks where Ron was away.

I wouldn't count out Kevin McCarthy as being part of a really good morning show. Actually, some could argue that McCarthy is better equipped to handle the kind of morning show that listeners flock to these days. Here in Dallas, Kidd and Howard have done incredibly well over the last decade with, let's face it, talk radio on music stations.

No dis to Fast Eddie or Chapman. I just wouldn't dismiss McCarthy so quickly.
 
Re: KVIL

Have you heard Kevin in the last year or two?
He rambles endlessly and seems to lose his way now on the Car Guy Show on WBAP.
I think you're remembering a great talent as he was, not as he is.
He seems to still be having problems getting his thoughts together.
As a student, I remember hearing about him having a nervous breakdown.
I don't know what the facts are or if he is fully recovered, but I don't think he could handle the pace of a morning show now.
>
> I wouldn't count out Kevin McCarthy as being part of a
> really good morning show. Actually, some could argue that
> McCarthy is better equipped to handle the kind of morning
> show that listeners flock to these days. Here in Dallas,
> Kidd and Howard have done incredibly well over the last
> decade with, let's face it, talk radio on music stations.
>
> No dis to Fast Eddie or Chapman. I just wouldn't dismiss
> McCarthy so quickly.
>
 
> You miss the point. We'd all LOVE to hear the great KVIL of
> old, but it ain't gonna happen. They BURIED it. It's gone.
>
>
> Sunny was beating them, okay, but THEY QUIT!...along with
> everyone else. When all your competitors quit - that leaves
> you the victor, plain and simple.
>
> Like it or not, 103.7 is rebounding, good for them, best of
> luck, knock your socks off...whatever. It is what it is.
>
> I'm ALL for bringing back fun, entertaining radio and I
> personally think it would still KILL in the ratings but I
> don't see any entity willing to try it.
>
> KLUV is the closest thing to it right now.
>
How do you say they quit? KEGL is getting ratings they haven't seen since the late 80s. They didn't quit, they just picked a better format. Even with the way Arbitron weights Hispanic books, you can't dismiss what they are doing in the ratings.
 
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