"Trying to Figure Out HD Radio" MSNBC

[PocketRadio]

"Trying to Figure Out HD Radio" MSNBC

"A survey released May 23, radio researcher Bridge Data estimates there are only 450,000 weekly listeners of HD Radio--compared with 15 million satellite subscribers and 57 million Internet radio listeners."

With about 150,000 HD radios in the hands of radio-geeks, at best (minus returns), we now know that 300,000 consumers have chosen not to buy expensive, problematic HD radios and listen directly on-line - why not ?

"But the cost of an HD license [all manufacturers must have one] has driven up the price of making an HD device so much that extras such as satellite receivers, Apple (AAPL) iPod cradles, or even CD players, are left out."

Looks like iNiquity keeps waiving their $40+ licensing fees, in a desperate attempt to generate consumer interest, by offering $40 rebates - how long can that go on ?

"So far, carmakers are slow to come on board. But in January, BMW became the first to offer HD Radio as an option across its entire line, and Hyundai and Jaguar both offer the option on some models."

Failed to mention that the Big 3 have rejected HD Radio, and that 30% to 50% of new cars will have standard/optional Satellite Radio, within the next two years (love our in-dash Satellite Radio that we just got on our new 2007 Ford Fussion, with a free 6 month trial)

"On the portable front, Samsung has an agreement with iBiquity that may allow it to unveil a portable HD Radio sometime in 2008, though details have yet to be released."

Good luck, with battery life and reception, without AM-loop and external FM-dipole antennas. Make sure, that it is not used in moving vehicles, due to the Doppler Effect and parallel digital/analog audio processing.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18920714/

"Trying to figure out HD Radio" - so are we !

 

[Mike Walker]

Blah, blah, blah. And SONY now makes HD radios. Not long ago you people were bitching about "no big companies". Try SONY, Kenwood, JVC, Yamaha, Sangean...you know...THE BIGGEST NAMES IN THE BUSINESS!

Then you were bitching that there "were no car radios". Well there sure as hell are now.

Then that "no factory-installed units are available". THEY ARE NOW!

And that "no major retailers carry HD radio". Well, try Best Buy, Wal Mart, Target, Circuit City, Radio Shack, Sams Club, and the biggest of them all, WAL MART!

Oh and the "lack of stations"? Try EVERY SINGLE TOP 100 MARKET SERVED BY MULTIPLE STATIONS, and multicast outlets.

As months have ticked by, EVERYTHING you guys have bitched about has been addressed. EVERYTHING. And the portables ARE coming, and WILL work, and we WILL REMEMBER another bogus prediction. With a track record like that, you guys should work for the Bush Administration!

 

[PocketRadio]

Blah, blah, blah...

"At Hyundai, Branding Is Job 2"

"Despite receiving high marks for quality, the carmaker has struggled with stalled sales."

http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/07_21/b4035069.htm

"Would the sale of Jaguar involve Land Rover, too?"

"Chief among them is possibly selling off Jaguar, which of the four members of Ford's Premier Automotive Group, has shown the least potential for profitability."

http://www.autoblog.com/2006/08/03/would-the-sale-of-jaguar-involve-land-rover-too/

BMW offers the only hope for in-dash HD Radio, as a $500 option - good luck with that one, too.

 

[Mike Walker]

If I sell 500 million widgets this year, and 500 million widgets again next year, then my sales are "stalled"...they neither went up, nor down. But if 500 million widgets puts me in the top tier of widget makers, I think I'm in good shape.

As for BMW and "good luck with that one", nobody who spends 50 grand on a car is EVER gonna' say "I want all the options". Nope. It would never happen

People who buy luxury cars don't quibble over 500 dollar options. GEEZ!

 

[wgliradio]

Blah, blah, blah. And SONY now makes HD radios. Not long ago you people were bitching about "no big companies". Try SONY, Kenwood, JVC, Yamaha, Sangean...you know...THE BIGGEST NAMES IN THE BUSINESS!

Quoting David Eduardo:

no major manufacturer made a large commitment to HD prior to knowing the FCC would give an unqualified approval, which happened less than 60 days ago.

=====

One of your own. I disagreed and said that even WITH all the majors behind it, HD has been stalled... and it has.

 

[Mike Walker]

"Stalled". With more of everything, and new announcements every week. "Stalled"...like that.

 

[wgliradio]

"Stalled". With more of everything, and new announcements every week. "Stalled"...like that.

Announcements only we notice. The public has moved on. If they want radio, I don't think they care how they get it, HD or analog. As far as getting the public to notice or really care, it is stalled.

 

[clouseau]

With about 150,000 HD radios in the hands of radio-geeks, at best (minus returns), we now know that 300,000 consumers have chosen not to buy expensive, problematic HD radios and listen directly on-line - why not ?

This is not quoted from any source. This is YOUR "Expert analysis". Lets see how it stacks up.

With about 150,000 HD radios

A number quoted 3 months ago with no time frame. I guess you think NO RADIOS have been sold in 3 months. Great Accuracy.

in the hands of radio-geeks

Made up, you don't have ANY info on who buys. No one does AFAIK.

we now know that 300,000 consumers have chosen not to buy expensive, problematic HD radios and listen directly on-line

Somehow you think they are listening to HD radio on the internet? And they count as HD radio listeners? It's been pointed out several times that they are not HD radio listeners, but INTERNET radio listeners. I see this doesn't support your assertion, but feel free to actually consider the facts before telling us about reality..

Thanks goodness we're back to the article...

"But the cost of an HD license [all manufacturers must have one] has driven up the price of making an HD device so much that extras such as satellite receivers, Apple (AAPL) iPod cradles, or even CD players, are left out."

For Now...

Looks like iNiquity keeps waiving their $40+ licensing fees, in a desperate attempt to generate consumer interest, by offering $40 rebates - how long can that go on ?

OK, you don't know about the license fee. It has not been released.

It's pretty funny actually. We're running up on the first quarter anniversary of HD official adaptation. The new rules are still not out. Am is still off at night. And you continue to show signs of the demise.

"So far, carmakers are slow to come on board. But in January, BMW became the first to offer HD Radio as an option across its entire line, and Hyundai and Jaguar both offer the option on some models."

It's a start.

Failed to mention that the Big 3 have rejected HD Radio,

I think they failed to mention Sony had no plans to offer it either. Oh wait, never mind. For now, the Big 3" have no plans to add. NOT rejected. Sorry.

"On the portable front, Samsung has an agreement with iBiquity that may allow it to unveil a portable HD Radio sometime in 2008, though details have yet to be released."

Yep.

Good luck, with battery life and reception, without AM-loop and external FM-dipole antennas.

I don't think luck will be required.

Clouseau

 

[PocketRadio]

This is not quoted from any source... OK, you don't know about the license fee. It has not been released.

"Trying to Figure Out HD Radio" MSNBC

"A variety of multifunction tabletop stereos with HD Radio have been on the market since 2004 (BusinessWeek recently reviewed six of them). But the cost of an HD license (all manufacturers must have one) has driven up the price of making an HD device so much that extras such as satellite receivers, Apple (AAPL) iPod cradles, or even CD players, are left out."

http://tinyurl.com/yqmwuj

“But is ‘availability’ of HD radios the problem?”

“And one broadcaster reported to me that he asked an iBiquity rep how many HD radios had actually been sold as of the most recent accounting. And this was his answer: 150,000.”

http://www.hear2.com/2007/04/but_is_availabi.html

Quoted from an iBiquity representative, which is no doubt over-stated and would not include the number of HD radios returned.

 

[R.F. Burns]

This is not quoted from any source... OK, you don't know about the license fee. It has not been released.

"Trying to Figure Out HD Radio" MSNBC

"A variety of multifunction tabletop stereos with HD Radio have been on the market since 2004 (BusinessWeek recently reviewed six of them). But the cost of an HD license (all manufacturers must have one) has driven up the price of making an HD device so much that extras such as satellite receivers, Apple (AAPL) iPod cradles, or even CD players, are left out."

http://tinyurl.com/yqmwuj

“But is ‘availability’ of HD radios the problem?”

“And one broadcaster reported to me that he asked an iBiquity rep how many HD radios had actually been sold as of the most recent accounting. And this was his answer: 150,000.”

http://www.hear2.com/2007/04/but_is_availabi.html

Quoted from an iBiquity representative, which is no doubt over-stated and would not include the number of HD radios returned.

MSNBC since the Imus show was taken off the air = If a tree falls in a forrest...

 

[wgliradio]

They are down to 177,000 viewers. This week Scarborough. Good luck.

 

[Tom Wells]

If I sell 500 million widgets this year, and 500 million widgets again next year, then my sales are "stalled"...they neither went up, nor down. But if 500 million widgets puts me in the top tier of widget makers, I think I'm in good shape.

As for BMW and "good luck with that one", nobody who spends 50 grand on a car is EVER gonna' say "I want all the options". Nope. It would never happen

People who buy luxury cars don't quibble over 500 dollar options. GEEZ!

Yesterday I interviewed Lou, the pressman who bought the 2007 BMW M5. It cost near $100K.
He is 40 years old, has money to spend, and likes classic rock.
I would think he'd be exactly the customer ibiquity would like to attract.
He did research his choices, has heard the HD commercials, and decided he wanted no part of it.
He said the salesperson made no mention or offer of HD radio being an option.
He is so fed up with the limited playlists and strangled formats that he says he has no faith in terrestial broadcast to do any better, regardless
of delivery method or alternate streams.
He is quite happy with his sat radio. With the full color integrated display for navigation, sat radio, I suspect this option was more than 500 dollars.

I asked him if he might consider an HD radio for the home.
The look he gave was priceless.

This guy was the vey model of the typical consumer described by Pocketradio and Supercaster.
Well informed, has money to spend, and ignoring HD. Not for being ignorant of it, but having chosen to ignore it.
He's also not happy that the Cub's games are now all mushy on WGN.
I can't say I blame him.

 

[radiopilot]

If I sell 500 million widgets this year, and 500 million widgets again next year, then my sales are "stalled"...they neither went up, nor down. But if 500 million widgets puts me in the top tier of widget makers, I think I'm in good shape.

As for BMW and "good luck with that one", nobody who spends 50 grand on a car is EVER gonna' say "I want all the options". Nope. It would never happen

People who buy luxury cars don't quibble over 500 dollar options. GEEZ!

Yesterday I interviewed Lou, the pressman who bought the 2007 BMW M5. It cost near $100K.
He is 40 years old, has money to spend, and likes classic rock.
I would think he'd be exactly the customer ibiquity would like to attract.
He did research his choices, has heard the HD commercials, and decided he wanted no part of it.
He said the salesperson made no mention or offer of HD radio being an option.
He is so fed up with the limited playlists and strangled formats that he says he has no faith in terrestial broadcast to do any better, regardless
of delivery method or alternate streams.
He is quite happy with his sat radio. With the full color integrated display for navigation, sat radio, I suspect this option was more than 500 dollars.

I asked him if he might consider an HD radio for the home.
The look he gave was priceless.

This guy was the vey model of the typical consumer described by Pocketradio and Supercaster.
Well informed, has money to spend, and ignoring HD. Not for being ignorant of it, but having chosen to ignore it.
He's also not happy that the Cub's games are now all mushy on WGN.
I can't say I blame him.

This is a typical example of someone who has the means, knows about HD radio and chooses not to buy one. If he were a radio geek I'm sure he would have contemplated buying an HD option for the car.

How many consumers in the market for products aren't of the same philosphy of the above example regardless of the money in your pocket?

HD radio is a technology 15 years too late!

Radiopilot

 

[Mike Walker]

Yeah, a guy with a car costing a hundred grand, who subscribes to pay radio, is "the very model of a typical consumer".

Wait...satellite radio has a TOTAL of 15 million listeners, vs. 270 million for terrestrial radio. So satellite ain't that "typical", is it?

So I guess having a 100,000 dollar car makes him typical? Maybe not.

Yeah...he's the "typical consumer", alright!

I'd wager a week's pay that more Americans have HD radios than 100 grand cars NOW!

 

[radiopilot]

Yeah, a guy with a car costing a hundred grand, who subscribes to pay radio, is "the very model of a typical consumer".

Wait...satellite radio has a TOTAL of 15 million listeners, vs. 270 million for terrestrial radio. So satellite ain't that "typical", is it?

So I guess having a 100,000 dollar car makes him typical? Maybe not.

Yeah...he's the "typical consumer", alright!

I'd wager a week's pay that more Americans have HD radios than 100 grand cars NOW!

Ok Mike I'll bite..

My daughter is in college, I bought her a Mazda 3i this past year.. it came with satelite radio, NO HD option, I pay her payments for this car and she pays the satelite fee: Sirius for 12.95 a month, now the car cost less than $15,000 out the door...is this a typical consumer? YOU BET it is... and if I and she can afford this than there are millions like me...

Sure if I can afford to buy a BMW 725 series car, I'd sure bet it won't have an HD radio in it, instead I'd have the VERY best it could have and it would be XM/Sirius/GPS/IPOD/MP3 player and if regular AM/FM and CD player came with it FINE...

So you see Mike the typical wealthy person could care less about HD radio and the typical wage earner making less than 50,000 a year could care less about HD radio.

Radiopilot

 

[Mike Walker]

There's an enormous difference between the "typical consumer", and the "typical wealthy person". You know as well as I do that you're comparing .2 percent of the population or less (those who spend 100 grand on a car) with "the rest of us".

Personally I wouldn't spend 100 grand on a car if I could afford it. Now on RADIO equipment....

Hey...I subscribe to satellite radio (XM) as I've said many times. And I have no illusions that I'm "typical". 15 million subscribers in a country of 300 million. I'm in a specialized niche. So are people who buy 100,000 dollar cars!

 

[radiopilot]

There's an enormous difference between the "typical consumer", and the "typical wealthy person". You know as well as I do that you're comparing .2 percent of the population or less (those who spend 100 grand on a car) with "the rest of us".

Personally I wouldn't spend 100 grand on a car if I could afford it. Now on RADIO equipment....

Hey...I subscribe to satellite radio (XM) as I've said many times. And I have no illusions that I'm "typical". 15 million subscribers in a country of 300 million. I'm in a specialized niche. So are people who buy 100,000 dollar cars!

First of all not all 300 million in this country are sporting radios like you say unless you've seen 6yr olds sporting headphones listening to radio, I wonder just where Arbitron gets those numbers too..

Unfortunately you must not live in an area where there are tons of BMWs, Jaguars, Lexus, Range Rovers, Mercedes, Porsches, etc. as they do here in South Florida, I can tell you there is money here and these people are the prime targets of HD radio YET they are not biting onto the HD radio craze...

Radiopilot

 

[scanman1]

Quote: "...and the typical wage earner making less than 50,000 a year could care less about HD radio."

I guess I'm not typical after all . I fit this category and love my HD radio. 8)

 

[radiopilot]

Quote: "...and the typical wage earner making less than 50,000 a year could care less about HD radio."

I guess I'm not typical after all . I fit this category and love my HD radio. 8)

This is no different than any other hobby... let's take photography...

Nikon and Canon make $2000+ SLR cameras for amateurs and professionals and then they make 100-300 dollar cameras for everyday folk... although excellent quality they conform to the majority of consumers out there, I have both types of digital cameras SLR and the pocket Nikons and love them both... they each have something different to offer.

HD Radios are no different, some people don't mind spending $500 or more for these radios and some don't want to spend more than 50 dollars for a radio, it's how much you ENJOY the hobby.

For you it doesn't matter the cost as long as you have one regardless of your income, but you have to admit that if you're on this board it qualifies you as a radio geek... for every 1 radio geek here there are 50,000 non-radio geeks out there that could care less that broadcasters are touting HD.

Radiopilot

 

[scanman1]

Quote: "For you it doesn't matter the cost as long as you have one regardless of your income, but you have to admit that if you're on this board it qualifies you as a radio geek... "

Yes, I admit it. While everyone else is toting MP3 players around, I'm toting radios.

Quote: "for every 1 radio geek here there are 50,000 non-radio geeks out there that could care less that broadcasters are touting HD."

And that kinda sucks. But whatcha gonna do? I Just hope that changes, because if it doesn't, it's back to analog for me after HD is gone. 8)