UNITY 2000 settings suggestions

[JackReynolds 983]

Does anyone have clean, loud settings suggestions for a Cutting Edge Unity 2000. I have the older one without the jog wheel. We're looking to make a CHR sound as great as we can with this unit. THANKS!

 

[FFoti1]

Does anyone have clean, loud settings suggestions for a Cutting Edge Unity 2000. I have the older one without the jog wheel. We're looking to make a CHR sound as great as we can with this unit. THANKS!

Please contact our Support Dept at (216) 241-3343, and they'll be able to assist you.

-Frank Foti

 

[JackReynolds 983]

Thanks Frank!

 

[BobOnTheJob]

Does anyone have clean, loud settings suggestions for a Cutting Edge Unity 2000. I have the older one without the jog wheel. We're looking to make a CHR sound as great as we can with this unit. THANKS!

I tried one of these back in the 80's & even with tech support's guidance, I could never arrive at a setting that didn't have objectionable sibilance distortion on a live microphone. We went back to the barefoot Optimod 8100A & the sibilance issue was not there, so I'm certain it was something particular to the 2000. For a very long time, that item poisoned my opinion of their products. Fortunately, I gave them another chance when Omnia 5 AM's & Omnia 6 FM's started falling into my lap. They make fantastic products today...Please let us know how your quest for a loud clean sound comes out with the 2000...especially in terms of how clean the on air microphone sounds when speaking a word with strong "s" sounds in it.

 

[JackReynolds 983]

You're right about the high end issue. I've always heard it was a problem with the phase rotator.

For a 15 year old unit, our sounds pretty good---I admit I'm hitting the clipper a little too hard and plan to back off.

I did notice the built in AGC made the base sound pumpy so I'm using a compellor ahead of the 2000.

 

[cgould]

The sibilance issue is not a phase rotator problem. It is simply the fact that you are hitting the FM clipper too hard with HF energy.

Some tricks to help you tame them involve finding the right attack / release times on the upper two bands for your format. The slower the attack time, the more energy is going to bang into the clipper, and give you sibilance problems...the faster, the better the issue becomes with the tradeoff being a loss of HF energy / transparancy.

One trick I've heard users do was to run the pre-emphasis at 50 uS, and adjust the limiter mix control to make up the difference. This will help, but the stuff about attack and release still apply.

It is possible to tame that problem.

With the Unity, you really need to understand what's going on to get it to sound somewhat decent, so really read the manual fully and really understand what you're up to. It gives you LOTS of rope to hang yourself!

With all that being said, it's going to be really difficult to get the thing to be as loud and clean as the DSP offerings of today. The Omnias were born from the same factory as the Unity, but the technology only bears a really really vague resemblance to the advanced functionality of even the first Omnia processor. The Omnia units took the best of what was in the Unity, built upon them, and added a slew of very advanced technologies to the mix.

-Cornelius

 

[stace]

True True. Although I'm using one 2000i with the jog wheel the issue remains the same.

I actually really like the concept of the Unity. The way the AGC goes into wait mode, the the above / below unity gain I think is something Frank should have played around with a little more...I guess he had his reason for moving to flat out 'gain reduction'.

I also reduced attack time on high and presence band limiters to reduce high end harmonic distortion issues. What I found would happen alot was drums and voices in general sounded very clippy and inconsistant. More limiter action was the fix. Also don't drive the mid band limiter too hard!

Another issue was when the unit gates. The levellers return to unity gain, but the limiters carry on releasing all gain. And if you have no gain reduction in the high bands, and alot in the mid-low bands (as in most presets) the spectral ballance during passages that drop below the gate often, such as live voice wanders.

Long story short, reduce attack time on high and pres limiters, and reduce drive to bass and mid limiters. Make up loss of loudness with a quicker release time on those lower bands.

 

[FFoti1]

True True. Although I'm using one 2000i with the jog wheel the issue remains the same.

I actually really like the concept of the Unity. The way the AGC goes into wait mode, the the above / below unity gain I think is something Frank should have played around with a little more...I guess he had his reason for moving to flat out 'gain reduction'.

I also reduced attack time on high and presence band limiters to reduce high end harmonic distortion issues. What I found would happen alot was drums and voices in general sounded very clippy and inconsistant. More limiter action was the fix. Also don't drive the mid band limiter too hard!

Another issue was when the unit gates. The levellers return to unity gain, but the limiters carry on releasing all gain. And if you have no gain reduction in the high bands, and alot in the mid-low bands (as in most presets) the spectral ballance during passages that drop below the gate often, such as live voice wanders.

Long story short, reduce attack time on high and pres limiters, and reduce drive to bass and mid limiters. Make up loss of loudness with a quicker release time on those lower bands.

The AGC does not operate on a flat out gain reduction platform. All of the AGCs are based upon a fixed gain platform, and then increase or decrease gain based upon the average value of the incoming audio to the AGC section. The 'wait' function is like a window between the gain increase and decrease modes.

-Frank Foti

 

[stace]

The AGC does not operate on a flat out gain reduction platform. All of the AGCs are based upon a fixed gain platform, and then increase or decrease gain based upon the average value of the incoming audio to the AGC section. The 'wait' function is like a window between the gain increase and decrease modes.

Sorry Frank I meant I like the concept of above and below unity. What I was curious about was, what made you change to using 'gain reduction' in later processors?

I would like the opportunity to lower the 'gate' on the presence and 'high' bands without lowering it on the mid and low bands like in the Omnias...is this possible? I find some material can initially sound dull but the high end kind of wakes up when the gate is released. This is why I prefer the band coupling idea on the high bands. The only gate control I know of is one that lowers the gate level on all of the 'levellers'...

 

[cgould]

"What I was curious about was, what made you change to using 'gain reduction' in later processors?"

You can run the Omnia in either mode. You can assign what the idle gain is by dialing in -5, -10, or -15 dB. Turning this off gives the "flat gain reduction" you are talking about.

This is possible on all the Omnia AGC's (wide and multiband).

"I would like the opportunity to lower the 'gate' on the presence and 'high' bands without lowering it on the mid and low bands like in the Omnias...is this possible? ..."

Yes...In the Omnia

Everything you pointed out was addressed in the Omnia series of processors.

 

[FFoti1]

Sorry Frank I meant I like the concept of above and below unity. What I was curious about was, what made you change to using 'gain reduction' in later processors?

I would like the opportunity to lower the 'gate' on the presence and 'high' bands without lowering it on the mid and low bands like in the Omnias...is this possible? I find some material can initially sound dull but the high end kind of wakes up when the gate is released. This is why I prefer the band coupling idea on the high bands. The only gate control I know of is one that lowers the gate level on all of the 'levellers'...

Ah...We didn't change anything when the Omnia platform came out. That operates off the same concept as the Unity, except that we designed the control loops to be actual RMS based functions. If anything, we offer more in the Omnia, as you can set the platform to freeze, or return to a specified platform level. The concept grew out of the Unity design, but with much more precision, and better sounding control.

If you have a set of schematics, you can create a gating method, in the Unity, as you desire, but you'll need to do some internal mods.

-Frank Foti

 

[stace]

Thanks

The concept grew out of the Unity design, but with much more precision, and better sounding control.
-Frank Foti

It's amazing how much of the Unity I hear in your current stuff, only the stuff I don't like isn't there

 

[audiophile.]

In my experience the Unity blows the doors off a FM 3 Turbo...

 

[stace]

In my experience the Unity blows the doors off a FM 3 Turbo...

You know I've had a situation where three stations on the same network that would be playing the same song at the same time, and there was one spot where you could clearly pick up all three. One with a 3fmt, one with a Unity 2000i, and one with an Omnia 6. The 6 was far above the other two, but for the same loudness the Unity was much cleaner and clearer than the 3fmt :-\

 

[Martijn]

Talking about schematics, anyone? I noticed some modifications in the Unity I bought some time ago. Some of the mod's I do not understand but maybe with the schematics.
Also the various jumper settings are not clear to me. From the downloadable version on the Omnia telos site it is hard te tell how the jumpers should be set.

Regards,

Martijn