• Get involved.
    We want your input!
    Apply for Membership and join the conversations about everything related to broadcasting.

    After we receive your registration, a moderator will review it. After your registration is approved, you will be permitted to post.
    If you use a disposable or false email address, your registration will be rejected.

    After your membership is approved, please take a minute to tell us a little bit about yourself.
    https://www.radiodiscussions.com/forums/introduce-yourself.1088/

    Thanks in advance and have fun!
    RadioDiscussions Administrators

Vocal that the format needs

N

Nock

Check out Bliss Bliss - Life So Far. A very well produced, nice sounding project that is a unique vocal that is fresh and something that I will actually spin. Then I read the liner notes and find out they are from just down the road from me. Check em out. So much more then Country going on in this town, y'all!

Nock
 
In the early years of NAC/Smooth Jazz (1986-1991), I remember hearing a fair amount of 'Sophisti-Pop' artists like Basia, Matt Bianco, Everything But The Girl, Swing Out Sister, and Michael Franks mixed into the format; I also recall hearing Brazilian vocalists like Djavan & Bebel Gilberto; and I even remember hearing eclectic, jazzy-pop tracks like "Cowboys & Angels" by George Michael (from his 1991 'Listen Without Prejudice' album), and a song called "The Kingdom" by Australian pop-rock band 'Icehouse' on KYOT Phoenix in 1993.

I'd like to get the opinion of this board: What value, if any, do you think these kinds of artists/tracks brought to 'Smooth Jazz' then; are there similar artists/tracks viable for the format today? If so, who/which?

I'll start by offering my own opinion: While I have always enjoyed hearing Luther Vandross, Sade, The Temptations, Sting, Stevie Wonder & Michael McDonald on Smooth Jazz radio, what has always excited me most was the chance to discover the more eclectic artists; a main reason I'm constantly raving on this forum about CIWV-FM Toronto (http://www.wave947.fm) is because they continue to include many of these artists on their playlist.

As always, I eagerly await your thoughts...

MediaMaven
 
Media_Maven said:
In the early years of NAC/Smooth Jazz (1986-1991), I remember hearing a fair amount of 'Sophisti-Pop' artists like Basia, Matt Bianco, Everything But The Girl, Swing Out Sister, and Michael Franks mixed into the format
Click to expand...

I don't know about the others, but I miss hearing these artists. Some of the stations will give the one or two Basia songs that been run to death and all of the stations have played, "Missing" from Everything But The Girl way too much. What I am saying, is that they are many great songs from these two artists along with the others you mentioned that they should play along with all the great instrumental tracks that they don't cover anymore or won't.

Media_Maven said:
I'll start by offering my own opinion: While I have always enjoyed hearing Luther Vandross, Sade, The Temptations, Sting, Stevie Wonder & Michael McDonald on Smooth Jazz radio
Click to expand...

While I don't mind an occasional rarely played track of Sade and Luther Vandross, just "sprinkle them in lightly". As for Stevie Wonder, I used to like listening to him, but smooth jazz radio stations have played his music so much now, that whenever I hear one of his tracks being played, I turn down the volume. I believe a lot of the old school R&B should be left out of the format.

Anyways, there are a lot of songs out there that fit in well with the format, even though the artist may not be a "smooth jazz" artist. That's just my two cents. ;D
 
My friend was a big mover and shaker in radio-She was through it all-When Bebel Gilberto blew up all over the world she talked to many people in SJ radio advising them to embrace Bebl for the Format. her song So Nice was a worldwide hit-BA and other stations turned it down right away. These folks had no vision,didn't care about embracing new artists and songs-They had a very narrow vision of what should work.I'm also noticing another year of the same artists in different combinations playing package shows
 
My private Smooth Jazz playlist includes a sprinkling of vocal tracks, about 5 percent of total. Certain vocals from eclectic artists blend terrifically well with Smooth Jazz instrumentals when they're mixed together in appropriate doses.

Here's a sampling of vocals from my own playlist. My taste bleeds into the 'grey' area of dance pop and chill; so they may not appeal to all. But tracks like these were a mainstay on 94.7 "The Wave" and other great stations in their heyday.

Barrier Feat. Themis - Sonhando Ipanema
Pete Belasco - Love Train
Van Morrison - Did Ye Get Healed?
Samantha James - Angel Love
Vanessa Daou- Two To Tango
Lemongrass - This Way
Sade - Clean Heart
Sade - Kiss Of Life
Donald Fagan - H Gang
Steeley Dan - Home At Last
Chris De Burgh - Sailing Away
Jody Whatley - Whatever
Simply Red - Sunrise
Daryl Hall - Cabdriver
David Pack - That Girl Is Gone
Al Jarreau - One Way
Swing Out Sister - Surrender (live version)
John Legend - Save Room
Michael Tomlinson - Sunlight
Everything But The Girl - Cross My Heart
Donny Osmond - Breeze On By
Bernard Oattes - On The Fairway
Bernard Oattes - The Grand Design
Bernard Oattes - Slidding Away
Basia - Blame It On The Summer
Basia - Miles Away
Matt Bianco - Golden Days
Allon Sams - The Sun Will Shine
Spencer Day - Till You Come Again
Chris Rea - On The Beach
Seal - Touch
George Benson - Kiss And Make Up
Howard Hewitt - I'm For Real
Eumir Deodato & Al Jarreau - Double Face
Bliss - Kissing
Harbor Wind - Keiko Matsui

These tracks have a dance/pop influence that I find appealing, but might not suit everyone:

Tahiti 80 - The Train
Michael Franks - The Camera Never Lies
Bryan Ferry - Don't Stop The Dance
IceHouse - The Kingdom
NightCruiser - The Call
 
smoothguy said:
My private Smooth Jazz playlist includes a sprinkling of vocal tracks, about 5 percent of total. Certain vocals from eclectic artists blend terrifically well with Smooth Jazz instrumentals when they're mixed together in appropriate doses.

Here's a sampling of vocals from my own playlist. My taste bleeds into the 'grey' area of dance pop and chill; so they may not appeal to all. But tracks like these were a mainstay on 94.7 "The Wave" and other great stations in their heyday.

Barrier Feat. Themis - Sonhando Ipanema
Pete Belasco - Love Train
Van Morrison - Did Ye Get Healed?
Samantha James - Angel Love
Vanessa Daou- Two To Tango
Lemongrass - This Way
Sade - Clean Heart
Sade - Kiss Of Life
Donald Fagan - H Gang
Steeley Dan - Home At Last
Chris De Burgh - Sailing Away
Jody Whatley - Whatever
Simply Red - Sunrise
Daryl Hall - Cabdriver
David Pack - That Girl Is Gone
Al Jarreau - One Way
Swing Out Sister - Surrender (live version)
John Legend - Save Room
Michael Tomlinson - Sunlight
Everything But The Girl - Cross My Heart
Donny Osmond - Breeze On By
Bernard Oattes - On The Fairway
Bernard Oattes - The Grand Design
Bernard Oattes - Slidding Away
Basia - Blame It On The Summer
Basia - Miles Away
Matt Bianco - Golden Days
Allon Sams - The Sun Will Shine
Spencer Day - Till You Come Again
Chris Rea - On The Beach
Seal - Touch
George Benson - Kiss And Make Up
Howard Hewitt - I'm For Real
Eumir Deodato & Al Jarreau - Double Face
Bliss - Kissing
Harbor Wind - Keiko Matsui

These tracks have a dance/pop influence that I find appealing, but might not suit everyone:

Tahiti 80 - The Train
Michael Franks - The Camera Never Lies
Bryan Ferry - Don't Stop The Dance
IceHouse - The Kingdom
NightCruiser - The Call
Click to expand...

Smoothguy, my man! How goes it??? A good number of these vocal selections look vaguely familiar. ;) Let me add a few that you all may not think would work with contemporary instrumentals, but they are some of my personal favorites:

Roxy Music - More Than This
Brian Ferry - Don't Stop The Dance
Darden Smith - Lovin' Arms
Jude Cole - Time For Letting Go
Steve Winwood - My Love's Leavin'
Steve Winwood - In The Light Of Day
Tasmin Archer - Sleeping Satellite
Celine Dion (w/Kenny G) - Halfway To Heaven
Phil Collins - Do Nothin' Till You Hear From Me
Phil Collins (w/Sting) - Long Long Way To Go

A couple Karukas' vocals I love:

Time Could Pass (Jonathan Butler)
I Keep It To Myself (Shelby Flint)

A few I want to add but can't quite muster the guts!

Hall & Oates - Don't Hold Back Your Love
Kenny Loggins - The Real Thing
INXS - Not Enough Time

The loyal listener who requested the Shahin and Sepeher tune threatened to drive hundreds of miles to smash the station computer over my head if I added...

KD Lang - Miss Chatelaine :D :D :D
 
Forgot to mention:

Wham - Different Corner (that one is in there, BTW :D)
 
Man, you guys are putting out some good tracks. ;) I have a few I add too.

Eliane Elias - Running
Mindi Abair - Everytime
Dave Koz and Luther Vandross - Can't Let You Go
Joyce Cooling - Cool of the Night
Richard Elliot -This Could Be Real
Paul Hardcastle - Smooth Jazz Is Bumpin

From Non Smooth Jazz Artists

Glenn Frey - You Belong to the City
Eilleen Shania Twain - The Heart Is Blind (Only Found On Complete Limelight Sessions 18 Track CD. (I think they call it a Single Remix or something like that. If you can't find it, the regular verison is on track four.
Don Johnson's (Yes, the actor) Voice On A Hotline, Can't Take Your Memory, Heartache Away, What If It Takes All Night

I have others, but it's late. ::)
 
I suspect my comments won't be popular in this thread, but here goes.

Drawing too much Urban or Adult Contemporary music into the format, or even too many vocals, suggests Smooth Jazz is being employed by radio management more as a promotional gimmick than as a long-term format choice. As a former programmer in the format, I believe a big part of Broadcast Architecture's current trajectory is a result of cloning what worked in Chicago to a bunch of markets that look nothing like Chicago.

A Smooth Jazz format which doesn't completely abuse the "jazz" part of its name has the potential to draw a small, fiercely loyal audience with terrific demographics, and if given some life promotionally can also be popular with agencies. But as soon as that niche is filled, the goal of management becomes broadening the format to increase cume, which theoretically evens out the dips and spikes in Arbitron, and that means more "familiar" (as in "played to death") music, and more vocals. Especially for stations which have been bought as fixer-uppers, and are being managed by career salespeople, niches don't hold their interest.

And, of course, as soon as a specialty format gets into "Adult-Contemporary-wanna-be" mode, the audience quality withers, and the station is no longer a distinct choice.

Smooth Jazz as defined by BA is too often neither smooth nor jazz. From a marketing standpoint, it would probably be much more effective to just call it "Smooth R&B" and get it over with. The name would more accurately describe what's played, including the instrumentals.

Sadly, Smooth Jazz as defined today is destined for HD2 channels in markets with substantial black populations, and not much else. It's a shame, because there are some supremely talented musicians in the format, and they're being pushed into unproductive style channels by misguided radio programming.
 
Completely agree, Paul. In fact, I think most of the regular posters on this board would also agree with you. We often have discussion about the "vocals" dilemma. I do think some vocals are needed as a change of pace, but to your point, they need to be the right vocals. And my instrumentals to vocals ratio is currently somewhere in the neighborhood of 8:1, and that seems to hit the spot with my diehard listeners. I try to find true NAC-era vocals, or underplayed AAA (and occasionally A/C) that have jazz elements. I also spin a lot of Steely Dan and Donald Fagen, but I do try to avoid the more "pop-sounding" tunes and focus on deeper cuts with jazz elements. But most importantly, I avoid the overplayed Urban A/C and R&B vocals you speak of (the BA strategy) that, IMO, were largely responsible for driving away base listeners and dragging the format down. The old proverb "Familiarity breeds contempt" is rather applicable here and something all Smooth Jazz programmers should be mindful of, both with instrumental and vocal selections.
 
I enjoyed the list of vocal tracks suggested by AC Tones, smoothguy, and Jazz_Kat; wow - I'd forgotten about a few of these gems! I think we're on the same page here.

A few more that I always thought Smooth Jazz should've embraced:

Koop feat. Yukimi Nagano - "Summer Sun" & "I See a Different You"
Level 42 - "Children Say"
Swing Out Sister - "Am I The Same Girl"
Ephraim Lewis - "Drowning In Your Eyes"
K.D. Lang - "Constant Craving" & "Help Me" -- especially if this version was available: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nt18OYGBLk4
Slim Man - "Fade To Gray"
Tears For Fears - "Advice For the Young at Heart"
Everything But the Girl - "Driving" & "Time After Time"
Beth Nielsen Chapman - "Walk My Way"
Double - "Captain of Her Heart"
George Michael - "Kissing A Fool" & "Desafinado" (feat. Bebel Gilberto)
Buckshot Lefonque - "Another Day" -- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QI6dxjxq4Fw
Gino Vannelli - "Sunset On L.A." & "Wild Horses"
Melody Gardot - "Baby, I'm a Fool"
Harry Connick, Jr. - "Recipe For Love"
Robert Palmer - "Every Kind of People", "Mercy Me/I Want You" & "Know By Now"
Bobby Caldwell - "Heart of Mine"
Van Morrison - "Someone Like You"
The Cooltrane Quartet - "Wonderwall" -- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6ggux2DI-Y
Brent Bourgeois - "Dare To Fall In Love"
Sting - "Englishman In New York" & "It's Probably Me"
Go West - "What You Won't Do For Love"
Peter Cox - "Tender Heart" & "They Whisper To Me"
Chris Rea - Josephine -- this version: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9BKKaa2hKKw

Could probably think of at least 100 more, but that's my short list
 
TERRIFIC list, Media_Maven! I need to look hard at adding a good number of these, definitely some are overlooked gems and I think can definitely work as change of pace cuts. One of my favorites from this list is the underplayed Tears For Fears' "Advice For The Young At Heart." I actually had that one in the rotation for a spell during my great vocals experiment of a couple years ago, in addition to Spandau Ballet's "Gold." Didn't sit particularly well with the diehard instrumental guys :D, but I was trying think out of the box a little. If you can believe it, I even tossed in Elton John's "Sweet Painted Lady," which to this day, remains my favorite Elton John tune of all time, followed by "Funeral For A Friend/Love Lies Bleeding In My Hand" and "Mona Lisas And Mad Hatters." Have also kicked around some other underplayed 70s pop/rock tunes like Player's "This Time I'm In It For Love", Poco's "In The Heart Of The Night", and although pop-flavored, even Ali Thompson's "Take A Little Rhythm." But I digress! ;D I realize this is the Smooth Jazz board, and I largely spin contemporary instrumental music old and new. But on occasion, I long for some of the vocals you and others have mentioned, and I think they have the vibe and are underplayed enough that they could work nicely as changed of pace tunes. Thanks for the suggestions!
 
Here are a few but by no means all of the cool vocals I used on the brunch..
Joni Mitchell - Help Me (this song still sounds amazing)
KD Laing - Anywhere But Here
Anisha Cay - Every Raindrop
BeBel Gilberto - Aganju (Latin Project Remix)
Bill Cantos - Morning Coffee
Bernard Oattes - island World
Billy Joel - Summer Highland Falls
Boz Scaggs - Some things Happen
Brettina - One
Carol Welsman - Brazasia
Chieli Minucci/Special EFX - HushABye (can't think of singers name)
Daniela Nardi - 485
Dido - No Angel
Five For Fighting - World
Jason Mraz - Bella Luna
Jamie Cullum - Wheels, Photograph
Jill Jenson - That's The Way of the World
Joe Jackson - Stepping Out (NEVER gets old!)
Kenny Loggins - Leap Of Faith
Karen Ramirez - Troubled Girl (spanish version is best)
Michael Buble - End of May
Mozella - Hurry Up and Choose (think Corrine B.R. without the childlike vocal affectations)
Pat Appleton - Smart Traveler
Raul Midon Don't Be A Silly Man, Love is the 7th Wave
Oleta Adams -Rhythm of Live
Seal - Lonliest Star
Sting - Big Lie, Small World, Come Down In Time
Vargo - The Flow
Robert Michaels - In the Air Tonight (thinks Bill H!)
Victor Davies - Morning Sun, Brother, Gold and Diamonds
Maysa w. Will Downing - Simple Life
 
Turned out to be a great topic, gang, although we ended up hijacking Nock's original post about Bliss Bliss. Sorry about that, brother ;). In any event, for my regular listeners, you are going to hear some vocals that may leave you scratching your head. I am sure I am going to get a few "WTH are you thinking?" and "Have you completely lost it?" e-mails, because I certainly got them the first time I experimented with these cuts about 2 years ago. ;D Here's the difference this time around. Last time, I was trying to be different for the sake of being different to get people talking about the station. This time around, it is purely for selfish reasons. I am doing this for me. Since I don't expect to have thousands of listeners anytime soon, and I am not getting any younger, I figure, WTH! "The .wav" has always been a reflection of my passion for the music I love. But there is a lot of music I love outside of the world of contemporary jazz that I have been dying to add to the playlist. Many of these vocals are some of my favorite of all time, and I am not ashamed to admit it. That said, you won't be hearing Whitesnake's "Still Of The Night", which I have been known on occasion to blare in the convertible on occasion. :D I think they work, at least for my ears they do, and offer the change of pace I strive for with my vocal selections. Some are quite familiar and dare I say, overplayed. But since you won't be hearing them repeat for about 10-14 days, I think slipping them in as a change of pace to what is an instrumental-heavy presentation won't be particularly offensive to my regular listeners. Bill and I had a nice discussion on this board a couple years ago about just playing "good music," and letting the chips fall where they may. So here goes nothin'! :)
 
As predicted, privately I have been getting flamed hard today by some of my diehard listeners for some of the vocal additions I have made over the last few days. It was anticipated, and I respect everyone's opinion. Instead of going into a lengthy rant about trying to justify my decision to add these songs, I am merely going to say, thanks for your support and hanging with me. For those of you who plan on sticking around and aren't going to let a very small number of what is 16 vocals MAX in a typical listening day make you walk, you have my word that I will continue to find and spin the best contemporary instrumental music I come across. If you respect my ear for this music, then I think you'll want to stick around. 8)
 
Excellent topic guys! I think vocals are definitely important to the format and makes thing more interesting :). I've got a few worth mentioning from all the hours of listening to my favorite SJ/NAC stations like "The .wav", 107.3 WNWV-HD2, CIWV 94.7, & others over the years. Here are a few on my iPod, I think are worth mentioning and maybe adding to your playlist. ;D

Ashling - Just One Look
Bobby Caldwell - Good to Me
Everything But The Girl - Understanding
Mr. Fingers - Survivor
Vonda Shepard - Don't Cry Illene
Oleta Adams - Slow Motion
Sarah McLachlan - Possession
Seal - Colour
Spur of the Moment - In My Corner (*Local group from DC. They had a track on one of the WJZW-105.9 CD samplers)
Al Jarreau - Random Act of Love
Swing Out Sister - Circulate
Natalie Cole - I Live For Your Love
Ronan Hardiman - That Place in Your Heart
Sade - In Another Time
Marilyn Scott - I'm Calling You
Slow Train Soul - Twisted Cupid
Amy Sky - Wicked Game
Skype - What's Wrong with Me
Seal - People Asking Why
Karla Bonoff - New World
Des'ree - Feel So High
Carol J Toca - I'm Yours
Lisa Stansfield - Never Set Me Free
Lizz Wright - Lead the Way
Norah Jones - Chasing Pirates
Phil Perry - One Heart One Love (* This is probably more R&Bish, but I first heard it on the former SJ in Raleigh WWND 102.9 (RIP) and fell in love with the song, because it sounded really good and I never heard it before)
Lisa Fisher/James "D-Train" Williams - You Moved Me To This
Brenda Russell - You Can't Hide Your Heart From Me



As for the die hard fans complaining about the vocals, well...folks have to remember that the original NAC format was pretty vocal heavy. The thing is to get a good mix of unique music that fits the format and not overplay songs that we can hear on other formats. Today in all genres that is unfortunately pretty hard on FM radio, since the music industry continues to the narrow down playlist. :)
 
You know AC, your station has been awesome for as long I have been listening. Only 16 vocal songs a day? BA and company go through that many in two hours. If they are going leave just because of this, maybe you are better off without them. I know I'm not going anywhere.

Take care buddy and the wav flowing smoothly. 8)
 
Jazz_Kat said:
You know AC, your station has been awesome for as long I have been listening. Only 16 vocal songs a day? BA and company go through that many in two hours. If they are going leave just because of this, maybe you are better off without them. I know I'm not going anywhere.

Take care buddy and the wav flowing smoothly. 8)
Click to expand...

It is what it is, Jazz_Kat. You can't make everyone happy. Never have, never will. And as a programmer, you can't take it personally. You just have to keep plugging away and roll with the punches. All I am asking is for listeners to look beyond the artist and their staple sound/genre, and listen to the song, namely to the vibe. I am sure there are plenty of purists who think I have no business playing Billy Idol, INXS, Duran Duran, Rod Stewart, Robert Plant, David Bowie, or Gary Wright alongside of contemporary jazz music. I think some are all too anxious to dismiss a song because of the overall perception (often negative) they have of the artist or he/she being associated with a mainstream genre. But my challenge to these same people is to listen to song. Forget about who is singing for a minute, and the music they are MOST notably know for. Listen to "Sweet Sixteen." Listen to "Not Enough Time." Listen to "Save A Prayer." How about "Passion"? "Little By Little"? "This Is Not America"? "I Really Wanna Know You"? As for the more familiar, why wouldn't Eddie Rabbit's "Suspicions" work? How about McCartney's "With A Little Luck"? Just curious.
 
Ultimately I think it comes down to how does it sound in the flow of the music mix and the context of how the station makes people feel. So it comes down to the instrumentals that surround the vocals, you can play an "out of place" vocal without freaking out the listeners if the songs surrounding it match in texture and tempo. That being said I think some songs are just too old, too burnt out, too out of place, or too likely to carry negative nostalgia baggage and those are all subjective things.
One of the worst train wrecks I ever heard was on a BA station that played Kenny G's "Songbird" into Clapton's "Wonderful Tonight".. That happens a lot when the music is being programmed by a computer (yeah, some folks don't edit their selector logs..they just put it in and let it roll)
 
Status
This thread has been closed due to inactivity. You can create a new thread to discuss this topic.


Back
Top Bottom