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W291CI 106.1 Jacksonville
- Thread starter olmjax
- Start date
I agree in large part with Kmagrill. White-collar workers are on the rise as well. The large land mass of the market would also suggest "the stick" should play a bigger role in picking the format. There are many vibes to the area. With so many diverse regions, listeners in some areas will be more supportive of certain formats than in others. I've done a number of marketing studies over the years and Otharadioman has it quite correct.
As far as the signal goes, yesterday morning (Saturday) The Dove was actually off the air and The Eagle was on instead. This wasn't the first time I noticed this. When The Dove returned, I was in Fruit Cove and decided to drive east along Race Track Rd to get back home and found the signal spotty at best. It stayed spotty even by the Avenues and for the first time I couldn't pick up the station at home in the JTB/Southside area.
Over the years I may have had my disagreements with Cox in how they do certain things, but they are very smart and they execute new formats flawlessly. Once all the kinks are worked out, I'm confident an underserved public will delight in their new find.
Repetition is probably in the ear of the beholder. I've always believed the average listener doesn't pay too much attention to a lot of things that ruffle the radio experts or even the very intense radio fan UNLESS something is power-played that they don't like. I've heard Gino Vannelli's "Living Inside Myself" a number of times. I just love that song and artist too. It was a hit in the early 80's and to this day it probably is in my top 5 favorite 80's songs of all times. For those who don't care for the song, hearing it too often can be a turn-off. The right programmer, the imaging and a segment of the public that just can't enough of all of it can make it all work.
Yesterday afternoon I was at the Tinsletown Publix and I ran into a former Magic 107.3 listener who I remember talking to from some of the station events. To paraphrase, she said radio in Jacksonville sucks and if you are an oldies lover, you have been pretty much jerked around by everybody.
I certainly hope Cox is not jerking us around and that the Dove isn't an interim format. It's rather frustrating to find something enjoyable, even fun to listen to and see it constantly go away. It's been a long road. Cool 96.9 was an outstanding station. In the hands of another company, they may have seen things differently. The torch was then passed to Renda. It's clear, the expense of moving Gator to market and the fact that station got all the goodies while Oldies and their Soft AC pretty much had to fend for themselves. Add a GM to the mix who everyone knows never cared much for either format and we shouldn't be surprised at the results. TAMA - oldies was on and off again, moved from this station to that, on just at nights, then weekends...and on and on. Then there was Magic 107.3. Probably it's best to call them Tragic 107.3 instead - what a shame. Now there is Jack..ugh.
Formats will often fall by the wayside if listener demand is not there among other things like revenue and how the format can strengthen the cluster. Perhaps Cox is even recognizing males are very super-served in Jacksonville. Cox is also known for making very bold moves. IMO, The Dove is a very good product and Jacksonville - trust me on this - is primed for a really good at work station. 106.1 is a good start to get the format going. Still, I believe Cox could significantly increase their market share and strengthen other formats in the cluster if The Dove can eventually wind up at a better signal such as 106.5. Cox is also known for strategy. There is one here. I'm just hoping I'm not getting sucked into the moment and setting myself up for more dissapointment.
As far as the signal goes, yesterday morning (Saturday) The Dove was actually off the air and The Eagle was on instead. This wasn't the first time I noticed this. When The Dove returned, I was in Fruit Cove and decided to drive east along Race Track Rd to get back home and found the signal spotty at best. It stayed spotty even by the Avenues and for the first time I couldn't pick up the station at home in the JTB/Southside area.
Over the years I may have had my disagreements with Cox in how they do certain things, but they are very smart and they execute new formats flawlessly. Once all the kinks are worked out, I'm confident an underserved public will delight in their new find.
Repetition is probably in the ear of the beholder. I've always believed the average listener doesn't pay too much attention to a lot of things that ruffle the radio experts or even the very intense radio fan UNLESS something is power-played that they don't like. I've heard Gino Vannelli's "Living Inside Myself" a number of times. I just love that song and artist too. It was a hit in the early 80's and to this day it probably is in my top 5 favorite 80's songs of all times. For those who don't care for the song, hearing it too often can be a turn-off. The right programmer, the imaging and a segment of the public that just can't enough of all of it can make it all work.
Yesterday afternoon I was at the Tinsletown Publix and I ran into a former Magic 107.3 listener who I remember talking to from some of the station events. To paraphrase, she said radio in Jacksonville sucks and if you are an oldies lover, you have been pretty much jerked around by everybody.
I certainly hope Cox is not jerking us around and that the Dove isn't an interim format. It's rather frustrating to find something enjoyable, even fun to listen to and see it constantly go away. It's been a long road. Cool 96.9 was an outstanding station. In the hands of another company, they may have seen things differently. The torch was then passed to Renda. It's clear, the expense of moving Gator to market and the fact that station got all the goodies while Oldies and their Soft AC pretty much had to fend for themselves. Add a GM to the mix who everyone knows never cared much for either format and we shouldn't be surprised at the results. TAMA - oldies was on and off again, moved from this station to that, on just at nights, then weekends...and on and on. Then there was Magic 107.3. Probably it's best to call them Tragic 107.3 instead - what a shame. Now there is Jack..ugh.
Formats will often fall by the wayside if listener demand is not there among other things like revenue and how the format can strengthen the cluster. Perhaps Cox is even recognizing males are very super-served in Jacksonville. Cox is also known for making very bold moves. IMO, The Dove is a very good product and Jacksonville - trust me on this - is primed for a really good at work station. 106.1 is a good start to get the format going. Still, I believe Cox could significantly increase their market share and strengthen other formats in the cluster if The Dove can eventually wind up at a better signal such as 106.5. Cox is also known for strategy. There is one here. I'm just hoping I'm not getting sucked into the moment and setting myself up for more dissapointment.
After a week of listening, I, for one, am quite positively impressed with the New 106-1 The Dove. The translator signal has been solid over ALL the areas of Jacksonville proper that I have been in, from near the airport, Atlantic/Neptune Beach, obviously Downtown, the Southside, the Northside (near JIA), and even very solid on the Westside. The Dove signal is far superior, in most of the city of Jacksonville, than it's predecessor, Sunny 94.1 - For most of the life cycle of Sunny 94.1, when their tower was located at the World Golf Village, despite being a full 25,000 watts (at just 300 ft.), the Sunny signal was NOT a factor in most of Jacksonville, that's why Renda was forced to market it as a St. Augustine station (where it should have remained, for technical reasons). I haven't been out to Fruit Cove, or deep into Orange Park/Fleming Island yet, (where the old Sunny 94.1 had a good signal) or out to the Ponte Vedra Beach area, so I can't comment on the Dove signal in these important listening areas. While the signal has been engineered very well for what it is, you have to remember, 225 watts can only pack so much punch, and Jacksonville has plenty of real estate to cover. For those who have HD tuners or receivers, WJGL HD2 will add some signal area. Plus, I would imagine, as is the case with their other signals, Cox will add audio streaming to their new website. The New 106-1 The Dove is still early in the launch phase, so let's be patient before we pass too much judgement yet. Hopefully, as elements are added, it will get even better! 
This is interesting. Cox isn't usually much for this kind of stunting, to my knowledge. If this is a stunt, it's quite a long and articulate one.upstate29651 said:
POWER 106.1
When was the last time Cox launched an Urban station? This would be great for Duval, but Cox tends to do more Rhythmic and Urban AC than straight Urban Hip-Hop. The last Urban "POWER" station Cox launched was in Birmingham and it's an Old School Hip-Hop translator with Rickey Smiley in the mornings. Hmmm
When was the last time Cox launched an Urban station? This would be great for Duval, but Cox tends to do more Rhythmic and Urban AC than straight Urban Hip-Hop. The last Urban "POWER" station Cox launched was in Birmingham and it's an Old School Hip-Hop translator with Rickey Smiley in the mornings. Hmmm
nfladxer said:The New 106-1 The Dove suddenly went off the air around 10:25 this morning in the middle of "Stand By Me" - Ben E. King. Since it's been off for quite a while, the questions is, when it returns, will it still be the Dove, or something else? :
UPDATE: As of 11:10am, the analog 106.1 is still off air, however, WJGL HD-2 is still playing "The Dove" format and audio.
nfladxer said:nfladxer said:The New 106-1 The Dove suddenly went off the air around 10:25 this morning in the middle of "Stand By Me" - Ben E. King. Since it's been off for quite a while, the questions is, when it returns, will it still be the Dove, or something else? :
UPDATE: As of 11:10am, the analog 106.1 is still off air, however, WJGL HD-2 is still playing "The Dove" format and audio.
2nd UPDATE: Analog signal returned to air approx. 2 hours after outage. Returns as: The New 106-1 The Dove! At least so far.
I drove right by the tower at a little after 12 and it was off the air once again.
If they do decide to go urban, 106.1 should be an Old School Hip-Hop station similar to the station in Birmingham, Power 102.1, which also operates on a translator relaying a signal from a HD sub-channel. This station should have Ricky Smiley in the mornings and the Michael Baisden Show in the evenings, which will give these two syndicated, urban-oriented shows an affiliate in Jacksonville. I've said from the beginning that the new 106.1 translator would be tailor made for a new urban station in Jacksonville because the 60 dBU service contour covers all of the areas in the city that have either a majority or a large African-American population and also there hasn't been a station that has seriously challenged the only urban stations in the area, Clear Channel-owned Mainstream Urban WJBT 93.3 FM and Urban AC WSOL 101.5 FM, in many years. On the other hand, I know there are people in Jacksonville that have been waiting on an Oldies/Classic Hits station and will be seriously disappointed and upset if Cox decided to flip 106.1 FM to Urban but if Cox was smart, they should move The Dove to 106.5 FM, which will end the simulcast of WOKV AM 690 but it will maintain the Soft AC, Oldies-based format in Jacksonville and on a slightly better stick (6 kW Class A @ 100 meters). As for WOKV-FM listeners, they will unfortunately have to revert back to listening to the station on AM 690 or listen to the station online, or perhaps, put the station on one of the other Cox FM HD sub-channels for people who own a HD Radio. In the long-term, however, they should buy an unused FM translator and upgrade it to the full 250 watts @ 300+ meters HAAT, in order to bring AM 690 back to the FM dial.
Otharadioman,
While the Urban scenario for 106.1 is certainly a real possibility, I'm betting Cox will NEVER take WOKV off FM! They paid 7 million dollars to acquire a rather modest Class A facility because they realize WOKV's future is tied to being available on FM car radios. Actually, at my Westside location, near Venetia/Ortega, the 106.1 signal is stronger than 106.5! The W291CI translator is very well engineered, and with their antenna almost 3 times higher than 106.5's, that doesn't hurt either! If WOKV is ever moved off of the 106.5 frequency, my guess is it would be headed down the dial to one of CMG's Class C sticks!
While the Urban scenario for 106.1 is certainly a real possibility, I'm betting Cox will NEVER take WOKV off FM! They paid 7 million dollars to acquire a rather modest Class A facility because they realize WOKV's future is tied to being available on FM car radios. Actually, at my Westside location, near Venetia/Ortega, the 106.1 signal is stronger than 106.5! The W291CI translator is very well engineered, and with their antenna almost 3 times higher than 106.5's, that doesn't hurt either! If WOKV is ever moved off of the 106.5 frequency, my guess is it would be headed down the dial to one of CMG's Class C sticks!
I never paid too much attention to the translator discussions on these boards. They usually were on the technical side of things and too “over my head” to be honest. Well, I’m seeing things in a different light. Through translators, especially ones that result in a half-way decent signal, I believe it can fill programming holes and get more people listening who may not otherwise.
A number of you would like to see a different kind of urban or rhythmic format come to Jacksonville. You can put me in that camp as well. Obviously I would not want that at The Dove’s expense. Still, I believe Cox has an opportunity to shake up the market and enhance their position.
A while back, I talked of how the signal should help determine the format. The last time, to my knowledge, a rhythmic format was tried on a signal that at least for technical reasons made sense was on 100.7. Well, it didn’t work out. Unfortunately, a brand was chosen that at the time did not have a track record. I don’t believe there were any syndicated programs or even a live and local person with whom the urban core recognized as one of their own. There was no real budget that could have made a difference and it went away. If Cox brings an urban or rhythmic AC or any hybrid to market, it probably will have to be more unique to what exists. Cox has a history of doing urban type formats very well.
Speaking of unique, Jacksonville is not alone in that there is a lot of overlap in music. I can understand how Jacksonville radio got to the state that it is in, but I believe the market is ripe for change.
The other morning I was at a convenience store. “Sweet Home Alabama” was playing in the background. What surprised me was I heard the song on Rock 104.5. Then I recall the PD mentioning how the music was tweaked and how their listeners wanted to hear those occasional classics. I’m not knocking the decision. Still, don't you find it amazing that for a market that acts like they are so adverse to bringing and keeping a retro top 40 to market because the music is old feature so much old music all over the dial?
But I figure there are at least 4 stations across 4 different formats featuring this 39 year old song. There are dozens of other examples for this as well. It’s probably a downside to music testing. Opinions really count for those 35-45. We shouldn’t be surprised at the songs these listeners favor and so we get lots of sameness. It may achieve targets but it alienates many listeners as well and I still believe that is not healthy for radio. Being inclusive especially in a diverse community makes sense or it should.
Now translators come along. Perhaps mistakes of the past can be corrected. I’m not expecting the majority of posters to this board to embrace The Dove. Many of you are rock-oriented and that’s perfectly OK. But I think you would have to agree, not all listeners share the same appreciation for certain genres of music. There are probably enough “younglees” out there who can support a new urban format to make it viable. I know I represent many listeners as well.
As far as demographics go, remember stats can be anything you want them to be. The Jax market is huge and musical taste changes depending on where you are. As a side note, WFEZ beats the classic hits format in 25-54 so we should not make assumptions. There is no doubt, formats such as The Dove attract older demos. But there is also a mass-appeal quality as well. When done right, there is viability and at least 1 station in the market that features something different. It's a win/win folks. There was a time, Jax had a Soft AC, a Rhythmic AC and an Oldies Station. Maybe it’s time the signal determines the format. With the Dove, Cox has filled about 1.5 in programming holes. If another urban comes to town as well, I would say radio in Jacksonville would be giving listeners a lot more choices and it's time is now.
A number of you would like to see a different kind of urban or rhythmic format come to Jacksonville. You can put me in that camp as well. Obviously I would not want that at The Dove’s expense. Still, I believe Cox has an opportunity to shake up the market and enhance their position.
A while back, I talked of how the signal should help determine the format. The last time, to my knowledge, a rhythmic format was tried on a signal that at least for technical reasons made sense was on 100.7. Well, it didn’t work out. Unfortunately, a brand was chosen that at the time did not have a track record. I don’t believe there were any syndicated programs or even a live and local person with whom the urban core recognized as one of their own. There was no real budget that could have made a difference and it went away. If Cox brings an urban or rhythmic AC or any hybrid to market, it probably will have to be more unique to what exists. Cox has a history of doing urban type formats very well.
Speaking of unique, Jacksonville is not alone in that there is a lot of overlap in music. I can understand how Jacksonville radio got to the state that it is in, but I believe the market is ripe for change.
The other morning I was at a convenience store. “Sweet Home Alabama” was playing in the background. What surprised me was I heard the song on Rock 104.5. Then I recall the PD mentioning how the music was tweaked and how their listeners wanted to hear those occasional classics. I’m not knocking the decision. Still, don't you find it amazing that for a market that acts like they are so adverse to bringing and keeping a retro top 40 to market because the music is old feature so much old music all over the dial?
But I figure there are at least 4 stations across 4 different formats featuring this 39 year old song. There are dozens of other examples for this as well. It’s probably a downside to music testing. Opinions really count for those 35-45. We shouldn’t be surprised at the songs these listeners favor and so we get lots of sameness. It may achieve targets but it alienates many listeners as well and I still believe that is not healthy for radio. Being inclusive especially in a diverse community makes sense or it should.
Now translators come along. Perhaps mistakes of the past can be corrected. I’m not expecting the majority of posters to this board to embrace The Dove. Many of you are rock-oriented and that’s perfectly OK. But I think you would have to agree, not all listeners share the same appreciation for certain genres of music. There are probably enough “younglees” out there who can support a new urban format to make it viable. I know I represent many listeners as well.
As far as demographics go, remember stats can be anything you want them to be. The Jax market is huge and musical taste changes depending on where you are. As a side note, WFEZ beats the classic hits format in 25-54 so we should not make assumptions. There is no doubt, formats such as The Dove attract older demos. But there is also a mass-appeal quality as well. When done right, there is viability and at least 1 station in the market that features something different. It's a win/win folks. There was a time, Jax had a Soft AC, a Rhythmic AC and an Oldies Station. Maybe it’s time the signal determines the format. With the Dove, Cox has filled about 1.5 in programming holes. If another urban comes to town as well, I would say radio in Jacksonville would be giving listeners a lot more choices and it's time is now.
Oh, one more thing. My mentioning Rock 104.5 is not to infer that I believe that is the station or format that should go away. Rock on 104.5 is after all heritage as it gets. I don't quite understand why Cox dropped the Rock 105 brand. If it were up to me, I'd bring that brand back, tweak the music even more to appeal to more people, especially if another rock-oriented property flies away.
For The Dove to be most effective, it has to be a really competitive at work station which means people have to be able to hear it. In time, I'd like to see The Dove on a bigger stick. I suppose one thing at a time is the order of the day. If nothing at all happens, I'm still grateful The Dove has come to Jacksonville.
For The Dove to be most effective, it has to be a really competitive at work station which means people have to be able to hear it. In time, I'd like to see The Dove on a bigger stick. I suppose one thing at a time is the order of the day. If nothing at all happens, I'm still grateful The Dove has come to Jacksonville.
Ignore the last two postings and any kind of logic that was attempted. Me thinks I am turning into a tragic Shakespeare character setting myself up for constant disapointment. The Dove is no more. Power 106.1 has made the scene just as Upstate tried to worn. Oh well.
I just wonder how many people like me tuned in and really believed the imaging liner of "finally ...your radio station and not your kids"..or something like that...not a very nice thing to do to people. So, for those of you who wnated this...congrats...some of us out here..well..no one seems to care
I just wonder how many people like me tuned in and really believed the imaging liner of "finally ...your radio station and not your kids"..or something like that...not a very nice thing to do to people. So, for those of you who wnated this...congrats...some of us out here..well..no one seems to care
Isn't there room for a "dove" format in Jacksonville, or for that matter any market? Gee..another blah format. Asides from talk radio and classic country, anybody over 45 is not being served by terrestrial radio. At least WJAX is still around. WKTZ,being owned by Jones College and in the same format since 1964 seems safe.
I'm in South Florida heading up through Jacksonville early next week and I was looking forward to hearing 106.1. Not any more.
How many CHR, urban and Hot AC sound alike stations do we need?
No wonder SiriusXM scored a jump in listenership last year.Yes, you pay for it,but at least there are unique formats that terrestrial radio does not have.
I'm in South Florida heading up through Jacksonville early next week and I was looking forward to hearing 106.1. Not any more.
How many CHR, urban and Hot AC sound alike stations do we need?
No wonder SiriusXM scored a jump in listenership last year.Yes, you pay for it,but at least there are unique formats that terrestrial radio does not have.
Even though this listener isn't happy that The Dove flew away, and Power landed, I wish Cox well on their effort. Terresrial Radio is primarily an advertising medium, and that's what largely drives these programming decisions. It's not so much about about the listener, and especially not about aging Baby Boomers. We can still enjoy Oldies, but not live and local anymore. You know the choices: online, smartphone apps, satellite radio, or create your own ipod or mp3 playlist. Radio - Thanks for the memories!
nfladxer said:
I've witnessed a lot of creative and even funny stunts over the years. This one was in your face and rather mean-spirited. Consider this. If the plan was to bring The Dove to market, would Cox first launch an urban format as some kind of tease? Certainly, we know the answer. Those, not only in the urban areas, but throughout the city who perhaps saw the new station as something they really liked would be pissed-off and rightfully so. Cox would probably have a lot of "splainin' to do being insensitive to a part of the community.
For even the upper-end 25-54 and beyond, this stunt is just another example of how we are really regarded, perhaps even laughed at for our enthusiasm when The Dove arrived.
Nfladxer, I have a lot of respect for you and I can understand why you take the politically correct approach to things. I don't. When you listen to all your options, take notice how many markets offer a Soft AC or a Classic Hits station or both. Also, take note in how exciting and personality-driven a real classic hits station can be. Why there and not here? They will tell you it's the market. I believe a lot of it starts with how listeners are treated and even core values. This latest chapter is just one more example of how certain listeners have been screwed with by all 3 major owners.
There are bright and creative people in Jacksonville radio. To tease people with any new format and then to abruptly take it away is just not the high road. Jacksonville deserves much better...this did not have to be done this way.
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