It's not just signal... it is the lowered level of interest in rock, particularly in the demos below age 40 to 45.
-
Get involved.
We want your input!
Apply for Membership and join the conversations about everything related to broadcasting.
After we receive your registration, a moderator will review it. After your registration is approved, you will be permitted to post.
If you use a disposable or false email address, your registration will be rejected.
After your membership is approved, please take a minute to tell us a little bit about yourself.
https://www.radiodiscussions.com/forums/introduce-yourself.1088/
Thanks in advance and have fun!
RadioDiscussions Administrators
WAAF - what a mess!!!
- Thread starter MarkW
- Start date
It's not just signal... it is the lowered level of interest in rock, particularly in the demos below age 40 to 45.
Guys... it always come down to demographics. Those in college and university simply don't listen to rock. That's why there aren't many modern rock stations-its not very popular with young people, period.
As CT listener said There is an ever increasing minority youth population and a white youth population thats is quickly declining and becoming a smaller, wealthier sect that doesn't listen to rock so much as they do indie music or hip hop. And what they do listen to they listen to on Apple Music and Spotify.
In the year 2000 there were 1,142,00 minorities and 5,198,359 white people in Massachusetts.
In the year 2019 there are ~2,070,000 minorities and 4,830,000 white people in Massachusetts.
The numbers are even more exaggerated in the Greater Boston Area-combine this with the rise of streaming and it is naive to think WAAF's 'strong history' means anything when they're unable to attract new listeners because tis a format fighting against a huge tide.
It's not a huge mystery. This isn't 1985.
The 'edge' rock once had is largely gone as the genre matured ...and even that 'edge' pales in comparison to some of today's pop/rhythmic music-let alone hip hop and urban music, those are the rockstars of today, and that's how they brand/identify themselves.
So often on this board you all postulate what could be causing certain things when its painfully obvious what the answer is. Then a few people try to rationalize things into oblivion and in a way that seem disingenuous at best and ignores the modern world around us and tries to confine things into this weird little radio world bubble. The radio as you all knew it is no more-the sooner they figure out away to make free FM radio more appealing to younger people is the minute radio makes a resurgence in pop culture. This is not that hard to figure out.
Last edited:
Well Urbanteenager, it is quite simple really. If the general public wants it bad enough, you could start a grassroots campaign to raise money for a "self supported" radio station instead.
Somehow, the major Urban Format owners do not seem to think that they can make a profit in Boston. Emmis never into the market, and Radio One did about over a decade ago and somehow failed! Now why did they? That is a question that I have been asking myself for a long time now!
Somehow, the major Urban Format owners do not seem to think that they can make a profit in Boston. Emmis never into the market, and Radio One did about over a decade ago and somehow failed! Now why did they? That is a question that I have been asking myself for a long time now!
And unless they are local live-at-home college students, they generally do not get onto the Nielsen PPM sample base. In other words, irrelevant to radio due to reality.
Not all "minorities" listen to the same thing. There are many different formats that appeal to Hispánics, Asians and Blacks, as well as to first generation immigrants who do not fall into these categories such as those from the former Soviet nations, Persians, and those from the Arabian nations.
But the fact remains that so far, no owner of a decent-signal FM has seen the opportunity for either a pure Urban format or an Hispanic targeted Spanish language CHR.
Let's be specific about this. You have three owners in Boston: Entercom, iHeart, and Beasley. Which is the most likely to hire a sales staff that would target minority advertisers? My guess is none of them. That's the real reason why you don't see minority programming in Boston. If you're not focusing on advertisers who specifically target that audience, there's no motivation to create the programming.
Of course not all minorities listen to the same thing but that doesn’t mean there are no obvious patterns and trends that are not only anecdotally but strategically backed with evidence. Saying not all minorities does nothing to further the conversation and is a straw man argument.
As for Urban or Spanish radio it’s just about getting the right signal and getting enough people to advertise with you. WKAF had the right signal-Suffolk County is 22% Black, Plymouth is 10% black and Norfolk’s is 7% black. Combined the three southern counties of the Boston MSA contain ~2 million people and is ~13.5% African American. So the Brockton-Boston should last the eye test. It’s the northern frosty of the metro that makes folks hesitant. That and a lack of large black businesses that would be able to afford advertising on an iHeart station.
The Spanish station thing is something I really don’t understand due to their huge numbers. Not sure why there is no Spanish FM station. Maybe it suffers from the same thing as the Black population but they have a heavy concentration on the north.
The Merrimack Valley still has a sizable minority population though, and they have an existing FM Spanish station (102.9 Lawrence).
That is an excellent point.
We all remember how Radio One tried to do a Spanish language station on its third signal in Houston.The sales staff couldn't sell it, as it was not their specialty and, for the most part, they were not believers. "Inside the building" there was a culture clash, as the two different lifestyles did not seem to find much in common. It did not last; it was a major disaster for Radio One.
A few general market broadcasters have done successful single-station Spanish language operations, such as iHeart in Miami and the old CBS in Houston, but they are the exception and, more important, they are in markets that are 50% Hispanic and 35% Hispanic respectively. And in both markets there are big Hispanic businesses, and even a number of Hispanic ad agencies. Boston is "none of the above".
A true Urban station is more likely, as iHeart and Entercom like the format and have skills in the area. The issue is whether there is enough billing, and whether they have a station that could do better in Urban than it is doing now.
That was the same conversation for CBS in Washington. Ultimately they felt there was enough billing to hire a specific sales staff for El Zol. CBS has a similar specific sales staff for WVEE in Atlanta. But clearly they don't see the benefit in Boston.
First, you have to stop focusing on bits and pieces of the market. Boston is bought as an MSA, not by neighborhoods or zones or parts. Stations have to program to the full market, and unless the whole market can justify a format, it won't happen.
Agency buys for "Boston" are based on the whole MSA, not areas within it.
Hispanic and Black targeted stations get agency buys in two ways. First, if the station ranks high in the market in the advertiser's target, they will be considered and bought if the rate is competitive. Second, there are ethnic budgets targeting Blacks or Hispanics. Only the largest national Black and Hispanic markets are on those lists. Boston is not generally on national Black or Hispanic buys.
So unless there is a lot of local business interest in reaching those groups and / or large Black and Hispanic business communities, the analysis stops there.
Only if those tests are passed do we get to formats, knowing that no format reaches all of either group.
Half of Hispanics in similar markets listen to general market radio, often CHR, AC and Churban. Not all Blacks like urban; they may like Uban AC or some general market format.
When you look at the past and present radio landscape, (or chessboard), what evidence do you see that this would work?
Are there any clues in Boston radio listenership/audience (past and present) that these formats would perform well?
If your only basis to your argument is "If it was done well, it might work".....that is not a rationale to gamble the millions of dollars at stake.
I guess its time to shake up things a bit then.
By going to something more rhythmic/pop/country, since those and classic rock seem to be the only formats with both listener and advertiser appeal?
Yup. It’s definitely time for a new format. By my calculations, it only has a measly 12,000 listeners in greater Worcester and 33,000 in Greater Boston. For comparison’s sake, WMJX has over 300,000 listeners in Greater Boston and an additional 50,000 (at least) from adjacent markets — Manchester, Worcester, Providence, New Bedford, Cape Cod and Portsmouth.
If we're talking total cume (all ages), your numbers are far too low.
WAAF cumes around 200,000, which is quite bad but not nearly as bad as you suggest. The top handful of stations in the Greater Boston area routinely exceed 600,000. Magic had almost 1.2 million in cume during the mid November - early December survey period.
WAAF cumes around 200,000, which is quite bad but not nearly as bad as you suggest. The top handful of stations in the Greater Boston area routinely exceed 600,000. Magic had almost 1.2 million in cume during the mid November - early December survey period.
The cume figures are not what you state:
Oct-Nov-Dec
Boston MSA 205,000
There is additional cume in Worcester, Portsmouth and Manchester MSAs. It has not shown in the Providence MSA for some time.
Overall, in the April-May-June PPM average for Boston they had a 3.5 share, while now the number is at 0.9 for the "Fall" period of 2019.
WSRS, WORC and WXLO have better shares in Worcester, but that is a market with one tenth the population of Boston.
WAAF is not "home" to the Worcester MSA and does not make an effort to compete there as local ad rates are extremely low.
WAAF outbills the top Worcester biller by about 25% because it sells in Boston, not the smaller market.
Start with bringing back a morning show. They kept the format where it was, then removed the biggest draw to help WEEI. It wasn't going to take a rocket scientist to see this happen. As for calls for a flip to country or pop or R&B, why don't you all ask yourselves the same questions the you always ask. What hole exists to replace it with. Fix the damn playlist and add a morning show back. I feel the Entercom left it for dead to ensure WEEI would get the ratings for Hill's move. It was a bad buisness plan. They could put Hsu and Carrie as a morning show the focuses on general entertainment, and have one of the weekenders, like Bob Hannah take middays and afternoon. After all, both of those are mainly music anyway. Start there, then see if there's an uptick. That's everyone's answer, "more pop and country stations."
- Status