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Want more callers? More FIRST-TIME callers? Better callers?

Thank you, I think...

smedge2006 said:
For once, I am forced to agree with Holland Cooke, at least in part.
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It's little wins like this that make those miles and miles along the lonesome road all worthwhile.

smedge2006 said:
I don't think call screening has become too loose. If anything, it's too tight. The inability of the crank to get through with a zinger to deflate the host's pomposity, even if it's "You Stink!" and a hangup, or the guy with the phony voice to derail the well-prepared "topic" has contributed to the cult of the all-knowing, all-seeing Ozlike fountain-of-political-truth host.
Click to expand...

Not just cranks. What about callers who are smart/witty/on-point and happen to disagree-with or otherwise-debunk what-Rush-just-said? There's too little of that. When the show degenerates into callers-congratulating-the-host-on-what-he-just-said, it fundamentally works-against how-Arbitron-works. Never forget: Arbitron is a memory test.

In that little video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wZMUbwOrZU), Barber made a statement many hosts' egos won't permit: "They [callers] think their opinion's more important than mine, and so do I." And Dave's use of the word "pontificate" is also appropriate, given what I hear in my travels.

smedge2006 said:
Yes to regular callers. Yes to chronic callers! Why turn away free talent?
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CAUTION: You risk making your cume sound small. When I hear a host say something like "FRANK...YOU, OF ALL PEOPLE. YOU'RE THE LAST ONE I'D EXPECT TO SAY THAT!" it sounds like 17 people listen to this show every day...and if I'm #18, I got there late. I don't know Frank. There shouldn't be a secret handshake. As a host, your goal is to halt a channel surfer in his/her tracks. Be THAT engaging. Let callers help you.

First-time callers are real valuable. They make your show sound like it's catching-on, gaining momentum. And a diversity of viewpoints/gender/geography/race/age makes the conversation richer and more-engaging.

On many of my client stations, we run a "First-Timer Friday" promo, inviting that "IF YOU'VE NEVER CALLED A RADIO SHOW BEFORE, TELL US, AND WE'LL MOVE YOU TO THE HEAD OF THE LINE." It's just a gesture, but it serves to inject a serendipity, an-element-of-surprise, that makes the show more memorable.

Help yourself. If you do such a promo, here's the line at the end: "FIRST-TIMER FRIDAY...EVERY FRIDAY, ON WXXX...BECAUSE YOU NEVER FORGET YOUR FIRST TIME." ;)

Bon giorno from The Ozarks,
HC
www.HollandCooke.com
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6FonOwlry9I
 
Holland Cooke said:
Quite a statement.
How do you know that?
Click to expand...

He knows that because he listens to the station. So do I--every day. In the past five years KFI has transformed itself to a personality station where callers play a very small part. If they do get on the air, there is no give and take. They are used a prop by the air talent.

Don't bring up youtube, blogging, or American Idol. This is talk radio and the trend on some talk stations is getting away from taking calls.
 
[In Jim Carrey "Ace Ventura" voice] "Al-RIGHTY then..."

barooosk said:
Don't bring up youtube, blogging, or American Idol. This is talk radio and the trend on some talk stations is getting away from taking calls.
Click to expand...


Why ride the horse in the direction he's facing?
 
Its personality that wins everytime. When I think of the radio shows I love like...Rush, Howard, O&A, Hannity, Lars, Randi, Savage, and John and Ken, not once have I thought, you know what I love about those shows?... the callers! I bond with personalities, not the callers.....

Callers can be fine...but I seem more and more shows use them as nothing more than a crutch.
 
Slant says:

Callers can be fine...but I seem more and more shows use them as nothing more than a crutch.
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I agree with you Slant...caller driven radio can be boring. I want host driven radio. Why? Because the host had better be the smartest guy in the room. If he has to rely on callers to lighten him up, we are going to wait for a long time. Not that it won't happen...but the wait can be agonizing.

Too many times I have seen lazy hosts throw a topic on the air, hoping it will light a spark and some listener will call up and make a great point that will launch the show. Problem is...it does not always happen. I have heard hosts waiting for that moment...almost begging for that moment. What sometimes happens is the caller actually decides to change the direction of the show...and the host goes along, because the host really had no idea where it was going anyway.

At WABC I look for hosts who really don't need callers. I remember the first show Matt Drudge ever did for me on WABC. It was a Saturday night...and his phones went dead, due to some technical glitch. Hey...it happens...even at WABC. Keep in mind he had never hosted a show before...and this was WABC for God's sake. He went on without missing a beat. He had plenty to say, and it was compelling. I knew then he would make it as a talk show host. Mark Levin uses callers like a cat and mouse game. They are there simply for his enjoyment, and when he loses interest he smacks them around and moves on. That usually takes just a few seconds. It is really fun to hear...but there is no doubt Mark is completely in charge...and Mark is going to win everytime. The host always wins...or we have a problem.

pb
 
RE "Callers can be fine..."

You betcha.
Thus the value of technique.

Slant said:
more and more shows use them as nothing more than a crutch.
Click to expand...

My point precisely.
Thus the value of technique.

BUT DON'T TAKE MY WORD FOR IT.
For those looking in here who actually DO radio?
TRY what that video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wZMUbwOrZU) describes.

DON'T TAKE MY WORD FOR IT.
Just try it.
Call my bluff.

And if you don't absolutely LOVE -- and I mean LOVE -- the results, you can go back to aping Rush and all those other I-talk-you-listen acts who are "above" callers.

But do so at-the-risk-of sounding-less-local-than how those local callers' accents COULD make your show more engaging than whatever-management-can-pull-off-a-satellite-instead-of-paying-you.

Good evening from The Ozarks, Springfield MO.
Tomorrow, Raleigh-Durham.
Next week, a PILE of laundry.

HC
www.HollandCooke.com
 
I used to work at KFI. When I helped out on Handel, we turned the phones OFF by blocking all of the lines. Zero calls. None.

When I helped out on John and Ken, they MAY take 1 or 2 calls an hour. Some hours they take no calls. Each show was easily less than 5 calls. This is for a 4 hour show.

Ziegler's show is basically a monologue about his take on the news. Like I said, he'll break it up with some calls, but never for more than 1 hour.

Smaller markets will eventually learn that calls suck.

Like I said, no one cares about Bob in Riverside's opinion. People tune in for the hosts.
 
RE "no one cares about Bob in Riverside's opinion."

I'm starting to feel bad for Bob.

And don't'cha think ANYONE ELSE in Riverside might find the show more relatable hearing Bob "from Riverside" than accents-from-another-part-of-America that they'll hear on the syndicated shows that management plugs in when they figure the local blowhard is expendable?
 
Well, I guess that settles it.

And if you'd like to tell me what-else-about-Programming I'm wrong about, you can do so in front of all my peers, when you come to my session at R&R's Talk Radio Seminar, in Santa Monica, Friday, March 9, 1030AM. I'm moderating an A-list panel:
Give More To Get More
"Your station's unique programming products have value across more platforms than ever in today's multimedia society. Learn how to offer more services that listeners really want from your station while also adding nontraditional revenues that won't clutter programming."

And to tell me how-full-of-it-I-am regarding Sales, join us at the Radio Advertising Bureau convention in Dallas Thursday, February 08, at 3:15, for my solo presentation:
Revenue...Right Under Your Nose!
"His previous sessions included 'Buried Treasure: Unearth Revenue Hidden in Your Station's Programming,' 'How to Make Money with How-To Shows,' and 'Podcasting for Profit.' This year, programming consultant Holland Cooke will outline proven, money-making tactics SO obvious you might not even notice them. Attendees will receive over 100 pages of handouts."

If you can't make it to RAB/Dallas; I'll be presenting this session again @ NAB/Vegas in April.
And here's The Free Prize Inside: a dazzling demonstration of my casino blackjack technique.
But book early. Flights and hotels go quick for this international show.

HC
www.HollandCooke.com
 
I like the fact that you and Mr. Boyce come here Holland. I really respect your opinions... Come to think of it, now I have an idea why I didn't get a PD gig for a station you were consulting way back! Maybe my programming philosphy was a bit off!
Cheers!
 
clubhoe4life said:
Like I said, no one cares about Bob in Riverside's opinion. People tune in for the hosts.
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"People" are different. They are individuals. Some may tune in for the host(s), some the callers, and some may like it best when the host and callers interact and clash. (Like me!) One thing's for sure, no matter what I do on-air, the listeners won't all be happy. So I just do what makes ME feel good. The presumption being that if it makes me happy, others will be pleased as well.

I do the show I as a listener always wanted to hear. Surprise! Turns out others want to hear that show too.

I've heard callers described as the "songs" of talk radio. This analogy only holds so far. Like songs, some callers will resonate with listeners while other listeners will be turned off by them. However, unlike music and even with screening a talk host never really knows what is going to come out of a caller's mouth. Sometimes it's garbage, sometimes golden. I ignore doctrinaire rules like, "callers should be on air for no more than 45 seconds" and judge each caller based on his or her merits. Some callers are droll, others absolutely fascinating. Put down the rulebook, play it by ear, and follow your instincts.

Oh, and read Holland's newsletter. ;D
 
The discussion of the value of callers misses the mark.

It's about "community".

When callers get to play a supporting and an occasional starring role in discussing the day's outrages, they feel like they're a part of the radio station.

Not all communities are collaborative. But Holland's right -- collaborative communities have the best chance of success because it is more likely that listeners will, even if they never call the show themselves, feel like they're part of a group with something in common when they hear lots of folks contributing to the show.

A few communities work in a more...shall we say...authoritarian style. But the history of authoritarianism everywhere suggests it's hard to pull off and harder to maintain.

The poster who says 'ignore YouTube' is, as Holland suggests, riding the northbound horse whilst facing southbound. The trend of the current age is collaboration, citizen content and greater user control of his/her environment.
 
I appreciate Mr. Cooke giving away his material here. It's worth what we pay for it.

I don't care how many conventions he attends. I know nostrums and platitudes when I see them. Apparently some station operators crave certainty in an uncertain world and grab onto Mr. Cooke's formulae for an illusion of assurance. I have visited Mr. Cooke's website. I don't see how a former Oldies jock and all news promotion director can claim credibility in programming call in talk radio.

but he does excel at (self) promotion, as his posts here demonstrate. He doesn't seem to realize, however, that few who visit this site are in a position to buy his services (unless he has a special rate for student radio stations).
 
"No soup for you!"

And your URL?
If you're going to misstate MY resume, at least share yours.
As the Ted Knight character deadpanned in "Caddyshack:"
"The world needs lumberyards too."

Your put-down about students is uncouth. radio-info.com can be to young-people-today what the now-lonely campus radio station was to us geezers a generation ago...the forum. Isn't the premise here that ANYONE can belly-up-to-the-bar?

Sure there are snipers here, as your own anonymous post attests. And YOU BET I'm making-a-living participating in this conversation which you choose to share. If your house is bigger than mine, or your boat is bigger than mine, I'll just work harder.

For you, the living, this mash was meant too: www.HollandCooke.com
 
Re: "No soup for you!"

Holland Cooke said:
And your URL?
If you're going to misstate MY resume, at least share yours.

For you, the living, this mash was meant too: www.HollandCooke.com
Click to expand...

I think people can judge the value of your programming "insights" for themselves. I have noticed when people challenge anything you say, your response is to demand that they go public (or to try to out them).

Just call me a dissatisfied ex-client.

It's too bad you don't have your own talk show. You excel at the jane you ignorant slut style of arguing and maybe you could try out some of your own clever ideas yourself.
 
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