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"War of The World's" on Q107
- Thread starter S McCoy
- Start date
It is so awesome that GAP is so proactive in there Lufkin market. It was great to hear the original War of the Worlds on the Q.
They have taken a ho-hum market and really spiced it up and went out on a limb with it. Now if they would only play more modern rock on the Q it would be fantastic.
They have taken a ho-hum market and really spiced it up and went out on a limb with it. Now if they would only play more modern rock on the Q it would be fantastic.
Modern Rock barely passes muster in DFW and Houston. It would be a disaster in Lufkin-Nacogdoches. Sure, the college kids would love it, but sales wise it would be a hinderance.
musicsweep said:Modern Rock barely passes muster in DFW and Houston. It would be a disaster in Lufkin-Nacogdoches. Sure, the college kids would love it, but sales wise it would be a hinderance.
I'm quite aware of your comment. They have been toying with it since the GAP change. I wouldn't want a total modern rock but just add a few more 80's - modern tracks in the rotation.
On Q's VIP section under the surveys, they always have at least one newer song that they want a rating on. IDK if they are already toying with the idea or what but that is a wish that I have for the station.
Back when Steve Rixx was the PD at Q107, they had 80s haircuts at noon, mandatory Metallica at 9 p.m. and the Floyd Fix at 11 p.m. 80s Hair Band songs were worked in once or twice an hour, and if a classic rock or hair band group released a new single, (such as when Motley Crue released Hell on High Heels) it was used sparingly. That's probably going to be the most workable solution to breaking the monotony of Zepplin, ZZ-Top, Crosby Stills & Nash, Supertramp, Zepplin, ZZ Top, Crosby Stills and Nash, Supertramp.
S McCoy said:Recently they gave away the new AC/DC cd which might indicate a move towards more active rock. I have noticed they have been playing new Metallica and the new Guns N' roses. There is still hope!
That they have. I personally got the new ac/dc cd from my vip point from Q's site.
Being a life long citizen of Lufkin for 30 + years, I have seen all the locals flip and flop from this to that. I have to say that GAP's tenure in Lufkin has been the best radio that this area has seen in a long time. They are trying out different thing with their stations. I know that a true active rock station won't pay the bills, but add a little more flavor to the pot. CCC really ruined a lot of great classics for me due to the overplaying of the songs.
Steve was a great pd and I know that his hands were tied by CCC but he did do a great job when he was at the Q.
S McCoy said:so, where do the GAP stations go from here? What is tyhe next level for appealling radio? Is there a true competitor in the market?
I think that Kfox, Kicks and true oldies are where they need to be.
Kfox has everything that they need. A decent morning show, good day, afternoon and evening dj's and the music that the kids want to here. So no other changes are needed here.
Kicks has a total package. IMHO the best dj's on radio in the market. The better playlist than their competition. No changes here.
True oldies - not much you can do to a voice tracked station.
KSFA - They are trying to add a little flavor to this station. I don't get to this station much but the lineup is decent. I would like to see either a neil boortz, dave ramsey, or a phil valentine on there but that is just a wish.
KTBQ - Since this is my station of choice, I will be a little more critical on them. DUMP john boy and billy. I would rather listen to the sophomoric idiots bob and tom or would really like the return of walton and johnson. MORE live dj's. At the apex of popularity of this station, they had more live dj's. Lisa and jen are good but this station need at least one more good dj's. Even if the voice track on of the other dj's from another station that GAP has, just something more here. And finally the can still tweak the playlist a little more. Throw in just a few more 80's - present day rock song a day. CCC has ruined a lot of song and bands for me through the over playing of them.
To wrap up, I am in no way anywhere close to being an expert or extremely knowledged on radio. This is just my opinion and my selfishness of my wants. I commend GAP on the great job that they have done with the lufkin cluster and it makes listening to lufkin a lot better.
From traveling around several areas that have GAP station, I know that the stations have great playlists, dj's and formats. I think they have a little more things to do to a couple of stations and things will go smoothly for all the stations.
So you can take or leave what I said but this is just one persons opinion.
S McCoy said:Promotionally what is missing in the market?
The lack of talent to do live spots and the lack of sponsors with good $. They keep doing the same spots with the same dj's at the same locations.
I think that now that GAP has the VIP section that they really don't need to do many live spots.There is some great merch on there, but limited amounts to choose from. Local businesses don't give a lot to go on there. I think that they need to get better merch on there and go up on the point value on it. Maybe some Cd's , posters, etc. that goes along with the format of the stations. They have concerts on the vip section but you have to drive 2 - 3 hours to get to them. I know that no good top bands are going to stop in Lufkin or Nacogdoches for a concert for 1 -2 hundred people. So that's virtually out of the question.
So i think that if they focus on more merch for their vips and continue to tweak where they are making their tweaks and get a few more dj's (live or voice tracked) and let the dj's do some bits a little more instead of just plugging what little that they plug and announcing the next song. When Adam smasher was on kafx (voice tracked from Dallas) for his brief stint, he had some bits that he done and i think that it livened up the station a bit. Stiffler does some small bits but not as much as when he was on ktux. So work on that a little more. I know that the dj's can do it, but will the be give the nod to do so.
There have been some greats stunts/promotions in the market over the years.
Broadcasting from a crane above a car dealership
Hands On Car giveaway
Radio Mash (from the Bill Schultz Days) anyone recall BS singing Happy Birthday on the air everyday?
Snow Machine for "White Xmas" KICKS did that 20 years ago? and people are still talking about it
KFOX gave away a refurbished Mustang years ago
KICKS did "debt free"
Anyone remember "Famous Amos"?
These are the kinds of promotions missing from the market (and all markets for that matter)...are listeners still engaged and open to these kinds of stunts/promotions? Are stations afraid to do these kinds of activities these days? Promotions have just gotten so watered down and stale today that there is no enthusiasm. Do the listeners still want this kind of excitement?
Broadcasting from a crane above a car dealership
Hands On Car giveaway
Radio Mash (from the Bill Schultz Days) anyone recall BS singing Happy Birthday on the air everyday?
Snow Machine for "White Xmas" KICKS did that 20 years ago? and people are still talking about it
KFOX gave away a refurbished Mustang years ago
KICKS did "debt free"
Anyone remember "Famous Amos"?
These are the kinds of promotions missing from the market (and all markets for that matter)...are listeners still engaged and open to these kinds of stunts/promotions? Are stations afraid to do these kinds of activities these days? Promotions have just gotten so watered down and stale today that there is no enthusiasm. Do the listeners still want this kind of excitement?
S McCoy said:There have been some greats stunts/promotions in the market over the years.
Broadcasting from a crane above a car dealership
Hands On Car giveaway
Radio Mash (from the Bill Schultz Days) anyone recall BS singing Happy Birthday on the air everyday?
Snow Machine for "White Xmas" KICKS did that 20 years ago? and people are still talking about it
KFOX gave away a refurbished Mustang years ago
KICKS did "debt free"
Anyone remember "Famous Amos"?
These are the kinds of promotions missing from the market (and all markets for that matter)...are listeners still engaged and open to these kinds of stunts/promotions? Are stations afraid to do these kinds of activities these days? Promotions have just gotten so watered down and stale today that there is no enthusiasm. Do the listeners still want this kind of excitement?
If you remember this is when this area had a lot of live dj's. This area has just a skeleton crew and do mostly voice tracking. There is not enough revenue here anymore to pay those hefty salaries.
The local businesses are holding onto their money very tightly. CCC put a sour taste in the businesses and it is showing. I have noticed over the years that businesses that did advertise on CCC radio have went over to Yates rather than giving GAP a chance since the change over or just stopped radio advertising period. Whomever is marketing at GAP needs to get out and show how that GAP is better than what CCC was. This would put more revenue in the stations so they could have the ability to do some of the thing that they use to.
What about the time Yakboy for the KJ Morning Zoo threw tortillas into people's car windows on North Street in celebration of Cinco De Mayo? If you caught a tortilla, you got a prize (Free dinner at Casa Ole.) ahhh, good times for KJCS. ;D
As for concert promotions, the average KFOX or Q107 listener has no problem going to the Woodlands Pavilian to see Skynyrd or Kid Rock... or to Reliant Stadium for the Houston Livestock Show and Rodeo. I would bet you could get a Kicks 105 listener to go to the Houston rodeo to see Alan Jackson. Trips to Houston are no big deal for any target listener in Lufkin-Nacogdoches, so concert promotions are the way to go.
As for revenue problems and the bad taste CCC put in everyone's mouth... I have a hard time buying into that. First of all, KYKS and KAFX have always been solid tools for advertisers. If you can't increase business through ad campaigns on those two stations, you are selling an undesireable product, or one that isn't intended for the general public. Second of all, Johnny Lanthrop (isn't that his name?) and Larry Gunter ran a pretty tight sales ship. I have a hard time seeing them let clients spots run out of date, or allowing spots to be missed consistently. IN my opinion, KTBQ and KSFA are also great products, but my guess is that the AE's would rather sell KYKS.
If ad revenue has been decreased in Lufkin Nacogdoches, there are two possible reasons. (1) The increase in corporate-owned stores that do not place local radio buys, or (2) the high turnover and general ineffectiveness of most sales departments in Lufkin-Nacogdoches. The station I worked at turned over their sales staff twice as fast as they did airstaffs. I worked with two during my 12-month tenure there. I also worked for 7 months at a Lufkin station prior to that. I saw new sales people every month. (Granted, I was there during a transition time). I have no idea about CC's turnover, but they did have consistent management.
What you have in radio sales, industry-wide, are unqualified account executives who don't know their product, who don't know how to lay out a successful campaign, who can't write copy, and who will over promise things the stations can not live up to just to get the signature. THree months later, the AE is gone and the station has alienated another client. This is a problem on the lower level, not in CC policies.
Case in point... a friend of mine contacted a radio cluster in a medium market which consisted of a rock station, a country station, and an AM News/Talk (Limbaugh-Hannity affiliate). His product was an upscale subdivision. The AE he was assigned to started pitching the country station. He asked about the AM news/talk. She said, "Oh, that's AM, no one listens to AM." He replied that he wasn't interested in country, to which she replied "but it's on FM." He asked about the shows on the News/Talker. She couldn't name any. He eventually gave up and hung up. The AM news/talker, btw, was a consistent top-five station. She didn't know her product, wouldn't work with the clients needs and desires, and despite owning three stations, only seemed capable of selling one. Eventually, he placed his news/talk buy, but had to go through the upper management to get it done. Most clients are not as pesistent. This was a market that I have yet to be able to break into... so it's not that small of a market. Stuff like this has hurt the industry, far worse than massive airstaff layoffs and corporate consolidation.
As for concert promotions, the average KFOX or Q107 listener has no problem going to the Woodlands Pavilian to see Skynyrd or Kid Rock... or to Reliant Stadium for the Houston Livestock Show and Rodeo. I would bet you could get a Kicks 105 listener to go to the Houston rodeo to see Alan Jackson. Trips to Houston are no big deal for any target listener in Lufkin-Nacogdoches, so concert promotions are the way to go.
As for revenue problems and the bad taste CCC put in everyone's mouth... I have a hard time buying into that. First of all, KYKS and KAFX have always been solid tools for advertisers. If you can't increase business through ad campaigns on those two stations, you are selling an undesireable product, or one that isn't intended for the general public. Second of all, Johnny Lanthrop (isn't that his name?) and Larry Gunter ran a pretty tight sales ship. I have a hard time seeing them let clients spots run out of date, or allowing spots to be missed consistently. IN my opinion, KTBQ and KSFA are also great products, but my guess is that the AE's would rather sell KYKS.
If ad revenue has been decreased in Lufkin Nacogdoches, there are two possible reasons. (1) The increase in corporate-owned stores that do not place local radio buys, or (2) the high turnover and general ineffectiveness of most sales departments in Lufkin-Nacogdoches. The station I worked at turned over their sales staff twice as fast as they did airstaffs. I worked with two during my 12-month tenure there. I also worked for 7 months at a Lufkin station prior to that. I saw new sales people every month. (Granted, I was there during a transition time). I have no idea about CC's turnover, but they did have consistent management.
What you have in radio sales, industry-wide, are unqualified account executives who don't know their product, who don't know how to lay out a successful campaign, who can't write copy, and who will over promise things the stations can not live up to just to get the signature. THree months later, the AE is gone and the station has alienated another client. This is a problem on the lower level, not in CC policies.
Case in point... a friend of mine contacted a radio cluster in a medium market which consisted of a rock station, a country station, and an AM News/Talk (Limbaugh-Hannity affiliate). His product was an upscale subdivision. The AE he was assigned to started pitching the country station. He asked about the AM news/talk. She said, "Oh, that's AM, no one listens to AM." He replied that he wasn't interested in country, to which she replied "but it's on FM." He asked about the shows on the News/Talker. She couldn't name any. He eventually gave up and hung up. The AM news/talker, btw, was a consistent top-five station. She didn't know her product, wouldn't work with the clients needs and desires, and despite owning three stations, only seemed capable of selling one. Eventually, he placed his news/talk buy, but had to go through the upper management to get it done. Most clients are not as pesistent. This was a market that I have yet to be able to break into... so it's not that small of a market. Stuff like this has hurt the industry, far worse than massive airstaff layoffs and corporate consolidation.
Well, most audiences in the Lufkin-Nac market are pretty well served. Men 25-54 have KYKS, KJCS, KTBQ and KSFA, as well as Sports-Talk. Men 35+ have KVLL (True Oldies), plus KYKS and KTBQ. Women 25-54 have KAFX and KYBI, as well as KYKS and KJCS. Hispanics have KSML-FM.
The market does not have a solid AC station in the vein of KOOI or Sunny 99. I think such a station would be sellable and a good product to present as an at-work station. Sure, the same format was tried on KVLL, but minimal effort was put into it, and most of the ads that ran on that station were bonused to clients for buying KJCS. The drawbacks to this format is that you'd be trying to find a way to sandwich yourself in between KYBI and KAFX while picking off a few KYKS listeners.
The other option would be Urban Adult Contemporary. The station would be an instant hit, as the African American audience represents a large portion of the population, yet isn't being served. The drawback, though, would be sellability. Urban formatting has always struggled in Lufkin-Nac. Of course, my theory is that it has struggled because of an over-use of hip-hop cuts in the music rotation. Perhaps a softer urban format, that blended upbeat R&B currents with classic Old Skool, along with some blues cuts thrown in with absolutely no hip-hop, would both serve the African American audience and also be sellable. Some rap would be ok, if it were the bridge to an R&B cut... such as when LL Cool J would jump in on the third verse of a J Lo song. Still, 50 cent is out! Business want African American customers... they just don't want thugs. This station would consistently rank near the top of the Arbs, but would always struggle with sales. That's just the nature of the beast.
So, if it were my money, I'd take the risk and go with the UAC format. I'd have Tom Joyner Mornings, Run American Urban Network news, hire a board-op to run the show, whose job description would also include news/public service director and board-op for remotes. I'd then hire a PM drive personality, who'd be our go-to guy to do the remotes. The rest of the day would be automated... with the possibility of hiring voice-trackers if station revenues would support it.
Launch would consist of stunting with "You Dropped the Bomb on Me" for a week before we launched with our full slate of programming. Launch day would be met with a lot of on-air fan fare. Promotions would include billboards and live-remotes at community events, like Blueberry Fest. Maybe even tie into the blues fest there. We'd then sponsor a Gospel concert, featuring the "Mighty Clouds of Joy" among others.
Sales strategy would be very simple. A significant portion of the population is African American, and we're the only station that serves them. Are you willing to forego their business?
Heck, I even know who I'd hire to sell it, and who I'd hire to do the programming.
You think I'm nuts? I probably am!
The market does not have a solid AC station in the vein of KOOI or Sunny 99. I think such a station would be sellable and a good product to present as an at-work station. Sure, the same format was tried on KVLL, but minimal effort was put into it, and most of the ads that ran on that station were bonused to clients for buying KJCS. The drawbacks to this format is that you'd be trying to find a way to sandwich yourself in between KYBI and KAFX while picking off a few KYKS listeners.
The other option would be Urban Adult Contemporary. The station would be an instant hit, as the African American audience represents a large portion of the population, yet isn't being served. The drawback, though, would be sellability. Urban formatting has always struggled in Lufkin-Nac. Of course, my theory is that it has struggled because of an over-use of hip-hop cuts in the music rotation. Perhaps a softer urban format, that blended upbeat R&B currents with classic Old Skool, along with some blues cuts thrown in with absolutely no hip-hop, would both serve the African American audience and also be sellable. Some rap would be ok, if it were the bridge to an R&B cut... such as when LL Cool J would jump in on the third verse of a J Lo song. Still, 50 cent is out! Business want African American customers... they just don't want thugs. This station would consistently rank near the top of the Arbs, but would always struggle with sales. That's just the nature of the beast.
So, if it were my money, I'd take the risk and go with the UAC format. I'd have Tom Joyner Mornings, Run American Urban Network news, hire a board-op to run the show, whose job description would also include news/public service director and board-op for remotes. I'd then hire a PM drive personality, who'd be our go-to guy to do the remotes. The rest of the day would be automated... with the possibility of hiring voice-trackers if station revenues would support it.
Launch would consist of stunting with "You Dropped the Bomb on Me" for a week before we launched with our full slate of programming. Launch day would be met with a lot of on-air fan fare. Promotions would include billboards and live-remotes at community events, like Blueberry Fest. Maybe even tie into the blues fest there. We'd then sponsor a Gospel concert, featuring the "Mighty Clouds of Joy" among others.
Sales strategy would be very simple. A significant portion of the population is African American, and we're the only station that serves them. Are you willing to forego their business?
Heck, I even know who I'd hire to sell it, and who I'd hire to do the programming.
You think I'm nuts? I probably am!
Sellability is the key to an UAC format. In 21st century sales, advertisers are holding their media "accountable" to deliver qualified customers (car dealers, furniture etc).
Unless you have a "safe" format that will serve an "underserved" target and are willing to wait until the format is proven with Arbitron, then you might survive. Otherwise in the current economic climate....it's going to be an uphill battle.
In 2009, there is no sure thing.
Unless you have a "safe" format that will serve an "underserved" target and are willing to wait until the format is proven with Arbitron, then you might survive. Otherwise in the current economic climate....it's going to be an uphill battle.
In 2009, there is no sure thing.
This format would fare well in the Arbitrons... that is not a question. Any station or company that can't give a format time to prove itself (2 years) doesn't need to be in business.
The key to success here is (a) low overhead and (b) the uniqueness of the product.
The sellability comes in avoiding the hip-hop cuts, image and thug image. The station would be programmed to older, more mature African Americans. These African Americans are gainfully employed, either from owning their own businesses, or from spending 20+ years at Pilgrims Pride, etc. They are mechanics in the service departments at local car dealerships, maybe even the service or parts manager. They run a local McDonalds. They are qualified customers because... well... look at what they are driving now. Someone's financing them.
Plus, the African American audience, for the most part, puts all of their earnings back into the economy. Very few actually save, according to demo info I received from having worked in this format before. So that provides two opportunities for advertisers. (a) for the retail business, knowing that African American customers want to spend money, have several avenues now to appeal to them. (b) It would be an opportunity for banks and investment firms to tap into an untapped market.
It's still risky, especially in this day and time. But I don't see an AC station making any more of an impact. One of the biggest challenges would be hiring a qualified sales staff that would know how to market it.
The key to success here is (a) low overhead and (b) the uniqueness of the product.
The sellability comes in avoiding the hip-hop cuts, image and thug image. The station would be programmed to older, more mature African Americans. These African Americans are gainfully employed, either from owning their own businesses, or from spending 20+ years at Pilgrims Pride, etc. They are mechanics in the service departments at local car dealerships, maybe even the service or parts manager. They run a local McDonalds. They are qualified customers because... well... look at what they are driving now. Someone's financing them.
Plus, the African American audience, for the most part, puts all of their earnings back into the economy. Very few actually save, according to demo info I received from having worked in this format before. So that provides two opportunities for advertisers. (a) for the retail business, knowing that African American customers want to spend money, have several avenues now to appeal to them. (b) It would be an opportunity for banks and investment firms to tap into an untapped market.
It's still risky, especially in this day and time. But I don't see an AC station making any more of an impact. One of the biggest challenges would be hiring a qualified sales staff that would know how to market it.
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