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Wash. Post writes about liberal talk radio including Air America

> Air America has about 222,000 listeners at one time in 61
> markets compared to more than 4.4 million for Rush on 600
> stations.
> http://www.washingtonpost.com/...

One other key comparison: Rush's show became syndicated in August 1, 1988. Air America started its network March 31, 2004.
 
> > Air America has about 222,000 listeners at one time in 61
> > markets compared to more than 4.4 million for Rush on 600
> > stations.
> > http://www.washingtonpost.com/...
>
> One other key comparison: Rush's show became syndicated in
> August 1, 1988. Air America started its network March 31,
> 2004.
>
Does it matter? After its initial sign on it has plumeted in the ratings barely drawing a rating here in Atlanta.<P ID="signature">______________
I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day</P>
 
> > > Air America has about 222,000 listeners at one time in
> 61
> > > markets compared to more than 4.4 million for Rush on
> 600
> > > stations.
> > > http://www.washingtonpost.com/...
> >
> > One other key comparison: Rush's show became syndicated
> in
> > August 1, 1988. Air America started its network March 31,
>
> > 2004.
> >
> Does it matter? After its initial sign on it has plumeted in
> the ratings barely drawing a rating here in Atlanta.
>


Plus...think of all the press they got before sign on. You couldn't turn on any of the time they got on CNN, MSNBC, FNC, CNNHN...the big 3. Not to mention print since then. And then the HBO thing a few months ago.
 
> > > > Air America has about 222,000 listeners at one time in
>
> > 61
> > > > markets compared to more than 4.4 million for Rush on
> > 600
> > > > stations.
> > > > http://www.washingtonpost.com/...
> > >
> > > One other key comparison: Rush's show became syndicated
>
> > in
> > > August 1, 1988. Air America started its network March
> 31,
> >
> > > 2004.
> > >
> > Does it matter? After its initial sign on it has plumeted
> in
> > the ratings barely drawing a rating here in Atlanta.
> >
>
>
> Plus...think of all the press they got before sign on. You
> couldn't turn on any of the time they got on CNN, MSNBC,
> FNC, CNNHN...the big 3. Not to mention print since then.
> And then the HBO thing a few months ago.
>

If Air America had grown to 300 stations and 2 million listeners, people would be saying that it only has 1/2 the audience of Rush. No one knows what the appropriate milestone in listenership at this point is for a radio network starting from scratch, attempting to create an audience where none existed.

That being said, Franken fares pretty well in the Bluer markets head-to-head with Limbaugh, even beating him in some cities in some demos.
 
> Plus...think of all the press they got before sign on. You
> couldn't turn on any of the time they got on CNN, MSNBC,
> FNC, CNNHN...the big 3. Not to mention print since then.
> And then the HBO thing a few months ago.

The HBO movie was a hoot, especially the payroll problems and the Multicultural Broadcasting fiasco. The founding management seemed either dishonest or very much in the dark about everything.
 
Air America might be off here anyway

word has it one of the sports talk stations will own that signal soon in case of potential schedule conflicts with the Hawks and GA Tech.
Air America is lousy. At some point people tire of listening to the bashing 24/7. Plus, talk radio demographics are the highest in all of radio. Highest household incomes, education levels etc...
That should tell you why conservative talk radio is a huge hit and liberal hissy fits make for a bad combination. Look at the average American conservative, higher income, achiever, better education and then understand why liberal talk radio fails miserably.
THEY CAN'T SELL ADVERTISING! What advertiser desires the average American liberal listener? The answer....NOBODY!
 
Re: Air America might be off here anyway

> word has it one of the sports talk stations will own that
> signal soon in case of potential schedule conflicts with the
> Hawks and GA Tech.
> Air America is lousy. At some point people tire of listening
> to the bashing 24/7. Plus, talk radio demographics are the
> highest in all of radio. Highest household incomes,
> education levels etc...
> That should tell you why conservative talk radio is a huge
> hit and liberal hissy fits make for a bad combination. Look
> at the average American conservative, higher income,
> achiever, better education and then understand why liberal
> talk radio fails miserably.
> THEY CAN'T SELL ADVERTISING! What advertiser desires the
> average American liberal listener? The answer....NOBODY!
>
Air America's level of 'lousiness' doesn't match that of your faulty rationalizations, however.<P ID="signature">______________
There's nothing to see here.</P>
 
What is faulty?

A liberal talk radio network or a radio network that can't find advertisers, scratches in the ratings books in two major liberal American hotbeds and is failing miserably.
Achievers buy products, especially high end products. Advertisers flock to the people that have the cash to spend and the programs they patronize.
The higher your income and education levels, the more likely you are a conservative.
Sorry if any of that "faulty" logic sails over your head!
 
If Air America had grown to 300 stations and 2 million
> listeners, people would be saying that it only has 1/2 the
> audience of Rush. No one knows what the appropriate
> milestone in listenership at this point is for a radio
> network starting from scratch, attempting to create an
> audience where none existed.
>
> That being said, Franken fares pretty well in the Bluer
> markets head-to-head with Limbaugh, even beating him in some
> cities in some demos.
>

Franken beat in the intial sign-on, after that he fell back into what would be last place in those same markets(NY, Chicago, Seattle). It was a novelty that couldnt hold up its arguments at all and people saw through him. He is not entertaining and his ratings reflect it since he has zero ratings anywhere anymore.

None? There were many failed attempts at this same market, problem is that when they start getting called on their points they cant back them up with common sense. Liberal radio fails because people are not going to give to some free-loading people to better society as a whole.<P ID="signature">______________
I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day</P>
 
This is what you do. As soon as someone offers a couple of decent points to counter your rants, you take political cheap shots and get the thread killed.

Liberal talk radio has failed in the past because it has failed to entertain. Jon Stewart has proven that a show can have a progressive perspective, be entertaining and attract an audience.


> Franken beat in the intial sign-on, after that he fell back
> into what would be last place in those same markets(NY,
> Chicago, Seattle). It was a novelty that couldnt hold up its
> arguments at all and people saw through him. He is not
> entertaining and his ratings reflect it since he has zero
> ratings anywhere anymore.
>
> None? There were many failed attempts at this same market,
> problem is that when they start getting called on their
> points they cant back them up with common sense. Liberal
> radio fails because people are not going to give to some
> free-loading people to better society as a whole.
>
<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by JimV_ATL on 06/19/05 03:13 AM.</FONT></P>
 
> This is what you do. As soon as someone offers a couple of
> decent points to counter your rants, you take political
> cheap shots and get the thread killed.
>
> Liberal talk radio has failed in the past because it has
> failed to entertain. Jon Stewart has proven that a show can
> have a progressive perspective, be entertaining and attract
> an audience.

Cheap shots? About what? Its common sense, people hate the thought of being forced to give to social programs, most would give what they could and above, if not forced. But this is not a political board so thats the end of that.

They fail cause they fail to hold the audience with their points, Rush, Neal, Sean, etc... make their listeners go do a little more research(one would hope) to find the truth. Sean is at his worst when trying to do his "entertaining" call-in bits, its painful to hear. I would hardly use progressive(socialist) or liberal for Jon Stewart, he is funny in doses but he does not focus entirely on politics, making fun of white men in stuffed suits is funny for only a short time.

Its trying like hell to entertain, but without an actual platform it will continue to fall into the bottom, even NY's AA is tanking now no matter what anyone says, a 1.2 is not good in that market.<P ID="signature">______________
I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day</P>
 
> Its trying like hell to entertain, but without an actual
> platform it will continue to fall into the bottom, even NY's
> AA is tanking now no matter what anyone says, a 1.2 is not
> good in that market.

We're not supposed to give ratings on these boards, even the 12+ ratings, which are so meaningless that Arbitron gives them away for free (while charging big bucks for the demographic breakdowns, including the all-important 25-54 numbers).

Given that, I can say that in that all-important 25-54 demo, AAR's WLIB is doing well and is now the number two political talk station in New York City after WABC. In fact, in 25-54, Al Franken beats Bill O'Reilly by a margin of two and a half to one. That's hardly "tanking."
>
 
We're not supposed to give ratings on these boards, even the
> 12+ ratings, which are so meaningless that Arbitron gives
> them away for free (while charging big bucks for the
> demographic breakdowns, including the all-important 25-54
> numbers).
>
> Given that, I can say that in that all-important 25-54 demo,
> AAR's WLIB is doing well and is now the number two political
> talk station in New York City after WABC. In fact, in
> 25-54, Al Franken beats Bill O'Reilly by a margin of two and
> a half to one. That's hardly "tanking."
> >
>
That was his original ratings, yes. Since then it has dropped like an anchor, that cannot be denied, all anyone has done is look at the initial ratings. Now, after they have had time to settle they are back in the toilet, even Viva looked like gangbusters when it first signed on and it has faded bad.<P ID="signature">______________
I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day</P>
 
> We're not supposed to give ratings on these boards, even the
>
> > 12+ ratings, which are so meaningless that Arbitron gives
> > them away for free (while charging big bucks for the
> > demographic breakdowns, including the all-important 25-54
> > numbers).
> >
> > Given that, I can say that in that all-important 25-54
> demo,
> > AAR's WLIB is doing well and is now the number two
> political
> > talk station in New York City after WABC. In fact, in
> > 25-54, Al Franken beats Bill O'Reilly by a margin of two
> and
> > a half to one. That's hardly "tanking."
> > >
> >
> That was his original ratings, yes. Since then it has
> dropped like an anchor, that cannot be denied, all anyone
> has done is look at the initial ratings. Now, after they
> have had time to settle they are back in the toilet, even
> Viva looked like gangbusters when it first signed on and it
> has faded bad.
>
You're wrong. Absolutely wrong. WLIB STILL beats WOR in 25-54 and thus is STILL the number two political talk station in NYC, even though WOR has a much more powerful signal. And Franken STILL beats O'Reilly in the hour when they're opposite each other. All the right-wing crowing about "tanking" is based on the 12+ numbers, which are virtually meaningless, even though they show that WLIB has about the same 12+ numbers now as it had when it had a much less desirable (to advertisers)audience of Caribbean immigrants.
 
> > talk station in New York City after WABC. In fact, in
> > 25-54, Al Franken beats Bill O'Reilly by a margin of two
> and
> > a half to one. That's hardly "tanking."
> > >
> >
> That was his original ratings, yes. Since then it has
> dropped like an anchor, that cannot be denied, all anyone
> has done is look at the initial ratings. Now, after they
> have had time to settle they are back in the toilet, even
> Viva looked like gangbusters when it first signed on and it
> has faded bad.

Franken actually beat LIMBAUGH for one month early on in the 25-54 demo, but that didn't last. But he still beats Bill O'Reilly in 25-54 -- and WLIB in general beats WOR in that demographic.
 
> > Its trying like hell to entertain, but without an actual
> > platform it will continue to fall into the bottom, even
> NY's
> > AA is tanking now no matter what anyone says, a 1.2 is not
>
> > good in that market.
>
> We're not supposed to give ratings on these boards, even the
> 12+ ratings, which are so meaningless that Arbitron gives
> them away for free (while charging big bucks for the
> demographic breakdowns, including the all-important 25-54
> numbers).
>
> Given that, I can say that in that all-important 25-54 demo,
> AAR's WLIB is doing well and is now the number two political
> talk station in New York City after WABC. In fact, in
> 25-54, Al Franken beats Bill O'Reilly by a margin of two and
> a half to one. That's hardly "tanking."
> >
> No, they are 3rd behind WOR in the latest releases and 2 other sations too close to call a station that appeared with such fanfare even a remote success.

Tank is a comparitive term to their intial ratings which everyone touted as being what America really wanted, AFTER that surge the ratings tanked, the same term that people on here described Viva 105.3's ratings after its initial book.<P ID="signature">______________
I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day</P>
 
> > We're not supposed to give ratings on these boards, even
> the
> >
> > > 12+ ratings, which are so meaningless that Arbitron
> gives
> > > them away for free (while charging big bucks for the
> > > demographic breakdowns, including the all-important
> 25-54
> > > numbers).
> > >
> > > Given that, I can say that in that all-important 25-54
> > demo,
> > > AAR's WLIB is doing well and is now the number two
> > political
> > > talk station in New York City after WABC. In fact, in
> > > 25-54, Al Franken beats Bill O'Reilly by a margin of two
>
> > and
> > > a half to one. That's hardly "tanking."
> > > >
> > >
> > That was his original ratings, yes. Since then it has
> > dropped like an anchor, that cannot be denied, all anyone
> > has done is look at the initial ratings. Now, after they
> > have had time to settle they are back in the toilet, even
> > Viva looked like gangbusters when it first signed on and
> it
> > has faded bad.
> >
> You're wrong. Absolutely wrong. WLIB STILL beats WOR in
> 25-54 and thus is STILL the number two political talk
> station in NYC, even though WOR has a much more powerful
> signal. And Franken STILL beats O'Reilly in the hour when
> they're opposite each other. All the right-wing crowing
> about "tanking" is based on the 12+ numbers, which are
> virtually meaningless, even though they show that WLIB has
> about the same 12+ numbers now as it had when it had a much
> less desirable (to advertisers)audience of Caribbean
> immigrants.
>
I suggest both of you go look at the latest book, they are getting beat by WOR in every quarter back through Sp04. I am sure glad that you are trying to defend a station that is dying.<P ID="signature">______________
I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day</P>
 
> >
> I suggest both of you go look at the latest book, they are
> getting beat by WOR in every quarter back through Sp04. I am
> sure glad that you are trying to defend a station that is
> dying.
>
What "latest book" are you referring to? The 12+ numbers published by Radio and Records? As I've said, those are virtually meaningless. I'm talking about the 25-54 numbers, which show that WLIB, with its puny signal that doesn't reach a significant part of the New York City market, actually beats 50,000 watt WOR in the only demographic that most advertisers care about. And even in your virtually meaningless 12+ numbers, WLIB's latest rating is about the same as it was a year ago -- hardly evidence that it is "dying."
 
>
> What "latest book" are you referring to? The 12+ numbers
> published by Radio and Records? As I've said, those are
> virtually meaningless. I'm talking about the 25-54 numbers,
> which show that WLIB, with its puny signal that doesn't
> reach a significant part of the New York City market,
> actually beats 50,000 watt WOR in the only demographic that
> most advertisers care about. And even in your virtually
> meaningless 12+ numbers, WLIB's latest rating is about the
> same as it was a year ago -- hardly evidence that it is
> "dying."
>
For all the fanfare and free press they have received, yes they are dying. Most thought they would be able to equal numbers of the heavyweights, so far they are only even or very slightly ahead of O reilly who regularly pisses people off so thats not surprising.

If that is all they can manage in one of the biggest cities then they dont have much of a future elsewhere.<P ID="signature">______________
I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day</P>
 
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