Weather Takes Down WWVA Wheeling

[Rusty Muck]

I notice that WEGW, usually easy to get here in the South Hills, is very weak and spotty, likely at reduced power.
Are the two related? Is their tower close to this 1170 site? Might they be trying to string a long wire?

I know the US Army has some very impressive temporary broadcast equipment that can be deployed around the globe
on very short notice. I recall they were testing it from Maryland when the extended band first opened up in the 90's.
Maybe CC should see if they could pick one up surplus and keep it on hand for these emergencies?

Yes, WEGW is part of the CC/Wheeling cluster (which also includes WOVK/98.7 [the former WWVA-FM], WKWK/97.3, WVKF/95.7, and WBBD/1400).

 

[Parttimer]

A few years ago when CC had filed to move 1170 to Cleveland the plan was to shift the WWVA identity to
1400 permanently. Conspiracy theories, anyone?

The political reporter Jeff Greenfield once said, "I never believe conspiracy theories, incompetence always explains so much more."

 

[schmave]

It was getting into Newark, Ohio weakly around 6:30 p.m. with some very deep fading. Nowhere to be found around 9:30, well after what would be the pattern change.

 

[Talk_Dude]

Rebuilding a tower is not as easy as one would think. The most extreme case of which was KFI's tower in Los Angeles, which was destroyed in 2004 and took two years to replace (they had to operate from an auxiliary tower at 10,000 watts instead of their normal 50kW signal during that time).

I have no background in structural engineering, so I need to ask, what's so difficult about erecting a steel tower? If the old one was structurally sound, why would it take years to have a replacement fabricated from the original blueprints and put back up? Are broadcast towers made with special, custom designed parts or can they just be welded or bolted together using standard steel components available from any metals supplier?

I'm not being snarky, I genuinely would like to know what would make erecting simple steel towers in a location where some had already been located before would take so long.

 

[Parttimer]

Just guessing here, but:

1) Lead time to order the towers. I don't think you can just drive down to "Towers r Us".

2) Permits... FCC and local

3) Assembly time is weeks rather than days

4) Testing

 

[Stormychuck]

Parttimer is correct, and erecting a new tower is some what more complicated once one has been blown down, it comes with a whole host of logistical issues.

As parttimer pointed out permitting, assembly erecting and testing, and providing theirs no additional damage ie; in reference to your ground strapping and hopefully not completely ripping out the tower's coaxial cable lines from the transmitter, or at worst, the tower has fallen completely through the transmitter building, squashing what use to be your transmitter flatter then a pie plate. Yes you need a separate bank account when mother nature throws you a curve from left field in order to put the station back on air.

Although they're are many company's nationally that handle radio/TV tower erections, sorry, that sounds suggestive, for these sort of emergencies, as stated above, it's costly even for insurance companies, should your tower be insured, and there many towers not insured.

Re-assembly can be a very lengthy process even for a station that has the bucks. Unfortunately, I seen all of the above happen and completely put stations off-air for good because it's just not financially feasible to re-erect the tower.

 

[Rusty Muck]

During Hurricane Hugo, WBT/Charlotte lost two of their three diamond-shaped Blaw-Knox towers. Thankfully, faithful replicas were built to match the surviving tower, but that process did take a year to accomplish.

 

[listner1]

Their app for an STA (temp authority) is on the FCC web site. They are running 12kw on a long wire antenna strung between what is left of two of the towers.

 

[Talk_Dude]

I did some research yesterday. (OK, I talked to a guy from my church who works for a metal fabricating company. That's almost research.) His company makes things like ceiling joists, towers, motorcycles frames, and pretty much anything else made of welded-together steel tubes or angle iron. He said that the length of time between order and delivery of something like radio towers depends on the time involved in engineering, in actual fabrication, and waiting until the jobs ahead of the towers already in the production queue are finished.

In a case of rebuilding exact replicas of the towers that fell over, he said that if the plans and designs of the original were already finished, then the engineering phase of the project wouldn't take any time. The time for the actual construction itself would depend on the size of the shop doing the work, but he figured no more than a month to six weeks for the actual work, if they had the steel available. Then he said that in this recession, the odds of there being any jobs in the production queue that you'd have to wait for are probably slim and none. It would have been a lot different four or five years ago, but now, if you have a job for a steel structure fabricator, chances are they can call some workers back from lay off and get started on it right away.

Now, that's just one middle manager at one steel fabrication company speaking in general terms. Take it for what it's worth. Your mileage may vary.

 

[hypwr]

I'm sure they will go with guyed towers. To duplicate the Blaw-Knox towers would cost a king's ransom.

 

[FreddyE1977]

A few years ago when CC had filed to move 1170 to Cleveland the plan was to shift the WWVA identity to
1400 permanently. Conspiracy theories, anyone?

The political reporter Jeff Greenfield once said, "I never believe conspiracy theories, incompetence always explains so much more."

....now THAT is a great line!

 

[secondchoice]

I'm sure they will go with guyed towers. To duplicate the Blaw-Knox towers would cost a king's ransom.

Assuming the ground system is intact, and they use the same height towers or less (avoiding a major hassle with the FAA) they should be able have the towers up in 10 weeks or less if they go with “new” guyed towers. I do not think local permits will be a problem. Usually to rebuild something is "automatic".

I don’t remember how often the FAA up dates their maps, but 3 lighted towers on a hill top is a good VFR reference point. I do not know if any body still uses AM directional finders in general aviation anymore. GPS takes all of the “skill” out of navigation now. As late as the early 1970’s some commercial pilots on really late flights “double checked” our positions by triangulation of a couple of 50 KW AM’s at night. Especially if there was a baseball game or something the crew wanted to listen to. WSM, KFI, WOAI, WBAP, WGN, WABC and KVI (not 50KW but worked well into Seattle) were favorites.

 

[FreddyE1977]

down on the WV board they are saying they're using a long wire strung between two of the
tower stubs at about 5kW. If that is the case, the signal into the South Hills of Pittsburgh is
amazingly good.

 

[secondchoice]

Their app for an STA (temp authority) is on the FCC web site. They are running 12kw on a long wire antenna strung between what is left of two of the towers.

I am assuming the FCC website is correct. Ham radio goes worldwide often without a gound system on the old clothes line with two glass insulators. Of course it's different Freqs. and a lot less power. I am surprized that a "solid state" 50KW transmitter can be "pulled back" to 12KW and run with a poor ground unless they have an old tube job just for emergencies. WWVA should not have a lot of adjacent channel interference for a couple of hundred miles. That will help reception. Using the 4 times power will double the reception "rule" they should only lose 51% coverage.

 

[gr8oldies]

For any engineers in the know, from my ham radio days I remember having an antenna tuner in line with a transceiver to make the rig "think" it was looking at a properly tuned-to-frequency antenna. Did the WWVA engineers manage to cut that longwire to exact length for 1170 or is some type of "fool the transmiter" tuning required?

 

[DG02816]

Got this info from my Broadcast mailing list on WWVA:
Update for those interested. WWVA is back on the air at 5kw.
The "antenna" is the stub (50') of the east tower (with all the folded
over tower cut away) plus about 150' of 3/8" guy wire strung between the
East and Center towers (with insulators in the wire before it was
attached to the center tower). The "system" is being driven from the
east tower feed point. The bridge measured the "system" at 5 -j25 which
was matched with an "L" network.

While current plans are in flux due to various factors, the
current direction is to clear the west tower and, once all the ducks are
marching in the same direction, erect a guyed tower at the same
location. This will allow us to increase power to 12.5kw while the rest
of the array is re-built.

Thanks to all for your consideration while we were working
through this "event"

Michael A. Golchert
Clear Channel Radio

 

[hypwr]

Their app for an STA (temp authority) is on the FCC web site. They are running 12kw on a long wire antenna strung between what is left of two of the towers.

I am assuming the FCC website is correct. Ham radio goes worldwide often without a gound system on the old clothes line with two glass insulators. Of course it's different Freqs. and a lot less power. I am surprized that a "solid state" 50KW transmitter can be "pulled back" to 12KW and run with a poor ground unless they have an old tube job just for emergencies. WWVA should not have a lot of adjacent channel interference for a couple of hundred miles. That will help reception. Using the 4 times power will double the reception "rule" they should only lose 51% coverage.

In addition to their Harris solid state 50, they have an Omnitronix 10KW. If they still had their RCA 50D they could run it into a coat hanger and it would work just fine.

 

[dB]

...
The "antenna" is the stub (50') of the east tower (with all the folded
over tower cut away) plus about 150' of 3/8" guy wire strung between the
East and Center towers (with insulators in the wire before it was
attached to the center tower). The "system" is being driven from the
east tower feed point. The bridge measured the "system" at 5 -j25 which
was matched with an "L" network.

...

Hams would call that an "Inverted-L" antenna. 200' would be electrically short for 1.17MHz, so adding some inductance ("L") would make it look longer. Probably has a very irregular radiation pattern, with gain in some directions and nulls in others.

On 160 meters (1.8MHz), eastern U.S. hams can work Europe fairly regularly with 100W or less, and similar non-ideal antennas, so I wouldn't be surprised by several hundred miles of coverage at night, getting better as we move closer to winter.

 

[schmave]

How does WWVA's usual 50K signal sound in and around Pittsburgh? Guessing with the high dial position and poorer ground conductivity out that way there's probably some cancellation.

 

[FreddyE1977]

Over the past few years it has been crappy, largely due to the fact they were running IBOC. Rapid in-and-out fades after sundown.