What am I missing with my new DTV converter box?

[murcuryvapor]

Here's what I have:

* KYW-3 offers one HD channel.
* 6 ABC offers an HD, an DT/SD with alternate programming (20/20 and movies) and WX-SD.
* NBC 10 offers DT/HD, and a WX channel.
* PHL 17 offers DT and WCSN sports channel-all sorts of foreign sports programs, including that Canadian thing with the brooms.
* NJN 23 comes in with a moderate signal. They give you WNJS DT (1) and a 3 and 4 with various local and educational programs (they seem to switch on/off 2 and 5 though-not sure why).
* I get a DTV 25-3-no call sign, but I'm guessing it's out of Reading. All informercials.
* Fox 29 has one DTV channel, Ditto WYBE.
* DTV-44 is intermittent. Weak to average signal.
* WGTW-48 has 5(!)DT offerings of religious crapola.
* WPSG 57 has one DT channel.
* Channel 61 has Ion, Qubo, IonLife and Worship.
* Channel 65 is WUVP-DT and WFPA en espanol. The second is a movie/sports channel.


Where is WHYY 12-1,2,3? The box is not finding it over the air. I read that they moved the DTV to Channel 50 UHF and lowered the power. Any info?

 

[tripinva]

Yeah, WHYY has one hell of a null going to the northeast. They're on channel 50 and have to protect WNJN in Montclair. Without knowing where you are, it's difficult to say exactly how low the power is for you.

25-3 is WTVE-DT, which is mostly infomercials, as you already said. They have a transmitter in Philly at the main tower site though, which is probably why you're seeing it.

Curling is the Canadian sport you're thinking of I believe.

NJN does not have a -2 feed to my knowledge:

23-1 NJN (same as analog)
23-3 Annenberg/CPB Channel
23-4 JerseyVision
23-5 PBS-HD

They turn off the -3 feed in order to air HD on -5 with less impact on the picture quality. Otherwise the -5 is off.

My site may help you out some: http://www.rabbitears.info/market.php?mktid=4

- Trip

 

[murcuryvapor]

Yeah, WHYY has one hell of a null going to the northeast. They're on channel 50 and have to protect WNJN in Montclair. Without knowing where you are, it's difficult to say exactly how low the power is for you.

25-3 is WTVE-DT, which is mostly infomercials, as you already said. They have a transmitter in Philly at the main tower site though, which is probably why you're seeing it.

Curling is the Canadian sport you're thinking of I believe.

NJN does not have a -2 feed to my knowledge:

23-1 NJN (same as analog)
23-3 Annenberg/CPB Channel
23-4 JerseyVision
23-5 PBS-HD

They turn off the -3 feed in order to air HD on -5 with less impact on the picture quality. Otherwise the -5 is off.

My site may help you out some: http://www.rabbitears.info/market.php?mktid=4

- Trip

I am in South Philly, close to the WW Bridge. I'm using a horizontal whip comm antenna magnemounted outside. Most signals are 80% to full. If WHYY is on the air at full power, OTA viewers will be screwed with a settop antenna.

EDIT: If I'm looking at the WHYY mapping properly (the little black and white circle-the FCC map links are dead) the null appears to cover the SE to some degree. I guess the null is to protect 50 until February when they move to 51?

I guess I'll live.

 

[tripinva]

I am in South Philly, close to the WW Bridge. I'm using a horizontal whip comm antenna magnemounted outside. Most signals are 80% to full. If WHYY is on the air at full power, OTA viewers will be screwed with a settop antenna.

EDIT: If I'm looking at the WHYY mapping properly (the little black and white circle-the FCC map links are dead) the null appears to cover the SE to some degree. I guess the null is to protect 50 until February when they move to 51?

I guess I'll live.

Yeah, the FCC doesn't even have it listed; I had to dig that information up from various sources. You are looking at it correctly; that is the directional pattern. Managed to find that one in a "TEST" filing by the FCC for channel 50 in Wilmington (some test, eh?).

The null is actually to protect the analog signal on 50; the digital on 51 is already operational.

How long is your horizontal whip antenna? Realize that as you go up in frequency, the wavelength gets shorter and shorter, and as the signal gets weaker, you need an antenna more optimized to the wavelength to receive it. A true UHF antenna might be beneficial for you, assuming your whip is longer than a typical UHF wavelength.

Next year, WHYY-DT moves from 50 to 12. Hopefully at that time the signal problems will go away, but somehow I'm doubting it.

- Trip

 

[murcuryvapor]

I am in South Philly, close to the WW Bridge. I'm using a horizontal whip comm antenna magnemounted outside. Most signals are 80% to full. If WHYY is on the air at full power, OTA viewers will be screwed with a settop antenna.

EDIT: If I'm looking at the WHYY mapping properly (the little black and white circle-the FCC map links are dead) the null appears to cover the SE to some degree. I guess the null is to protect 50 until February when they move to 51?

I guess I'll live.

Yeah, the FCC doesn't even have it listed; I had to dig that information up from various sources. You are looking at it correctly; that is the directional pattern. Managed to find that one in a "TEST" filing by the FCC for channel 50 in Wilmington (some test, eh?).

The null is actually to protect the analog signal on 50; the digital on 51 is already operational.

How long is your horizontal whip antenna? Realize that as you go up in frequency, the wavelength gets shorter and shorter, and as the signal gets weaker, you need an antenna more optimized to the wavelength to receive it. A true UHF antenna might be beneficial for you, assuming your whip is longer than a typical UHF wavelength.

Next year, WHYY-DT moves from 50 to 12. Hopefully at that time the signal problems will go away, but somehow I'm doubting it.

- Trip

Yeah, I meant ''when WNJN turns off 50", but since WHYY is moving the DT operation to 12, it doesn't matter.

A better site: http://tvfool.com/.

Gives pre and post signal levels. And the power of WHYY-DT at 12 will be 3kW lower -10kW. Hopefully they will be fully circular.



I use a 12" whip. Works very well. I might upgrade, but it works well enough for now.

The channel 50 allocation was for the FCC to run set top box tests.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=322163

 

[tripinva]

Yeah, I meant ''when WNJN turns off 50", but since WHYY is moving the DT operation to 12, it doesn't matter.

A better site: http://tvfool.com/.

Gives pre and post signal levels. And the power of WHYY-DT at 12 will be 3kW lower -10kW. Hopefully they will be fully circular.



I use a 12" whip. Works very well. I might upgrade, but it works well enough for now.

The channel 50 allocation was for the FCC to run set top box tests.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=322163

I'm quite familiar with TV Fool, believe me. =) My site's more about subchannels than reception itself, thus why I linked you.

I don't buy their "set top box" argument for one second. Qualcomm wanted channel 55 for its MediaFLO service and has been paying off stations to move off of that channel for years. WLNY, WACX, WYPX, all are analogs on 55 that terminated their channel 55 operations because of Qualcomm. WHYY-DT moved to 50 for much the same reason, and KFMB-DT in San Diego moved to 7 for that reason. Both moves have been disastrous for stations reception.

- Trip

 

[murcuryvapor]

Yeah, I meant ''when WNJN turns off 50", but since WHYY is moving the DT operation to 12, it doesn't matter.

A better site: http://tvfool.com/.

Gives pre and post signal levels. And the power of WHYY-DT at 12 will be 3kW lower -10kW. Hopefully they will be fully circular.



I use a 12" whip. Works very well. I might upgrade, but it works well enough for now.

The channel 50 allocation was for the FCC to run set top box tests.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=322163

I'm quite familiar with TV Fool, believe me. =) My site's more about subchannels than reception itself, thus why I linked you.

I don't buy their "set top box" argument for one second. Qualcomm wanted channel 55 for its MediaFLO service and has been paying off stations to move off of that channel for years. WLNY, WACX, WYPX, all are analogs on 55 that terminated their channel 55 operations because of Qualcomm. WHYY-DT moved to 50 for much the same reason, and KFMB-DT in San Diego moved to 7 for that reason. Both moves have been disastrous for stations reception.

- Trip

Do you have a link for this Qualcomm info?

 

[tripinva]

http://www.sbe36.org/

That's for KFMB.

http://broadcastengineering.com/news/qualcomm-magic-number-20050619/

WACX and KWDK.

http://broadcastengineering.com/newsletters/bth/20050925/

WLNY.

http://broadcastengineering.com/RF/stations-spectrum-deal-qualcomm-0604/

WTBY and WYPX.

http://www.fybush.com/NERW/2007/070305/nerw.html

WHYY.

EDIT: Here's one for KLDT in Dallas.

http://www.broadcastingcable.com/article/CA6393042.html

- Trip

 

[Jul]

Here's what I have:

* KYW-3 offers one HD channel.
* 6 ABC offers an HD, an DT/SD with alternate programming (20/20 and movies) and WX-SD.
* NBC 10 offers DT/HD, and a WX channel.
* PHL 17 offers DT and WCSN sports channel-all sorts of foreign sports programs, including that Canadian thing with the brooms.
* NJN 23 comes in with a moderate signal. They give you WNJS DT (1) and a 3 and 4 with various local and educational programs (they seem to switch on/off 2 and 5 though-not sure why).
* I get a DTV 25-3-no call sign, but I'm guessing it's out of Reading. All informercials.
* Fox 29 has one DTV channel, Ditto WYBE.
* DTV-44 is intermittent. Weak to average signal.
* WGTW-48 has 5(!)DT offerings of religious crapola.
* WPSG 57 has one DT channel.
* Channel 61 has Ion, Qubo, IonLife and Worship.
* Channel 65 is WUVP-DT and WFPA en espanol. The second is a movie/sports channel.


Where is WHYY 12-1,2,3? The box is not finding it over the air. I read that they moved the DTV to Channel 50 UHF and lowered the power. Any info?

I think that you should contact WHYY about this: http://www.whyy.org/about/contact.html

 

[murcuryvapor]

I think that you should contact WHYY about this: http://www.whyy.org/about/contact.html

Already done.

 

[Bill_W]

I'm I Gloucester Twp, NJ. I've had an ota digital receiver since I got my 1st HD DirecTv box. I have never been able to get channel 12 DT ota. I get all the other digital stations. It only comes in via comcast on channels 240, 241, & 242. Does channel 12 send DT to comcast and verizon via fiber?

 

[murcuryvapor]

I'm I Gloucester Twp, NJ. I've had an ota digital receiver since I got my 1st HD DirecTv box. I have never been able to get channel 12 DT ota. I get all the other digital stations. It only comes in via comcast on channels 240, 241, & 242. Does channel 12 send DT to comcast and verizon via fiber?

You're in the null. Not sure about the fiber, but I suspect that's true.

 

[Jefferson]

I'm about 7 miles NW of Roxborough along the Schuylkill River in norristown and WHYY's DT signal is utterly non-decodable. I don't think their OTA signal is at full capacity and it bugs me since I can't even get NJN from my location. And don't get me started on WYBE's new format for people with ADHD. :-(

 

[8638]

And don't get me started on WYBE's new format for people with ADHD. :-(

Isn't that about the worst programming you've ever seen?

 

[csp-1]

i live near steel road and west chester pike in havertown , part time , and in margate city new jersey part time . half of the analog channels are not watchable on my digital boxes (in havertown) - just walking around the room makes the picture freeze , at least , or worse , makes the "weak signal" icon come on - horrible - i tried an amplified set of rabbit ears with minimal improvement . in margate city new jersey , i get no channels at all .... not even wmgm nbc 40 ..... this situation is worse than even realistic "i" expected .... will i have to install a roof top antenna with gobs of splitters ? i have lots of quality analog older t.v.'s , and do not want to throw them away .. i do not want another bill (cable) and i will not let verizon take down my copper loop to give me fios plus i thought public airwaves were free :-X ... IS THERE SOME KIND OF SUPER QUALITY AMPLIFIED OR MADE FOR DIGITAL RABBIT EARS MADE TO SELL TO THE PUBLIC ? if i install a rooftop in margate , it surely will be blown down within a year .... i am frustrated as heck , plus worried about february 20th , 2009 , when i can watch next to nothing

 

[fybush]

When it comes to DTV, "amplified" is not always a good thing, especially the cheap amps in most consumer set-top antennas. If you're near powerful signals (as you are in Margate, with WMGM-DT), the local DTV signal can overload the amp and wipe out not only itself but other channels as well. Get your hands on a Silver Sensor (the unamplified version) and you may have more success.

 

[csp-1]

thanks a lot ... i'll do a google search on "silver sensor" ... never heard of it .... if it's readily available , and it works , i'll be buying 15 of them ...have 5 t v 's in jersey and 10 tv ' s in pennsy

 

[8638]

i live near steel road and west chester pike in havertown , part time , and in margate city new jersey part time . half of the analog channels are not watchable on my digital boxes (in havertown) - just walking around the room makes the picture freeze , at least , or worse , makes the "weak signal" icon come on - horrible - i tried an amplified set of rabbit ears with minimal improvement . in margate city new jersey , i get no channels at all .... not even wmgm nbc 40 ..... this situation is worse than even realistic "i" expected .... will i have to install a roof top antenna with gobs of splitters ? i have lots of quality analog older t.v.'s , and do not want to throw them away .. i do not want another bill (cable) and i will not let verizon take down my copper loop to give me fios plus i thought public airwaves were free :-X ... IS THERE SOME KIND OF SUPER QUALITY AMPLIFIED OR MADE FOR DIGITAL RABBIT EARS MADE TO SELL TO THE PUBLIC ? if i install a rooftop in margate , it surely will be blown down within a year .... i am frustrated as heck , plus worried about february 20th , 2009 , when i can watch next to nothing

I've heard good things about the Silver Sensor as well, but I think it will only prove useful in Havertown. In Margate, I think you'll only see WMGM-DT. I think you are going to need a roof antenna for any meaningful reception there. I too live on the Shore (on the mainland side, so a bit less wind). Here's the good news: other than WPVI and WHYY, I believe all the other Philly DT's will be UHF's post transition. Much smaller antenna than what you are used to seeing on roofs=less wind loading, less chance to get blown over. I'd try doing that without amplification first, for the reasons that Scott Fybush outlined. I think you may be pleasantly surprised.

Another important thing: at the distance Margate is from Roxborough, antenna orientation is critical for good reception. My antenna is on a rotor, and it proves
very useful for locking in a good signal. Sometimes a degree or two makes the difference. If manually orienting the antenna, shoot for positioning that gives the best signal on WCAU-DT (67) and WTXF-DT (42). They are the most difficult to receive here in Ocean County. If you have them, you should have all of the rest.
Until the transition, WPVI-DT (64) will come in. You probably won't get WHYY-DT (50) for reasons discussed ad nauseum here on the board.

If you need to use a preamplifier or distribution amplifier, do not buy cheap stuff (this means no Wal-Mart or Radio Shack). Go with Channel Master or any of the reputable manufacturers. Worth the extra money!

 

[csp-1]

thanks a million , don !!! if i can receive only wmgm dt in margate , "WATCHABLE" , using a silver sensor antenna , i can be happy , as long as the picture does not "freeze" .... i'm not a t.v. person , per se' , more of a radio person ... but to not have any t.v. at all, is not acceptable , even for a person like me . in havertown , if i can just get in some of the major network channels , and p.b.s. , WATCHABLE , i can be happy in havertown , too . i found some silver sensor antennaes on e-bay ....

 

[8638]

thanks a million , don !!! if i can receive only wmgm dt in margate , "WATCHABLE" , using a silver sensor antenna , i can be happy , as long as the picture does not "freeze" .... i'm not a t.v. person , per se' , more of a radio person ... but to not have any t.v. at all, is not acceptable , even for a person like me . in havertown , if i can just get in some of the major network channels , and p.b.s. , WATCHABLE , i can be happy in havertown , too . i found some silver sensor antennaes on e-bay ....

My pleasure! Let us know how it works out for you.