What happened to AM

[TakeItFromMe]

This has been mentioned before by some cowboys on this board but what is going on with AM radio in Seattle ??? The top AM station in the last couple of months ain't even top twenty, much less top 10 25-54 outside of sports ??? Guess that's why KIRO moved to the FM band and guess we will see if it is content or the AM band that is the tuneout :-\ Seems in other markets AM signals still work but I don't know the demos.

FM band is seeing quite a shakeup in recent months with WOLF, MOVIN and KCMS moving back to the top of the July numbers. Hmmmmmmmm. Somethin may be happenin in Seattle radio. Thoughts ???

 

[SeattleRadioPro]

It's not just Seattle. With relatively few exceptions (KGO, WABC el. al) AMs are slowly dying nationwide. Like most trends it just took a little longer for it to hit the PNW.

 

[radioplayer]

I think the biggest issue has to be the changes made by the industry and the FCC regarding the audio quality. When AM has only got 10Khz of spectrum, that's not much and it reduces the fidelity to the point that it's only really good for (ironically) "Talk Radio"......AM used to be so much better than just a bunch of yakkers!

I also think the ball got dropped in the early 80's after the AM stereo debacle....the medium never recovered from that issue either.

I'm sure some of the more technical folks on this board can elaborate further on my point about the audio quality.

Thanks for posting this topic!

 

[djdan]

It may be even worse than you think. KGO looks very poor in PPM pre-currency, same with WABC. PPM does not appear to favor AM radio stations. Only KFI and KYW held their own but with 55+ numbers. News, Talk, Hispanic, Jazz, Christian, Rhythmic and Urban are all very much down in the PPM markets both pre-currency and currency. Soft AC, Hot AC, CHR and Rock are all pretty much up. Country has been down, but not all markets have Country. AAA has been up, but not all markets have AAA. The fate of AM may be tied to PPM.

 

[LITTLEBOYBLUE]

I know the only time I sample AM is when I've seen breaking news or want traffic. MAYBE I stick around if I am curious about programming...sampling talk every few months. So that leads me to wonder if we'll end up with a scenario where major markets have a few talk/info-based AM's (as we do now with KOMO, KIRO, KJR, and the 3 bigger talkers of KVI, KTTH, KPTK).

I wonder if many of the major AM's now brokering programming end up being candidates for smaller market stations (e.g. KRKO, KBRC, etc.). Canada has kind of done that...when a major AM turns it's paperwork back in (for an FM license), the AM often migrates to a suburban community. Difference is there the formats are regulated where here operators hang on to the frequency and often just broker the thing to improve cash flow. The issue that does not speak well for that possibility is many of the smaller operators doing similar programming where it's off the bird, brokered, syndicated, etc. so in the end they are not really a "community" station either.

 

[DanStrassberg]

When AM has only got 10Khz of spectrum, that's not much and it reduces the fidelity to the point that it's only really good for (ironically) "Talk Radio"......

The bizarre part of this discussion is that the set manufacturers want people to spend $200 a copy for HD radios that don't sound all that wonderful on AM, but refuse to produce analog AM radios that sound good. A selling price of $200 a copy would allow manufacturers and retailers to turn a nice profit on AM radios that sound GREAT!

Although the spacing between adjacent AM channels is indeed only 10 kHz in the Western Hemisphere (9 kHz elsewhere), AM stations can use 20 kHZ for analog signals, and most did exactly that before the advent of HD radio. 20 kHz analog bandwidth allows 10-kHz audio bandwidth, which was permitted under the old NRSC mask. AM signals that use 20 kHz of bandwidth cause far less havoc on the band than do AM-band HD Radio signals, which claim to use 30 kHz but actually use even more than that. If I'm not mistaken, each of the two (that is, L and R) channels of the AM-band HD Radio signal is allowed a data rate of 16 kbps, which necessitates lossy compression that many listeners find produces really annoying artifacts, particularly with spoken program material (less noticeable with music).

So there is no need for AM to sound crappy, and if it weren't for the bizarre logic of the receiver industry, we could have some really good sounding AM radios for less than the current price of most HD Radios. You wouldn't be likely to be able to buy a good quality analog AM/FM radio new at retail for $15.00, but you might have a variety of them to choose from at $150.00.

 

[Bongwater]

I hate to say this, but AM Stereo still whips AM HD ANYDAY!

 

[mimo]

I hate to say this, but AM Stereo still whips AM HD ANYDAY!

Agreed. At least you could hear it more than 10 miles from the transmitter, it didn't spread hash over adjacent frequencies, and it had (to my ears anyway) BETTER separation than FM. You also had all the distance you got with AM. If you could hear the station, you could hear it in stereo.

I think AM kind of did itself in, in the U.S., AM got safe music wise, while FM went more experimental. AM stations started having tighter playlists in the 70's. In Canada, it at least survived into the 90's until the hit restrictions were lifted from FM, then all the AM top 40's gave up pretty much overnight. Some held on for a couple of years after that. I get a station from Montreal where I live now, that just went back to music. I notice the songs I grew up listening to on AM don't quite sound the same as I remember on the AM radios I had, and I blame that on the receivers that don't have the same frequency response the radios I had 20 years ago did on the AM side. I still think AM will find a way to reinvent itself.

 

[SeattleObserver]

I hate to say this, but AM Stereo still whips AM HD ANYDAY!

And, it didn't lie about what it was.

If I had a dime for every time a station claimed that iBiquity "HDRadio" meant 'high definition' radio... I'd be rich! ... and even more so for those that say 'hybrid digital' - apparently it doesn't mean that either.

HEY! KIRO isn't ID'ing "K-I-R-O-F-M-H-D-One" shouldn't they be doing that too?

 

[SeattleRadioPro]

HEY! KIRO isn't ID'ing "K-I-R-O-F-M-H-D-One" shouldn't they be doing that too?

Yes they should. And when they do - it will be long enough of an ID for someone to sponsor it. Just think:

"K-I-R-O SEATTLE, K-I-R-O F-M K-I-R-O-H-D-1, TACOMA SEATTLE, PRESENTED BY CATLIN CAPITAL.

 

[Bongwater]

HEY! KIRO isn't ID'ing "K-I-R-O-F-M-H-D-One" shouldn't they be doing that too?

Yes they should. And when they do - it will be long enough of an ID for someone to sponsor it. Just think:

"K-I-R-O SEATTLE, K-I-R-O F-M K-I-R-O-H-D-1, TACOMA SEATTLE, PRESENTED BY CATLIN CAPITAL.

Just what we need...more alphabet soup at the top of the hour.

I once had a dream (nightmare?) that corporate sponsorship got into radio and did away with call letters. KUBE became Taco Bell 93, KZOK became Budweiser 102.5, KIXI became Depends 880, KWJZ became Bellevue Land Rover 98.9, etc....

But back to AM. Like I said before (and time will prove me right), the FM band will either need to be expanded to 76-128 MHz or, with HD on most of their stations already and nothing worthwhile on any of them, radio cluster ownerships need to be cut (or preferrably both) if we're going to accomodate a mass exodus from AM to FM. There just isn't enough room for everybody as it is.

AM should become a local radio service for small broadcasters and special licenses for radio hobbyists.

 

[SeattleObserver]

Yes they should. And when they do - it will be long enough of an ID for someone to sponsor it. Just think:

"K-I-R-O SEATTLE, K-I-R-O F-M K-I-R-O-H-D-1, TACOMA SEATTLE, PRESENTED BY CATLIN CAPITAL.

KOMO already does it during baseball! *snicker*

 

[DanStrassberg]

If I had a dime for every time a station claimed that iBiquity "HDRadio" meant 'high definition' radio... I'd be rich! ... and even more so for those that say 'hybrid digital' - apparently it doesn't mean that either.

iBiquity says that the HD in HD Radio does not stand for anything. Hybrid digital would be an apt definition to put behind the HD initialism, but AFAIK, as far as the people who own the HD Radio trademark are concerned, the HD in HD Radio doesn't stand for hybrid digital or anything else. I believe the trademark owner has the final say in such matters.

 

[Bongwater]

If I had a dime for every time a station claimed that iBiquity "HDRadio" meant 'high definition' radio... I'd be rich! ... and even more so for those that say 'hybrid digital' - apparently it doesn't mean that either.

iBiquity says that the HD in HD Radio does not stand for anything. Hybrid digital would be an apt definition to put behind the HD initialism, but AFAIK, as far as the people who own the HD Radio trademark are concerned, the HD in HD Radio doesn't stand for hybrid digital or anything else. I believe the trademark owner has the final say in such matters.

But you have to admit, no matter what it stands for or not, it was at the very least; convenient. It came along just as HDTV was starting to take off. Plus it promised the clarity of CDs ("Radio that sounds like a CD!"), has extra sub-channel capacity similar to DTV, etc.

Public confusion, an FCC supported monopoly (sorry Digital Radio Mondiale), a great and very profitable licensing scheme and perfect timing can be wonderful things......