What He Said

[pocket-radio]

If you watch trends it's amazing how much revenue growth is from digital.
For the recored digital has nothing to do with HD!
Advertisers are demanding accountability and digital provides the analytics marketers want.
Thankfully digital and AM/FM radio play nice together. 238 million people still listen to analog radio and we can engage with our listeners as they use digital, not HD.
Furthermore advertisers can reach more people with paper flyers than HD.

HD needs the pure mass and weight of listeners equal to analog radio to matter.
For HD to play on the same analytics level as digital it requires a two-way connection like the internet. And with the internet who needs HD and their licensing scam?

What he said below is spot on with the radio's future.

"We stake our future on the Internet, mobile phone apps, social marketing, podcasts and of course, over the air."

http://www.rbr.com/features/viewpoints/24759.html

 

[nd2023]

Yelling on the street will reach more people than advertising on an HD2.

 

[kenglish]

Anybody for Digital Radio Mondiale (DRM)? ;D

 

[R.F. Burns]

Anybody for Digital Radio Mondiale (DRM)? ;D

Great, but DRM is totally incompatible. That's the entire problem. If the commission had assigned new spectrum for radio, we'd probably be using DRM in this country.

 

[K6JHU]

Or Eurkea.

BTW, DRM is allowed under the FCC rules. But only on SW.

 

[RadeoEngineer]

Anyone for FMeXtra? Would take a rules change but has been demonstrated to work well out to the 54 dBu contour.

 

[R.F. Burns]

I keep reading about the wonders of FMeXtra. That's fine but, the commission insisted on a system, usable for both AM & FM. FMeXtra doesn't work on AM and receivers are not generally available. At this stage it is very doubtful that there will be a new digital broadcast format used in the United States.

 

[mmnassour]

The FCC also approved a mechanical color system for TV and had to backtrack there. It's been proven in the marketplace that AM HD is a complete failure. Technical issues with FM HD continue. This system is not the answer. One could argue that radio desperately needs a digital system, but given its floundering years after its introduction this simply isn't it.

 

[Rich883]

As K6JHU noted the Eureka 147 - DAB+ actually would be most efficient and lower cost than even analog FM given multiple stations sharing the same transmitter multiplex(up to 25 plus stations). If you thought digital was important, DAB+ is low cost (no fees) efficient way to delivery audio and multimedia content.

 

[KB1OKL]

I keep reading about the wonders of FMeXtra. That's fine but, the commission insisted on a system, usable for both AM & FM. FMeXtra doesn't work on AM and receivers are not generally available. At this stage it is very doubtful that there will be a new digital broadcast format used in the United States.

After this ibiquity HD fiasco it is doubtful whether ANY digital broadcast format will be used in the United States for radio.

 

[Tom Wells]

.... the commission insisted on a system, usable for both AM & FM. FMeXtra doesn't work on AM......

The commission would insist Maxwell's laws make special exceptions for favored corporations, but the laws haven't budged an inch,
have they?

The FMeXtra people were wise enough implement a digital mode ONLY in a wavelength with sufficient resolution to do the job.

Trying to make digital communications work at 1 mhz is like trying to invent a telegraph using pipe, water, and valves.

Technically it can sorta maybe work, but so poorly that it's embarassing.

 

[OKCRadioGuy]

The cure for AM: http://www.radio-info.com/news/fcc-...gests-adding-tv-channels-5-6-to-radio-service

 

[dumber than a box of hair]

The cure for AM: http://www.radio-info.com/news/fcc-...gests-adding-tv-channels-5-6-to-radio-service

A cure that's going to take decades, if not longer. Let's remember that there are by most estimates between 800 million and 1 billion radios in the hands of the US listening public that can't tune 76-88 MHz, and a substantial portion of those are car head units that can't be easily swapped out for newer versions. Yes, it's a great idea, but it faces one of the same roadblocks that HD does...lack of radios for listeners to use.

 

[DaveBayArea]

A cure that's going to take decades, if not longer.

Well, I don't know if I'd go that far. How many radios do you have right now designed to tune up to 1700 on AM? There would be far more demand for programming on this new band than there was for X-band AM.

Dave B.

 

[kenglish]

Wow!....So, we make 76-88 MHz in to a new analog "FM Radio" band?
Then, we move AM stations in to it as simulcasts, and we add hundreds of new satellite-fed religious broadcasters in to it. Eventually, everybody buys new radios that include the new band, but until then the "early adopters" who get 87.9 and 87.7 can be heard on most existing radios. And, the stations that luck out and get 81.7, or 81.8 in the old TV channel 5, or 87.7 or 87.9 in the old TV channel 6, might be heard on portable analog TV sets? Everybody else just pumps tons of wattage in to the troposphere, with fewer listeners than HD Radio.

How about getting rid of the "In Band, On Channel" idea, and just move the HD Radio band down there? With no analog component to deal with, there'd be room for lots of HD2, HD-3, HD4, etc.....
The few tens of thousands (or, even hundreds of thousands) of HD Radios in existence could be reconfigured to add 12 MHz to their tuning bands, probably with just a software change.

Or, create a new-and-improved version of Digital Radio, with enough new features and higher-quality sound, so that people would WANT to buy in to it. The "i-Phone" is a hit because it has down-loadable "apps" (not to mention, lots of hype)....not because it's "still just a phone". Few people are going to buy a new radio just "because some new stations are down there".

 

[pocket-radio]

Create a new-and-improved version of Digital Radio, with enough new features and higher-quality sound, so that people would WANT to buy in to it. The "i-Phone" is a hit because it has down-loadable "apps" (not to mention, lots of hype)....not because it's "still just a phone". Few people are going to buy a new radio just "because some new stations are down there".

The Iphone is a hit because it offers features people want, and so are willing to purchase a new phone.

HD offers listeners really more of the same, another country music station or a simulcast of AM talk. Nothing very exciting and so people are ignoring it!

Steve Jobs has had a serious of hits that broke all the rules, he's become an icon and the news media follow him.

Listen to any Clear Channel station and you'll hear tons of promos, and awareness of HD radio high very high. Enough consumers are aware of this product for HD to hit critical mass
instead they're ignoring HD. HD sounds like FM. Nobody was really asking for better sound.

Being able to listen to what they want when they want it a different story..
46% of smart phone users listen to streaming!

 

[radioskeptic]

Kenglish said:

Wow!....So, we make 76-88 MHz in to a new analog "FM Radio" band?
Then, we move AM stations in to it as simulcasts, and we add hundreds of new satellite-fed religious broadcasters in to it. Eventually, everybody buys new radios that include the new band, but until then the "early adopters" who get 87.9 and 87.7 can be heard on most existing radios. And, the stations that luck out and get 81.7, or 81.8 in the old TV channel 5, or 87.7 or 87.9 in the old TV channel 6, might be heard on portable analog TV sets?

Sorry, Kenglish, but they wouldn't be heard on those TV's. Ever heard of intercarrier sound?

 

[kenglish]

Kenglish said:

Wow!....So, we make 76-88 MHz in to a new analog "FM Radio" band?
Then, we move AM stations in to it as simulcasts, and we add hundreds of new satellite-fed religious broadcasters in to it. Eventually, everybody buys new radios that include the new band, but until then the "early adopters" who get 87.9 and 87.7 can be heard on most existing radios. And, the stations that luck out and get 81.7, or 81.8 in the old TV channel 5, or 87.7 or 87.9 in the old TV channel 6, might be heard on portable analog TV sets?

Sorry, Kenglish, but they wouldn't be heard on those TV's. Ever heard of intercarrier sound?

OK...even FEWER potential listeners. ;D

That's another reason why, any form of Digital "Radio" is going to have to be much, much, much more than just "radio". It's going to have to be some sort of new multimedia experience...a way to give people a reason to come back to "broad cast" (as opposed to internet based one-connection-per-user) media. "Stations" might have to give up having only one "identity"...."Rock-100" might need to promote it's rock format on it's rock program channel, but allude to it's overall identity as it's own call letters, or "Atlanta's Music"...then identify it's program. Like, "Atlanta's Music Rock-100", "Atlanta's Music Jazz Club", "Atlanta's Music Soul Spot", .......identifying as their various formats and niches.

I'd like to see/hear a multichannel broadcast environment, where I can hear a hundred different formats, without paying a fee, and get my local news, weather, advertisements, and a local "feel'. And, it would be something more personal than sat-rad or internet streaming.

 

[ajc_trw]

The cure for AM: http://www.radio-info.com/news/fcc-...gests-adding-tv-channels-5-6-to-radio-service

A cure that's going to take decades, if not longer. Let's remember that there are by most estimates between 800 million and 1 billion radios in the hands of the US listening public that can't tune 76-88 MHz, and a substantial portion of those are car head units that can't be easily swapped out for newer versions. Yes, it's a great idea, but it faces one of the same roadblocks that HD does...lack of radios for listeners to use.

But many of those radios may be able to tune in 76-88 if they have a Japan setting. My Aiwa TX694 (digital tuning on a casette walkman-type unit) does, but it may be because it has a TV tuning band.

My point is it's easier IMHO to make a radio which tunes 76-108MHz with settings for each region of sale rather than limit the tuning section and need to make multiple versions of each model. And if the stations are headed for the air I don't see it being too long before all new FM radios go all the way to 76MHz. All IMHO so YMMV.

P.S.: Serendipity is fun, everybody check your radio manuals. You may be pleasantly surprised.

 

[kenglish]

Anybody know if the HD Radios, like the Sangean HDT-1X, can be switched internally to the Japanese bandplan?
Or, would you have to update the software?

I'd say, make the allocations in 76-88 MHz accommodate the wider bandwidth needed for HD Radio, and migrate down there if there are interference issues.