With the talk of how Z100 remains the top CHR in this market, there was one station that actually gave Z a few punches out of the top back in the day, and those days was the Hot 103/97 era. Now, since all this talk about NOW never going to beat Z and how PLJ failed (Power 95) my thoughts have gotten deep and this question came out. What if Hot 97 remained a Top 40 station? Would we see Hot actually beat Lite FM without having any protective contours in the way? Would Hot 97's SummerJam be a quicker sellout than Z100's Jingle Ball? I know this is all "what if's" but correct me on this, but it does feel that Hot 103/97 did put up a fight with Z100, and probaly was the only Top 40 station that can beat Z. Sure, we may see ups and downs with both stations, but if Hot 97 never took the pure hip-hop format and kept it Top 40, would the same success still occur if not, more revenue and numbers than they are as hip-hop?
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What if HOT 97 remained Top 40?
- Thread starter d21ofnj
- Start date
Actually, Power 95 was the only station Top 40 station that was able to beat Z-100, back in 1985. Power also came close a few times afterwards. Hot 103, on the other hand, never enjoyed the same type of runaway success as Power 106 L.A. when it debuted with its Top 40/Dance format. It did well when it became Hot 97 for a time, but was never able to beat Z-100.
Hot 97's heydays are in the mid 90s when it was the market's sole Hip Hop station
Hot 97's heydays are in the mid 90s when it was the market's sole Hip Hop station
Z-100 and urban 98.7 KISS-FM usually duked it out for the #1 slot in NY during the mid-80s. Power 95 on a couple of occaisions nosed out both of them for the #1 slot. They were aimed more toward a slightly older audience than Z-100.
Hot 103/97 arrived in August 1986 to fill the gap left by the flip of 'KTU to K-Rock. As a CHR/Dance station it did well, but it seemed they hurt the other music stations of the day (Z-100, Power 95, 98.7 KISS-FM) more than they helped themselves. Hot saw a market for Hip Hop and went for it with great success.
Hot 103/97 arrived in August 1986 to fill the gap left by the flip of 'KTU to K-Rock. As a CHR/Dance station it did well, but it seemed they hurt the other music stations of the day (Z-100, Power 95, 98.7 KISS-FM) more than they helped themselves. Hot saw a market for Hip Hop and went for it with great success.
Nick said:
Hot 97 did on occaision beat Z-100, but Emmis saw more $$$$ with Hip Hop than with CHR/dance. This eventually led to the return of 'KTU.
CHRles said:
Just what I thought! Hot 97 as dance/CHR did OK, but never really threatened Z-100. Hot 97 probably did push 'PLJ out of CHR.
I really had to think about this.
I'm not going to answer it in the way of a station beating another station. Emmis was SMART to go the hip-hop wave when they did since the station was number 1 throughout most of the 90's. But I'll go about it in this style....
The one thing about dance music is that it IS cyclical. It rode a strong wave during the mid 80's and early 90's with the emergence of freestyle and house. Things were fading in the 90's as freestyle was eventually pushed off rotation on the station. Now, granted this is all speculatory (since this NEVER happened)....but this is my take (and I'll admit, a bit of "Toronto" is included in this) if Hot 97 was still doing Top 40/Urban format (the official name)
1. Eurodance - A big wave was riding high in Toronto with Eurodance during the mid 90's. Artists like Corona, Culture Beat, 2 Brothers On The Fourth Floor etc. were riding high in Toronto though artists such as Real McCoy and La Bouche did crack here. The music would most likely have been part of the rotation in 1994/95. The "Happy Hardcore" sound which was also big up in Toronto would probably have never made it here.
2. Freestyle on a comeback? - You would have heard more of the West Coast sound with Jocelyn Enriquez and Lina Santiago much earlier. That would have been the evolution of the music along with the New York based artists doing something similar. That COULD have saved freestyle in that sense and the music would have come back with a newer sound that people would have accepted, as opposed to the "pause" between Hot 97 and 'KTU whereas when they did play Enriquez and Santiago, it received lukewarm praise but not enough for the freestyle strong to accept a change.
3. Trance - I don't know if certain aspects of Trance would have been on rotation, but that music was gaining strength in the late 90's. Dirty Vegas would have probably been the most "extreme" out of trance, but there would have probably been a "Trance" party (similar to the "All Night House Party").
4. "Florida Breakz" - I think a small aspect of it would have gotten here since a lot of elements of the music had a "freestyle" flow to it. Orlando based groups such as Pepperspray, DJ 43 (thanks to station WPYO - 95.3 Party) would have gotten airplay on Hot 97 during the early 00s.
5. Electro & "Dirty Dutch" - Pulse 87 left just as electro was growing. Even though they did play "Infinity" - Guru Josh Project, if Hot 97 was still around you would have heard more of it. Also, be sure thanks to a show such as "Jersey Shore", there would have been a "Dirty Dutch" style specialty show that Hot 97 would have done on the weekends, for those that love the "fist pumping" sick sounds...which has taken off AFTER Pulse went off the airwaves.
Yet through it all, the most popular mainstream dance tracks would have gotten airplay along with the rhythmic aspects of Top 40. However, I would like to think that if a Hot 97 still existed as a dance format, it would have been a lot easier for artists that are "core" in nature to crack into rotation. I also think freestyle would have been able to evolve to a sound that while the first generation may not necessarily accept, the second generation would have embraced as its own. There still would have been a 'KTU wanting to compete, though I would think the station would have leaned more classic (like Mix 102.7) and totally have avoided the currents, which would have been fine because those that wanted classics would have gone to 'KTU while those wanting currents would have stayed on Hot 97.
Now granted, my name is not Joel Salkowitz, lol, but if Hot 97 were to have stayed the course as it first broke out in 1986 it would have remained a hip station that would have been on the dance music trends. With all of the voids that have occurred, while dance still made its evolutions, certain things were held back. And while things are starting to look good for us now, thanks to Lady Gaga's influence, it had (and some ways still is) a struggle as dance continues to strive for mainstream/Top 40 acceptance.
Okay, MarcR, this is the part where you're supposed to blow me up for being "dense" and "non realistic" about what I've said.
Neverthless this is my hypothesis.
I'm not going to answer it in the way of a station beating another station. Emmis was SMART to go the hip-hop wave when they did since the station was number 1 throughout most of the 90's. But I'll go about it in this style....
The one thing about dance music is that it IS cyclical. It rode a strong wave during the mid 80's and early 90's with the emergence of freestyle and house. Things were fading in the 90's as freestyle was eventually pushed off rotation on the station. Now, granted this is all speculatory (since this NEVER happened)....but this is my take (and I'll admit, a bit of "Toronto" is included in this) if Hot 97 was still doing Top 40/Urban format (the official name)
1. Eurodance - A big wave was riding high in Toronto with Eurodance during the mid 90's. Artists like Corona, Culture Beat, 2 Brothers On The Fourth Floor etc. were riding high in Toronto though artists such as Real McCoy and La Bouche did crack here. The music would most likely have been part of the rotation in 1994/95. The "Happy Hardcore" sound which was also big up in Toronto would probably have never made it here.
2. Freestyle on a comeback? - You would have heard more of the West Coast sound with Jocelyn Enriquez and Lina Santiago much earlier. That would have been the evolution of the music along with the New York based artists doing something similar. That COULD have saved freestyle in that sense and the music would have come back with a newer sound that people would have accepted, as opposed to the "pause" between Hot 97 and 'KTU whereas when they did play Enriquez and Santiago, it received lukewarm praise but not enough for the freestyle strong to accept a change.
3. Trance - I don't know if certain aspects of Trance would have been on rotation, but that music was gaining strength in the late 90's. Dirty Vegas would have probably been the most "extreme" out of trance, but there would have probably been a "Trance" party (similar to the "All Night House Party").
4. "Florida Breakz" - I think a small aspect of it would have gotten here since a lot of elements of the music had a "freestyle" flow to it. Orlando based groups such as Pepperspray, DJ 43 (thanks to station WPYO - 95.3 Party) would have gotten airplay on Hot 97 during the early 00s.
5. Electro & "Dirty Dutch" - Pulse 87 left just as electro was growing. Even though they did play "Infinity" - Guru Josh Project, if Hot 97 was still around you would have heard more of it. Also, be sure thanks to a show such as "Jersey Shore", there would have been a "Dirty Dutch" style specialty show that Hot 97 would have done on the weekends, for those that love the "fist pumping" sick sounds...which has taken off AFTER Pulse went off the airwaves.
Yet through it all, the most popular mainstream dance tracks would have gotten airplay along with the rhythmic aspects of Top 40. However, I would like to think that if a Hot 97 still existed as a dance format, it would have been a lot easier for artists that are "core" in nature to crack into rotation. I also think freestyle would have been able to evolve to a sound that while the first generation may not necessarily accept, the second generation would have embraced as its own. There still would have been a 'KTU wanting to compete, though I would think the station would have leaned more classic (like Mix 102.7) and totally have avoided the currents, which would have been fine because those that wanted classics would have gone to 'KTU while those wanting currents would have stayed on Hot 97.
Now granted, my name is not Joel Salkowitz, lol, but if Hot 97 were to have stayed the course as it first broke out in 1986 it would have remained a hip station that would have been on the dance music trends. With all of the voids that have occurred, while dance still made its evolutions, certain things were held back. And while things are starting to look good for us now, thanks to Lady Gaga's influence, it had (and some ways still is) a struggle as dance continues to strive for mainstream/Top 40 acceptance.
Okay, MarcR, this is the part where you're supposed to blow me up for being "dense" and "non realistic" about what I've said.
Neverthless this is my hypothesis.
M
musik187
Guest
Tony Santiago said:
Honestly Tony, no matter who it is on here that would disagree with you, I would definitely say they were wrong, lol.... "IF" Hot 97 did stay the path all these years, I believe that's exactly what they would have done more or less throughout all those different periods. Makes total sense! It's just a shame that didn't happen, (whether with HOT 97 or another "true" replacement for the original Hot 97 to cover the last full 17 or 18 years since dance music lost it's rotation on HOT)... because I think that a lot of dance music history has been lost to a "mainstream" audience because of it. However, even though I'm still not sure where things are going yet exactly...it's quite obvious, that the tide is most definitely turning now!
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