What If... (The Sports FM Edition)

[CleveFan]

With all this talk about the possible arrival of a new sports station in Cleveland at 92.3 or 98.5, here are some scenarios I've drawn up:

1. 92.3 goes to sports talk and 98.5 remains as classic rock. 100.7 would tweak their music closer to alternative or become alternative-focused.

2. 92.3 goes to sports talk and 98.5 remains as classic rock. 107.3 would tweak their music closer to alternative or become alternative-focused.

3. 92.3 goes to sports talk and 98.5 flips to alternative. 100.7 would tweak their music closer to classic rock or become more classic rock-oriented.

4. 92.3 goes to sports talk and 98.5 flips to alternative. 107.3 would tweak their music closer to classic rock or become more classic-rock oriented.

5. 98.5 goes to sports talk and 92.3 flips to classic rock. 100.7 would tweak their music closer to alternative or become alternative-focused.

6. 98.5 goes to sports talk and 92.3 flips to classic rock. 107.3 would tweak their music closer to alternative or become alternative-focused.

7. 98.5 goes to sports talk and 92.3 remains as alternative. 100.7 would tweak their music closer to classic rock or become more classic rock-oriented.

8. 98.5 goes to sports talk and 92.3 remains as alternative. 107.3 would tweak their music closer to classic rock or become more classic rock-oriented.

Which one do you guys think its more likely. For me, anything goes. Mine would be #5 or #6.

One scenario: If the new "Fan" does not lure away Jim Rome from 850, 100.7 could pick him up to protect 1100 and help put a bullet on the new "Fan." That's an idea.

 

[vjm]

Well for one thing, WMMS probably won't do much (if anything) to their music, because it's only a small part of the overall man cave format they have going (Rover, Cox, Sixx, Browns, sprinkling of Tribe and Cavs).

If anything, 100.7 would like to snag Jim Rome when the contract runs out to put in between Rover and Cox.

Unless GKB gives him back the noon hour on 850, he WILL bolt.

92.3 will be "The Fan", and NCX will stay as is.

98.5 will be an excellent simulcast partner with 92.3 if CBS were to snag the Browns PBP in a couple of years (again...pointing to the Buffalo Bills as an example of a double FM flagship).

NCX ain't moving unless The Fan shows to be a winner...check back next year.

I don't see 107.3 going alternative, not as long as the current crew remains in place over there (Gallagher, Ravenna, Rocco, and Hansen don't scream "alt-rock").

If anything, I see ELB selling off 107.3 sometime in the near future, and if GKB were smart, the'd buy it or at least LMA it to keep up with the Joneses.

 

[Rusty Muck]

Well for one thing, WMMS probably won't do much (if anything) to their music, because it's only a small part of the overall man cave format they have going (Rover, Cox, Sixx, Browns, sprinkling of Tribe and Cavs).

If anything, 100.7 would like to snag Jim Rome when the contract runs out to put in between Rover and Cox.

Unless GKB gives him back the noon hour on 850, he WILL bolt.

92.3 will be "The Fan", and NCX will stay as is.

98.5 will be an excellent simulcast partner with 92.3 if CBS were to snag the Browns PBP in a couple of years (again...pointing to the Buffalo Bills as an example of a double FM flagship).

NCX ain't moving unless The Fan shows to be a winner...check back next year.

I don't see 107.3 going alternative, not as long as the current crew remains in place over there (Gallagher, Ravenna, Rocco, and Hansen don't scream "alt-rock").

If anything, I see ELB selling off 107.3 sometime in the near future, and if GKB were smart, the'd buy it or at least LMA it to keep up with the Joneses.

It's also probable that 107.3 might make some drastic changes if things don't improve over there. The "radio" format (as it were) range from modern AC to AAA to the alternapop that 92.3 has/had. It might seem better to have them become jockless outside of Ravenna in the morning.

 

[Rusty Muck]

With all this talk about the possible arrival of a new sports station in Cleveland at 92.3 or 98.5, here are some scenarios I've drawn up:

5. 98.5 goes to sports talk and 92.3 flips to classic rock. 100.7 would tweak their music closer to alternative or become alternative-focused.

6. 98.5 goes to sports talk and 92.3 flips to classic rock. 107.3 would tweak their music closer to alternative or become alternative-focused.

#6 is likely (see previous post) while #5 is less likely. MMS had an all-90s alternative weekend. Maybe they do that in the future.

Say 98.5 does become "The Fan" and 92.3 becomes "92.3 WNCX." Both stations would still be great co-flagships for the Browns. Why not?

 

[vjm]

With all this talk about the possible arrival of a new sports station in Cleveland at 92.3 or 98.5, here are some scenarios I've drawn up:

5. 98.5 goes to sports talk and 92.3 flips to classic rock. 100.7 would tweak their music closer to alternative or become alternative-focused.

6. 98.5 goes to sports talk and 92.3 flips to classic rock. 107.3 would tweak their music closer to alternative or become alternative-focused.

#6 is likely (see previous post) while #5 is less likely. MMS had an all-90s alternative weekend. Maybe they do that in the future.

Say 98.5 does become "The Fan" and 92.3 becomes "92.3 WNCX." Both stations would still be great co-flagships for the Browns. Why not?

I still think 92.3 will start as "The Fan".

Look at it this way...what if The Fan flops? Then you basically wasted a major move by moving a heritage classic rocker off it's long time home, only to then move it back.

The best approach would be to just flip 92.3, and see how it goes...if it turns out to be a sucess, THEN we can talk about swapping with 98.5.

No need to shoot all the bullets all at once.

 

[Tim]

If there was so much ad money in alternative formats, WMMS would not be talk in the two biggest radio dayparts: morning and afternoon drive.

If alternative formats were huge money makers, WMMS (or somebody with a big FM signal) would be 24/7 alternative.

The sad reality is, the listening habits of men and women in the 18-34 age group are spread out over about 4 or 5 totally different format. It's not like the 60's and 70's when top 40 stations played all kinds of music and got huges audiences.

Alternative, CHR, urban/hiphop, country, even some adult CHRs. Any given station has such a small slice of the 18-34 audience, it's not enough to drive huge ad revenues (like WDOK, WQAL, WTAM, and WGAR) who's audiences are older, and other than WTAM, mainly in the 25-54 female adult age demo where 75% of advertising dollars go.

Sportstalk formats attract a lot of men, granted...but, they are men of all ages....not just very young men (like alternative) or just middle-aged/older men (like classic rock, talk).

Heck, a HEAVY portion of ad dollars WTAM nets come from two sources: Mike Trivisano (high-profile talk personality) and their sports play-by-play relationships).

This is why CBS and other groups in large markets want FM sportstalk formats to compliment their female-format sister stations. Sportstalk stations make a lot, lot more money than other male-dominated formats, and traditionally have better coverage than most AMs.

Plus...80% of radio listening occurs on the FM band.

So, if you have two marginally-performing FMs...one has mediocre coverage, one has great coverage...common sense says: go sportstalk where the biggest potential audience is...and most money is....right from the start.

Any business majors out there? LOL.

 

[Buckeyes2001]

The thing about the 92.3 frequency at least here in Vermilion is that I often get co-channel interference from WMXD/Detroit unlike the 98.5 frequency. I can see that being a big complaint from listeners on the far west side of the Cleveland area. Just something else to consider. Also 92.3 wouldn't be listenable very far southeast of Akron due to the presence of WDJQ 92.5.

 

[Buckeyes2001]

The thing about the 92.3 frequency at least here in Vermilion is that I often get co-channel interference from WMXD/Detroit unlike the 98.5 frequency. I can see that being a big complaint from listeners on the far west side of the Cleveland area. Just something else to consider. Also 92.3 wouldn't be listenable very far southeast of Akron due to the presence of WDJQ 92.5.

Case in point, I tuned in 92.3 just now on my home stereo and am getting WMXD/Detroit over top of WKRK from here in Vermilion.

 

[Tim]

Lots of trop propagation on FM in the midwest today. I had the same experience at noon today.

Hey, I'll tell you what....why not move WQAL *and* WDOK to 92.3....run WQAL in the left channel, run WDOK in the right channel, and classic rock on 102.1 AND 104.1!

Then, run X-rock on a CBS HD channel til they can purchase WMMS from Clear Channel as it's new home!

CBS doesn't need to make any money. Hell, WNCX is a "heritage rock station". What's the matter with all of you?????

 

[AntDog152]

This is really not that hard to figure out. FM sports will most likely be on 92.3 if its launched within the next few weeks. If they gain the Browns local PBP, they could double flagship with 98.5.

If CBS is aiming for a Labor Day launch, then a WNCX move to 92.3 in exchange for sports would be more realistic and maybe the more desirable plan for CBS. This would allow a month for the older NCX audience to prepare for the move to the new 92.3 NCX, while promoting the new 98.5 The Fan (or The Ticket, or The Miz ;D ) If CBS wants a winner with FM Sports this year, they have to go all in with this station.

 

[Tim]

Not likely to start out on 92.3, then move to another frequency in a few weeks, months, whatever. That's normally not what format flips are all about: the element of surprise.

No reason to "beta-test" sportstalk on a lesser frequency, waiting for a play-by-play contract to come.

The new sports station needs to build as large an audience and advertiser base as possible in order to attract a major sports team's play-by-play.

And to do that, the sports station needs as large a coverage area as it can get. And, that's not on 92.3 with 98.5's 18-county coverage sitting there.

Now, it makes total sense to run recorded &/or live promos on the old frequency during the new format....i.e.: "classic rock WNCX has moved down the dial to 92.3".

Wonder if the big moves begin at 6:00am this coming Monday morning?

 

[1sttimecaller]

I keep reading where you guys think WMMS wants Rome.
What is your source for this?

If WMMS wanted Rome they could have had it a long time ago.
Premiere Radio Networks would only be required to provide WKNR with a 90 day cancelation notice.
All of the Premiere contracts are written with the 90 day out from either party after the first year of the deal. Based on what Rome said on the air when WKNR ripped off the 12pm hour, I'm sure they asked if there was a station within the family that would clear the show. Since it's been several months, my guess is no. Rome ain't getting huge ratings in Cleveland and you would have to give up inventory. I don't see WMMS picking up Rome, but I said earlier this sports this was wrong. Opps. Rome ain't the same talk as Rover and Cox. Think about it this way, would WMJI spin a lady gaga record to head of a challenger to Kiss? Nah.

 

[Tim]

John...Does Jim Rome score big numbers in other large markets? If so, have his ratings faded over the years?

To me, his street-talk style (whatever the heck you want to call it) is silly. Just talk like a regular person on Main Street. But, hey...that's just my personal likes/dislikes.

Rome has obviously built a nice nitch for himself....good for him.

 

[1sttimecaller]

Don't get me wong Rome does well in Cleveland but WMMS beats him with music.

Rome does well 18-34 and 25-54 males.

 

[CleveFan]

Okay, here's something to consider:

What if after The Fan arrives, and if commercial spoken word is proven a hit, could there be a Hot Talk station on FM or News/Talk on FM? That could happen and it could work in Cleveland.

 

[OhioMediaWatch]

What if after The Fan arrives, and if commercial spoken word is proven a hit, could there be a Hot Talk station on FM or News/Talk on FM? That could happen and it could work in Cleveland.

Well, if CC ever gets the engineering cleared up on that 99.1 translator, which they had a CP for, for a few days, conventional wisdom says that'll be a simulcaster of WTAM. Though CC hasn't lit one of those up for a few weeks or months.

Who else would do it? CBS is the only other group in the market that could do it, and they've got their hands full with "The Fan"-or-whatever-it'll-be-called.

Radio One doesn't do general market/non-urban talk, and they can't get out of their own way half the time...give or take established successes like their music FMs. (And 93.1 and 107.9 aren't flipping any time soon.)

Salem - ditto on getting out of their own way, and if they ever flipped 95.5 to talk, it'd be the same as 1420.

ELB wouldn't go full-market general talk on 107.3.

Am I missing someone?

 

[Rusty Muck]

What if after The Fan arrives, and if commercial spoken word is proven a hit, could there be a Hot Talk station on FM or News/Talk on FM? That could happen and it could work in Cleveland.

Well, if CC ever gets the engineering cleared up on that 99.1 translator, which they had a CP for, for a few days, conventional wisdom says that'll be a simulcaster of WTAM. Though CC hasn't lit one of those up for a few weeks or months.

Who else would do it? CBS is the only other group in the market that could do it, and they've got their hands full with "The Fan"-or-whatever-it'll-be-called.

Radio One doesn't do general market/non-urban talk, and they can't get out of their own way half the time...give or take established successes like their music FMs. (And 93.1 and 107.9 aren't flipping any time soon.)

Salem - ditto on getting out of their own way, and if they ever flipped 95.5 to talk, it'd be the same as 1420.

ELB wouldn't go full-market general talk on 107.3.

Am I missing someone?

Theoretically, if Salem ever decided to get out of Cleveland, what's to stop CBS from buying 1220 and 1420? Just flip 1220 to a general talker with a local host or two, and turn 1420 to a 24/7 ESPN affiliate to complement the all-local "92.3 [98.5??] The [Whatever]."

All three stations would then be cobbled into the "CBSCleveland.com" portal, which we all know will be established with creation of "The [Whatever]."

Don't get me wrong... CBS could mount a talk format on FM. But for all of the reasoning me and the Primary(tm) have outlined, such a format couldn't and wouldn't work on 92.3. At least to any full potential. And no way it will displace 102.1 or 104.1. But does CBS want to do such a thing, even though it would cut more into WTAM?

Aside from that, this is all dead-on. No other cluster can mount a talk format to go after WTAM - and ELB is too dirt-cheap to operate WEOL properly.

 

[Tim]

From everything we've all heard....CBS wants out of Cleveland...sooner or later.
Heck, if you leave Columbus & Denver...why would you stay in NE Ohio, with our economy? So, they're trying something that's likely to strike gold and make their stay here (for now) easier to swallow, and more attractive to potential future buyers.

Anybody have any $$$ to spend on radio stations in the Cleveland MSA? From multiple sources, Salem and ELB's stations have been offered for sale for 2 or 3 years, with no takers so far.

So, any format those guys put on the air better be cheap to operate.

Like so many things, it's a reflection of the current/most-recent recession, and general trend of the economy in these midwest rustbelt markets.

 

[DToTheJ]

Does Jim Rome score big numbers in other large markets? ...To me, his street-talk style (whatever the heck you want to call it) is silly...

I believe the word you're looking for is "smack". :-[

 

[Rusty Muck]

From everything we've all heard....CBS wants out of Cleveland...sooner or later.
Heck, if you leave Columbus & Denver...why would you stay in NE Ohio, with our economy? So, they're trying something that's likely to strike gold and make their stay here (for now) easier to swallow, and more attractive to potential future buyers.

Anybody have any $$$ to spend on radio stations in the Cleveland MSA? From multiple sources, Salem and ELB's stations have been offered for sale for 2 or 3 years, with no takers so far.

So, any format those guys put on the air better be cheap to operate.

Like so many things, it's a reflection of the current/most-recent recession, and general trend of the economy in these midwest rustbelt markets.

It was a hypotheical. Aside from that, for practical reasons I outlined in a different thread, there's NO white knight whatsoever that's in any buying mood.

CBS, ELB, Salem, Radio One, et al, are all stuck here. And who knows how long that will last.