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What Other Stations Could Come Back On HD-2?

As much as I'd love to agree with that, rbruce, I don't know. Entercom recently recreated the classic WKBW on its main 50kw AM channel, and I can tell you they did one heck of a job. The old jingles, Dan Neavereth in the morning, Sandy Beach middays, nostalgic local commercials, and a VERY artfully done Jackson Armstrong voicetrack job in PM drive. The music rotations were excellent. They even brought back Pulse Beat News complete with the late 50s intro with slapback echo.

It was great fun to listen to, but didn't move the needle, and Entercom pulled the plug and put on lefty talk.

I think there was a similar experience with 1530 in Cincy - one of my former employees and ex-Rochesterian has been in the market forever (Tom "Cat" Michaels).

If it didn't fly on the main AM channel it's hard to see it working on HD-2.
 
rbrucecarter5 said:
If I lived in New York, I would like to see Musicradio WABC come back on an HD-2 channel. Now THAT would generate some HD radio sales!
Click to expand...

With the 50+ crowd that actually remembers WABC's music format, perhaps. Two chances of that happening: Slim and none. No one is going to spend what it takes to do that format right when no one is listening, and let's face it: To a WABC fanatic (and I certainly count myself as one), anything less than what it was in its heyday is going to be a disappointment.

Further, try and find a programmer and an airstaff these days who understand what made WABC great, and who can translate that understanding into proper execution of the format. Today's versions of that great air staff, not to mention Rick Sklar who somehow made it all hang together, effectively don't exist.

I'm assuming you know that for four hours every Saturday night, WABC runs an oldies show, complete with the original music and jingles. During the warm months, part of the show is in HD (Citadel won't run HD after sundown), and it's also streamed.
 
dumber than a box of hair said:
I'm assuming you know that for four hours every Saturday night, WABC runs an oldies show, complete with the original music and jingles. During the warm months, part of the show is in HD (Citadel won't run HD after sundown), and it's also streamed.
Click to expand...

Streaming it is - local KAAM jams WABC in the Dallas area.
 
Savage said:
As much as I'd love to agree with that, rbruce, I don't know. Entercom recently recreated the classic WKBW on its main 50kw AM channel, and I can tell you they did one heck of a job. The old jingles, Dan Neavereth in the morning, Sandy Beach middays, nostalgic local commercials, and a VERY artfully done Jackson Armstrong voicetrack job in PM drive. The music rotations were excellent. They even brought back Pulse Beat News complete with the late 50s intro with slapback echo.

It was great fun to listen to, but didn't move the needle, and Entercom pulled the plug and put on lefty talk.

I think there was a similar experience with 1530 in Cincy - one of my former employees and ex-Rochesterian has been in the market forever (Tom "Cat" Michaels).

If it didn't fly on the main AM channel it's hard to see it working on HD-2.
Click to expand...


Both stations were excellent, and being right next to each other on the dial was a treat for the listeners. I think that WSAI and WCKY swapped frequencies again and I heard (and I may be wrong) that the oldies continues (or at least it did for a bit) on 1360. I really enjoyed the presentation of both stations and it gave me the feeling radio that radio had that I miss.
 
mimo said:
Both stations were excellent, and being right next to each other on the dial was a treat for the listeners. I think that WSAI and WCKY swapped frequencies again and I heard (and I may be wrong) that the oldies continues (or at least it did for a bit) on 1360. I really enjoyed the presentation of both stations and it gave me the feeling radio that radio had that I miss.
Click to expand...

I think my point is made. Suggest something for an HD-2 channel that people really want to listen to - a proven commodity that generated enormous ratings in the past - and you get excuses: "Too hard to do", "it won't work today", "the people are all scattered", "music has changed". The difference really amounts to money, and effort. There is no money to be made from HD-2 channels, so nobody wants to put money or effort into them, even if the format has suceeded in the past. As unique as WABC AM was - a fast paced, announcer personality driven, top-40 format could still work - not THAT much has changed, there is some really good music out there, you just tweak the format a bit, find some fresh, new, enthusiastic, local talent - let them have some creative freedom, lock the lawyers out of the loop and let them engage listeners with fun contests and stunts - listeners WILL come. They might even buy HD radios to get it. More of the same corporate legal approved, focus group filtered, corporate board room approved "safe" and "perfect" radio - radio is DOOMED whether it is HD or not.
 
rbrucecarter5 said:
If I lived in New York, I would like to see Musicradio WABC come back on an HD-2 channel. Now THAT would generate some HD radio sales!
Click to expand...

I totally agree! One of the main complaints (yawns, really) about HD radio and a big reason people aren't interested in it is that the programming choices aren't compelling. Those "stations between the stations" tend to be considered as ho-hum and not worth spending money on an HD radio to get.

If someone would program an HD-2 channel as suggested here, that would generate a great deal of interest in some quarters and would absolutely move some HD radios off the shelves. Sure, a WABC-type format wouldn't single-handedly change the landscape for HD radio nationwide, but it would point station owners in the right direction. With HD radio, they need to provide programming that's worth the trouble of buying a new radio and fiddling with the antenna for hours.

So far, very little of this is happening nationwide. Great example: CBS-owned WOGL (Philadelphia). Already a 70's-early 80's heavy "oldies" station, what is it's HD-2 stream? Sounds of the 70's. Are you kidding me? The same station who's musically 75% in the 1970's, and which has all 70's on Sundays on the main channel has "sounds of the 70's" for its HD-2?

I can just imagine the box of monkeys scratching their heads and eating nits all day thinking of that one! When programmers do things like this, they are working to doom HD Radio - a technology that is already pretty shaky. Make it compelling; make it a "must have" and it will be successful - despite it's technical flaws. Do as you're doing now and watch it die.

When it does, I want to be the one to destroy the hard drive that contains those "beep.....hi, your radio here..." IBOC ads with an axe! :mad: :p
 
And here's the problem, BRNout:

If you want specific oldies music genres, a lot of them are done quite well on XM and Sirius already. At the gym where I work out daily I've trained the front-counter guys to put Sixties on Six or Fifties on Five on the PA system. (They see me coming through the front door and say to me sardonically, "you want the Old Guy Channel on??") XM does what I would consider a very good job with these channels. They get it: with the music rotations, personality input, properly-used vintage PAMS jingles - which are great to hear, even if they're re-sung with politically correct lyrics. Not perfect. But quite listenable.

Sixties on Six does excellent weekly commercial-free features, and spotlights classic 60s top 40 stations. One morning I walked in to hear the unmistakable Johnny Mann CKLW acca jingles - which I played hundreds of times on-air!

And you can get a SkyFi radio or satradio car system easily and cheaply, anywhere. Subscription deals are plentiful and inexpensive. Cars with satellite-friendly audio systems are flying off showroom floors and Ford is getting a lot of great press on its Internet-capable SYNC system. Here comes Internet radio in the car.

So what's left in the dust here? That would be: HD. Sub-channels with oldies nothwithstanding, given the current costs and availability of receivers.

Even if corporate radio wakes up and realizes that their only hope with the HD sub-channels is QUALITY programming, DIFFERENT programming as opposed to another Format In A Box indifferently plugged through the router into the HD exciter, they'd have to do something that offers a product that isn't already ubiquitous - to coin a phrase - from existing other services, cheaply/easily available everywhere.
 
And then we have the trend of radio companies providing a simultaneous web stream of their HD2 programming.

Case in point is Clear Channel's announcement of their eRockster format which will be available on the web as well as HD2.

Of course, you can't blame CC for wanting to reach the widest audience possible by making their new format available on multiple platforms, and they will certainly reach far more people on the web then they will with HD Radio.

But if that's the case, where is the specialness of these HD2 niche formats? Putting HD2 and HD3 programming on the internet suddenly removes the compelling reason to buy an HD Radio.

C5
 
I agree - they need to use the HD-2 channels with niche formats - put a 'beautiful music' channel on HD-2 (ala XM's 'Escape 78').
Actually, Clear Channel should do a swap - XM programming on the CC terrestrial HD2 and HD3, and XM gives CC a wee bit of spectrum for their crud (like they are forced to do now by court order; but that is to end sometime soon).
 
Savage said:
And here's the problem, BRNout:

If you want specific oldies music genres, a lot of them are done quite well on XM and Sirius already. At the gym where I work out daily I've trained the front-counter guys to put Sixties on Six or Fifties on Five on the PA system. (They see me coming through the front door and say to me sardonically, "you want the Old Guy Channel on??") XM does what I would consider a very good job with these channels. They get it: with the music rotations, personality input, properly-used vintage PAMS jingles - which are great to hear, even if they're re-sung with politically correct lyrics. Not perfect. But quite listenable.

Sixties on Six does excellent weekly commercial-free features, and spotlights classic 60s top 40 stations. One morning I walked in to hear the unmistakable Johnny Mann CKLW acca jingles - which I played hundreds of times on-air!

And you can get a SkyFi radio or satradio car system easily and cheaply, anywhere. Subscription deals are plentiful and inexpensive. Cars with satellite-friendly audio systems are flying off showroom floors and Ford is getting a lot of great press on its Internet-capable SYNC system. Here comes Internet radio in the car.

So what's left in the dust here? That would be: HD. Sub-channels with oldies nothwithstanding, given the current costs and availability of receivers.

Even if corporate radio wakes up and realizes that their only hope with the HD sub-channels is QUALITY programming, DIFFERENT programming as opposed to another Format In A Box indifferently plugged through the router into the HD exciter, they'd have to do something that offers a product that isn't already ubiquitous - to coin a phrase - from existing other services, cheaply/easily available everywhere.
Click to expand...

I've heard XM's Sixties on Six and it is very well done with a great music mix! Haven't had the pleasure of hearing their replays of classic programming - but will look out for it. However, my agreement with the original poster was that IF someone resurrected a sixties-style local station on HD-2, it might actually make it worthwhile to invest in an HD radio. In other words, that's the sort of content that might be "compelling" rather than the dullness of what's offered now.

A satellite vs. HD debate would be interesting: at this point, satellite is the hands-down winner, despite the fact that it's not doing all that well. However, HD could theoretically catch up by programming actual "good stuff" on their HD-2 subchannels - programming that is LOCAL. This is a niche that XM/Sirius would be hard pressed to fill.

The thing is, most radio owners and programmers are so short-sighted that this doesn't seem to be happening on any scale. All that's offered is a combination of automated jukebox formats, many of which parrot the main channel (we clearly agree here). So, no interest (or 'buzz') is being generated amongst the public at large. The offerings are just so lackluster that it hasn't been worth the trouble to run out and buy an HD radio. So, sales are low and retailers are reticent about dedicating shelf space to this marketing dud. Not to mention that the HD technology is vastly inferior to what satellite operators offer. As for HD on AM....forget it. It's a disaster.
 
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