What the hell is on the AM band that keeps people posting about.

[Starbucks]

I finally took a little time when travelling to monitor the AM band while driving thru 3 large states last week. The question is especially after sunset...What the hell is on?
It amazes me when I read or glance through these posts....when an AM station signs off or goes broke, people react to it like a loss girlfriend. (It's probably what it is.) What do you people see analyzing an AM station, whether it's canned talk, ethnic, 179 watts or doesn't have live news cast with the teletype on at 3 AM in the morning? I can't find one thing I want to listen to 95% of the time with the exception of one national talk show host , or a local morning show. Anything at night, especially when there's a dull George Noory show, I'm bored listening. I tried to fetch whtever was around that played any type of contemporary music....and of course , 3 out of 4 stations were Radio Disney. I found a canned or satellite delivered oldies, and Classic Country station, and let alone with the a C Crane radio I experimented with...all I got was alot of chatter with more signals on..... it sounded more like a bunch of graveyard channels. The fun of DXing is not what it once was. Anything that a morning show let alone KYW announces, I get it before or just as fast with the internet. we all should be discussing Internet WIFI Radio, Hulu, Netflix, Station Playlist. The point is that most of these AM stations are on because it's hard walking away from a license. Or it came with a deal to acquire 2 powerhouse FM's or something like that. It's like walking away from a $600,000 plus mortgage payment. Maybe if you feel I'm wrong...then you can tell me what is exciting on today's AM radio dial. Local or National. Am I missing something? An antenna switch? Star Spangled banner? A daytimer signing off? Another non- english station I can't understand. Maybe a pirate, or a part 15 that gets out far....Now that's exciting.

 

[wcradio2]

The cool thing is, every now and then, you run across some locally produced show that's interesting.
Sometimes it's genuinely good. Sometimes, it's so bad it's good. If you're lucky, you catch it more than once and realize it's something that you won't, or more likely can't, hear on FM or Satellite but wish you could..
So, despite the static, or the poor execution of a good idea, or just because it's really something local that someone really believes in and has taken the time to put it on the only 'air' available, you get to experience something you can't get anywhere else. Usually because FM, Satellite, and other outlets are just too formatted to allow it.
Finding something like that is very rare, I grant you. But when you do... well, it makes AM worth talking about. And listening to. And lamenting about... and finally, posting here.

 

[musichead1029]

Outside of the noncommercial outlets that for some reason get little notice here, FM is so bland and uneventful that it makes AM sound interesting. What makes for good discussion may not make for great listening and vice versa. Web radio is definitely where it's at these days, and there's a board for that.

 

[MattParker]

The curious is part is not that people post about KYW or WPHT. It's a bit curious we don't see much about WIP It's really curious that some obscure, weak sticks with almost no audience get so much attention. This includes some in the 'burbs or in peripheral markets and some that have gone out of business but got lots of attention when they were still around. Part of it seems to be they are doing something no sane person would attempt with a weak AM signal. Part of it seems to be that a lot of people went through the revolving door at these stations. And part seems to be some sympathy for an underdog - even a dumb underdog.

 

[Starbucks]

The curious is part is not that people post about KYW or WPHT. It's a bit curious we don't see much about WIP It's really curious that some obscure, weak sticks with almost no audience get so much attention. This includes some in the 'burbs or in peripheral markets and some that have gone out of business but got lots of attention when they were still around. Part of it seems to be they are doing something no sane person would attempt with a weak AM signal. Part of it seems to be that a lot of people went through the revolving door at these stations. And part seems to be some sympathy for an underdog - even a dumb underdog.

You pretty much hit it. I think that the thrill of these small stick AM stations is that it has a Twilight Zone effect on some of these postees and listeners. It's like a solitude environment where it is a thrill to pick up and monitor these lower wattage stations in smaller towns where not much is happening, and no one is listening except for them on a Friday or Saturday night. Or even New Year's eve or something like that.
Hey by the way, I gotta go and I'll let you guys know what went on while I'll listen to a replay of the Jim Bohannan show this evening.

 

[TheBigA]

It amazes me when I read or glance through these posts....when an AM station signs off or goes broke, people react to it like a loss girlfriend.

I think you're close. It's the loss of their youth. They remember listening to WIBG or WFIL and miss those days. They wish they'd return, because they'd become young again...maybe. And they get mad when someone gives up on one of those stations, insisting that "compelling programming" would bring audiences back. And if you put wings on a pig, it could fly.

You're right...AM was once exciting...when there was nothing else. It's since been eclipsed by lots of other things that are more exciting. I agree that it used to be exciting to DX an AM station from thousands of miles away. These days, what's the point? They all run the same overnight shows. What killed AM? It began with FM, continued when the FCC cut power on clear channels, added thousands more lower power AMs, and attempted to force more local radio on an overcrowded marketplace. Too many stations, not enough money, that leads to empty airwaves, the radio equivalent of Camden. It once was a big city, now it's an empty skeleton. Some beautiful buildings remain. But it's mostly memories. Like Springsteen singing in "Glory Days."

 

[Bob1370]

"You're right...AM was once exciting...when there was nothing else. It's since been eclipsed by lots of other things that are more exciting. I agree that it used to be exciting to DX an AM station from thousands of miles away. These days, what's the point? They all run the same overnight shows."

It's really all about programming. About 80% of radios sound the same whether they're tuned to AM or FM--they're lo-fi desktop and car radios. It's program quality that drives everything. If you program it and promote it and it's good, they will still come. If they aren't coming, they either don't know about it, or it isn't good.

 

[imhomerjay]

Or the inherent limitations of the technology are what they are, and people presented with myriad choices will always fragment.

Look to TV for a moment on the "or it's not good" item. How many shows that never caught on are rabidly defended by the fans they did have as being among the best programs? ("Arrested Development" anyone?) "Good" or "bad" is entirely subjective.

 

[radiophiler]

A friend who knows I used to work in radio told me this recently: On a recent business trip, his Marriott's clock radio had FM but no AM.

 

[MikefromDelaware]

It gets down to programming. If what you want to hear is not on FM, but only on AM, then you'll listen to AM. Talk and sports have been traditionally on AM stations as FM was for music. NPR, college FM stations, and Christian FM stations have broken that mold showing that FM can be great for spoken word formats. So now we're seeing talk, sports, and sports talk moving to FM stations more and more. However, for some local sporting events, such as high school and smaller colleges AM radio will still be attractive as those pro games and larger universities migrate to FM, AM will fill the void with more high school and smaller college sports, which if you want to hear the game, then you'll tune in to AM or go to the game. So in one sense that will bring AM back more to its earliest roots, its pre-network radio days of being very local in focus.

An example would be: if you're a "ditto head" and want to hear Limbaugh, but can only get him on AM and don't want to pay to hear him online at his website or on XM/Sirius, then AM is all that's left, unless an FM station starts airing national syndicated talkers in your market. If an FM station in Philly that has a strong signal that could blanket the tri-state area with a city grade signal into the Philly/Wilmington/Trenton metro area started airing Limbaugh, my guess is the numerous AM stations in that region now airing Rush might be in real trouble. A WYSP would be such a Philly FM station.

WYSP now is the flag ship station for the Eagles. It would be interesting to find out if the regions AM stations that also carry the Eagles, such as Wilmington's WDEL, have noticed a drop in listeners during the games since WYSP became the flagship.

 

[gunsmoke]

With all due respect to all the posters, why does everyone have a hot nut for Rush, no-one says anything about those rotton so and so's, Jackson, Sharpton, Farrakhan and their clones, with their hate spewing radio and television broadcasts/messages....just curious, could someone enlighten me, or am I missing something.

 

[TheBigA]

So in one sense that will bring AM back more to its earliest roots, its pre-network radio days of being very local in focus.

Doing that costs money, and most AM stations, those without a 50KW stick, can't afford to do that. That's why the AM band is a ghetto of syndication, religion, ethnic, and brokered.

 

[MikefromDelaware]

So in one sense that will bring AM back more to its earliest roots, its pre-network radio days of being very local in focus.

Doing that costs money, and most AM stations, those without a 50KW stick can't afford to do that. That's why the AM band is a ghetto of syndication, religion, ethnic, and brokered.

I agree, but local sports and some local talk and sportstalk seem to sell well (probably depends on the market - the Philly market being a major market probably not so good for high school and small college sports but talk and sports talk works. However, in a medium or small market like Wilmington, Dover, Harrisburg, Atlantic City, Allentown, etc, where a smaller stick like 1K and 5K can cover the market and where local yokel interest may be higher than in a major market where there is far more local on a higher level available like pro sports and big league University sports). Also probably depends on the local show too. Some are just not listenable, others hit the nerve or the pulse of that local area and pull in listeners and more importantly, spot revenue. So in that arena local talk/sportstalk/sports might be affordable. Both WDEL and WWTX do extensive local high school and small college sports and both seem to have a boatload of local spots during those broadcasts. That's probably what pays WWTX's bills.

Granted music isn't a local thing anymore as it truly doesn't make any difference if a jock is sitting at the local station or in LA, NYC, or Philly playing the same CD's. Dick Clark, Kasey Kassem, and yes Delilah made a career of doing just that.

The thing that is going to make AM even more of a "radio ghetto" is talk, sportstalk and sports moving to FM. But I still believe the non-major markets AM's can survive by doing more local talk and sports.

 

[TheBigA]

I agree, but local sports and some local talk and sportstalk seem to sell well

Maybe, but have you seen the rate? They are priced very inexpensively. A few hundred dollars can give you full sponsorship. No one's making money on high school basketball after they pay the on-air team. It's done strictly for community relations, not money. You can't build a station business around it. When you're doing a busines plan, you add up all of your costs and expenses, divide by the number of spots, and see if you can come up with a cost per spot that advertisers will find fair. Quite often, if you're talking a 1 or 5K station, that number is a few bucks per spot. You have to sell a lot of them to pay local salaries. You can make more clearing an infomercial, without any expense.

 

[MikefromDelaware]

With all due respect to all the posters, why does everyone have a hot nut for Rush, no-one says anything about those rotton so and so's, Jackson, Sharpton, Farrakhan and their clones, with their hate spewing radio and television broadcasts/messages....just curious, could someone enlighten me, or am I missing something.

Probably one reason is I don't know of a local station either in Philly or Wilmington that carries Sharpton, Jackson, or Farrakan, or other national lib talk shows beyond NPR and they really aren't as lib oriented as the right would like to think. Other than Sharpton, I didn't know Jackson and Farrakan had radio shows. Those three would be just as irritating to my ear as the big three in right wing talk Rush/Hannity/Beck. But as I've never heard any of their shows (thankfully) it's hard to comment on them. I can only surmise that I'd probably not like their shows, but that's not a reasonable point of view for discussion and is unfair to them. So I'd have to listen to their shows first before making statements about their shows. I have made comments on things Sharpton and Jackson have said that made it into the news, but I really can't comment on their radio shows.

Yes Limbaugh is easy low hanging fruit, sort of like shooting fish in a barrel, but his name is synonymous with right wing talk, sort of like Clinton is synonymous with, well you know, heh, heh. As Leonard Nemoy is synonymous with Mr. Spock, etc.

 

[MikefromDelaware]

Maybe, but have you seen the rate? They are priced very inexpensively. A few hundred dollars can give you full sponsorship. No one's making money on high school basketball after they pay the on-air team. It's done strictly for community relations, not money. You can't build a station business around it. When you're doing a busines plan, you add up all of your costs and expenses, divide by the number of spots, and see if you can come up with a cost per spot that advertisers will find fair. Quite often, if you're talking a 1 or 5K station, that number is a few bucks per spot. You have to sell a lot of them to pay local salaries. You can make more clearing an infomercial, without any expense.

If that is the case, then AM is doomed to become even more trapped in a "Radio Ghetto". So then we all should expect to hear more ethnic, religious, brokered informercials, etc, on AM. I can understand ethnic and religious programming as folks do tune in and that piece of the population is being served, but does anyone really tune in to hear an informercial? Apparently enough that the informercial folks are making enough money to keep buying time on AM radio and OTA TV during the overnights and off times on weekends.

 

[MattParker]

Smaller market AM stations can keep going (with or without listeners) because of two types of accounts. Local sports. Paid religion. The lack of an audience does not seem to bother time buyers in these categories. Local business' want to be identified with the team (and they get that even if nobody actually listens to the broadcasts). And for preachers, it's all about the ego-trip of being on the radio (and the folks in the pews who are gullible enough to pay premium rate for a half-hour Sunday morning).

There is one way in which AM or FM can be seen as different. A study several years ago concluded that AM radio is foreground radio - people listen to it. FM is background radio - people have it on. That's not always true but it is true often. People listen to sports, news and talk formats. People used to listen to music radio with personality DJs and songs with lyrics. Most FM music formats are there as background noise. These stations may register on PPM devices but probably the ads don't register much on people's brains. Another reason why advertisers have left radio.

 

[TheBigA]

If that is the case, then AM is doomed to become even more trapped in a "Radio Ghetto". So then we all should expect to hear more ethnic, religious, brokered informercials, etc, on AM.

That's what I'm saying. The people running these stations aren't idiots. They're simply playing the cards they've been dealt. They can hire a lot of people for local talk, but they'll go broke doing it. Just do the math. The advertising simply won't support it. There's an audience for ethnic programming. It's not big, but it's dedicated, and they'll support businesses that advertise. They're more loyal than high school basketball. An informercial just wants "reach." So you're selling him access to an audience in Philadelphia. Doesn't matter that no one's listening. It's like all those paid shows that run on cable between 2-4AM.

Earlier, you said it's all about programming. I believe it's all about money. The programming you do will depend on the money you can make. If great programming costs too much to make money, you don't do it, even if there's an audience for it. That's the tough decision I make all the time.

 

[TheBigA]

People used to listen to music radio with personality DJs and songs with lyrics. Most FM music formats are there as background noise. These stations may register on PPM devices but probably the ads don't register much on people's brains. Another reason why advertisers have left radio.

I think the advertisers don't know what they want. Because you go to them with foreground programming that will put their brand and product front and center, and they complain about the total rating points. Then give them something with high TRP, and they don't like the context. They want big numbers AND become top of mind, and those two things are hard to deliver. Especially at the price they're willing to pay. This is why companies do cluster sales where they can offer a mix of options. If all you have is one or two stations in a market, it's all or nothing. In Philly, you have a lot of stand-alone AMs. In that situation, you really don't have anything for strategy.

 

[MattParker]

In Philly, you have a lot of stand-alone AMs. In that situation, you really don't have anything for strategy.

In Philly, there are only three AM stations with any kind of numbers. And CBS owns all three.