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What's My Line? & I've Got A Secret on GSN

E

EJ204

Guest
If you're a fan of these 1950s-60s black and white game shows, this week GSN is running them.

What's My Line airs at 2am and I've Got A Secret at 2:30am, ET. Oddly, GSN returns to recent game shows in color from 3-4am, before the infomercials kick in. (Gee, couldn't they have gone 2-4am with black and white shows on this week before Christmas?)

A few years ago, GSN used to run black and white game shows every night at 2am. Not just WML and IGAS but Password, Beat The Clock, To Tell The Truth and even some rarely seen or remembered game shows, such as The Name's The Same with Robert Q. Lewis and Winner Take All with Bill Cullen. That 1952 show is so old that it also was carried on the radio as well as TV. Unfortunately, GSN took all the black and white shows off its schedule a few years ago, although maybe once or twice each year, they'll give us a week of these programs.

By the way, on Christmas Day, GSN is having a marathon to celebrate the 50th anniversary of The Match Game. They're promoting that they will air a "never before seen" pilot program in black and white. That version had only had two celebrities, Orson Bean and Jayne Mansfield, each leading a team of two contestants. But Gene Rayburn was the host back then as well.
 
I would much rather see reruns of B&W What's My Line, etc, instead of tired old episodes of newer "junk." Pity they don't do any of the black and white shows (or even their newer color siblings from the 60's) during normal viewing times instead of the dead of night. It might actually make me want to watch!

I remember watching the original Match Game during my youth and they obviously found their way with the 70's version. I would love to see the 80's Match Game/Hollywood Squares hour as it will likely never see the light of day again.
 
^ I have a video of that "Winner Take All". I believe I read that it was the first show to have the "lockout" to answer first without the opponent doing so. In this show, one contestant's sound was a buzzer, and the other a bell; it had to have been on radio too, like was said here---because Bill would say something like, "That's the buzzer, so you [name] answer." It was certainly obvious to the TV audience.

Primitive this show was, maybe----but the lockout changed the game show world forever. :)

cd
 
"Winner Take All" started on radio in 1946 with the concept
of bells, buzzers, and the lockout device which indicated who
signaled first; it was also the first game show to keep a returning
champion who kept playing until defeated. Bill was originally the
announcer; one day he replaced the ailing (or possibly drunk) regular
host, Ward Wilson, and a 40-year emceeing career was born.
 
...are there any of the Winston-sponsored I've Got a Secrets in the mix? I seem to recall that "Winston" sign on the front of Garry Moore's desk got those episodes removed from the rotation a dozen years ago after some litigious character in Kansas or Nebraska filed some lawsuit or other, citing a violation of the Federal Communications Corruption's ban on broadcast advertising of tobacco products. Apparently, GSN didn't want to bother editing out the references to Winston (like CBN did the references to NBC and DeSoto on The Best of Groucho in the '80s)...
 
Ultimajock said:
...are there any of the Winston-sponsored I've Got a Secrets in the mix? I seem to recall that "Winston" sign on the front of Garry Moore's desk got those episodes removed from the rotation a dozen years ago after some litigious character in Kansas or Nebraska filed some lawsuit or other, citing a violation of the Federal Communications Corruption's ban on broadcast advertising of tobacco products. Apparently, GSN didn't want to bother editing out the references to Winston (like CBN did the references to NBC and DeSoto on The Best of Groucho in the '80s)...
Click to expand...

I don't get GSN, but last I thought I read, I thought that the cigarette signs were intact, along with a disclaimer on GSN that this was the way things were back then, and GSN does not promote the use of cigs.

As to "Best of Groucho", I don't think this was CBN's doing. BOG was a syndicated package of 130 episodes from 1954-61 only, distributed by NBC Films in '61. I used to watch these on WCIX 6 Miami in the 1970s---same stuff. I believe that NBC Films removed the "NBC" on Groucho's mic, and any sponsor references on the wall behind everybody. How this was done back in 1961, I do not know.

cd
 
EJ204 said:
By the way, on Christmas Day, GSN is having a marathon to celebrate the 50th anniversary of The Match Game. They're promoting that they will air a "never before seen" pilot program in black and white. That version had only had two celebrities, Orson Bean and Jayne Mansfield, each leading a team of two contestants. But Gene Rayburn was the host back then as well.
Click to expand...

Correction: the test edition of "The Match Game" from 1962 had Peggy Cass and Peter Hayes in the roles reserved for celebrated guests. Orson Bean and Jayne Mansfield appeared later in an edition from 1964 (the later edition is part of the marathon). Here is a link to a list of the rest of the programs scheduled for the marathon.
 
The list linked to my previous post did not have a description of the last edition of "Match Game" scheduled for the marathon. According to a programming schedule for the Game Show Network, the last edition in the marathon will be from the version of the program from 1990 with Ross Shafer in the role of host.

I noticed the advertisement from the Game Show Network for the marathon shows pictures of Orson Bean and Jayne Together from an edition of the original "Match Game" series while the announcer says the marathon has the "never-before-seen pilot" for the original series. This part of the advertisement is misleading for folks unaware of the actual celebrated guests for the first edition of the original series.
 
Did the original "Match Game" (1960s) have more than one pilot? The Peggy Cass/Peter Lind Hayes pilot was on the Match Game DVD that came out a few years ago----I have one disc of it. I am sure it's on YouTube as well. So if it was "never before seen," maybe they mean on GSN only.

cd
 
I noticed they had an episode of the 1998 version listed, which was a total flop. It's too bad they couldn't have had an episode of The Match Game Hollywood Squares Hour, but I've heard about all the legal problems with that.
 
Ultimajock said:
...are there any of the Winston-sponsored I've Got a Secrets in the mix? I seem to recall that "Winston" sign on the front of Garry Moore's desk got those episodes removed from the rotation a dozen years ago after some litigious character in Kansas or Nebraska filed some lawsuit or other, citing a violation of the Federal Communications Corruption's ban on broadcast advertising of tobacco products. Apparently, GSN didn't want to bother editing out the references to Winston (like CBN did the references to NBC and DeSoto on The Best of Groucho in the '80s)...
Click to expand...

I think the guy in Kansas raised a ruckus about "Two For The Money," which was sponsored by Old Gold cigarettes and which showed Herb Shriner giving cartons of the cigarettes to every contestant. I never recall seeing the Winston-sponsored "I've Got A Secret"s on Sunday Night in Black and White; all the episodes of "I've Got A Secret" I've ever seen on GSN are either from the first year (1952-53) or the Monday-night years in the '60s when General Foods was its primary sponsor.

As for Groucho, yes, the pictures were cropped and/or blown up to eliminate the DeSoto-Plymouth (and in the later years, Toni) logos and the NBC logo on Groucho's microphone was blacked out, and all that was done when the show first entered syndication in the early '60s. I'm surprised PBS hasn't done something like that with Dodge and Geritol logos on "The Lawrence Welk Show."
 
"You Bet Your Life" (Was: Re: "What's My Line?" & "I've Got A Secret" on GSN)

B. Patrick wrote: said:
As for Groucho, yes, the pictures were cropped and/or blown up to eliminate the DeSoto-Plymouth (and in the later years, Toni) logos and the NBC logo on Groucho's microphone was blacked out, and all that was done when the show first entered syndication in the early '60s.
Click to expand...

Based on episodes from the final two seasons of "You Bet Your Life" (retitled "The Groucho Show" in 1960), and having seen both the syndication prints (in reruns) and the original versions of those 1959-61 episodes (on the "You Bet Your Life: The Lost Episodes" and "You Bet Your Life: The Best Episodes" DVD sets), I can tell you that by 1959, Groucho's RCA 44-BX microphone no longer had any NBC markings on it, and it appears that sponsor logos (which by that time were on the front of the desk Groucho sat behind) were added in post-production.

It's possible that by 1959, "You Bet Your Life" may have been distributed to other English-speaking countries, so by removing the NBC markings from Groucho's mike and added sponsor logos in post-production so the show could run overseas.

Or, perhaps "You Bet Your Life" executive producer John Guedel and/or Groucho were beginning to look at the idea of having reruns of the show syndicated once the series' prime-time NBC run ended, and wanted to make it possible for reruns to be syndicated.
 
Mario-500 said:
The list linked to my previous post did not have a description of the last edition of "Match Game" scheduled for the marathon. According to a programming schedule for the Game Show Network, the last edition in the marathon will be from the version of the program from 1990 with Ross Shafer in the role of host.

I noticed the advertisement from the Game Show Network for the marathon shows pictures of Orson Bean and Jayne Together from an edition of the original "Match Game" series while the announcer says the marathon has the "never-before-seen pilot" for the original series. This part of the advertisement is misleading for folks unaware of the actual celebrated guests for the first edition of the original series.
Click to expand...

Even though I was not willing to visit the Buzzer Blog (a site with news about game shows) again due to one of its contributors using rude language through the Twitter feed for the site constantly, I felt the need to go there to confirm some details about the marathon I read about through a message on the Game Show Network's message board. According to the Buzzer Blog, the programming schedule for the marathon now has one of five test editions for the version of "Match Game" first broadcast in 1990 (the test edition scheduled was the third edition produced). According to the site, this program would be broadcast last in the marathon and it has Bert Convy in the role of host, not Ross Shafer, who took the place of Bert Convy due to him being diagnosed for a brain tumor before his death in 1991.
 
A couple of additions...

What's My Line and I've Got A Secret will also air during Christmas week each weeknight from 2-3am. But then, that's it for black and white game shows for a while.

On Christmas morning at 8am, GSN will run the black and white pilot for Match Game, hosted by Gene Rayburn, featuring celebrities Peter Lind Hayes and Peggy Cass. Some years ago, GSN had put together a special on The Match Game, featuring candid interviews with panalists including Brett Somers. But that is not on the Match Game marathon.

As for You Bet Your Life/Best of Groucho, when the show went into syndication, it's true that signs with the name of sponsors were cropped out of most sceens by zooming into Groucho and the contestants. I think you could see DeSoto or Toni occasionally. As for the big "NBC" on Groucho's microphone, they didn't really black it out. They lightened it out. It looked like a beam of light was shining on the microphone, so you couldn't see the NBC sign.

The show was popular as an off-network rerun for quite a few years. In NYC, Independent WPIX 11 ran it for a while at 8pm on weeknights after NBC dropped it. It continued to run late at night or early mornings for many years in the 70s and 80s, although never in an important time slot. WPIX would drop it for a while, then bring it back at 12:30am or 1am or 6am. Up till a few years ago, the Jewish Life channel ran it occasionally. I don't know why they discontinued it. If it's in public domain, it costs them nothing to carry it.
 
Ultimajock said:
...are there any of the Winston-sponsored I've Got a Secrets in the mix? I seem to recall that "Winston" sign on the front of Garry Moore's desk got those episodes removed from the rotation a dozen years ago after some litigious character in Kansas or Nebraska filed some lawsuit or other, citing a violation of the Federal Communications Corruption's ban on broadcast advertising of tobacco products. Apparently, GSN didn't want to bother editing out the references to Winston (like CBN did the references to NBC and DeSoto on The Best of Groucho in the '80s)...
Click to expand...

I think that character complained to the FCC directly.
 
In 1959 Groucho got a new backdrop, which included sliding panels
for contestants who wanted to dance or perform in some other way,
and yes, he got a new microphone minus the NBC letters. I have seen
clips of the Toni logo but they may have been from the previous year,
as DeSoto stopped sponsoring the show in '58, in preparation for shutting
down (the 1961s were the last DeSotos ever made).

On the episodes where the NBC logo is obscured on Groucho's mike, it
looks like a black spot over the letters. I suppose the reason for blacking
out, whitening out, or whatever you want to call it, is that the show was
picked up in syndication by non-NBC stations (in the '60s by ABC and CBS
affiliates or independents in some markets; in the '70s by mostly independents
although I do recall the ABC affiliates in Tampa, Charlotte, Greenville/Spartanburg/
Asheville, and Columbia, SC, airing the show around 1976 or '77).

I remember as a kid in the '60s watching "Best Of Groucho" on WFMY Greensboro
(CBS) or WESH Daytona Beach/Orlando (NBC); in the '70s I saw it on Pat Robertson's
station in Atlanta (now CBS affiliate WGCL) (and always wondered why Ted Turner
passed on it). And that in itself would at least partially explain why the NBC letters
were obscured.

You'll also notice that the opening animated segment, where Groucho's features roll
around until they fall into place, then cut to the duck pointing to a sign which says
"The Best Of Groucho," dissolves into "Groucho Marx," and finally "You Bet Your Life,"
and then directly to George Fenneman and the standard "Here he is...the one, the only..."
introduction, is not the original (unless it was used in the summer reruns). If you can
find Groucho's show on DVD or radio tapes, you'll most likely get a DeSoto plug before
Fenneman appears (usually something musical like "Groucho sent me...to see the new
DeSoto...") and a different arrangement of "Hooray For Captain Spaulding" than you hear
in syndication.

Just for the record, and my apologies to Chrysler's ad agency, "Groucho Sent Me" went
something like this:

(WOMAN) Groucho sent me...to see the new DeSoto...
(MAN) Groucho sent me, and I love to drive this car.
It's long and low and roomier, so handsome you can see,
(WOMAN) It's powerful and I'm so glad that Groucho sent me...
(BOTH) Listen to him, when you hear Groucho say...
(GROUCHO, singing) Drive the new DeSoto at DeSoto-Plymouth dealers todaaaay!
 
One of the syndie "Best of Groucho"s had a dialogue that went like so:

Groucho (to contestant): Where are you from?
Contestant: Portland, Oregon.
Groucho: What's your line of work?
Contestant: I work for NBC.
Groucho (excitedly): Wonderful! We must have a new affiliate there! Who is it?
Contestant: No, Groucho, I work for the National Biscuit Company.

We all know that much of the dialogue is staged, anyway.....but a reference to NBC in the syndie prints nonetheless.

cd
 
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