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What's Next for 'BNN?

R

Radio-X

Guest
I would wonder what is in the future for Big Country 105.3 now that you can *sorta* pick them up in C'ville? Will they remain country (I think a bad move, nobody would buy much from a rimshot country station with a number 1 station comming in better) Perhaps they will cater to C'ville better with a JACK format? Hmm...with C'ville being full of rich psuedo-intellectual types who would CRAVE that type of station...If I owned BNN, that would be my route...

But the 800 lb. gorilla in that case is John Boy and Billy...they would not do well on a JACK format...perhaps a "rock that knows no boundaries" format like 96rock in Raleigh...they have JB+B and a wide variety of Rock...

I just think personally, WBNN could make a killing with some non-existant formats in C'ville

WBNN Dillwyn/Charlottesville is the NEW 105-3 BOB FM...

'NRN watch ya back!

Radio-X
 
> I would wonder what is in the future for Big Country 105.3
> now that you can *sorta* pick them up in C'ville? Will they
> remain country (I think a bad move, nobody would buy much
> from a rimshot country station with a number 1 station
> comming in better) Perhaps they will cater to C'ville better
> with a JACK format? Hmm...with C'ville being full of rich
> psuedo-intellectual types who would CRAVE that type of
> station...If I owned BNN, that would be my route...
>
> But the 800 lb. gorilla in that case is John Boy and
> Billy...they would not do well on a JACK format...perhaps a
> "rock that knows no boundaries" format like 96rock in
> Raleigh...they have JB+B and a wide variety of Rock...
>
> I just think personally, WBNN could make a killing with some
> non-existant formats in C'ville
>
> WBNN Dillwyn/Charlottesville is the NEW 105-3 BOB FM...
>
> 'NRN watch ya back!
>
> Radio-X
>
I think some other format would be better on WBNN for C'ville but I really can't see a station with the "Jack" or "Bob" format having much staying power. That "play anything" format will likely get old die off with the other faded fad formats, like the all 70's format stations tried a few years ago. Clear Channel had a 70's format in Charlottesville a few years ago and it was a flop.

I've been listening to WBNN off and on since I discovered them about 3 years ago. WBNN is a great sounding station as it is. I like John Boy & Billy for the most part, however I would prefer a locally produced morning show that's actually somewhat entertaining. At least John Boy & Billy better than some of these politically correct "we don't offend anyone" formats that are just plain boring. For a small station WBNN has good jocks and a variety of programs without being obscure. Whoever's in charge of the progrmming at WBNN must be doing something right to upset the folks at Clear Channel as they have.

WBNN can now be heard pretty well in Charlottesville, even north of town, but the signal is still not powerful enough to take on any existing format in the market, especially one with a 50k signal, they might have a shot if get a translator of their own. Surely they're smart enough to figure out something. Just as long as it's not another lite AC type format *yuck* I'll keep listening.

RadioABC
 
I've listened to WBNN for awhile now while I've traveled in the Charlottesville area. Now with the repeater gone from 105.1, They have a pretty good signal in the downtown area. I agree with other posts in saying that WBNN needs a repeater of their own in the downtown area to have a shot with WCYK and now it seems WKCY as well. That means there will be 3 country stations in the Charlottesville market. 2 Clear Channel and WBNN, this should provide for an interesting battle. I also agree that the jocks on WBNN sound really good compared to what is on WCYK. Whoever is programming WBNN knows what they are doing. Also getting John Boy & Billy was a good choice. I guess someone was doing thier homework in Charlottesville. That market didnt have them until now, but did have them before when 102.3 was classic rock. I guess someone did thier homework.
As far as a format change, I'd like to see WBNN do something diffrent. The jocks sound like should be on a diffrent format anyway. Maybe a classic hits format that leaned classic rock. They might step on 3WV's toes a bit but they could play a lot of the stuff from the 60's, 70's, 80's, and only the good stuff from the early 90's. It would be almost like a Jack/Bob format but I dont think they should go as far to call it that. I agree that the Jack/Bob format is a fad and will die out in a few years.
I guess we will see in the comming months.

<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by computertech4476 on 06/15/05 03:41 PM.</FONT></P>
 
Lot's of fluff in these posts. First, WBNN hasn't caused CC any problems or concern - other than apparently (according to VARTV) exercising their FCC ruled right to turn off an xlator causing interference with market signals. WCYK has had on-going problems with that site going back to before CC was in the market. It caused downtown interference to the Crozet NPR station for years until the site was resolved a while back - its basically a lousy site and was a lousy installation, that has been repaired and upgraded by CC. The first adjacent issue with WBNN has little to do with who owns it or what the format is.

A market country format would be an issue for WCYK as they have never had any real competition in market (in market always makes me smile since WCYK is licensed to Staunton - west of the Mt.) If WBNN provides metro coverage then they could be a problem - IF they market it as a Cville station - that's what WCYK has done. If they don't - they'll always live on the margin. Also, depending on what the major coverage contour is for WBNN - they might not be able to put a xlator in as has been mentioned - typically they can not be used to extend METRO coverage unless they fill in the main contour...which is why both WCYK and WKCY can put one in Cville - both stations are 50 KW and their main contour extends over the area where the xlators are located.
 
> Lot's of fluff in these posts. First, WBNN hasn't caused CC
> any problems or concern - other than apparently (according
> to VARTV) exercising their FCC ruled right to turn off an
> xlator causing interference with market signals. WCYK has
> had on-going problems with that site going back to before CC
> was in the market. It caused downtown interference to the
> Crozet NPR station for years until the site was resolved a
> while back - its basically a lousy site and was a lousy
> installation, that has been repaired and upgraded by CC. The
> first adjacent issue with WBNN has little to do with who
> owns it or what the format is.
>
> A market country format would be an issue for WCYK as they
> have never had any real competition in market (in market
> always makes me smile since WCYK is licensed to Staunton -
> west of the Mt.) If WBNN provides metro coverage then they
> could be a problem - IF they market it as a Cville station -
> that's what WCYK has done. If they don't - they'll always
> live on the margin. Also, depending on what the major
> coverage contour is for WBNN - they might not be able to put
> a xlator in as has been mentioned - typically they can not
> be used to extend METRO coverage unless they fill in the
> main contour...which is why both WCYK and WKCY can put one
> in Cville - both stations are 50 KW and their main contour
> extends over the area where the xlators are located.
>

There were other interference issues, but WBNN played a major role in shutting down WCYK's 105.1 translator. It was the FCC that exercised their right to shut them down. CC would have never given it up that translator unless they were given no other choice. CC would've got a new translator asap on another frequency for WCYK, but since for whatever reason they couldn't, they managed to get one on 104.9 for their Harrisonburg country station, WKCY. If WBNN was not a threat to WCYK, CC would not be the least bit worried out it.

WKCY is actually a better station than WCYK so CC is essentially cutting the throat of WCYK with another one of their own stations in an effort to flood the market with their 2 country formats in an effort to battle WBNN. I guess the next thing CC will do is get a translator in Charlottesville for Lite 98 in Richmond so they can go after WQMZ?

Whether WBNN continues as they are or if go for a different format, They'll be just fine. Fluff or not, big or small, it can't be denied that WBNN sounds great and has certainly left it's mark on the market.

RadioABC
 
> There were other interference issues, but WBNN played a
> major role in shutting down WCYK's 105.1 translator. It was
> the FCC that exercised their right to shut them down. CC
> would have never given it up that translator unless they
> were given no other choice. CC would've got a new translator
> asap on another frequency for WCYK, but since for whatever
> reason they couldn't, they managed to get one on 104.9 for
> their Harrisonburg country station, WKCY. If WBNN was not a
> threat to WCYK, CC would not be the least bit worried out
> it.
>
> WKCY is actually a better station than WCYK so CC is
> essentially cutting the throat of WCYK with another one of
> their own stations in an effort to flood the market with
> their 2 country formats in an effort to battle WBNN. I guess
> the next thing CC will do is get a translator in
> Charlottesville for Lite 98 in Richmond so they can go after
> WQMZ?

As I said lots of fluff - sure WBNN applied and was granted the right to shut down the xlator - but again - any station with any format in any market gets to to that with xlators and LPFM's - thats the way the rules are written - and what do you think CC will do with that xlator for WKCY?? HMM - its just possible they'll xfer it to another station - I wonder which one??? - again following the FCC's rules. It doesn't do WKCY any good over there since it over covers (in any great way) the downtown area. And guess what if it was WBNN who had it shut down - further proof the system works based on the rules - The xlator has been on for a decade or more. HOw long has WBNN been on the air? NOt as long.

XLATORS and LPFM's are the least of the FM band - any fully licensed station with interference issues - trumps them. Believe it or not - this happens all over the country. And no the FCC didn't just do it - just like they don't do many things because they can - but because stations exercise their rights under the rules and complain and file complaints. You make it sound like big gov't shut down CC - not correct. Besides Clark Broadcasting - the former operator of WCYK - got the xlator in the first place not CC - duh. NO they won't be getting one for WTVR-FM cause they can't - as mentioned above - commercial stations can only get xlators within their MAIN CONTOURS - not to extend their listening area - only to fill in holes in their areas - helps if you know the rules.
>
> Whether WBNN continues as they are or if go for a different
> format, They'll be just fine. Fluff or not, big or small, it
> can't be denied that WBNN sounds great and has certainly
> left it's mark on the market.
>

I can deny it as long as they don't show in the ratings and there are few if any Cville businesses advertising on them - cause in commercial radio - that's the proof. Proof is not found on one of these more or less blog sites - with a bunch of blow hards exercising opinions that are not based even on a few facts...

Just call me Jethro!
>
 
----with a bunch of blow hards exercising opinions that are not based even on
> a few facts...
>
> Just call me Jethro!
> >
>

Talk about "the pot calling the kettle black"!
 
> > There were other interference issues, but WBNN played a
> > major role in shutting down WCYK's 105.1 translator. It
> was
> > the FCC that exercised their right to shut them down. CC
> > would have never given it up that translator unless they
> > were given no other choice. CC would've got a new
> translator
> > asap on another frequency for WCYK, but since for whatever
>
> > reason they couldn't, they managed to get one on 104.9 for
>
> > their Harrisonburg country station, WKCY. If WBNN was not
> a
> > threat to WCYK, CC would not be the least bit worried out
> > it.
> >
> > WKCY is actually a better station than WCYK so CC is
> > essentially cutting the throat of WCYK with another one of
>
> > their own stations in an effort to flood the market with
> > their 2 country formats in an effort to battle WBNN. I
> guess
> > the next thing CC will do is get a translator in
> > Charlottesville for Lite 98 in Richmond so they can go
> after
> > WQMZ?
>
> As I said lots of fluff - sure WBNN applied and was granted
> the right to shut down the xlator - but again - any station
> with any format in any market gets to to that with xlators
> and LPFM's - thats the way the rules are written - and what
> do you think CC will do with that xlator for WKCY?? HMM -
> its just possible they'll xfer it to another station - I
> wonder which one??? - again following the FCC's rules. It
> doesn't do WKCY any good over there since it over covers (in
> any great way) the downtown area. And guess what if it was
> WBNN who had it shut down - further proof the system works
> based on the rules - The xlator has been on for a decade or
> more. HOw long has WBNN been on the air? NOt as long.
>
> XLATORS and LPFM's are the least of the FM band - any fully
> licensed station with interference issues - trumps them.
> Believe it or not - this happens all over the country. And
> no the FCC didn't just do it - just like they don't do many
> things because they can - but because stations exercise
> their rights under the rules and complain and file
> complaints. You make it sound like big gov't shut down CC -
> not correct. Besides Clark Broadcasting - the former
> operator of WCYK - got the xlator in the first place not CC
> - duh. NO they won't be getting one for WTVR-FM cause they
> can't - as mentioned above - commercial stations can only
> get xlators within their MAIN CONTOURS - not to extend their
> listening area - only to fill in holes in their areas -
> helps if you know the rules.
> >
> > Whether WBNN continues as they are or if go for a
> different
> > format, They'll be just fine. Fluff or not, big or small,
> it
> > can't be denied that WBNN sounds great and has certainly
> > left it's mark on the market.
> >
>
> I can deny it as long as they don't show in the ratings and
> there are few if any Cville businesses advertising on them -
> cause in commercial radio - that's the proof. Proof is not
> found on one of these more or less blog sites - with a bunch
> of blow hards exercising opinions that are not based even on
> a few facts...
>
> Just call me Jethro!
> >
>

Hmmm...sounds like "Jethro" is a CC "company man" I'm sure it's kinda embarrassing to CC for a little station like WBNN to put a dent in their "evil empire" Take a look at the ratings again..and not just 12+! Sure, it is not likely they will ever be #1 with country, but they can certainly help themselves to the piece of the pie.

Check your facts. Maybe even listen to some of these stations before you express your opinions.
 
> ----with a bunch of blow hards exercising opinions that are
> not based even on
> > a few facts...
> >
> > Just call me Jethro!
> > >
> >
>
> Talk about "the pot calling the kettle black"!
>

Ha-Ha-Ha...you might be correct.

But it is the same on all these lists...someone chimes in with an opinion and declares it as fact. When lots of times its wishful thinking on their part and nothing more ("oooh I hope CC is really ticked about WBNN!!!").

I don't work for CC - never have. I have been in radio in the area - now just do voice over work from home on Afton (so yeah I probably qualify as a blow hard at times :). I just think it likely silly to say that CC Cville cares who chimed in on the xlator - its a bump in the road to them - they'll work it out - that's what companies their size do. And to say that they put WKCY on and it will cut WCYK's throat - is simply silly as well. Having worked in markets with these types of xlators - most listeners never know about them - and their value is highly suspect - you can only trace it through arb diaries mentions - and they rarely show up because they are hard to promote effectively along with the main frequency. As far as my facts - I have seen all the break outs from fall 04 (the most recent survey) and will get to see spring 05 - from one of the agency buyers I work with - and WBNN does not and has not shown AT ALL in the metro. A hint. If stations don't show in the freebie 12+ stuff you can get at Allaccess - its highly unlikely they'll show in any single demo... Not gonna quote #'s since don't want the arb police to get their panties in a wad... I will grant you that I have not listened to WBNN this week but have as recently as last week - and they were promoting some father's day giveaway - but I don't remember hearing any Jim Price ads or Brown ads... and even if the big guns in cville spend money out there now - its what's left after they cover the main guys at Saga and CC...Jethro
 
Anyone with a doubt the WBNN will at least make an attempt in Charlottesville, should just take a listen to them now. I've kinda been listening to them the last week and they calls from the charlottesville area have more than doubled. The translator hasnt been down even a week yet. I think WBNN will give WCYK a run for it's money. People in Charlottesville have grown tired of CC and want something better. Frankly, I think WBNN in a lot better sound wise than WCYK. What hurts WBNN is the fact that the station is in Dillwyn and not somewhere in Charlottesville. I'd actually like to see the books for the Charlottesville area for the last couple of years and see what WBNN has done. I'm sure it's nothing really great, but even something small would be signifigant. It takes time to make changes for listeners. I think if given sometime, WBNN could be a medium-sized dog in Charlottesville.
 
>> I'd
> actually like to see the books for the Charlottesville area
> for the last couple of years and see what WBNN has done. >>

If you look at the numbers on R&R's site WBNN doesn't show up. It's WCYK, WJMA and WKCY. Will be interesting to see if WKCY moves up with the translator in Charlottesville now.
 
> >> I'd
> > actually like to see the books for the Charlottesville
> area
> > for the last couple of years and see what WBNN has done.
> >>
>
> If you look at the numbers on R&R's site WBNN doesn't show
> up. It's WCYK, WJMA and WKCY. Will be interesting to see
> if WKCY moves up with the translator in Charlottesville now.
>

Actually, WBNN has shown up in the Cville book in it's history. I too won't quote any, but their numbers were suprisingly good, especially when you consider that WCYK's translator was blocking most of WBNN's signal coverage within the city limits.

WBNN will probably never set the market on fire with any format, but give them a break. Did anyone really ever expected anything much from them, if anything at all? I listen to them from time to time and I've heard several Charlottesville ads. I wouldn't be shocked if you hear Jim Price or Brown Auto ads on WBNN one day. They do have listeners and I'm sure their rates compared to CC or Saga would be well worth considering for any business. You can call it "fluff" all you want, but the fact remains that they have a good program lineup and a good sound overall.

Often I hear talk about how there's no radio station doing something different. Sure, it's one of many country stations in the area, but WBNN certainly doesn't follow strictly the main stream. I hear new songs on WBNN long before the other stations pick them up and from time to time they'll throw in an great "oldie" Let's hear WCYK or WKCY spotlight and play a Johnny Cash song in afternoon drive. WBNN is a small station and they don't have have million-dollar nationwide promotions to get listeners, but they could use some better self-promotions such as TV and newspaper ads so they'd be more known about. Besides, when was the last time someone from the Cville area won a million bucks from a CC station? It might not be a cash jackpot, but I bet you'd have a better chance winning something WBNN gives away.

Succeed or not, I gotta say hooray for the underdogs! At least WBNN is giving us another choice as far as country stations go. Bringing WKCY into Cville will only bring more of what most are bored with from WCYK. Certainly they do well, strong signals with dull programming with little or nothing else to choose from...XM and Sirius thives on it.
 
I agree, the programmers at WCYK would never play Johnny Cash or anything like that during the drive. When it's spolighted as WBNN has done. It's really good. I've traveled to Washington DC and WMZQ does the same thing all day long. They'll spotlight one of those great old country classic songs. That's the only other station I've ever heard do it. True, WBNN doesn't do as much of the self promotions that they need to in order to be seen like they should. I think part of that was of the signal issue in Charlottesville. Now with the translator gone, they possible could start doing some more self promotions. I think we'll start seeing alot more WBNN in Charlottesville now. I say, just give them some time to get noticed. Sure, they won't cause a forrest fire but a few brush fires that clean out the forrest ever now and again isn't bad.
 
> throat - is simply silly as well. Having worked in markets
> with these types of xlators - most listeners never know
> about them - and their value is highly suspect - you can
> only trace it through arb diaries mentions - and they rarely
> show up because they are hard to promote effectively along
> with the main frequency.

Oh really? Have a listen to WROV in Martinsville sometime. They've got a shadowing issue in Blacksburg and therefore have a translator there. When they ID, you hear...

"This is 96-3, WROV-FM Martinsville and 96-7 WROV Blacksburg, the Rock of Virginia."

Unless it's one of their REAL IDs in which case it's...

"96-3 WROV-FM Martinsville, 96-7 W244AD Blacksburg, the Rock of Virginia."

The W244AD is said quickly so as to not be heard, but if you're listening for it (as I am) then it's audible.

Now I'm not saying that it makes an effect on a competitor (considering there aren't any other than "The Bear" with it's nearly worthless signal), but to say that they have no value... I cannot agree with that. I know many people who go to Virginia Tech listen to 96.7.

- Trip<P ID="signature">______________
Visit my website, www.rabbitears.info! It's eventually going to be your one resource for television info! Digital television, histories, and technical information for the entire USA from one source!</P>
 
> > throat - is simply silly as well. Having worked in markets
>
> > with these types of xlators - most listeners never know
> > about them - and their value is highly suspect - you can
> > only trace it through arb diaries mentions - and they
> rarely
> > show up because they are hard to promote effectively along
>
> > with the main frequency.
>
> Oh really? Have a listen to WROV in Martinsville sometime.
> They've got a shadowing issue in Blacksburg and therefore
> have a translator there. When they ID, you hear...
>
> "This is 96-3, WROV-FM Martinsville and 96-7 WROV
> Blacksburg, the Rock of Virginia."
>
> Unless it's one of their REAL IDs in which case it's...
>
> "96-3 WROV-FM Martinsville, 96-7 W244AD Blacksburg, the Rock
> of Virginia."
>
> The W244AD is said quickly so as to not be heard, but if
> you're listening for it (as I am) then it's audible.
>
> Now I'm not saying that it makes an effect on a competitor
> (considering there aren't any other than "The Bear" with
> it's nearly worthless signal), but to say that they have no
> value... I cannot agree with that. I know many people who
> go to Virginia Tech listen to 96.7.
>
> - Trip
>

OK - that's one. How many xlators are there across the land? The one(s) in question in Cville (including the one downtown for 102.3) can be off for days at a time and nobody notices - this has happened tons of times. One difference for WROV is that due to their coverage - they promote the xlator as serving a different town, Blacksburg - so its another avenue to promote - again in Cville - both serve Cville - to the average joe listener - it can be confusing. "OK I listen to 99.7 when I am west of downtown, 105.1 when I'm downtown and 99.7 everywhere else..."
 
FM translators seem to be much more useful in mountainous areas, such as Blacksburg, where there is far less co-channel and adjacent channel interferrence. On the coastal plain, they do seem rather useless, as any kind of trop conditions renders them unlistenable. The large number of translators in Charlottesville, to me, seems mainly aimed at insuring that out of market stations, namely Richmond, can not be heard in the thickly populated area. For example 106.7 blocks out Power 106.5 from Richmond, which otherwise has a good signal in the area. Considering the extremely poor quality of C'ville radio, blocking signals is probably a smart move on the part of local broadcasters.
 
That is 1065 the Beat....Power is on 921 known as Power 921 Jamz (both Richmond stations)

> FM translators seem to be much more useful in mountainous
> areas, such as Blacksburg, where there is far less
> co-channel and adjacent channel interferrence. On the
> coastal plain, they do seem rather useless, as any kind of
> trop conditions renders them unlistenable. The large number
> of translators in Charlottesville, to me, seems mainly aimed
> at insuring that out of market stations, namely Richmond,
> can not be heard in the thickly populated area. For example
> 106.7 blocks out Power 106.5 from Richmond, which otherwise
> has a good signal in the area. Considering the extremely
> poor quality of C'ville radio, blocking signals is probably
> a smart move on the part of local broadcasters.
>
 
> That is 1065 the Beat....Power is on 921 known as Power 921
> Jamz (both Richmond stations)

You are correct!
>
Considering the extremely
> > poor quality of C'ville radio, blocking signals is
> probably
> > a smart move on the part of local broadcasters.
> >
>
This part of the post is off mark. Doubtful local broadcasters are putting on translators 'just' to block out of market signals - its aimed more at just competing. Cville local radio is poor by many standards - one being just local FM signals. You have 107.5, 95.1 (both A's) and 97.5 (50KW) and WUVA 92.7 a class and that's about it...most everything else comes in from outside - and its a mountainous area. 99.7 comes in from Afton/Skyline Drive, 102.3 comes in from Crozet - and a screwy location - its tall - but not taller than the next ridge closer to Cville. 101.9 comes in from out past the airport - was on the floor out there in front of the urban sprawl along 29 until moved it to the mountain site - its still a crappy market signal.

I haven't been close enough to pick up the 106.7 xlator for a while - but isn't it an out of market religious broadcaster? - The bummer to me is while over there you can't get a listenable WJFK out of DC. With this 'most' of the Richmond sigs boom in - at least those of B or better class.
 
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