When CBS Really "Blew It."

[mleach]

ixnay
(who, during this era, spotted a Hee Haw lunchbox in school, with Roy and Buck on one side and I don’t know who on the other. BTW I grew up in Boothwyn, PA, a Philadelphia suburb)

The now defunct Opryland Theme Park in Nashville back in the 80's actually had a Hee Haw Department Store. Not only did they sell Hee Haw lunchboxes but even those "Trapper Keeper" notebooks with the Hee Haw logo on one side and the cast on the other. Hmmm..one could go to school with Hee Haw LOL

Oh they also sold Hee Haw Boxer Shorts complete with a picture of Roy Clark and Buck Owens on the back. Good way for someone to "sit" on Roy & Buck ;D.

Now would anyone admit they would wear such a thing? I seriously doubt it.

 

[bpatrick]

When did "Hee Haw" cease first-run production?

1993 according to Brooks and Marsh.

ixnay

"Hee Haw" made a major mistake in 1991, firing practically the entire cast, then moving the show out of the cornfield and into the setting of an intimate club, with a new group of unknowns who mostly sang. That was designed to attract a more urban audience, but it just wasn't "Hee Haw" (imagine Lawrence Welk as host of "Shindig" and you'll see what I mean).

Someone mentioned watching "Hee Haw" even though he or she lived in a suburb of Philadelphia. No need to apologize or feel guilty. I'm reminded of a story longtime New York Daily News radio-TV columnist Ben Gross told in his book "I Looked And I Listened" (1954, updated 1969); he had interviewed the man who started the "Greenwich Village Barn Dance" on local New York radio in the '30s and commented that it seemed improbable that such a show would do well in supposedly-sophisticated New York. The man answered, "Don't you get it? This is still the biggest hick town in the world!" Not to imply that the Philadelphia resident is a "hick" (I don't even like the word), but country music does have a following in places you wouldn't expect--like New York--and always has.

 

[Skynet74]

I wish CBS would have stuck with Gilligan's Island for longer than three years. That may have been their great 60's mistake.

 

[pabsungenis]

It's not surprising that "Petticoat" was the first of the "rural" comedies to go. There was no way it could have long survived the death of Bea Benaderet.

And the reason for the "Captain Kangaroo Curse" is simply that CBS was so successful (comparatively) against "Today" and "GMA" because it counter-programmed them with the Captain instead of going head to head. If they had kept the Captain or developed a new kids' show to replace him with as he grew stale, they might still have a niche in the morning.

 

[firepoint525]

"Hee Haw" made a major mistake in 1991, firing practically the entire cast, then moving the show out of the cornfield and into the setting of an intimate club, with a new group of unknowns who mostly sang. That was designed to attract a more urban audience, but it just wasn't "Hee Haw" (imagine Lawrence Welk as host of "Shindig" and you'll see what I mean).

Kinda reminds me of when Solid Gold made similar changes, in what proved to be its last year on the air. They changed it to Solid Gold in Concert, which may have been in response to all the criticism of lip-synching on the show, but apparently the show was never the same after that. I don't think any of my local affiliates even carried it that last season! :'(

 

[FreddyE1977]

Let me see if I've got this straight. You are still angry at CBS for canceling Green Acres.

Do not underestimate how many of us out here in flyover country are still furious with
CBS for canceling Green Acres!

 

[CKLW fan]

Does anyone know of a really good pig lawyer?

Let me see if I've got this straight. You are still angry at CBS for canceling Green Acres.

Do not underestimate how many of us out here in flyover country are still furious with
CBS for canceling Green Acres!

"Green Acres" was an incredibly funny and intelligent series. I always thought that its writers must've been high at the time. It was the 1960s' version of "Arrested Development"...both series had a relatively sane central character surrounded by the certifiably insane. I can look back and proudly claim to be a Green Acres fan. It would take more than a gun to my head for me to say the same about any of today's reality shows.

 

[imhomerjay]

"Hee Haw" made a major mistake in 1991, firing practically the entire cast, then moving the show out of the cornfield and into the setting of an intimate club, with a new group of unknowns who mostly sang. That was designed to attract a more urban audience, but it just wasn't "Hee Haw" (imagine Lawrence Welk as host of "Shindig" and you'll see what I mean).

Someone mentioned watching "Hee Haw" even though he or she lived in a suburb of Philadelphia. No need to apologize or feel guilty. I'm reminded of a story longtime New York Daily News radio-TV columnist Ben Gross told in his book "I Looked And I Listened" (1954, updated 1969); he had interviewed the man who started the "Greenwich Village Barn Dance" on local New York radio in the '30s and commented that it seemed improbable that such a show would do well in supposedly-sophisticated New York. The man answered, "Don't you get it? This is still the biggest hick town in the world!" Not to imply that the Philadelphia resident is a "hick" (I don't even like the word), but country music does have a following in places you wouldn't expect--like New York--and always has.

But would not changing the format have yielded significantly different results? So often people point to a change made late in a series' life as if it's evidence the change killed the show, while choosing to ignore the reason a change was made in the first place: the show was fading anyway. It's a bit like being told by the doctor that if you do nothing, you're guaranteed to die, but if you attempt a treatment plan, there's no guarantee that will change, but there are better odds than the alternative.

Let's be honest: most people in any commercial business are in it to make money, and they don't radically change something that's still bringing in the green just for the heck of it (exceptions duly noted, and even some of those are calculated gambles because of potentially better payout by shifting strategy).

 

[LKellerIII]

Let me see if I've got this straight. You are still angry at CBS for canceling Green Acres.

Do not underestimate how many of us out here in flyover country are still furious with
CBS for canceling Green Acres!

It must be hard to remain angry about anything for 38 years. Go outside and kick some cow-pies around, or something.

;D Just kidding...really...

 

[oldiesfan6479]

I wish CBS would have stuck with Gilligan's Island for longer than three years. That may have been their great 60's mistake.

Bill Paley--at his wife Babe's urging (she was a fan of Gunsmoke)--overruled
the network president and renewed the tentatively canceled western. As its
incumbent Saturday 10/9 slot was already spoken for, Gunsmoke was moved
to Monday at 7:30/6:30, resulting in Gilligan's demise.

Now the unresolved question is--what other half-hour show also got a late ax
in order to open up an hour's worth of airtime? Somehow I don't think it was
Mr. Terrific that was going to be renewed. Anyone? Bueller? bpatrick?

 

[mleach]

Someone mentioned watching "Hee Haw" even though he or she lived in a suburb of Philadelphia. No need to apologize or feel guilty. I'm reminded of a story longtime New York Daily News radio-TV columnist Ben Gross told in his book "I Looked And I Listened" (1954, updated 1969); he had interviewed the man who started the "Greenwich Village Barn Dance" on local New York radio in the '30s and commented that it seemed improbable that such a show would do well in supposedly-sophisticated New York. The man answered, "Don't you get it? This is still the biggest hick town in the world!" Not to imply that the Philadelphia resident is a "hick" (I don't even like the word), but country music does have a following in places you wouldn't expect--like New York--and always has.

It is true that country music does have its fans in places where one doesn't expect like NYC or Philadelphia..even London and can't forget LA where even the famous KHJ radio, even they got into country music at one time. However none-the-less for the most part its the fans in the more rural areas that tend to be "way" into country music so much so its a way of life. And those folks are more forgiving like the fans who continued over the years to buy tickets to see George Jones in concert despite his reputation of being a no show..at his own concerts. had George Jones pulled a stunt like that say in NYC, fans wouldn't be as forgiving as they would have been say in West Virginia. I think it was NYC's big country music station in the past, the old WHN-AM where the PD once said "..we are not a country music radio station..but rather a radio station that just happens to play country music".

 

[LKellerIII]

Someone mentioned watching "Hee Haw" even though he or she lived in a suburb of Philadelphia. No need to apologize or feel guilty. I'm reminded of a story longtime New York Daily News radio-TV columnist Ben Gross told in his book "I Looked And I Listened" (1954, updated 1969); he had interviewed the man who started the "Greenwich Village Barn Dance" on local New York radio in the '30s and commented that it seemed improbable that such a show would do well in supposedly-sophisticated New York. The man answered, "Don't you get it? This is still the biggest hick town in the world!" Not to imply that the Philadelphia resident is a "hick" (I don't even like the word), but country music does have a following in places you wouldn't expect--like New York--and always has.

It is true that country music does have its fans in places where one doesn't expect like NYC or Philadelphia..even London and can't forget LA where even the famous KHJ radio, even they got into country music at one time. However none-the-less for the most part its the fans in the more rural areas that tend to be "way" into country music so much so its a way of life. And those folks are more forgiving like the fans who continued over the years to buy tickets to see George Jones in concert despite his reputation of being a no show..at his own concerts. had George Jones pulled a stunt like that say in NYC, fans wouldn't be as forgiving as they would have been say in West Virginia. I think it was NYC's big country music station in the past, the old WHN-AM where the PD once said "..we are not a country music radio station..but rather a radio station that just happens to play country music".

Country music was popular in LA from just post World War II thru the 1970s, at least. In the 50s, there was KXLA/1110 - home to disc jockeys Cal Worthington (later the famous TV car dealer) and Tennessee Ernie Ford. There was KFOX and KBBQ (Yes - "K-Barbecue") in the 1960s. Indeed, KHJ tried it for awhile once it was clear that Top 40 had moved to FM. But the biggest country station in LA was probably KLAC (Metromedia) in the 1970s.

Even in "hip liberal" San Francisco, KNEW (also Metromedia) had a popular country format in the 70s and early 80s. Former hippie underground FM station KSAN (sister station to KNEW) became a popular country station in the 1980s for a number of years.

Country is hardly just a rural format.

 

[onairb]

I wish CBS would have stuck with Gilligan's Island for longer than three years. That may have been their great 60's mistake.

Somewhere on a site called tvseriesfinale.com, in the 'Gilligan's Island' section, is a writeup on the never-realized fourth season of the show...which would have been its last, and ended with the castaways getting rescued(it doesn't go into details of how, or whether they'd have just gotten stuck again, like in the 'Rescue from Gilligan's Island' TV movie.) Interestingly, Tina Louise was to have been written out of the show in the second episode(something about being hurt or knocked out while swimming in the lagoon, being carried out to sea, and rescued by an ocean liner...which, naturally, couldn't rescue anybody else!) In the next episode, Ginger was to have been replaced by two women, who fell off yet another cruise ship.

 

[mleach]

Country is hardly just a rural format.

That is very true even though when I worked in country radio ( in Virginia back in the mid 90s ) for some reason to me it did seem the format was "different" when I heard stations and airchecks from markets that wasn't exactly known as "country friendly". Not so much in terms of the music but rather to me it seemed that the jocks at those stations weren't really taking the format quite so seriously. For example when Ty Herndon was busted for drugs and asking a male police officer for sex back in 1994 (?), we were not allowed to say anything about that on the air at all since according to my PD at the time "Ty is big here and we can't upset his fans" and it was more/less the same with the other country stations around Virginia too. YET at the same time I was listening to an aircheck of the country station out of Boston and they were making jokes about Ty right on the air. Very similiar to the bizarre rumors about Tracy Lawrence that were going around earlier this year where Tracy Lawrence had "changed" his name to "Matt Taggert" and is now doing X-rated movies. Denver's country station KYGO-FM went bananas on the air about that one while in my hometown where Clear Channel owns the local country station, I was told that CC actually had sent out a memo warning their employees that if they would "talk" about this rumor...well kiss your job goodbye. Guess this is another example of what is OK in one market but not in another.

But you are right that country hardly being a rural format just as the case wwith Hee Haw...where in Pittsburgh one of their local stations for a time had aired that show in PRIMETIME, even dropping what the network was airing and Pittsburgh isn't known as a "country" town.

 

[firepoint525]

Even in "hip liberal" San Francisco, KNEW (also Metromedia) had a popular country format in the 70s and early 80s. Former hippie underground FM station KSAN (sister station to KNEW) became a popular country station in the 1980s for a number of years.

Country is hardly just a rural format.

Who KNEW? ;D

 

[firepoint525]

I wish CBS would have stuck with Gilligan's Island for longer than three years. That may have been their great 60's mistake.

Somewhere on a site called tvseriesfinale.com, in the 'Gilligan's Island' section, is a writeup on the never-realized fourth season of the show...which would have been its last, and ended with the castaways getting rescued(it doesn't go into details of how, or whether they'd have just gotten stuck again, like in the 'Rescue from Gilligan's Island' TV movie.) Interestingly, Tina Louise was to have been written out of the show in the second episode(something about being hurt or knocked out while swimming in the lagoon, being carried out to sea, and rescued by an ocean liner...which, naturally, couldn't rescue anybody else!) In the next episode, Ginger was to have been replaced by two women, who fell off yet another cruise ship.

It always amazed me how, with the number of "visitors" they had on the island, that no one in "civilization" ever found out about them! ;D Maybe the castaways were so "wacky" that no "visitor" to the island ever wanted to be associated with them! Of course, if they were ever "rescued," the show would have been over with, anyway.

 

[stdjsb25]

Had ABC got Rather...wonder what would have happened to Frank Reynolds who was the main anchor for ABC at the time?

I don't think ABC would have gotten Reynolds out of the chair. I think Rather would have more than likely replaced Max Robinson, who was known for his issues with ABC at the time.

Then again, it would have probably led to an interesting fight between Rather and Peter Jennings for the main anchor chair upon Reynolds' death in 83.

 

[bpatrick]

Country is hardly just a rural format.

That is very true even though when I worked in country radio ( in Virginia back in the mid 90s ) for some reason to me it did seem the format was "different" when I heard stations and airchecks from markets that wasn't exactly known as "country friendly". Not so much in terms of the music but rather to me it seemed that the jocks at those stations weren't really taking the format quite so seriously. For example when Ty Herndon was busted for drugs and asking a male police officer for sex back in 1994 (?), we were not allowed to say anything about that on the air at all since according to my PD at the time "Ty is big here and we can't upset his fans" and it was more/less the same with the other country stations around Virginia too. YET at the same time I was listening to an aircheck of the country station out of Boston and they were making jokes about Ty right on the air. Very similiar to the bizarre rumors about Tracy Lawrence that were going around earlier this year where Tracy Lawrence had "changed" his name to "Matt Taggert" and is now doing X-rated movies. Denver's country station KYGO-FM went bananas on the air about that one while in my hometown where Clear Channel owns the local country station, I was told that CC actually had sent out a memo warning their employees that if they would "talk" about this rumor...well kiss your job goodbye. Guess this is another example of what is OK in one market but not in another.

But you are right that country hardly being a rural format just as the case wwith Hee Haw...where in Pittsburgh one of their local stations for a time had aired that show in PRIMETIME, even dropping what the network was airing and Pittsburgh isn't known as a "country" town.

I remember that at one point KDKA carried "Hee Haw" Saturdays at 7.
Somehow that doesn't square with the image Westinghouse tried to
project, but it must have worked. Likewise, sister station WJZ Baltimore
carried Lawrence Welk on Sunday afternoons.

From what I've read, country music began making inroads in LA as people
from the South--and, in particular, the Southwest--moved out there to
work in defense plants during World War II and took the music with them.
In fact, there's a story (I won't vouch for the accuracy) that the Japanese
liked to lure American troops into combat by screaming, "To **** with Roy
Acuff!" Definitely Spade Cooley and Tennessee Ernie (as Mr. Ford was known
in those days) were big on early LA TV.

 

[PhDance]

Back to the original post in this thread; I believe the entire argument is predicated on "rural shows=ratings", yet judging from Earl's rapid decline and subsequent cancellation (which is on "big city" NBC), I'm not so sure I agree. There are plenty of shows that I like that America doesn't like, but I won't start up a thread suggesting that XXX network "BLEW IT" because they don't play what America doesn't want to watch! Those types of shows are victims of the ages; do people really live like Green Acres any more? I'm writing from a location about as deep south as you can get, yet we have a downtown area where people from all kinds of rural areas go. Wouldn't you know- there are nightclubs, lounges, and tall buildings too. Even if those types of living conditions exist, they are only a stone throw's distance away from a more vibrant downtown area. Plus, do you realize how many more people live in big cities? That is what advertisers care about. A station isn't goint to thrive depending on ad buys featuring the latest "Grits and Gravy" special at the Hogly Wogly. Shows like Green Acres are a novelty and will continue to exist to serve a very small niche market of America. So, fear not, dvd volumes of your favorite rural shows will continue to be produced.

 

[bpatrick]

Living in the South myself, I've seen how
Raleigh/Durham/Chapel Hill, Charlotte, Atlanta,
and even Birmingham have changed over the
years since I was a kid and shows like "Green
Acres" dominated the ratings. My students,
most of whom are native-born, watch shows
like "Family Guy" and "Seinfeld" (in reruns), neither
of which could be considered rural by any stretch.
The country has really become more homogenized
since the '60s, in part because of the influx of people
from the North to our part of the country, in part
because young people find jobs in the urban areas.

But we still get Andy Griffith every day at 5:30.
Go figure.