Which is the bigger "tune out" factor?

[PirateJohnny]

In another post in another section I was heading towards this question and I thought I would post it here instead. What causes more tune outs - hearing a "stiff" once or hearing the same hit three times in one week?

As a follow-up - what era and how many songs would make a good library? I have personally set up 1964 (Beatles) to 1975 (Disco) as one playlist in my own iTunes library. I was born in 1957 and graduated high school in 1975, btw. That means I'm 55 now and not high on advertisers' want list.

 

[landtuna]

Mine runs from the end of the Doo Wop era (mid-50's) through the early 80's.

Some Doo Wop, Be Bop, early 60's (without most of the girl groups, some Beatles, 60's psycho rock and folk rock as well as pop, lots of 70's (hardly any Disco) up through '84 or so. No metal, grunge, very few hair bands, no bubble gum but a couple of favorite novelty songs.

I also have some Big Band, some Country (hardly any crossovers though), a bit of New Age, and some Easy Listening.

If I had to pick just one decade to play it would be the 70's pre-disco.

I don't have too many "stiffs" that force me to hit the pre-set but most Motown has that effect.

 

[oldies76]

In another post in another section I was heading towards this question and I thought I would post it here instead. What causes more tune outs - hearing a "stiff" once or hearing the same hit three times in one week?

Hearing the same ole, daily! Whether 3x a day, or 5 times a week, to me that's a tune out.

Hearing a "stiff" every so often mixed with the tested music will do no harm, as some claim otherwise.

Every song is someone's favorite.

 

[EZway2go]

The bigger tune out for me, by far, is hearing the same hit 3 times. About 10 years ago we had one of those Sunny-type stations and I swear, every time I had it on, I would hear that Taste of Honey song, "Boogie Oogie Oogie." Then one day I heard it twice, once in the morning and again in the afternoon. That was the final straw; I stopped listening altogether.

On the other hand, I was on vacation in Myrtle Beach in the '90s when I was scanning different stations with my Walkman. I stumbled upon "Softly Whispering I Love You" by the English Congregation which immediately caused me to stop on that station. I thought to myself, for them to play a song like that, I'd have to hear what other goodies they might have out of the vault. Naturally, that was the station I stuck with the rest of the vacation. I even remember it was on 94.5 but it's long gone; it's now a talk station.

 

[PirateJohnny]

Mine runs from the end of the Doo Wop era (mid-50's) through the early 80's.

Some Doo Wop, Be Bop, early 60's (without most of the girl groups, some Beatles, 60's psycho rock and folk rock as well as pop, lots of 70's (hardly any Disco) up through '84 or so. No metal, grunge, very few hair bands, no bubble gum but a couple of favorite novelty songs.

I also have some Big Band, some Country (hardly any crossovers though), a bit of New Age, and some Easy Listening.

If I had to pick just one decade to play it would be the 70's pre-disco.

I don't have too many "stiffs" that force me to hit the pre-set but most Motown has that effect.

I was thinking and not typing too clearly. I meant radio station library. But, hey, it's interesting to see (hear) what others in the biz listen to when no one is paying attention. Landtuna, you library is very similar to mine. I also set up playlists for 55 to 63 and 76-87. I've gotten into the Blues as I study the roots of the Rock and Roll I like so much. I even went to Clarksdale, Mississippi this summer and stood at THE Crossroads at midnight.

Now, back to our regularly scheduled thread.

 

[johnbasalla]

The big tune-out for me is to hear the same-old, same-old monster hit that I, at best, only kind-of liked when it was new. I really enjoy hearing the "Oh-Wow!" songs. That's one of the reasons that, living up here near Cleveland Ohio, I tune in to "Zoomer Radio", AM740 out of Toronto Canada. A pretty good number of "Oh Wow" tunes for me. Over the past couple of days, I heard two watered down versions of a couple of hits, but it was still very refreshing. They played "Lucky Lips" by Cliff Richards (a huge star in the U.K.). The original was a catchy Rock/R&B piece by Ruth Brown. The other was an early 1970s version of "Poor Little Fool" by Frank Mills (original by Ricky Nelson in the late 1950s). Frank is from Canada, and to be honest, the Canadian content rule indirectly helps them pick interesting records for us Stateside. You'll also find that Burton Cummings stood tall in Canada with more hits besides "Stand Tall". Edward Bear may have hit first with "Last Song", but unlike in the U.S. it wasn't their first and last big hit.

 

[firepoint525]

Every time I go somewhere for a haircut, I usually strike up a conversation with the stylist about the music that they have playing over the radio there. It's a great conversation starter, but usually they will eventually complain that they are hearing the same songs, at the same time of day, every day. They listen for so long every day (or maybe they are forced to) that they start picking up patterns in what the station plays every day. In other words, if they hear "A," they know that they will soon hear "B," etc. Of course, I NEVER tell them that I am a former radio guy myself!

It's important to get the opinions of those OUTSIDE of radio, and for the most part, you WON'T get that here. We are all (for the most part) radio veterans, or at least, die-hard listeners. I just needed to say that before David Eduardo weighed in!

 

[michael hagerty]

Every song is someone's favorite.

I doubt that very much, but let's say it's right. If that person isn't listening to your station when you play it, you're toast.

The goal is to play songs that are everyone's favorites...not someone's. It's a numbers game.

 

[oldies76]

I doubt that very much, but let's say it's right. If that person isn't listening to your station when you play it, you're toast.

The goal is to play songs that are everyone's favorites...not someone's. It's a numbers game.

Well, a few may tune out, but to others, it will come across as an "oh wow!" factor and will listen to a song that they have not heard in years and will become curious (as most humans do) and stay hooked to your station a tad longer to hear, what other gems might come across.

 

[HCochet]

Some of the reasons I change stations are

1: annoying ads such as "Kars 4 kids".
2: When I hear that Lloyd Lindsey Young is about to come on. I don't want to hear him yell "Hellooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo", so it's good-bye to that station.
3: in the car (when I used to listen to music stations), I had several different ones programmed and I'd change the station a few dozen times when certain songs came on.
4: talk shows when you don't like the topic.

The most notable tune out I've done is I don't listen to KGO as much now since they changed in Dec 2011. I cut them by about 95%. But they don't care because I turned 50 that December and I don't count.

 

[EZway2go]

The big tune-out for me is to hear the same-old, same-old monster hit that I, at best, only kind-of liked when it was new. I really enjoy hearing the "Oh-Wow!" songs. That's one of the reasons that, living up here near Cleveland Ohio, I tune in to "Zoomer Radio", AM740 out of Toronto Canada. A pretty good number of "Oh Wow" tunes for me. Over the past couple of days, I heard two watered down versions of a couple of hits, but it was still very refreshing. They played "Lucky Lips" by Cliff Richards (a huge star in the U.K.). The original was a catchy Rock/R&B piece by Ruth Brown. The other was an early 1970s version of "Poor Little Fool" by Frank Mills (original by Ricky Nelson in the late 1950s). Frank is from Canada, and to be honest, the Canadian content rule indirectly helps them pick interesting records for us Stateside. You'll also find that Burton Cummings stood tall in Canada with more hits besides "Stand Tall". Edward Bear may have hit first with "Last Song", but unlike in the U.S. it wasn't their first and last big hit.

You're right about AM740 in Toronto. Going back to their CHWO days, the nighttime signal was clearly audible in southern NJ. You're also right about that Canadian content rule, which explains why that's the only station I ever heard "Love Me, Love Me, Love" by Frank Mills these many years after its original run in the early '70s. I also discovered for the first time a catchy little number from the '60s by Canadian artist Bobby Curtola called "Johnny Take Your Time."

 

[michael hagerty]

I doubt that very much, but let's say it's right. If that person isn't listening to your station when you play it, you're toast.

The goal is to play songs that are everyone's favorites...not someone's. It's a numbers game.

Well, a few may tune out, but to others, it will come across as an "oh wow!" factor and will listen to a song that they have not heard in years and will become curious (as most humans do) and stay hooked to your station a tad longer to hear, what other gems might come across.

And if those few who tune out happen to be PPM participants and those who don't aren't, you've gained nothing and lost significant share in the ratings, which will affect your revenue and ultimately your ability to stay in format and possibly on air.

 

[PirateJohnny]

...You're also right about that Canadian content rule, which explains why that's the only station I ever heard "Love Me, Love Me, Love" by Frank Mills these many years after its original run in the early '70s...

WOW! One more I need to track down for my library. That was a favorite back in the day.

 

[firepoint525]

I doubt that very much, but let's say it's right. If that person isn't listening to your station when you play it, you're toast.The goal is to play songs that are everyone's favorites...not someone's. It's a numbers game.

Well, a few may tune out, but to others, it will come across as an "oh wow!" factor and will listen to a song that they have not heard in years and will become curious (as most humans do) and stay hooked to your station a tad longer to hear, what other gems might come across.

And if those few who tune out happen to be PPM participants and those who don't aren't, you've gained nothing and lost significant share in the ratings, which will affect your revenue and ultimately your ability to stay in format and possibly on air.

Then WE need to become PPM participants. How do we go about doing that? After all, you said earlier that the goal is to play everyone's favorites, not just someone's. If we are catering to just PPM'ers, then we are catering to just a select few, and not to the masses. WE need to become PPM'ers, so that we can blunt their effect on radio.

 

[oldies76]

After all, you said earlier that the goal is to play everyone's favorites, not just someone's. If we are catering to just PPM'ers, then we are catering to just a select few, and not to the masses. WE need to become PPM'ers, so that we can blunt their effect on radio.

Funny, similiar thread going on.....check out the San Francisco board, "Do You Really Care About Radio" David Eduardo, Michael Haggerty and the BigA are having their say about playing untested "hits" on classic hits radio. An endless debate, it seems.

As for the PPM participation, not a bad idea......

 

[michael hagerty]

After all, you said earlier that the goal is to play everyone's favorites, not just someone's. If we are catering to just PPM'ers, then we are catering to just a select few, and not to the masses. WE need to become PPM'ers, so that we can blunt their effect on radio.

Funny, similiar thread going on.....check out the San Francisco board, "Do You Really Care About Radio" David Eduardo, Michael Haggerty and the BigA are having their say about playing untested "hits" on classic hits radio. An endless debate, it seems.

As for the PPM participation, not a bad idea......

It's a similar thread because the original poster spun this one off from that one.

As for PPM participation, all you have to do is say yes when Arbitron asks you. There's no way to get on a list. They just have to call you. Oh, and there's a pre-interview to make sure that your listening habits aren't so far out of the mainstream that your listening isn't representative of several thousand other listeners.

That's because, in a metro market of 5 million people, there are fewer than 500 PPM participants chosen.

Good luck.

 

[oldies76]

That's because, in a metro market of 5 million people, there are fewer than 500 PPM participants chosen.

Good luck.

Which in no way possible, can this "group" represent the other 4,999,500 in music tastes for classic hits stations. I just don't see the possibilities here. Everyone has their own favorites oldies.

Even if only 500,000 listened to classic hits, that's only .001% representation for music tests.

 

[michael hagerty]

That's because, in a metro market of 5 million people, there are fewer than 500 PPM participants chosen.

Good luck.

Which in no way possible, can this "group" represent the other 4,999,500 in music tastes for classic hits stations. I just don't see the possibilities here. Everyone has their own favorites oldies.

Even if only 500,000 listened to classic hits, that's only .001% representation for music tests.

This reads as though you may be confusing PPM participants, upon whose data Arbitron bases ratings, with participants in music testing. They are (barring a huge coincidence) completely separate groups of people.

 

[oldies76]

This reads as though you may be confusing PPM participants, upon whose data Arbitron bases ratings, with participants in music testing. They are (barring a huge coincidence) completely separate groups of people.

I must have misinterpreted Firepoint's post about us taking part in PPM surveys.

 

[michael hagerty]

After all, you said earlier that the goal is to play everyone's favorites, not just someone's. If we are catering to just PPM'ers, then we are catering to just a select few, and not to the masses. WE need to become PPM'ers, so that we can blunt their effect on radio.

I may not have been clear. By playing "everyone's" favorites, what I meant was playing the songs the greatest number of people have in common as favorites. For example, let's say 85% of the people who listen to KXXX like Fleetwood Mac's "Dreams". That's a song you should be playing. But let's say 15% count Ike and Tina Turner's "River Deep-Mountain High" as a favorite. You take a huge risk if you play that and are better off trying to find another song the Ike & Tina fans have in common with the Fleetwood Mac fans.

That's what music testing does...assembles a cross-section of the audience you want to attract to your station (age, sex, income level, ethnicity) and determines what songs the greatest number of them have in common as favorites, and what songs the majority will tolerate (not tune out).

After that, it becomes about negative reactions...songs that people do tune out over...every song has some negatives...when they hit a certain level, though, it becomes difficult to justify playing it.