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Why are there 2 50000 watt CHR stations in CT
- Thread starter nd2023
- Start date
B
bigmax
Guest
b/c they were owned by separate companies up until clear channel purchased amfm (the hartford stations) in 2000. both bring in enough revenue to warrant keeping them around as is; evident by the fact that clear channel chose not to sell the new haven cluster when they divested themselves of over 400 radio stations in markets ranked over 100. it all may change when the clear channel deal with bain goes through in december or january...
on a side note - their playlists lately have been pretty different, with kc101 opting for the pop/rock hits from maroon 5, matchbox 20, colby calliet, etc and kiss going for urban/rythmic tracks from mims, yung berg, plies, etc.
on a side note - their playlists lately have been pretty different, with kc101 opting for the pop/rock hits from maroon 5, matchbox 20, colby calliet, etc and kiss going for urban/rythmic tracks from mims, yung berg, plies, etc.
Are they both 50,000 W? I'm not so sure about that. Their playlist have always differed to varying degrees and both pretty well focused on their respective markets. They are by no means interchangeable. For my money, KC 101 is far superior with a much more varied playlist.
BTW, has anyone noticed how bad the Kiss audio sounds lately? Seems very flat to me. Have they completely given up on what was once a great station?
BTW, has anyone noticed how bad the Kiss audio sounds lately? Seems very flat to me. Have they completely given up on what was once a great station?
Nick said:
Not from where the corporate guys are sitting. KC-101 is a New Haven market station for which CC sells advertising in that market and serves that market's listeners. Any listeners they get in Hartford or Long Island are gravy - KC-101 does not really "serve" either market.
Likewise Kiss is a Hartford market station that sells advertising to Hartford market clients and serves Hartford market listeners. Any listeners that they get in New Haven or Springfield are gravy - Kiss doesn't "serve" either market.
Listen to the local ads on each station and you'll see what I mean. And, it has always been true - even when neither station was in Clear Channel's corporate orbit. KC-101 rarely (if ever) ran local ads for Hartford area businesses - unless those businesses ran ads on a regional basis. Stephen's World of Wheels comes to mind - back in the old days when they were one of the only multi-brand dealerships in the region. They advertised in Hartford, Springfield, New Haven and even Danbury's I-95. But they were a rarity.
And, how many ads do you hear on Kiss for businesses in North Haven or Milford? Not many.
Granted, they are geographically close together. But, just because you can get both stations does not mean that they target the same markets. They do not. Both have been sustainable in their respective markets for 20+ years. It's all about the business side.
So, you wanted to know why and that's why.
U
unreal256
Guest
Nick said:
let me throw my two cents in here...
Both Kiss 95.7 and KC 101 are in really bad positions right now. Both stations are doing really bad. I'm not sure if you've listened to Kiss recently but it sounds like garbage. They didn't dip as much as everyone thought they were going to dip this past ratings period but sometimes dramatic changes take a few books to show up. Kiss just sounds bad period. They have a mid day on air peersonality who is the PD and goes by Justin Sane and somehow someone at allaccess is in bed with Stan Priest because everytime they "suspend" Justin Sane, it makes the top of the news. The morning show on Kiss is really bad, Munchie and Skillet are Stan Priests' boys, they are part of the "regime." Need I say more about Kiss. They could blow up Kiss at any minute into anything Clear Channel wants because Clear Channel doesnt care. Whatever is going to make them more money at the end of the day, they'll do. As far as KC 101 goes, they are in some serious trouble over there. The ratings have continued to fall for them and they have not had a great book in some time now. I don't know about you but ratings are what the advertizers look at it, and if there is no ratings, there's no advertizers which means no money which means no jobs which means change of format or sceneary. What a lot of people forget is that Clear Channel doesnt care about how legendary or great Kiss or KC 101 ONCE were. If they suck, there will be changes. The morning show at KC 101 is really bad, the mid slot I thought was Jagger who is now at WKTU in New York but I checked out KC 101's website and they took Jagger down and added someone new named Ryan Smart who I am not sure who that is. Not quite sure what happened to Jagger, again, think what you want about him, the fact is that he works in the #1 market in the country. So maybe, he left on his own accord. Trey is a pretty good jock in the afternoon and does a solid shift whenever I've tuned in. The night show, not sure whats going on there, no one is listed on the website. I was just looking at the KC 101 ratings on allaccess.com which are just the basic 12 plus numbers, because those of us that arent in the know, cant get ahold of the actual demo numbers. The 12 plus numbers I didnt realize were that bad. In their own market, Kiss beat them. That never use to be the case. Kiss never use to show up that much in the New Haven book. Kiss showed up with a 4.1 12+. KC 101 had a 3.7, which was down from a 5.1 the previous spring. If my calculations are correct, the big legendary 50 thousand watt KC 101 is tied for 9th in their own market. We're not talking 9th place in LA where it's actually a good thing to come in 9th, we're talking 9th place in market #109 New Haven. In fact, WELI the AM talker in the same building as KC 101 in the Fall actually beat KC 101 in the 12+ ratings. Thats embarrassing. WELI almost beat them again in the Spring which is always KC 101's best book. WELI showed up with a 3.4. Just .3 shares lower than KCI. Something obviously is not right with KC 101. I'm surprised something "major" hasnt gone down over in New Haven. Not to mention, if you tune in KC 101, the quality is not up there with some of the other stations in and around Hartford and New Haven. It's very plain. Kiss is not far behind with it's own troubles... Moral of the story is that they may not be competing with each other too much longer.
For what its worth, the last New Haven book seems to be heavily weighted toward the northern half of the New Haven market. Places where Hartford stations do well (Meriden, Cheshire, etc.). When compared with past performance, every one of the New Haven and Fairfield County stations did poorly in that book and several Hartford ones did very well. Both Hartford and New Haven are relatively small markets (geographically), so any inconsistency in the geographic makeup of the ratings survey is magnified.
You can't take too much away from 12+ ratings in that one book, which is what you're trying to do. How are they doing in the demos? THAT is the key question.
About the signal overlap, it really doesn't matter as much as you think. Each station still targets their home market and each one "sells" to advertisers in their respective home markets. As far as Clear Channel is concerned, the two stations might as well be 100 miles apart as neither has the ability to put a local grade signal over the entirety of the other's market. Or, put more specifically, KC-101 doesn't have enough signal over the entire Hartford market (the larger of the two) to be worth trying to rimshot Hartford (and pretty much ignore New Haven) with an alternate format. They can make a lot more money targeting New Haven - which is lucrative enough for CC.
Also, KC-101 competes in a different environment than does Kiss, so you can't just lump them together. KC-101 has to deal with the fairly strong hip hop signals that enter the market from Hartford, Long Island and New York - and with a very popular local urban/AC station (WYBC). The music and imaging have to lie between all of those. Kiss doesn't even think about that - they only need to concentrate on what WZMX, WPHH and (on the other extreme) WTIC-Fm are doing. This is why they sound somewhat different.
Kiss could target either market, but goes for Hartford because it is much bigger. No one targets the New Haven market from West Peak because they can target Hartford, where there is more money to be made.
In the end, with Kiss and KC-101, CC ends up cornering the CHR format (generally young females 18-34) in both markets with heritage signals. It's as simple as that. Frankly, there aren't many format openings left to flip either one to something else. If they're having issues it is because they are not running things well enough internally. That's what they need to work on.
Don't confuse radio (where Hartford and New Haven are separate markets) with TV (where they are one market).
You can't take too much away from 12+ ratings in that one book, which is what you're trying to do. How are they doing in the demos? THAT is the key question.
About the signal overlap, it really doesn't matter as much as you think. Each station still targets their home market and each one "sells" to advertisers in their respective home markets. As far as Clear Channel is concerned, the two stations might as well be 100 miles apart as neither has the ability to put a local grade signal over the entirety of the other's market. Or, put more specifically, KC-101 doesn't have enough signal over the entire Hartford market (the larger of the two) to be worth trying to rimshot Hartford (and pretty much ignore New Haven) with an alternate format. They can make a lot more money targeting New Haven - which is lucrative enough for CC.
Also, KC-101 competes in a different environment than does Kiss, so you can't just lump them together. KC-101 has to deal with the fairly strong hip hop signals that enter the market from Hartford, Long Island and New York - and with a very popular local urban/AC station (WYBC). The music and imaging have to lie between all of those. Kiss doesn't even think about that - they only need to concentrate on what WZMX, WPHH and (on the other extreme) WTIC-Fm are doing. This is why they sound somewhat different.
Kiss could target either market, but goes for Hartford because it is much bigger. No one targets the New Haven market from West Peak because they can target Hartford, where there is more money to be made.
In the end, with Kiss and KC-101, CC ends up cornering the CHR format (generally young females 18-34) in both markets with heritage signals. It's as simple as that. Frankly, there aren't many format openings left to flip either one to something else. If they're having issues it is because they are not running things well enough internally. That's what they need to work on.
Don't confuse radio (where Hartford and New Haven are separate markets) with TV (where they are one market).
B
bigmax
Guest
Ryan Smart is Dangerboy, formally of Kiss 95.7. Nights is a guy named Brady.
New Haven does not have an AC station, so the options are WEBE, WEZN, WRCH and WALK. Maybe KC101 should go AC.
T
That Anonymous Nerd
Guest
quite frankly, I'm suprised Clear Channel hasn't blown peeps out from both KCI & KSS and just made one gigantic CHR in the state. You guys are right, why are they competing with themselves when they can take the best from both and make one great station.
Don't get me wrong. From a nostalgia standpoint, I'd be upset if that ever happend. But from a business standpoint, it makes sense. ???
Don't get me wrong. From a nostalgia standpoint, I'd be upset if that ever happend. But from a business standpoint, it makes sense. ???
That Anonymous Nerd said:
Actually no... from a business standpoint, it makes no sense. Hartford and New Haven are completely seperate radio markets. Plus, neither station completely covers the state.
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