why aren't local artist on the radio no more?

[knowbetter]

I wonder if any of the LP pirate stations that do pretty well (and even have advertising) ever use consultants?

(Lest that be taken the wrong way, I should point out that I am definitely not "anti-consultant." A lot of the great, successful stations I hear in other markets owe much of their success to their consultants.)

I really can't answer that one, although most pirates I have come across do have prior knowledge of radio broadcasting, the most successful of them seem to understand radio well, they just want to serve a need they see as unfulfilled, and simply step in and fill it.

LPFM's are generally a different story, a lot of them are not radio people, they are non profits that have some other purpose, for the most part, and they see an opportunity to expand their influence somehow, be it religious, educational, political, some city or municipality, or what have you. These folks are generally not broadcasters, some do find some assistance, but that assistance is generally with people the of the same mindset they group had, which sometimes is a big limitation.

These folks would be better off to use a limited consultancy, not to tell them what to do, but to keep them from getting into trouble. I think a good consultant will give advice and expertise, but not dictate what the station should do, what it's philosophy should be, they should just be there explaining how to properly keep things going in the right direction. For example, I can't tell you all of the LPFM's that don't seem to understand it takes money to broadcast,and that money needs to be carefully raised. There are a whole lot of pitfalls with raising funds on LPFM's, and you really must understand what you are doing there.

There is also a major difference between a public station, here is Columbus, WOSU and WCBE, and LPFM's like WCRS and WCRX, in how they (should at least) operate, but I suspect if you ask them all, they will not necessarily agree.

Nu, I guess if I have one gripe about the whole LPFM process, it's that LPFM's can't go to small business groups owned by people with broadcast experience. I think this could add some better local programming, and spice to the radio dial, and allow opportunities for small businesses to grow, since we really know that it's difficult to even begin to think about getting into the radio business today.

Hell, a station programming all new local music could easily grow out of that!

 

[jakej]

Don't get me wrong, I love low power radio, I consult a few, and can honestly tell you that most don't realized the asset they have, and most of them feel they know everything...

Low-power FMs use consultants? Are you kidding me?? They should be ashamed of themselves!!!

I wonder why you say that, even though in your first statement, you confirmed that LPFM people know absolutely everything about what they think they are doing...

I'm sorry, knowbetter, I misunderstood, or at least partially misunderstood. I was thinking strictly about music consultants, which at least in my case and I would think in the majority of other show hosts' cases would be the LAST people they'd want their station's management to go to for advice. It's the pro music consultants who helped drive me and others into the world of LPFM in the first place!
The day that 'CRS tells me what to play because of a consultant's recommendations is the day that my show ends, and if you're interested I'll bet you a hundred dollars that such a directive never comes. My underwriters like "Yesterday's Top Secrets" just the way it is, and that's what's got to be most important to everyone back at headquarters. Well, that and having lots of listeners, which I know I've also got. One of my underwriters has been backing the show for ten months now on a monthly renewal basis, which adds up to a rather large sum of money -- and I don't think it's doing that just because it likes me.

 

[knowbetter]

I'm sorry, knowbetter, I misunderstood, or at least partially misunderstood. I was thinking strictly about music consultants, which at least in my case and I would think in the majority of other show hosts' cases would be the LAST people they'd want their station's management to go to for advice. It's the pro music consultants who helped drive me and others into the world of LPFM in the first place!
The day that 'CRS tells me what to play because of a consultant's recommendations is the day that my show ends, and if you're interested I'll bet you a hundred dollars that such a directive never comes. My underwriters like "Yesterday's Top Secrets" just the way it is, and that's what's got to be most important to everyone back at headquarters. Well, that and having lots of listeners, which I know I've also got. One of my underwriters has been backing the show for ten months now on a monthly renewal basis, which adds up to a rather large sum of money -- and I don't think it's doing that just because it likes me.

understood, and no, I wouldn't take that bet... I've listened to your show in the past, and like what you do...

 

[jakej]

Well thank you!

 

[masterdarke]

What ever happened to Local Stuff on The Blitz? Or whatever they call themselves these days.

 

[KevinFodor]

You would think though that with the technology to produce recordings by anyone with a computer and a little practice that there could be some kind of weekend show featuring local talent. But that might take local stations, locally owned and actually involved in the community.

You mean like WCRS? Then we've got it! And there ought to be a celebrating that it exists instead of a pretending that it doesn't.
I don't understand a lot of the moaning and groaning on this board. I say make the most of the station's existence, tell others about it, and use it to help bring down the people and the frequencies that you hate. That's what I'm doing.

Jake:

I totally stand by you as it regards your station offering an opportunity for local artists to get their music played on the air. That is, one of the things which a low-powered community radio station can do. And that does fall under the general category of serving the "public interest, convenience and necessity".

The only area I would chide you a bit about...is that radio, especially community radio, is supposed to be about just this type of programming. NOT about "bringing down the people and frequencies you hate." Because with 100 watts, I got news for you - you ain't gonna do it. But, you can provide a service that gives exposure to deserving local acts. And perhaps, if some of those acts start developing a buzz locally, you might be able to influence a playlist or two in town.

It's the people who try to program their LPFM stations as "anti-radio" who are, most often, the ones who fail. (Don't believe me? Look it up on the internet.) Take a more positive approach about what you're doing. Push your "unique selling prospect", as opposed to conducting a 24 hour hate campaign against stations who, frankly couldn't care less whether you're on the air or not. At best, you might pull a "zero point something" in the Arbitron's with your peanut power. BUT - that's not bad considering what you have. At least it would mean, you have measurable audience.

I am well aware from your posts you have a burr up your behind about status quo radio. And yes, you and I have some pretty measurable differences on programming philosophy. But, I am not going to criticize ideas such as these as it relates to an LP-FM. You're on a station at which you CAN experiment. Making a mistake will not cost WCRS millions of dollars, as it can with a commercial station. Now, go find a unique way to do something, get a decent audience with it and you might make a commercial station stand up and take notice.

Good luck.

okay could you tell something i can do to make what your telling me become a reailty!

Sorry, Datfireman, I've been out of touch for a couple of weeks (got a nasty virus on my computer here at home, but it's all good now)!

How can it be done? Realize the way commercial stations did it in the past. Yes, there was a day, probably long before some of you guys were born that Top 40 AM stations (and some early "progressive" FM stations), would now and then, add a song by a local artist. So what are you looking for?

For starters: you're all dead wrong if you take the approach that "we play anything that is submitted to us". It's a nice panacea...but, let's face reality. Some local CD's are great...others are only good for coasters. Learn to separate the good from the not-so.

Look for songs on locally produced CD's (or MP-3's) which are "ear-palatable". That's an old term out of the 1970's, but I suspect it would work today. If you can hear the song played on the radio along side what's topping the charts in a respective format today, you could be onto something. And this is true, whether the song is rock, rap, pop, country, whatever...(the formats are different, but the rules for all the formats are the same...)

Then...play it. Play it again. Play it a lot. Bring the artists in for an interview. Play it two or 3 more times.
Find out which songs from the local area your listeners like. Track CD sales on i-Tunes (if the song is available there), or in area music stores (where possible). Follow promising groups on their websites.
How 'bout come up with a "Columbus's Top 10" and do it as an hour long feature every week? WCRS could do just that.

How's that for a start?

 

[KevinFodor]

Don't get me wrong, I love low power radio, I consult a few, and can honestly tell you that most don't realized the asset they have, and most of them feel they know everything...

Low-power FMs use consultants? Are you kidding me?? They should be ashamed of themselves!!!

I wonder why you say that, even though in your first statement, you confirmed that LPFM people know absolutely everything about what they think they are doing...

I'm sorry, knowbetter, I misunderstood, or at least partially misunderstood. I was thinking strictly about music consultants, which at least in my case and I would think in the majority of other show hosts' cases would be the LAST people they'd want their station's management to go to for advice. It's the pro music consultants who helped drive me and others into the world of LPFM in the first place!
The day that 'CRS tells me what to play because of a consultant's recommendations is the day that my show ends, and if you're interested I'll bet you a hundred dollars that such a directive never comes. My underwriters like "Yesterday's Top Secrets" just the way it is, and that's what's got to be most important to everyone back at headquarters. Well, that and having lots of listeners, which I know I've also got. One of my underwriters has been backing the show for ten months now on a monthly renewal basis, which adds up to a rather large sum of money -- and I don't think it's doing that just because it likes me.

You know, Jake. There was a day when I thought all consultants were bad, too. Then, I met some good ones who didn't tell people specifically how to run their stations, or tell them what songs they had to add. They offered advice, they offered research information which they received from their clients around the country...and then, let the local programmer or programmer's make their own decisions. Sometimes they agreed, sometimes not. And that is the way it's supposed to be. The best consultants in radio are the ones who are NOT heavy handed. The sad thing is: you don't often hear about those consultants. They tend to be the ones who don't go to the conventions and don't spend all their time tooting their own horns on sites such as this one.

But, you're in a position where you don't need them right now. Sure, some LP-FM's would benefit from some advice from people in radio. (There's a big difference in being successful with an LP-FM in Columbus where, within reach of your signal, you have a potential cume audience of, oh...let's say 50,000-70,000 people and a small town with a total cume of 6,000. You have to be a lot more conservative with smaller potential cume to capture a wide audience). But where you are, you can try and carve your own niche. That's where you're in the catbird seat, and from the sound of it...it sounds as though you're beginning to strike paydirt.

 

[jakej]

Yeah, I've struck paydirt without the pay, for me anyways! Thanks for your post, Kevin. The new featured artists starting tonight and tomorrow night are gonna be the Supremes and Simple Minds. We just finished seven nights with the Animals and Adam and the Ants up on the "Secrets" stage, and before that, it was a twelve-evening run for the Who and Husker Du.

 

[datfireman]

No, but HOT 1029 covers most parts of Columbus.

LOL! everytime I turn to it sounds very staticy. and most times I hear nothing.

 

[datfireman]

Hell, a station programming all new local music could easily grow out of that!


[/quote]

you think so I really hope so?

 

[datfireman]

Don't get me wrong, I love low power radio, I consult a few, and can honestly tell you that most don't realized the asset they have, and most of them feel they know everything...

Low-power FMs use consultants? Are you kidding me?? They should be ashamed of themselves!!!

I wonder why you say that, even though in your first statement, you confirmed that LPFM people know absolutely everything about what they think they are doing...

I'm sorry, knowbetter, I misunderstood, or at least partially misunderstood. I was thinking strictly about music consultants, which at least in my case and I would think in the majority of other show hosts' cases would be the LAST people they'd want their station's management to go to for advice. It's the pro music consultants who helped drive me and others into the world of LPFM in the first place!
The day that 'CRS tells me what to play because of a consultant's recommendations is the day that my show ends, and if you're interested I'll bet you a hundred dollars that such a directive never comes. My underwriters like "Yesterday's Top Secrets" just the way it is, and that's what's got to be most important to everyone back at headquarters. Well, that and having lots of listeners, which I know I've also got. One of my underwriters has been backing the show for ten months now on a monthly renewal basis, which adds up to a rather large sum of money -- and I don't think it's doing that just because it likes me.

agree

 

[datfireman]

You would think though that with the technology to produce recordings by anyone with a computer and a little practice that there could be some kind of weekend show featuring local talent. But that might take local stations, locally owned and actually involved in the community.

You mean like WCRS? Then we've got it! And there ought to be a celebrating that it exists instead of a pretending that it doesn't.
I don't understand a lot of the moaning and groaning on this board. I say make the most of the station's existence, tell others about it, and use it to help bring down the people and the frequencies that you hate. That's what I'm doing.

Jake:

I totally stand by you as it regards your station offering an opportunity for local artists to get their music played on the air. That is, one of the things which a low-powered community radio station can do. And that does fall under the general category of serving the "public interest, convenience and necessity".

The only area I would chide you a bit about...is that radio, especially community radio, is supposed to be about just this type of programming. NOT about "bringing down the people and frequencies you hate." Because with 100 watts, I got news for you - you ain't gonna do it. But, you can provide a service that gives exposure to deserving local acts. And perhaps, if some of those acts start developing a buzz locally, you might be able to influence a playlist or two in town.

It's the people who try to program their LPFM stations as "anti-radio" who are, most often, the ones who fail. (Don't believe me? Look it up on the internet.) Take a more positive approach about what you're doing. Push your "unique selling prospect", as opposed to conducting a 24 hour hate campaign against stations who, frankly couldn't care less whether you're on the air or not. At best, you might pull a "zero point something" in the Arbitron's with your peanut power. BUT - that's not bad considering what you have. At least it would mean, you have measurable audience.

I am well aware from your posts you have a burr up your behind about status quo radio. And yes, you and I have some pretty measurable differences on programming philosophy. But, I am not going to criticize ideas such as these as it relates to an LP-FM. You're on a station at which you CAN experiment. Making a mistake will not cost WCRS millions of dollars, as it can with a commercial station. Now, go find a unique way to do something, get a decent audience with it and you might make a commercial station stand up and take notice.

Good luck.

okay could you tell something i can do to make what your telling me become a reailty!

Sorry, Datfireman, I've been out of touch for a couple of weeks (got a nasty virus on my computer here at home, but it's all good now)!

How can it be done? Realize the way commercial stations did it in the past. Yes, there was a day, probably long before some of you guys were born that Top 40 AM stations (and some early "progressive" FM stations), would now and then, add a song by a local artist. So what are you looking for?

For starters: you're all dead wrong if you take the approach that "we play anything that is submitted to us". It's a nice panacea...but, let's face reality. Some local CD's are great...others are only good for coasters. Learn to separate the good from the not-so.

Look for songs on locally produced CD's (or MP-3's) which are "ear-palatable". That's an old term out of the 1970's, but I suspect it would work today. If you can hear the song played on the radio along side what's topping the charts in a respective format today, you could be onto something. And this is true, whether the song is rock, rap, pop, country, whatever...(the formats are different, but the rules for all the formats are the same...)

Then...play it. Play it again. Play it a lot. Bring the artists in for an interview. Play it two or 3 more times.
Find out which songs from the local area your listeners like. Track CD sales on i-Tunes (if the song is available there), or in area music stores (where possible). Follow promising groups on their websites.
How 'bout come up with a "Columbus's Top 10" and do it as an hour long feature every week? WCRS could do just that.

How's that for a start?

that's a good start. who do i contact at WCRS TO tell them my idea.

 

[knowbetter]

that's a good start. who do i contact at WCRS TO tell them my idea.

Jake can help you with WCRS, I can help you with WCRX, and depending on the format of your music, Kevin might be able to help you in a different market.., so why don't you PM everyone with the same proposal??

If you prefer to go direct to that stations, try Jamye at CRS, Laura at CRX, but PM Kevin

 

[knowbetter]

You know, Jake. There was a day when I thought all consultants were bad, too. Then, I met some good ones who didn't tell people specifically how to run their stations, or tell them what songs they had to add. They offered advice, they offered research information which they received from their clients around the country...and then, let the local programmer or programmer's make their own decisions. Sometimes they agreed, sometimes not. And that is the way it's supposed to be. The best consultants in radio are the ones who are NOT heavy handed. The sad thing is: you don't often hear about those consultants. They tend to be the ones who don't go to the conventions and don't spend all their time tooting their own horns on sites such as this one.

Hi Kevin, I tend to agree, there are a whole lot of consultants, of many different styles.. not to mention the group program directors who tend to copy a station and place it in every single market they control. I don't tend to think much of those guys, short of the "consultants" who developed a format, like Drake, or Abrams, and then tuned them for each market. I believe you can take a national idea, and localize it for a market, 90% of the music is probably palatable anywhere, there is just that local taste and color that must be there for a station to be successful.

Music consultants aside, there are engineering, technical, operations and other factors that need to be considered, as you well know, there are a whole lot of aspects in this business that are not intuitive, and there isn't really a good book on this stuff yet, but I know a few folks who are writing just such a book. There are also associations for just about everything, but one has to be careful in joining some of them.

But, you're in a position where you don't need them right now. Sure, some LP-FM's would benefit from some advice from people in radio. (There's a big difference in being successful with an LP-FM in Columbus where, within reach of your signal, you have a potential cume audience of, oh...let's say 50,000-70,000 people and a small town with a total cume of 6,000. You have to be a lot more conservative with smaller potential cume to capture a wide audience). But where you are, you can try and carve your own niche. That's where you're in the catbird seat, and from the sound of it...it sounds as though you're beginning to strike paydirt.

Columbus is indeed an interesting situation, an LPFM with a translator, and a signal that should be heard pretty much over the entire city, so the potential listenership for the local station is rather substantial. I think this may well be one of the markets that LPFM could garner a size-able market share, especially if it is programmed and promoted right. LPFM wasn't intended to serve and entire area this large, but it happened here, and if the two remaining partners ever learn to work together, instead of separate, this is going to be great.

 

[masterdarke]

The Blitz used to have Local Stuff but I've been out of Columbus so long I don't know if they do it anymore. We got a box full of tapes and CDs and the majority of them sucked and went right in the trash. I can still remember getting hate mail, hate e-mails and hate calls from bands and their friends when they didn't get played every Sunday. You can't please everyone.

 

[Nu_Roo_2]

The Blitz used to have Local Stuff but I've been out of Columbus so long I don't know if they do it anymore.

Based on how dead this board has been for the past three weeks I'm wondering if EVERYBODY is out of Columbus. Or maybe just busy setting up new Country stations?

 

[imadethisusernamemyslef]

Based on how dead this board has been for the past three weeks I'm wondering if EVERYBODY is out of Columbus. Or maybe just busy setting up new Country stations?

I think they haven't been on much because everybody is tired of talking about this boring stations in Columbus.

 

[imadethisusernamemyslef]

I think that the only station that plays local music is CD 101. Most of the music the station plays is horrible, but at least they attempt to be different then all of the other stations in Columbus.

 

[JJWALKER]

Wasn't there a show called Fillmore East that showcased local artists?

 

[OH Radio]

WUAR, www.upperarlingtonradio.com (internet radio) is doing a half hour show featuring local artists from a recording studio in UA. It is on Wed nights at 8:30 and also on the stations archives. Vaughan Music Studios is located at Kingsdale Shopping Center.