Why do stations leave their HD off the air for weeks or months?

[nd2023]

In New York City, market 1, 92.3 Now and Fresh 102.7 had their HD off for 3 weeks earlier this summer. FM News 101.9 has not been in HD for at least a month. WPAT 93.1 also hasn't been in HD for at least 2 months. Last year, 106.7 Lite FM wasn't in HD for 3 months.

If stations have invested so much in HD radio, why do they not bother to immediately fix any problems with their HD transmitters? If the analog signal goes off, even at 3 AM, they will wake up the engineer to fix it. But when the HD goes off, no one notices that, except the DXers who gain 2 empty frequencies for DX.

 

[cd637299]

In New York City, market 1, 92.3 Now and Fresh 102.7 had their HD off for 3 weeks earlier this summer. FM News 101.9 has not been in HD for at least a month. WPAT 93.1 also hasn't been in HD for at least 2 months. Last year, 106.7 Lite FM wasn't in HD for 3 months.

If stations have invested so much in HD radio, why do they not bother to immediately fix any problems with their HD transmitters? If the analog signal goes off, even at 3 AM, they will wake up the engineer to fix it. But when the HD goes off, no one notices that, except the DXers who gain 2 empty frequencies for DX.

^....like me! The only answer I could give maybe is, that nobody cares? If they did, the phones to the studios would be ringing like mad.

You would think, after 10 years, radio would get the hint....

We have one station here whose HD is off-and-on, yet even when it is off, the sides have dead air (as opposed to the "hiss" that the HD puts out).

There are some decent HD2's & 3's out there, but do the websites of the "mains" even put a blurb of them on the sites? I would hate to think that they are "placeholders" until something more, um, innovative, comes along.

cd

 

[tomservo]

If the rate of return is so low in market #1 that it's not worth checking the HD side channels, then it's not worth operating anywhere at any time.

On the opposite side, maybe people aren't contacting the stations because the stations make it nearly impossible to contact anyone live. Most stations have Facebook and/or Twitter feeds, but they're staffed by lackeys who don't know a Megahertz from a megaphone and are incapable of passing along technical issues to the engineering department or whoever can go restart the computer. Try finding an e-mail on a corporate station's website. I tried to write local stations (or call, but all I got was sales) and had no luck. All I wanted to say was "hey, reboot the HD-2 jukebox when you get the chance."

So when I couldn't find anyone (and my Facebook posts were deleted after "the station sounds fine to me" responses) I just quit listening to both the digital AND analog, because if they don't care, why should I give them ANY of my business? I have Tune In, Pandora, podcasts and Spotify to keep me amused when my own music runs low.

Contrast that to one of the local public radio outlets who not only published multiple e-mail addresses for each of the station's departments in radio and TV, but when I wrote I got an actual thoughtful reply from the head engineer. We weren't able to resolve my issue (radio wouldn't tune the HD-2, only HD-1 and HD-3, but it didn't really matter since the -2 was classical) but it got fixed after a software update on their end eventually.

So now if I listen to radio, it's usually the NPR affiliate. They have a fantastic radio reading service on the HD-3 that's often more interesting than the NPR content on the main channel.

 

[MRFLASHPORT]

yep, corporate radio are run by useless tools who don't give a rats behind about the communities in which they are granted a LICENSE to serve, let alone any technical quality standards. They just tow the line enough to keep the FCC off their back, and even then it's only if somone complains loud enough.

Corporate consolidation has turned radio into the VAST WASTELAND Newton Minnow once spoke of television being in the 1960's. It's just a spam filled junk pile of the same sub 300 song playlist of (insert rock, urban or country) or mouthpiece talkers with more hot air than the exhaust end of a Pratt and Whitney JT9D. They don't care what their listeners think, feel or hear. They only listen to what their turds in suits, I mean, consultants tell them, and numbers on their monitors from the phony ratings services. It's not going to change, so do just that, tune them out, Pandora, Spotify, iTunes and even YouTube are where we will be going for our music entertainment, and TuneIn radio can help you get the intelligent (read not on corporate radio) talk shows and podcasts worth hearing and supporting.

Public and community radio will eventually be the ONLY radio left once the corporate stations complete their suicide mission of destorying commerical radio. and then maybe we can have our airwaves back. The corporate entities will finally realize NO ONE is listening and will divest most of their stations to local operators. Many will go silent. I can't wait for that day to come. It's not far off, but let's see what other games and tricks they pulll from out of their rear ends until then.

 

[KB1OKL]

In New York City, market 1, 92.3 Now and Fresh 102.7 had their HD off for 3 weeks earlier this summer. FM News 101.9 has not been in HD for at least a month. WPAT 93.1 also hasn't been in HD for at least 2 months. Last year, 106.7 Lite FM wasn't in HD for 3 months.

If stations have invested so much in HD radio, why do they not bother to immediately fix any problems with their HD transmitters? If the analog signal goes off, even at 3 AM, they will wake up the engineer to fix it. But when the HD goes off, no one notices that, except the DXers who gain 2 empty frequencies for DX.

Perhaps the guy who used to listen to these in NY city moved?

 

[mmnassour]

I'm afraid the tragic response to the original question is: no one cares.

...not the station manager, who's never heard it.

...not the engineer, who after another staff cutback has too much to do.

...not the sales folks, for there are no spots to sell and no audience even if there were.

...not the listener, who 1) doesn't know what it is, 2) has heard of it but doesn't want to buy a new radio, especially since they can't be bought and 3) the listener who has an HD Radio but has it put up in a closet because it doesn't work or turned off the system in his car's dashboard.

 

[RadioMan203]

What's even more funny is that the staff of most stations no clue when the HD goes down. If the station themselves aren't listening then who is?

HD was just executed wrong from the start. Any station that insists on paying iBiquity extortion licensing fees for using this dreck technology are the fools, especially if when it does off they leave it off for a period of time. With millions of radios that operate perfectly fine I don't see the masses running out to purchase yet another radio.

HD Radio will be this decade's AM Stereo debacle.

 

[local oscillator]

And why should the local staffs care? Unlike their corporate masters who blindly drink the iBiquity Kool-Aid, they know HD Radio is a useless pile of junk science, and they give it the attention it deserves. Local staffs know that they have far more important things to do -- like taking care of their analog signals/revenue generators. In my opinion, if local engineering staffs could make the call, HD Radio would disappear as fast as the switches could be thrown.

 

[cd637299]

I wonder, and this is the DXer in me talking:

I wonder if I sense some serious DX coming, and my adjacent frequencies would be affected, if I could just call the main station and ask "Could you shut off your HD for a bit, while I work this DX?"---I wonder if any would comply.

Don't laugh. In July 1992 there was monster Tropo to the Caribbean here in south FL. I knew about a Jamaican station.....I called a station who actually ran dead-air midnight to 6 or so, so I politely asked. It was off that night, and a 1000 watt JBC station was there for me!

In 1975 or so, I called an AM station who would shut off Sun night/Mon morning about once a month....I called a DJ and asked if they would shut off, and he told me, "no, we don't plan to, tonight," but they did....I caught an adjacent that I wanted.

cd

 

[local oscillator]

I think the jury is still out on whether the government will mandate FM in cellphones, which got a big shot in the arm as a result of the storm that swept through the DC area (among others) a couple of weeks ago; accurately predicting what our federal government will do is a fool's errand. Nonetheless, only Struble thinks the debate involves FM-HD in cellphones -- the odds of that, I believe, are indeed zero. Struble's snake-oil marketing ability is good, but not THAT good.

 

[TimeIsTight]

AT&T and Verizon have already make it clear...radio chips in cell phones will not happen.

The FCC stated that FM chips in cell phones is going to be market-driven.

Perhaps we are already seeing a jump in demand for radios being built into cell phones, since receivers are already built into several models.

Check this bit of research from a news story on the homepage of this website last Friday:

"That could help explain this next finding: “13.4% of women, up from 8% last year, now listen to AM or FM radio on their cell phones virtually every day.”

And that is with just a few models cell phones having the feature available. It looks like some people on the carrier/cell phone maker side of this debate may be misreading actual market signals. And you have to wonder what the usage figures would be if radio reception was available on most, or all, cell phone models?

Here is a link to the full research article: http://www.radio-info.com/news/alan-burns-women-want-their-opinions-to-be-heard

 

[mmnassour]

The article doesn't say is they're streaming...or actually listening to RF. Somehow I think it's the former. Does anyone have an example of a cell phone with an AM radio built in

 

[TimeIsTight]

The article doesn't say is they're streaming...or actually listening to RF. Somehow I think it's the former

Does it really matter whether they are listening to a stream or to RF? It is the radio listening experience that they are after, and when they get it using RF they are freeing cell system data bandwidth, and getting the signal for free. And should the cell system go down, it's a backup system.

Here's a survey story from a year ago, it shows that about 17% of cell phones have RF receivers built-in, and that among those who have the radio listening option 5% use it every day, another 14% use it a few times a week, and another 24% listen to RF on their cellphones "once in a while." About 57% never use it at all.

The full survey story is here:

http://www.markramseymedia.com/2011/07/new-survey-shows-when-fm-is-built-in-to-mobile-phones-most-consumers-dont-use-it/

 

[TimeIsTight]

FM chips have been in some cell phones for a while - there is no "jump" in demand. Cheesy

I guess you don't equate a rise in the percentage of women using the RF receivers in their cell phones, year over year, as a "jump in market demand for the services?"

That could help explain this next finding: “13.4% of women, up from 8% last year, now listen to AM or FM radio on their cell phones virtually every day.”

Any sort of mandate is dead, because the carriers now have NOAA weather alerts - that is the only thing they need to thwart a mandate. Just sayin!

So how does getting a text message warning of bad storms help somebody in the aftermath of a sudden earthquake, power outage, EMP, major terrorist attack etc. etc. etc. ?

What's needed just as much is the ability to hear what is happening and what to do next, where emergency shelter, transportation, food, water, medicine and other emergency services can be found. What has a short storm warning text message from NOAA got to do with any of that, especially if the cell phone system is overloaded and down for the count?

 

[mmnassour]

The article doesn't say is they're streaming...or actually listening to RF. Somehow I think it's the former

Does it really matter whether they are listening to a stream or to RF? It is the radio listening experience that they are after, and when they get it using RF they are freeing cell system data bandwidth, and getting the signal for free. And should the cell system go down, it's a backup system.

My gosh, yes, it's a HUGE difference, at least to Verizon and AT&T.

Streaming makes them money. RF COSTS them money, both in hardware and time not bought by the customer. That's their point.

 

[TimeIsTight]

My gosh, yes, it's a HUGE difference, at least to Verizon and AT&T.

Streaming makes them money. RF COSTS them money, both in hardware and time not bought by the customer. That's their point.

That would be a much better argument if there weren't reasons for concern about spectrum bandwidth limitations.

Cellphones and their data connections were primarily designed for two-way interactive communications, and it is a waste of limited bandwidth to send all those individual duplicate streams, essentially, in one direction, especially when systems are overloaded with two-way emergency communication needs.

The cell phone carriers enjoy an oligopoly status because the available spectrum is limited, and, naturally, want to maximize every advantage they can, to grab every penny they can. But because they use public spectrum they also have certain public responsibilities.

Personally, my only interest is in having a totally separate emergency mass communication system available to the majority of Americans who carry cell phones in their pockets. Because we know from experience that the cell phone system can be overloaded, and go down, and that cellphone in your pocket becomes totally useless just when you need it the most.

 

[mmnassour]

The cell phone carriers enjoy an oligopoly status because the available spectrum is limited, and, naturally, want to maximize every advantage they can, to grab every penny they can. But because they use public spectrum they also have certain public responsibilities.

Personally, my only interest is in having a totally separate emergency mass communication system available to the majority of Americans who carry cell phones in their pockets. Because we know from experience that the cell phone system can be overloaded, and go down, and that cellphone in your pocket becomes totally useless just when you need it the most.

Could be, yea.

Now, everyone in favor of using HD Radio as a system for emergency notifications, for information upon which your life may depend, raise your hand.




















(crickets)


We've GOT an EAS system. It's called radio. It works, or rather, WILL work when the broadcasters and feds can get their act together. Adding iBiquity's folly to the mix is just one more thing to break. If you want to stick an FM radio into a cell phone, you could probably get away with that as it's been done. But anything else? Better to spend that money and time on coming up with a digital broadcasting system that we can actually use.

 

[K6JHU]

The advantage of NOAA weather radio is that YOU DON'T HAVE TO LISTEN. No lousy programming, no limited play list, no commericals. Mine just sits threre on the window sill listening to NOAA without a peep until an alert goes off. Then I pay attention, especially when it goes off at 3:00 AM.

Even the weekly tests just light an indicator. Nothing unless it is important. Best $20 investment ever out here.

 

[Radio-X]

As a consumer with a cell phone that has FM radio capabilities, I can tell you the following facts:

The FM radio app on the Droid X (and most Motorola based smartphones) is mediocre at best. I live in the suburbs of Washington DC, and zero, zilch, nada DC stations show up on the dial...even with an 8 foot headphone cord as antenna. People here listen to DC stations more than the locals...so I'm not interested in picking up the few Jesus-casters, oldies, or country stations that provide an adequate signal here. So, it is completely worthless to me.

However, cell phone coverage is excellent here, and with 2GB of data and wifi at both home and work, I just use tunein and have perfect coverage of any station wherever I go. Why would I even bother using a mediocre FM tuner on a phone?? Riddle me that, Batman!

Also, during the strong VA storms recently, 3 of 4 local FM's were off the air...but I had no issues with cell coverage at all.

Finally, when those storms hit, I was listening to a portable radio tuned in to a local FM at work. Got an emergency alert on my phone a full five minutes before the FM got the EAS alert. Honestly, if it was a tornado warning, I would have needed that extra time to save my tail!


Radio is something I care deeply about...but just like the railroads, there are people who refuse to change with the times or want the government to mandate its use when far superior technologies are out there. I'm not saying there isn't a place for terrestrial AM/FM, but in 95% of situations for 95% of people, there is a better option for general listening and emergencies!

Radio-X