Why does conservative talk work in most markets ?

[radiobum]

'why it works' (as in gets ratings) ? I'm the one who started this post with the theory that people with no expertise on any given issue can call in and be on the radio with hosts who also have no expertise and see things in a black and white way. They also can outright lie- second hand smoke is not dangerous and there is no such thing as climate change. Limbaugh has said both and all his fellow idiot right wing talk show hosts believe the latter-despite overwhelming evidence.

 

[DonTheTrucker]

I question the assumption in the original question that conservative talk "works." But as long as a bunch of stations around the country do it, some people will say that's proof enough.

If it didn't work, it wouldn't be a popular format. You can bash the demo that listens all you want, but in more cases than not, the format sells spots. And they're normal radio advertisers too. Believe it or not, the people who listen to talk radio can read, and they're interested in cars, restaurants and cell phones like everyone else.

 

[Talk_Dude]

I question the assumption in the original question that conservative talk "works." But as long as a bunch of stations around the country do it, some people will say that's proof enough.

If it didn't work, it wouldn't be a popular format. You can bash the demo that listens all you want, but in more cases than not, the format sells spots. And they're normal radio advertisers too. Believe it or not, the people who listen to talk radio can read, and they're interested in cars, restaurants and cell phones like everyone else.

No, talk radio doesn't sell spots. Good salespeople who work for companies that program conservative talk radio sell spots. And they have to work to sell the spots. The days when any station that programmed conservative talk radio could expect a certain amount of sales from car dealerships, restaurants, cell phone vendors, and other local businesses calling them are gone. Instead of the local Cadillac dealers automatically pencilling in the local talk radio station in their advertising plans, it takes a good and persuasive bit of salesmanship (and maybe some pencil sharpening) to close deals. Even at that, the spots bought are more likely to be the local independent used car dealer than the local Cadillac or even Chevy dealership. The restaurant spots won't be for the four-star gourmet restaurants, they'll be for the local Dew Drop Inn. And forget cell phone spots.

 

[DonTheTrucker]

No, talk radio doesn't sell spots. Good salespeople who work for companies that program conservative talk radio sell spots. And they have to work to sell the spots. The days when any station that programmed conservative talk radio could expect a certain amount of sales from car dealerships, restaurants, cell phone vendors, and other local businesses calling them are gone. Instead of the local Cadillac dealers automatically pencilling in the local talk radio station in their advertising plans, it takes a good and persuasive bit of salesmanship (and maybe some pencil sharpening) to close deals. Even at that, the spots bought are more likely to be the local independent used car dealer than the local Cadillac or even Chevy dealership. The restaurant spots won't be for the four-star gourmet restaurants, they'll be for the local Dew Drop Inn. And forget cell phone spots.

You make a good point. Without good salespeople, no format will work. You're also right about the sponsors not being the "highest quality" sponsors. But that has nothing to do with the format, that has everything to do with the medium. Radio isn't exactly burning up the world when it comes to cutting edge advertising. That isn't necessarily a bad thing. The local used car dealer and the Dew Drop Inn need to advertise too. Treating them like their advertising dollars are somehow worth less than Apple or Starbucks is just crazy talk.

 

[bturner]

Matt Parker, which hate filled talk host are you? Instead of valid points, it's hate, hate hate. Do you have anything to add to this conversation?

Conservative talk radio works because (and any talk radio works) because the listener that tunes in establishes a bond with the host. The listener feels they must check in to see what the host says. These listeners like hearing something that might not have thought of so they can share it with friends or co-workers. It's the same concept that build Howard Stern, Paul Harvey, etc.

 

[DonTheTrucker]

Playing the "hate" card is the 2010 version of playing the race card. It's lame, offensive, and a cheap shot.

I don't begrudge a single man or woman that makes a living talking for a living. Subject matter is irrelevant to me. I even like Jerry Springer's Air America show. He was likable. Marc Maron was good too. On the other hand, I really dislike some conservative hosts, without naming names, of course. But if they can put food on the table by talking to people on the radio, good for them. It's not easy.

 

[MattParker]

Matt Parker, which hate filled talk host are you? Instead of valid points, it's hate, hate hate. Do you have anything to add to this conversation?

Conservative talk radio works because (and any talk radio works) because the listener that tunes in establishes a bond with the host. The listener feels they must check in to see what the host says. These listeners like hearing something that might not have thought of so they can share it with friends or co-workers. It's the same concept that build Howard Stern, Paul Harvey, etc.

B: I'm not sure what upset you about my post. Frankly, Jerry Springer is my idea of a hate filled rant.

I think you are on to something. But a listener "checks in" with a given host because he knows or expects he is going to like and agree with what he hears. Rush used to do (maybe still does) spots in this show for subscriptions to his paid newsletter. In those he said in effect most people look to opinion leaders (not the term he used but the one favored by social scientists) to shape their views. That's true. Rush, Hannity, Beck, et al get their talking points from the RNC (and Hartmann, Miller, Schultz, et al get theirs from the DNC), pass them on to listeners who, in turn, repeat them at water coolers. It's sort of sad how few people think things through for themselves and need radio hosts to give them something to repeat at the water cooler.

The question is: Does right wing talk "work" when it reaches a limited audience, not in demographic segments sought by leading advertisers? And when it has driven away possibly more listeners than it reaches? I say driven away not just by the ideology but also conservatives turned off by the shrill, angry and yes, sometimes even hate-filled tone these hosts often use. This would account for the fact that almost as many people who call themselves "conservatives" listen to NPR as those calling themselves "liberal."

 

[radiobum]

I agree that Rush etc get talking points from RNC. I do not agree that Hartmann and Schultz get theirs from DNC-they are progressives -not liberals.

It's obvious that conservative talk is HUGE in some markets and not in others and of course there are plenty of stations that have live hosts and not just running Rush etc and the other hate mongers/outright liars. Someone told me that Hannity does not do as well when he doesn't follow Rush.

I agree about the comment about the 'race card'. Why does Rush use an affected voice when it talks about Sharpton or Jesse Jackson. How did Tom Daschel become "Puff' Daschel.

Did you know Neal Boortz used to be a speechwriter for segregationist governor Lester Maddox ?!
Hell he calls himself "Mighty Whitey" !

 

[bturner]

As for the 'negative' in talk radio, I think there is a growing group of listeners that tire of the 'controversy aspect'. I know I usually like pretty stress-free days over ones where a talk show host is trying to push my buttons in the name of ratings.

The owner of the station I work for said that no matter how popular a certain show might be (politically liberal or conservative) there are several businesses that would never advertise because it polarized the customers. He had been in the banking business prior to radio. He said every businesses wanted the largest number of customers they could get and any advertising venue that alienated any segment of the potential customers, was not desirable.

 

[in3media_be1]

Some posts from this thread have been moved to Take It Outside


http://boards.radio-info.com/smf/index.php?topic=178903.msg1545266#msg1545266

 

[radiophiler]

Getting back to whether conservative talk really works, here is a somewhat rare look at the comparison between AM dial news/talk stations' 12+ numbers and their 25-54 numbers. The following is from an article in the Boston Herald about a WTKK Boston talk show host leaving the station:

During the month of October, the most recent ratings period, WTKK was in 16th place with a 2.5 share among the coveted 25- to 54-year-old listeners. WBZ-AM (1030) was in 12th place with a 3.7 share while WRKO-AM (680) was in 19th place with a 1.8.

Among all listeners, WTKK was 13th place with a 3.1 share. WRKO was 18th with a 2.6 and WBZ was second with a 7.5.

Even an FM talk station (WTKK) is having trouble with the all-important 25-54 numbers.

A second-place mostly all-news station, WBZ, sinks to 12th in 25-54. AM talk stations have a considerable chunk of their audiences 55+.

However, WTOP, Washington and WSB, Atlanta, seem to be making former AM news/talk stations work on FM. Their demos have gotten better since switching to FM.

And of course, situations will be different in small to medium-small markets where local sales are more important. They may still be doing pretty well with an AM talk station anchored by the usual Beck-Limbaugh-Hannity-Levin/Savage schedule.

 

[Talk_Dude]

There's another consideration that few people have mentioned. Ten years ago, the people who are now 55 years old and who have moved out of the coveted 25-54 demographic were 45 years old. Now, they are 55.

It's not that talk radio appeals to people of a certain age, it's that talk radio appeals to people in a certain generation. To make an internet forum appropriate generalization, Baby Boomers like talk radio, Gen-Xers don't. As Baby Boomers get older, the demographic appeal of talk radio grows along with them.

So, conservative talk radio is working as good as it always did in appealing to the people born between 1946 and 1960. And, it's doing as badly at appealing to people born between 1960 aand 1975 as it always did.

 

[ExConservtive]

It amazes me...an Ex-CON preaching virtue daily on blogtalkradio... Ex-CONservative Radio Hour, that while there are few absolutes, one thing IS absolute. The absence of data, facts, those things that "ARE" more often precluded by ridicule. Never, or rarely based on substance or thought, but more like feelings...we have been feminized..
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/tony-venuti

If you haven't got anything good to say, but say it anyway..."You just might be a liberal."

People "Buy" what they need, desire and can afford. Unlike the healthcare that we were compelled to BUY even though it was not "sold" to us. People might be reactionary, and not "think" very well, but they do understand, Intuitively when someone is makethem bend over....(not backwards) and without even a kiss first.

Tony Venuti, "The Wizard of Is." "This ought to be a reality show baby."

 

[blue67ccm]

It would seem to me the original poster proved himself to be conservative and one who calls talk radio all the time given his "simplistic" definition.......pot meet kettle?

 

[semoochie]

"So, conservative talk radio is working as good as it always did in appealing to the people born between 1946 and 1960. And, it's doing as badly at appealing to people born between 1960 and 1975 as it always did." I always thought the reason for News/Talk's success was partially the lack of connection to modern music by the pre-rock generation and once the baby-boomers reached that age, the format's popularity would drop off. Those listeners are now over 70 and were replaced by baby-boomers after all. I don't really have a conclusion for all of this but it'll be interesting to see what happens to all those giant AM stations in a few years.

 

[Talk_Dude]

"So, conservative talk radio is working as good as it always did in appealing to the people born between 1946 and 1960. And, it's doing as badly at appealing to people born between 1960 and 1975 as it always did." I always thought the reason for News/Talk's success was partially the lack of connection to modern music by the pre-rock generation and once the baby-boomers reached that age, the format's popularity would drop off. Those listeners are now over 70 and were replaced by baby-boomers after all. I don't really have a conclusion for all of this but it'll be interesting to see what happens to all those giant AM stations in a few years.

The "pre-rock" generation are people born in the 1930's. The people born in the late 1930's and during WWII are the earliest rock listening audience. Buddy Holly was born in 1936. Elvis Presley was born in 1935. Keith Richards is 66 years old. Chuck Berry is 84!

The lack of connection between modern music and those of us in the Baby Boomer generation is largely a myth. With all of the oldies and classic rock stations out there, the people in Generations X and Y include many people who prefer old rock to the new stuff, including many of the new rockers who were inspired by, and who tend to copy, the old-school rockers.

The thing is, no generation is a monolithic block that all marches in lock step. Some of us Baby Boomers like conservative talk programming. Some of us like music programming. Most of us will sometimes want to hear spoken word programming and sometimes want to hear music.

Anyone involved in radio realizes that attracting an audience is like shoveling sand. When you put the shovel into a pile of sand and pick it up, some falls off. You're never going to get all of it in one scoop. But you'll get a lot, and a lot is usually enough. Most people who know what's what in radio automatically understand that broad statements about who likes what are really only referring to big chunks of a market and not the entire demographic.

If news talk gets a 5% share, that means 95 out of every 100 people listening to the radio aren't listening. Conservative news talk has always gotten big shovelfuls of Baby Boomers, but it never gets all of them. It gets smaller shovelfuls of Gen-Xers, but it does get some.

As for the giant AM stations, don't be surprised if the AM band ends up being re-assigned to some other form of electronic communications.

 

[KeithE4]

As for the giant AM stations, don't be surprised if the AM band ends up being re-assigned to some other form of electronic communications.

I wouldn't bet on that happening. No other communications service besides broadcasting has any need for those frequencies. The band is less than 1.2 MHz wide and efficient antennas only have about a 50 kHz bandwidth tops. That rules out any kind of digital mode other than at relatively low bit rates (and remember how "well" IBOC works).

Ham operators would make use of it, but who else would want or need the AM band?

 

[semoochie]

I didn't put that together well enough. Instead of "modern music", I should have said "rock era music", referring to everything from Elvis to Lady Gaga, which is all miles away from Frank Sinatra and anything that went before. I was trying say that the "greatest generation" and those who came before them, generally don't have a direct connection with "rock era music" and because of that, I thought it contributed a large part of News/Talk's popularity but baby boomers, who DO make that connection, replaced the older generation, as listeners to that format. I wasn't inferring whether or not baby boomers generally like Lady Gaga. There's still plenty of relatable music for them on the radio, something you can't say about their predecessors.

 

[MikefromDelaware]

There may also be an age factor involved with who listens to news/talk vs music. The younger folks aren't all that interested in politics NOW, but as they age, own a home, paying school taxes, trying to make ends meet providing for a family, start paying higher taxes due to having a higher paying job due to their college education, better understand how what the politicians in Washington, and their state capitals affect how they live, etc, seems to be the time when the next generation gets into politics more and thus news/talk radio.

The Babyboomer generation did get an earlier dose of political angst due to the Viet Nam War due to the draft. With no draft today, the Gen X'ers and Gen Y'ers don't have as much interest in the political world, but that will change as they age for a new generation of talk show hosts who will be from their generation.

I tuned in to Rush the other day ( I'm not a regular listener) and his voice is sounding older (he'll be 60 next year). Even the network newscasters get shuffled out to keep a younger and now prettier face on the screen as there are many more female anchors today vs the days of Walter Cronkite or Chet Huntley/David Brinkley (other than Bob Schiefer on Face the Nation and of course The 60 Minutes Crew both on CBS) you don't really see many "elder" news anchors any more.

It would be interesting to find out the age, income levels, education demos of Commercial News/Talk audiences vs NPR News/Talk audiences.

 

[Goat Rodeo Cowboy]

The Babyboomer generation did get an earlier dose of political angst due to the Viet Nam War due to the draft. With no draft today, the Gen X'ers and Gen Y'ers don't have as much interest in the political world, but that will change as they age for a new generation of talk show hosts who will be from their generation.

An earlier generation got pushed into political interest and action by Viet Nam.

The current generation may get pushed into political interest and action because of health care. Whether "Obamacare" survives threats of repeal and gets perfected, or if the newly passed health care indeed gets repealed, the whole question of health care is looming over our head like a big dark cloud. As the parents of today's younger generation start getting shredded by the costs, the rules and the availability of healthcare, the younger generation will get politically active when mom and/or dad move in with the younger generation because they cannot afford nursing homes, assisted living and hospitals.

It's not IF.... it's WHEN.