vjm said:
As is almost everything on "KNRAlmost2", save for Rome/ESPN, and perhaps for Munch's 7-9 show. And even Munch brings his own sponsors.
Does Thistledown still broker a weekly show on 1540?
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WKNR Programming Changes
- Thread starter kaysguy
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As is almost everything on "KNRAlmost2", save for Rome/ESPN, and perhaps for Munch's 7-9 show. And even Munch brings his own sponsors.
Does Thistledown still broker a weekly show on 1540?
LullonSports said:
Welcome to the board, Joe.
I hope they aren't eventually thinking of putting "TnT" in the X's and O's slot.
"Xs and Os" got their start on KNR2 and got popular enough to be brought over to the big station.
I hope the same theory isn't in play here.
And speaking of Xs and Os...
Je'Rod Cherry would (I feel) be a good addition as the 3rd wheel to RBS. He and Rizzo work well together on the Sunday morning Browns pregame show, and Cherry would also be able to keep Hammer in check (somewhat anyway...nobody can do it completely and we all know why).
Hammer felt emboldened when he had kindred spirit Chris Fedor with him...not so much should there be a 6' 2", 220lb, 3x Super Bowl winner across the table.
"Xs and Os" got their start on KNR2 and got popular enough to be brought over to the big station.
I hope the same theory isn't in play here.
And speaking of Xs and Os...
Je'Rod Cherry would (I feel) be a good addition as the 3rd wheel to RBS. He and Rizzo work well together on the Sunday morning Browns pregame show, and Cherry would also be able to keep Hammer in check (somewhat anyway...nobody can do it completely and we all know why).
Hammer felt emboldened when he had kindred spirit Chris Fedor with him...not so much should there be a 6' 2", 220lb, 3x Super Bowl winner across the table.
vjm said:
Hell, they might as well give Reghi and/or Roda the entire 7pm-12am slot and be done with it.
"TnT" from 4pm - 5pm? Might as well. Come December, WWGK goes bye-bye for the night at 5pm (not counting the puny 18-watt post sunset authority).
You have to wonder how long WWGK can operate before it gets crowded out by brokered programming...
Nathan Obral said:
As long as CK still needs a home for hour #4 of Mike and Mike, and hour #1 of Jim Rome (as well as giving Cowherd, Van Pelt, and Gottlieb a Cleveland clearance), KNR2 1540 will stay pretty much as is.
Is WWGK anything to write home to Mom about...no.
But it's something...and though the folks in Bristol and at Premeire will grumble, it's better than nothing.
If WKNR wants to really be more competitive with WKRK, then they should do this:
6a-10a Mike and Mike
10a-12p The Really Really Big Show
12p-3p Jim Rome
3p-12a local sports talk
Or they could do this...
WKNR could just go all local from 6a to 12a with ESPN from 12a to 6a, while WWGK is all network (though Jim Rome may as well go elsewhere, but where? WMMS could be an option, but with WKRK now sports talk, The Buzzard has become a new option for alt-rock, and I don't think those in charge want to mess with it.).
6a-10a Mike and Mike
10a-12p The Really Really Big Show
12p-3p Jim Rome
3p-12a local sports talk
Or they could do this...
WKNR could just go all local from 6a to 12a with ESPN from 12a to 6a, while WWGK is all network (though Jim Rome may as well go elsewhere, but where? WMMS could be an option, but with WKRK now sports talk, The Buzzard has become a new option for alt-rock, and I don't think those in charge want to mess with it.).
CleveFan said:
ESPN wants Mike and Mike to be on 850. It's their flagship show, and they want it to be on the big station. They're muttering under their breath as it is because of the 9 a.m. hour, so no way will they tolerate the whole show going to KNR2.
And Hell will freeze over before they contract RBS. It's their biggest $$ maker featuring their most popular personality/minority owner and the teacher's pet sidekick who is tethered to him with a chain.
I've always been a proponent of WMMS picking up Jim Rome. Whether or not they do is a different matter. But remember this...the Rome/KNR contract expires in the 1st quarter of 2012.
I won't pretend I know what the final outcome will be, but I can tell you with some confidence 3 options that won't happen:
1. The status quo
2. All 3 hours on 1540
3. Rome on The Fan.
Premire doesn't particularly care for the current arrangement, and NO WAY will they take the whole show moved to KNR2.
92.3 probably won't take Rome because all of the CBS FM sports talkers are centered around local programming (especially 6a-12a).
Back to the ratings thing, multiple people on both boards predicted that The Fan would immediately stomp KNR into oblvion, and if anything KNR's numbers actually went up while The Fan is barely a blip. And now people are saying "oh well it will take time of course." Isn't it true in many cases that format flips lead to immediate ratings spikes? (see 106.5) I'm no ratings expert, but if KNR is dominating that much in the 12+ how much could specific breakdowns really save face for The Fan? Why did The Fan launch so softly? No billboards, no TV ads leading up to their first day on the air.
SixOnTheFloor said:
What we (meaning us radio geeks) didn't factor in was just because we knew about The Fan, it didn't mean Joe Sixpack radio listener knew about it. CBS has to take some heat for not going full bore with advertising 92.3's flip. They didn't even do any stunting (unlike 106.5 with Mix becoming The Lake)...just alt-rock until 6 a.m. on August 29, then like a needle scratching across a record, it went straight to "Kiley and Booms" and sports talk.
They screwed up on that point...plain and simple.
Having said all that, The Fan isn't a bad station. K & B and the Talking Heads are acquired tastes, but decent enough. Bull and Fox are legitimate stars in the making, and Ken Carman is solid in the evening.
Also, there's no doubt CBS is gonna go after some PBP. The Buckeyes are up after 2012, and would be a coup for The Fan to pick up (gotta believe OSU is grumbling about having Hammer, Hooley, and Fedor doing their thing on what is by far their biggest affiliate).
The colors of WKRK's logo should leave no doubt about the brass ring they will attempt to win when the time comes.
And it can't be downplayed that The Fan had to be in CK's head for him to make all the recent changes (tweaking RBS by removing Ned and scolding Hammer, the "Hooley-gans" in PMD, and R & R at night).
Give it time...The Fan will be a player.
A quick update on 1540's new PMD show, now that all the details are clear...
The show will be called "The Slump Busters", and air from 4-5 p.m. starting Monday.
It is hosted by T.J. Wichmann and Tim Corrigan, who are owners of Lakewood sports bar "Eddy and Iggy's" (a play on St Eds and St Ignatius as the 2 gentlemen came from those respective longtime rival schools), with GKB staffer Matt "Hanna Montana" Fontana as producer/sidekick (the nickname was bestowed upon him by Greg Brinda).
The program debuted as a Sunday morning show in January on KNR2 as "The TnT Show" and took place from the bar.
With the move to weekdays, the hosts will be in the studio, and the TnT name goes bye-bye.
This more than likely is a brokered show.
The only reason I'm giving this so much attention, is because it's reminicent of the path "Xs and Os with the Pros" took:
Weekly on 1540, then daily, then moved to 850.
"Slump Busters" could (if it catches on) take the same path and eventually move over to 850 and ultimately be what fills the old Xs and Os slot.
We shall see.
The show will be called "The Slump Busters", and air from 4-5 p.m. starting Monday.
It is hosted by T.J. Wichmann and Tim Corrigan, who are owners of Lakewood sports bar "Eddy and Iggy's" (a play on St Eds and St Ignatius as the 2 gentlemen came from those respective longtime rival schools), with GKB staffer Matt "Hanna Montana" Fontana as producer/sidekick (the nickname was bestowed upon him by Greg Brinda).
The program debuted as a Sunday morning show in January on KNR2 as "The TnT Show" and took place from the bar.
With the move to weekdays, the hosts will be in the studio, and the TnT name goes bye-bye.
This more than likely is a brokered show.
The only reason I'm giving this so much attention, is because it's reminicent of the path "Xs and Os with the Pros" took:
Weekly on 1540, then daily, then moved to 850.
"Slump Busters" could (if it catches on) take the same path and eventually move over to 850 and ultimately be what fills the old Xs and Os slot.
We shall see.
As for the Fan's first monthly...yes, they lost well over half the audience from Radio 92.3, and 'KNR ticked up a bit. Those are the (beauty contest) facts.
But:
* This is their first MONTH, not their first THREE MONTHS.
* A lot of the missing audience is alt-rock partisans (young males) who likely scattered to the winds at the first show of "Kiley and Booms"...looking for their favorite music or some facsimile thereof. Aside from diehard young sports fans in the same group, 92.3 had little chance of keeping them.
* As I said, it's silly to declare winners and losers in one PPM month. As someone wrote in a certain media blog the night before The Fan launch:
As I also wrote, CBS is not in this to play around. They've thrown a ton of people and money at the thing, and will basically throw money in the direction of the Browns and Indians, and possibly other teams, to pick up the rights.
Does that mean they automatically wipe WKNR off the dial at some point? Probably not. But it certainly will affect WKNR, and to a lesser extent WTAM and WMMS.
The first PPM monthlies? They only show which alt-rock fans hit the exits on August 29th.
I do believe CBS needs to do a big outdoor campaign. They've been teasing recently, with ads on the RTA rapid.
"But there aren't radio listeners there!", you might say...but yes, there are, when they get off at the park and ride lots. Oh, and me, on occasion, with a portable radio
But yes, they at very least need to occupy some unsold billboards.
But:
* This is their first MONTH, not their first THREE MONTHS.
* A lot of the missing audience is alt-rock partisans (young males) who likely scattered to the winds at the first show of "Kiley and Booms"...looking for their favorite music or some facsimile thereof. Aside from diehard young sports fans in the same group, 92.3 had little chance of keeping them.
* As I said, it's silly to declare winners and losers in one PPM month. As someone wrote in a certain media blog the night before The Fan launch:
As I also wrote, CBS is not in this to play around. They've thrown a ton of people and money at the thing, and will basically throw money in the direction of the Browns and Indians, and possibly other teams, to pick up the rights.
Does that mean they automatically wipe WKNR off the dial at some point? Probably not. But it certainly will affect WKNR, and to a lesser extent WTAM and WMMS.
The first PPM monthlies? They only show which alt-rock fans hit the exits on August 29th.
I do believe CBS needs to do a big outdoor campaign. They've been teasing recently, with ads on the RTA rapid.
"But there aren't radio listeners there!", you might say...but yes, there are, when they get off at the park and ride lots. Oh, and me, on occasion, with a portable radio
But yes, they at very least need to occupy some unsold billboards.
vjm said:
I'm not writing about it on the blog until it escapes brokered hell and 1540...it's a general policy of mine, with limited exceptions. ("Cleveland Browns Daily" could be considered a brokered show in some form, though the team denies it is a straight time buy...and I wrote about its debut for obvious reasons.)
Oh, about the 106.5 flip vs. 92.3:
"The Lake" was a very compatible format to what came before it, "Mix 106.5". I could see a lot of Mix listeners sticking with the new station, which they apparently did. And here 10 months later, WHLK has cooled off from its red hot debut, though it still does well.
Though there were certainly some diehard sports fans around when 92.3 flipped from Radio 92.3 to The Fan, I'm assuming the demos were younger with alt-rock than WKRK hopes to get with sports talk.
Those folks ended up probably unsuccessfully finding a 24/7 radio replacement for "Radio 92.3" (aside from college/HS stations that aren't really full market stations), or retreating into the world of Pandora and Internet radio.
"The Lake" was a very compatible format to what came before it, "Mix 106.5". I could see a lot of Mix listeners sticking with the new station, which they apparently did. And here 10 months later, WHLK has cooled off from its red hot debut, though it still does well.
Though there were certainly some diehard sports fans around when 92.3 flipped from Radio 92.3 to The Fan, I'm assuming the demos were younger with alt-rock than WKRK hopes to get with sports talk.
Those folks ended up probably unsuccessfully finding a 24/7 radio replacement for "Radio 92.3" (aside from college/HS stations that aren't really full market stations), or retreating into the world of Pandora and Internet radio.
I did actually hear an ad for The Fan played on 98.5 on Sunday, first time I've heard that cross promotion.
I get that Mix to The Lake was a very similar transition, and an improvement over the old model, makes sense the ratings would spike. However I would think that if KNR had disenfranchised so many listeners that word of The Fan would have spread like wildfire and had a more immediate effect. Maybe The Fan wondered if this would happen and thus held back spending money on any kind of ad campaign? Should be interesting to watch the number over the next 6 months or so.
I get that Mix to The Lake was a very similar transition, and an improvement over the old model, makes sense the ratings would spike. However I would think that if KNR had disenfranchised so many listeners that word of The Fan would have spread like wildfire and had a more immediate effect. Maybe The Fan wondered if this would happen and thus held back spending money on any kind of ad campaign? Should be interesting to watch the number over the next 6 months or so.
SixOnTheFloor said:
Or maybe they wanted to be sure the station was "set" and jelling before they unleashed a big marketing campaign for it? Maybe They Have Plans and a timetable for this...remember, the Browns and Indians PBP rights are SURELY in their sights.
Heck, the Jim Thome promotion...how much did the Indians charge them for those 9,230 tickets? Even at a few bucks a pop, that's significant spending. It's their first attempt to show the Indians that they're serious, when those rights come up.
I wonder why they weren't able to squeeze some more promotional time on Channel 5 linked to Andy working there. He mentions it very occasionally (like when Dustin Fox was on one of the post-game shows), but they should at least get a brief billboard like the radio stations do for carrying weather... "Listen to NewsChannel 5 sports director Andy Baskin weekdays on 92.3 The Fan".
There may be disgruntled WKNR listeners, but CBS Radio has to get them to 92.3 first before you can count them.
DToTheJ said:vjm said:
Ah, typical juvenile show name - then again, what else would you expect from the typical juvenile WKNR?
I guess they want to save the "TNT" for their plan when 92.3 lays into them in the ratings... :
Just as long as we are spared the inevitable "'TNT' on KNR? It's Dy-no-MITE!" liner...
(I'm sorry... I couldn't resist. :
)SixOnTheFloor said:
And I've heard more than one promo for 98.5 on The Fan in the past day or two. I assume they aren't crossing the Male-to-Female Audience Wall and running 92.3/98.5 promos on 102.1/104.1.
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