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WKOX Upgrade question

F

FloridaBear1776

Guest
Would it make sense for Clear Channel to 'enhance' its upgrade of WKOX
by taking its San Antonio flagship WOAI directional, thus creating a situation
similar to that between KRLD (Dallas) and WTIC (Hartford)?
 
> Would it make sense for Clear Channel to 'enhance' its
> upgrade of WKOX
> by taking its San Antonio flagship WOAI directional, thus
> creating a situation
> similar to that between KRLD (Dallas) and WTIC (Hartford)?
>
Preposterous idea! Have you ANY idea of how many full-time stations there are on 1200 between Newton and San Antonio? Must be dozens! The latest (CP granted just a couple of weeks ago), will be licensed to Highland NY (Poughkeepsie) with 4.7 kW-D/1 kW-N DA-2 five towers day and night. A little farther northwest is WTLA N Syracuse 1 kW DA-N two towers. And north of WTLA is CFGO Ottawa 50 kW-U DA-2 (six towers nights beaming north). Farther west is WCHB Inkster MI (Detroit) 50 kW-D/15 kW-N DA-2 (ten towers nights beaming due north). And there is a powerful 1200 AM in Chicago. This list is scarcely complete!

WKOX was the first station (other than WOAI, of course) to apply for nighttime operation on 1200. The FCC accepted WKOX's application before the AM freeze that preceded the breakdown of the (then) IA clear channels circa 1980. Many applications were filed during the freeze but WKOX's application was the only one on any IA channel that was accepted for filing before the freeze began. WKOX's application was for 50 kW DA-N. When the freeze was lifted, the rules limited new Class II occupants of IA channels in the 48 contiguous states to 10 kW-D/1 kW-N. That limitation died only a few years later when the Rio treaty was signed sometime in the mid 80s.

Anyhow, when the freeze ended, WKOX scaled back its application to 10 kW/1 kW but it was deemed mutually exlusive with an application from WAGE Leesburg VA (then a daytimer on 1290). After a hearing, both applications were granted (WAGE's for 5 kW-D/1 kW-N DA-N), but WKOX had to accept significant nighttime interference from WAGE, which had proposed a site southwest of Leesburg. To protect WOAI, WAGE had to directionalize toward Boston using a two-tower array. Protecting WKOX while also covering Leesburg was impossible from WAGE's proposed site.

Given the 1-kW nighttime limitation, the significant co-channel interference from WAGE, and WKOX's desire to cover the whole MetroWest market, WKOX oriented its two-tower array with its axis at 215 degrees. That arrangement protected WAGE and provided nighttime coverage of Marlborough but proved to be a big problem when the 1-kW nighttime power limitation was lifted. The Town of Framingham refused building permits to reconfigure the towers in any way whatsoever. And stations, some of which I've listed above, were cropping up on 1200 all over the Northeast, Midwest, and Eastern Canada. A power increase that would have provided better service to suburbs between MetroWest and Boston became impossible because of the orientation of the towers. Were the towers at, say, 270 degrees, WAGE could have been protected and WKOX could probably have received a nighttime increase to 10 kW--maybe more--using the two existing towers (50 kW using three towers). All that is water under the bridge now, but the history and all of the NIMBYism around here have succeeded in delaying WKOX's power increase by more than a decade--so far.
 
Re: WKOX Upgrade question (Didn't They Win?)

Didn't we just read somewhere (Fybush?) that CC, WUNR, WRCA took the Newton issue to some sort of Mass. state land-use court; and won? But then that might be a temporary victory.... me thinking of WQTH-720, which won the same kind of battle in NH state court against town of Hanover NH (or was it Lebabnon NH?), but then soon after, the town passed a law that required all radio transmission sites must have something like a 10'-high fence around the entire perimeter of the site. In the case of WQTH-720, encircling 30 acres (4 towers) with such a fence might be more costly than building the towers.


> > Would it make sense for Clear Channel to 'enhance' its
> > upgrade of WKOX
> > by taking its San Antonio flagship WOAI directional, thus
> > creating a situation
> > similar to that between KRLD (Dallas) and WTIC (Hartford)?
>
> >
> Preposterous idea! Have you ANY idea of how many full-time
> stations there are on 1200 between Newton and San Antonio?
> Must be dozens! The latest (CP granted just a couple of
> weeks ago), will be licensed to Highland NY (Poughkeepsie)
> with 4.7 kW-D/1 kW-N DA-2 five towers day and night. A
> little farther northwest is WTLA N Syracuse 1 kW DA-N two
> towers. And north of WTLA is CFGO Ottawa 50 kW-U DA-2 (six
> towers nights beaming north). Farther west is WCHB Inkster
> MI (Detroit) 50 kW-D/15 kW-N DA-2 (ten towers nights beaming
> due north). And there is a powerful 1200 AM in Chicago. This
> list is scarcely complete!
>
> WKOX was the first station (other than WOAI, of course) to
> apply for nighttime operation on 1200. The FCC accepted
> WKOX's application before the AM freeze that preceded the
> breakdown of the (then) IA clear channels circa 1980. Many
> applications were filed during the freeze but WKOX's
> application was the only one on any IA channel that was
> accepted for filing before the freeze began. WKOX's
> application was for 50 kW DA-N. When the freeze was lifted,
> the rules limited new Class II occupants of IA channels in
> the 48 contiguous states to 10 kW-D/1 kW-N. That limitation
> died only a few years later when the Rio treaty was signed
> sometime in the mid 80s.
>
> Anyhow, when the freeze ended, WKOX scaled back its
> application to 10 kW/1 kW but it was deemed mutually
> exlusive with an application from WAGE Leesburg VA (then a
> daytimer on 1290). After a hearing, both applications were
> granted (WAGE's for 5 kW-D/1 kW-N DA-N), but WKOX had to
> accept significant nighttime interference from WAGE, which
> had proposed a site southwest of Leesburg. To protect WOAI,
> WAGE had to directionalize toward Boston using a two-tower
> array. Protecting WKOX while also covering Leesburg was
> impossible from WAGE's proposed site.
>
> Given the 1-kW nighttime limitation, the significant
> co-channel interference from WAGE, and WKOX's desire to
> cover the whole MetroWest market, WKOX oriented its
> two-tower array with its axis at 215 degrees. That
> arrangement protected WAGE and provided nighttime coverage
> of Marlborough but proved to be a big problem when the 1-kW
> nighttime power limitation was lifted. The Town of
> Framingham refused building permits to reconfigure the
> towers in any way whatsoever. And stations, some of which
> I've listed above, were cropping up on 1200 all over the
> Northeast, Midwest, and Eastern Canada. A power increase
> that would have provided better service to suburbs between
> MetroWest and Boston became impossible because of the
> orientation of the towers. Were the towers at, say, 270
> degrees, WAGE could have been protected and WKOX could
> probably have received a nighttime increase to 10 kW--maybe
> more--using the two existing towers (50 kW using three
> towers). All that is water under the bridge now, but the
> history and all of the NIMBYism around here have succeeded
> in delaying WKOX's power increase by more than a decade--so
> far.
>
 
Re: WKOX Upgrade question (Didn't They Win?)

> Didn't we just read somewhere (Fybush?) that CC, WUNR, WRCA
> took the Newton issue to some sort of Mass. state land-use
> court; and won? But then that might be a temporary
> victory.... me thinking of WQTH-720, which won the same
> kind of battle in NH state court against town of Hanover NH
> (or was it Lebabnon NH?), but then soon after, the town
> passed a law that required all radio transmission sites must
> have something like a 10'-high fence around the entire
> perimeter of the site. In the case of WQTH-720, encircling
> 30 acres (4 towers) with such a fence might be more costly
> than building the towers.

Well, as I understand it, they (KOX, RCA, UNR) won a battle--but not the war--at least not yet (if ever). The Land Court rejected the City of Newton's denial of a building permit and ordered the City to grant the permit within 14 days. The City immediately announced that it would appeal the Land Court decision, however. (I think the appeal is to the Commonwealth Supreme Court.) Scott did report that there were signs that the City appeared willing to negotiate with the radio stations, but I've seen no follow up except that, in the same column, Scott called this development "promising."

WQTH has applied to move its COL to Claremont (further south) and construct a six-tower setup south of that town. I believe that Vinikoor decided to proceed with building on the WQTH site, however. I'm pretty sure that his WUVR 1490 (licensed to Lebanon) is on the air from what was supposed to be the WQTH site. WUVR involves only one tower and 640W, however. Maybe Vinikoor got the Lebanon town fathers to agree to fencing around a small portion of the land for this low-power operation. I believe that WUVR is using a 240' top-loaded tower that Vinikoor originally intended to be one of WQTH's four towers. I'm pretty sure I recall that WUVR's application stated that WUVR would be diplexed into one of WQTH's towers.

WQTH continues to have its problems. though. It looked as if its application for Claremont with 50 kW-D/2.5 kW-N DA-2 (six-towers nights/four-towers days) was all set to fly, when the FCC found a fly in the ointment--an allocation for a 720 station (Class A, I believe) in a small town in Greenland!!! WQTH has now filed to reduce its night power to 670W. According to the app, even with the reduced power, the 12.8 mV/m NIF contour will cover 88% of Claremont. Since that's greater than 80%, the lower power ought to fly with the FCC. Anyone know whether Greenland is considered to be a part of Europe (9-kHz spacing) or a part of North America (10 kHz). It doesn't really matter; 720 happens to be one of those frequencies that is evenly divisible by both 9 and 10, but I am curious. Looking at a globe, I could see Greenland being called part of either Europe or North America--or neither one.
 
Re: WKOX Upgrade question (Didn't They Win?)

> ...Anyone know whether Greenland is considered to be a
> part of Europe (9-kHz spacing) or a part of North America
> (10 kHz). It doesn't really matter; 720 happens to be one of
> those frequencies that is evenly divisible by both 9 and 10,
> but I am curious. Looking at a globe, I could see Greenland
> being called part of either Europe or North America--or
> neither one.

Geographically, Greenland (known locally as Kalaallit Nunaat) is considered a part of North America. Politically, Greenland is a part of the Kingdom of Denmark, with limited self-governing powers. From what I've been able to determine, only 5 AM frequencies are in use on the island: 570, 650, 720, 810, and 900. The use of 570 and 650 leads me to believe they utilize 10 kHz spacing in that part of the world. On the FM side of things, they follow a non-North American approach, using .1 MHz separation (95.0, 96.1, 98.2 etc.).

Sources:
http://www.tvradioworld.com/region1/grl/Radio_Tv_Frequencies.asp
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/gl.html

Peace.

<P ID="signature">______________
It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt.
-- Samuel Langhorne Clemens
</P>
 
Re: WKOX Upgrade question (Didn't They Win?)

> Geographically, Greenland (known locally as Kalaallit
> Nunaat) is considered a part of North America. Politically,
> Greenland is a part of the Kingdom of Denmark, with limited
> self-governing powers. From what I've been able to
> determine, only 5 AM frequencies are in use on the island:
> 570, 650, 720, 810, and 900. The use of 570 and 650 leads
> me to believe they utilize 10 kHz spacing in that part of
> the world. On the FM side of things, they follow a
> non-North American approach, using .1 MHz separation (95.0,
> 96.1, 98.2 etc.).

Thanks! Well, if a 720 in Claremont NH running 2500W-N would interfere with the Greenland 720, just imagine what WGY must do to the Greenland 810. But there is also a 650 in Gander Newfoundland (well, an allocation, anyway) 5 kW-N DA-N two towers with most signal going north, east, and south (daytime power and pattern unclear). Gander is a lot closer to Greenland than Claremont is.
 
Re: WKOX Upgrade question (Didn't They Win?)

> > Geographically, Greenland (known locally as Kalaallit
> > Nunaat) is considered a part of North America.
> Politically,
> > Greenland is a part of the Kingdom of Denmark, with
> limited
> > self-governing powers. From what I've been able to
> > determine, only 5 AM frequencies are in use on the island:
>
> > 570, 650, 720, 810, and 900. The use of 570 and 650 leads
>
> > me to believe they utilize 10 kHz spacing in that part of
> > the world. On the FM side of things, they follow a
> > non-North American approach, using .1 MHz separation
> (95.0,
> > 96.1, 98.2 etc.).
>
> Thanks! Well, if a 720 in Claremont NH running 2500W-N would
> interfere with the Greenland 720, just imagine what WGY must
> do to the Greenland 810. But there is also a 650 in Gander
> Newfoundland (well, an allocation, anyway) 5 kW-N DA-N two
> towers with most signal going north, east, and south
> (daytime power and pattern unclear). Gander is a lot closer
> to Greenland than Claremont is.

Even though we're talking about a 720 CP in NH that could cause a problem for something in Greenland. There is a AM 720 in the way of that, that runs 10kw-U, DA-N.. CHTN Charlottetown PEI, which I'm sure is nulled towards Chicago.
>
 
Re: WKOX Upgrade question (Didn't They Win?)

Greenland-720 isn't on my AMSTNS database viewer, but CHTN DOES have a deep null toward Chicago.


Dave Gardiner

WVCH 740/WNWR 1540

Philadelphia
 
Re: WKOX Upgrade question (Didn't They Win?)

> Greenland-720 isn't on my AMSTNS database viewer, but CHTN
> DOES have a deep null toward Chicago.
>
>
> Dave Gardiner
>
> WVCH 740/WNWR 1540
>
> Philadelphia
>
The Greenland 720 is located in Simiutaq, on the southeastern shore of the island, just south of the Arctic Circle, due west of Iceland (65° 52'N, 37° 2'W). It is operated by KNR (Kalaallit Nunaata Radio, or Greenland Broadcasting Company to those of us who don't speak Greenlandic), as are all of the stations on the AM band in GL. The 720 station operates with 20 kW ND1.
Sometimes I think I have way too much free time!

Sources:
http://www.travelpost.com/EU/Greenland/Ostgronland/Simiutaq/6299763
http://www.am-dx.com/lists/greenlan.htm
http://knr.gl/in_english/about_knr/
(in addition to the sources cited in my earlier post in this thread)

Peace.

<P ID="signature">______________
It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt.
-- Samuel Langhorne Clemens
</P>
 
Re: WKOX Upgrade question (Didn't They Win?)

> Even though we're talking about a 720 CP in NH that could
> cause a problem for something in Greenland. There is a AM
> 720 in the way of that, that runs 10kw-U, DA-N.. CHTN
> Charlottetown PEI, which I'm sure is nulled towards Chicago.
>
Thanks, I had forgotten about CHTN! What's more, both it an CFCY (the other PEI AM) have applied to the CRTC (or do I mean Industrie Canada?) to move to FM. And I think FM channels have been allocated to them. Anyhow, if this FM move is like all the other such moves I know of in Canada, the AM allocations will remain internationally notified in perpetuity. I can't believe that CHTN doesn't deliver a much bigger signal to Greenland than would a station in Lebanon NH running 2.5 kW-N into six towers and protecting both WGN and CHTN. I would think that the combination of CHTN and WGN would make Lebanon drop out of the 25%-exclusion NIF calculation for the Greenland station. If that were so, there would be no reason for WQTH to have to reduce its night power (or at least to have to reduce its night power by almost 75%). I can't figure out what's going on.
 
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