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WPHT shake up

George Brusstar said:
There are plenty of "shadow city" markets where the smaller station carrying Limbaugh isn't loaded with PSAs during local avails-- despite the bigger-town station's signal being about as good as WPHT's is in Wilmington. I'm thinking of Providence and Baltimore. Even WSBA York-- last I heard, had plenty of locals despite WHP Harrisburg's looming in.

Providence might have been an OK example when Limbaugh was on WRKO in Boston--I believe that WRKO's signal in Providence is quite good BUT nowhere near what local WHJJ does. Remember, Boston is in New England and the soil conductivity here is quite poor. Now, Limbaugh is on WXKS (AM), which is 50 kw, owned by CCU, and has its transmitter about 15 miles closer to Providence than WRKO's Tx. Still WXKS's higher dial position, shorter towers, and directional pattern that doesn't push way more than the equivalent of 50 kW toward Providence do not help it down there. WXKS has applied to tweak its daytime directional pattern, which will slightly improve its signal in Providence, but the signal will still be only marginally more than 0.5 mV/m. Nowhere near enough to be competitive.
 
Thanks Dan, I forgot Rush wasn't on 'RKO anymore... And within Wilmington city proper, WILM's signal blows away WPHT's...

But my point was more about sales, and not engineering. I realize Wilmington isn't exactly a bastion of conservatism, but there are plenty of other left-leaning markets that have no problem selling Rush. If a station/cluster isn't able (or willing) to sell the most listened-to program in the history of modern radio-- maybe it's time to find a new hobby.

If Limbaugh's (or Beck's or Hannity's) carriage fees simply made it uneconomical for WPHT to continue its present course, that's one thing. But for a station to be loading local avails in the mid-day with Smokey-The-Bear PSAs during Rush Limbaugh in a Top 75 market? That's pretty sad. I'm pretty sure there weren't PSAs filling local time when Rush was carried on WDEL a few years back.
 
ccuphl said:
The WUBA signal is not a player in the market. It never has been.
Sam Lit said:
Actually, there was a time.
George Brusstar said:
Sam beat me to it... Wasn't exactly a flamethrower, but certainly a lot better than the IBOC-ridden whimper it is now...

1480/WDAS-AM was a legendary Rhythm and Blues heritage station located in the beautiful Fairmount Park section of Philadelphia. I had the privilege of growing up there are a kid, with my step brothers and sisters, as my stepfather Bob Klein was General Manager and owner. The term legendary does not even capture what WDAS-AM was to Philadelphia or the role it played as setting the standard of urban radio, both locally and nationally. WDAS’s influence was unequalled, where Philadelphia and the country heard the Rhythm & Blues hits and The Sound of Philadelphia first. It was unique and magical, with an extraordinary on air presentation that began at the dawn of Rock and Roll in 1951, when Rock and Roll meant Rhythm and Blues. WDAS was an influence that was heard and woven into the fabric of our society, as well as the broadcast industry, nation wide.

WDAS Studios

WDAS Soul Surfers Survey

WDAS More Soul Sounds Album

The WDAS studios in beautiful historic Fairmont Park were one of the most exciting full service, on air engineer broadcast assisted, RCA blue print facilities that I have ever seen. And I have seen them all, including as you know WIBG, where I also grew up as a kid. The Disc Jockeys were true radio wizards, and the home of legends like Jocko Henderson, Georgie Woods, Kae Williams, Jimmy Bishop, Larry Daily, Carl Helm, Louis Williams, Joe (Butterball) Tamburro, and many more. Even Hy Lit was on WDAS-AM in 1969 from 1-4pm, as he launched WDAS-FM into contemporary underground radio beginning in late 1968. (see Hy Lit History Page for a history timeline).

Hy Lit WDAS Publicity Photo

WDAS Licence Plate

wdashistory.org was assimilated by Wynne Alexander (Wynne Klein), my step sister, Bob Klein’s oldest, and, Max Leons granddaughter. Bob Klein, Max's son-in-law, General Manager, and part owner of WDAS, married my mother after her and Hy divorced. Even before as Hy’s best friend, (that’s another story for another time), Bob and his kids were part of a close family inner circle that dated way back before I was born. Bob was originally married to Max Leon’s daughter. Max Leon was a Jewish immigrant and at the age of 16 came to the US from Poland (Swierze) with a violin, four dimes, and a suitcase. Max ultimately became the general manager of a candy factory at which he began work as a candy breaker. He then became the owner of that same company, the Whole-Sum Products in 1934. They made different types of sweets while inventing marshmallow ice cream for the Breyers Ice Cream Company headquartered in the Grays Ferry section of Philadelphia. He kept the candy factory all during the WDAS days. In fact, the candy company was a major sponsor on WDAS radio. There was many a year in which I heard the ‘Dainty Mints’ commercials on the air, and in the production studio. Dainty Mints was one of the staple nickel sugar product lines manufactured by Whole-Sum Products. Max made a bundle, one nickel at a time, literally. He made millions and in 1943, he founded, financed and conducted "the Philadelphia Pops Orchestra" which was the the prelude to what is now the Philadelphia orchestra.

Saturday afternoons saw Max and his members of the Philadelphia Pops Orchestra practicing on the 4th floor of his candy factory and at the Lorraine Hotel on Broad Street. Max "broadcast" the rehearsal throughout the plant through a loudspeaker system in the production area. During the Second World War, the orchestra played concerts at Army and Navy hospitals, service centers, camps, stations and raised over $6,000,000 in war bond sales. Leon organized it, led it, paid all the bills, and was their conductor. It was his baby. Throughout the years, he continued to conduct the eighty piece Philly Pops with performances at the Academy of Music.

For twenty-nine years, Max M. Leon owned the majority interest in WDAS which he purchased for a half million dollars on October 19, 1950 from William Goldman (a theater chain owner.). WDAS was originally licensed to Ocean City, NJ, Subsequent ownership was retained by retailers Dannenbaum & Steppacher, Thus the call letters "W-D-A-S. Dannenbaum & Steppacher moved the station to Philly where it has remained ever since. Bob Klein, and Leon applied for and was granted a construction permit for an FM station and in 1959, 105.3/WDAS-FM was licensed and came on the air. (105.3 was originally WHAT-FM/105.3 and was abandoned when WHAT-FM moved to 96.5 Mhz. Up until Hy launched Hyski’s underground on WDAS-FM in late 1968, WDAS-FM was Max’s personal playground for the fine arts in Philadelphia. (Coincidentally, Hy was heard on 105.3 when his 1340/WHAT-AM radio show was simulcast on WHAT-FM/105.3, from 1954-55).


Factoid: 1972 WDAS' Bob Klein files a class action suit against the Arbitron rating service on behalf of all black radio stations and proves that black radio listenership was undercounted. Arbitron settles after four days of testimony and amends its methologies and policies.
Factoid: 1968: Bob Klein hires Hy Lit as V.P. and General Manager of WDAS-FM. Hyski’s underground is launched on WDAS-FM. Hy also does 1-4 afternoons on WDAS-AM.
Factoid: 1968 The campaign waged by WDAS News against Girard College's "white only" policy is victorious, when US Supreme Court orders that black students be allowed to attend the school.
Factoid: 1967 WDAS personality and Gospel Queen Louise Williams introduce a young gospel singer, Aretha Franklin to Jerry Wexler of Atlantic Records... and the rest is music history.
Factoid: 1962 Georgie Woods breaks the Beatles', "Please, Please Me," originally on the African-American owned, Chicago-based Vee-Jay Records label.
Factoid: 1960 Louise Williams hired by Bob Klein to come to WDAS-AM to do gospel. WDAS Charities established to address the needs of the community. WDAS Charities initiates "WDAS Freedom Shows," both Rock n' Roll and gospel concerts that raise money to benefit those in need in the Philadelphia community. John "Lord Fauntleroy" Bandy appointed Assistant General Manager at WDAS, one of the first African-Americans to hold that position in radio nationwide. WDAS commissions further market research and listenership study with E. John Bucci, President Kennedy's chief statistician. WDAS initiates one of the first voter registration drives. WDAS credited with increasing African-American voter registration by mayor of Philadelphia.
Factoid: 1956 Georgie Woods joins "Jocko" Henderson at WDAS-AM.
Factoid: 1953 "Jocko" Henderson hired at WDAS-AM in Philadelphia on October 5th. Georgie Woods hired as an air personality at WHAT-AM after a brief stint at WWRL-AM in New York.

Meanwhile Joe Tamburro (butterball) who began his career spinning records for Hy Lit at record hops in the late 50's and who met my stepfather, Bob Klein through the association with Hy, started DJ’ing on WDAS-AM in the late ‘60’s and began programming WDAS FM in the 70’s. He is still there as program director to this day.

Hy Lit WDAS FM Newspaper Ad
 
George Brusstar said:
I realize Wilmington isn't exactly a bastion of conservatism, but there are plenty of other left-leaning markets that have no problem selling Rush... for a station to be loading local avails in the mid-day with Smokey-The-Bear PSAs during Rush Limbaugh in a Top 75 market? That's pretty sad...

Are you kidding? I believe the new "Rush Radio 1200" in Boston still plays PSA's during commercial breaks today!
 
Diamond Joe, you're picking up the 1200 in Boston from the Bronx?

Because if you're listening on the stream, the station (like most others) covers up the real spots with PSAs and other garbage (because most terrestrial radio operators are clueless and treat their streams like throwaways-- then wonder why their demos are geriatric).
 
Not that I want to see a 3rd right-wing talk station here, but nobody has speculated about 640 AM switching from Disney to talk. They have been selling off their middle market stations, maybe they'd see an opening with talk here at this time. The station signal might be somewhat compared to that of 1200 in Boston, strong in the market daytime, weak at night but still reaching key areas.
 
aindik said:
newhampshiredude said:
aindik said:
Are we sure the 4-7 shift is tape delayed from four hours before?

To answer this question, I was actually wrong. There was an earlier article I read that has since been corrected which said that Smerconish would keep his noon-3 program and broadcast the 3-4 live to Philly. It seems weird to offer the syndicated Smerconish from 4-7 when they could do the local hour at 6 instead of at 3. It just seems like this is more standard for talk radio lineups.

So, they ARE using a four hour tape delay for the 4-7 portion of afternoon drive.


As far as I know, Smerconish's national show will now air live from 4pm-7pm ET. I have read conflicting information on this online. Mayeb Dial Global should clear it up.
 
George Brusstar said:
Diamond Joe, you're picking up the 1200 in Boston from the Bronx? Because if you're listening on the stream, the station (like most others) covers up the real spots with PSAs and other garbage...

It was reported on the Boston board that they were full of them - at least when they first started, but I thought I read a poster in another thread say they still hear PSA's on 1200:
http://boards.radio-info.com/smf/index.php?topic=164566.0
 
Not sure if the Mouse wants to dump WWJZ. The 50 kW day signal does reasonably well, but who are they protecting at night to be limited to 950 watts?That low power at night would again be a deal breaker, unless a CP
moving to Horsham with 50 kW-D, 39 kW-N, DA-2 was built out.
 
TheBigA said:
How about Sounds of Sinatra 24/7? The demo is about the same as Rush.

I'm 41, I listen to Rush, Sean, The Great One & Preston & Steve. I only hear Sinatra when Pierre Robert plays him on 'MMR.
 
Does this shake up have anything to do with the Phillies extending their contact with WPHT for an additional season in 2011?

I can understand both Beck and Hannity not wanting to be on tape delay from 7pm to 10pm at night due to the Phillies. What I don't get though is that they dropped Beck, who was based at the station from 2002 until 2010.

Any thoughts from the gallery?
 
laserm2r said:
Does this shake up have anything to do with the Phillies extending their contact with WPHT for an additional season in 2011?

I can understand both Beck and Hannity not wanting to be on tape delay from 7pm to 10pm at night due to the Phillies. What I don't get though is that they dropped Beck, who was based at the station from 2002 until 2010.

Any thoughts from the gallery?

Beck moved his show to NYC in early 2006, when his talk show on HLN debuted. It's been hosted from Premiere's studios at Radio City ever since.

Since 2008, Buckley's WOR/710 has been his flagship station.
 
laserm2r said:
Does this shake up have anything to do with the Phillies extending their contact with WPHT for an additional season in 2011?

I can understand both Beck and Hannity not wanting to be on tape delay from 7pm to 10pm at night due to the Phillies. What I don't get though is that they dropped Beck, who was based at the station from 2002 until 2010.

Any thoughts from the gallery?

This shakeup has EVERYTHING to do with conveniencing Michael Smerconish. He's the one who likely initiated ALL of this, and probably brought Giordano along for the ride or at least gave him the impetus to demand a regular outlet instead of the Phillies-laden timeslot.

Look no further than Smerconishes ego.
 
DG02816 said:
who are they protecting at night to be limited to 950 watts?

I believe they are protecting several stations: Akron OH, Westfield MA, St. Johns NF. They were all on 640 prior to WWJZ. I might add to the list Blountville TN, which came on about the same time as WWJZ, if memory serves me correctly.
 
rtetro said:
I believe they are protecting several stations: Akron OH, Westfield MA, St. Johns NF. They were all on 640 prior to WWJZ.

Akron and NF were on 640 _long_ before anyone proposed breaking down the I-A clear channels. In fact, NF was on 640 with 10-kW-U ND-U before NF was absorbed into Canada! Akron operated from local sunrise to L.A. sunset, so it wasn't a full-timer but it was on until around 8:00PM in mid-winter and until nearly 11:00PM in the summer. I guess that if KFI was off the air overnight, Akron was able to sign on in the early morning (before Akron sunrise in the winter). Class II-D stations on I-A channels were allowed to operate at night when the dominant I-A was off the air. And many of the I-As did sign off overnight--at least until the 1950s, when the FCC mandated that they stay on overnight at least six nights a week for "skywave monitoring," which was related to the above-ground nuclear tests in Nevada. If KFI signed off from, say, 1:00AM to 5:00AM PST, Akron could have signed on at 4:00AM EST and then could probably have stayed on continuously until close to 8:00PM EST, even in December--and later in other months. The other limited-time stations on 640 back in the day were Norman OK and Ames IA.
 
John1 said:
Not that I want to see a 3rd right-wing talk station here, but nobody has speculated about 640 AM switching from Disney to talk. They have been selling off their middle market stations, maybe they'd see an opening with talk here at this time. The station signal might be somewhat compared to that of 1200 in Boston, strong in the market daytime, weak at night but still reaching key areas.

That's ONLY if someone was interested in buying 640 from Disney... and again, so far, it's only the smaller-market stations that are being sold. In Pittsburgh, Disney is flipping their ESPN Radio O&O to Radio Disney come January, basically conceding the sports radio race to CBS and Clear Channel.

Besides, Disney sold off ABC Radio to Citahell a few years back, so it wouldn't make any sense to start such a station after leaving that portfolio behind outright.

The likelihood that 640 flips to talk: -72%.
 
DanStrassberg said:
rtetro said:
I believe they are protecting several stations: Akron OH, Westfield MA, St. Johns NF. They were all on 640 prior to WWJZ.

Akron and NF were on 640 _long_ before anyone proposed breaking down the I-A clear channels. In fact, NF was on 640 with 10-kW-U ND-U before NF was absorbed into Canada! Akron operated from local sunrise to L.A. sunset, so it wasn't a full-timer but it was on until around 8:00PM in mid-winter and until nearly 11:00PM in the summer. I guess that if KFI was off the air overnight, Akron was able to sign on in the early morning (before Akron sunrise in the winter). Class II-D stations on I-A channels were allowed to operate at night when the dominant I-A was off the air. And many of the I-As did sign off overnight--at least until the 1950s, when the FCC mandated that they stay on overnight at least six nights a week for "skywave monitoring," which was related to the above-ground nuclear tests in Nevada. If KFI signed off from, say, 1:00AM to 5:00AM PST, Akron could have signed on at 4:00AM EST and then could probably have stayed on continuously until close to 8:00PM EST, even in December--and later in other months. The other limited-time stations on 640 back in the day were Norman OK and Ames IA.

WHLO/640 Akron only operates with 500 watts nighttime. It covers the Akron/Canton region (and parts of neighboring Cleveland) rather decently.

The protection issues with KFI also affect the 640 signal in Atlanta, where CC talker WGST is a powerful 50,000 watts in the daytime, but it's puny 1,000 watt night signal can't even cover half of the sprawling Atlanta metro area.
 
Nathan Obral said:
The protection issues with KFI also affect the 640 signal in Atlanta, where CC talker WGST is a powerful 50,000 watts in the daytime, but it's puny 1,000 watt night signal can't even cover half of the sprawling Atlanta metro area.

I'm sure if Clear Channel wanted to invest the capital into a new transmitting plant with enough towers situation due West of Atlanta proper and beam every signal watt due East directly over Atlanta proper, WGST can get a nighttime power increase. The question, which only an AM directional RF engineer can answer, is how many towers will it take to get the job done? And at what cost?
 
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