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WPOZ/WMYZ upgrade questions
- Thread starter JH_Radio
- Start date
R
rbrucecarter5
Guest
Looking at the list, I think they take the translators dark or sell them off, since they are no longer required. WPOZ has had a history of a bad frequency, difficult to shoehorn in, and other stations moving in and cutting them off from upgrades. Over the course of the last 15 years, they have worked hard to buy the little guys out, take them dark so they can upgrade. It is quite interesting, perhaps we can hear directly from them. Hats off to them - taking a frequency and situation almost nobody would want (or envy), and turning it around to a full service station in the area.
Dean ONeal has been known to chime in, so perhaps he'll give insite.
what was 88.3 before WPOZ was on the signal?
so WMYZ and WHYZ were also stations that people didn't want?
I'm wondering which signal would penitrate The Villages? If not the translator which we use now, i was thinking perhaps WMYZ? I know they need to protect 88.1 WHIK/Ocala.
what was 88.3 before WPOZ was on the signal?
so WMYZ and WHYZ were also stations that people didn't want?
I'm wondering which signal would penitrate The Villages? If not the translator which we use now, i was thinking perhaps WMYZ? I know they need to protect 88.1 WHIK/Ocala.
Just thinking out loud again, but I was kinda' hoping once the upgrades happen that they would move 106.3 The Rock to the better signaled 88.7 (keep it on 88.3 & 91.1's HD-3 of course) and maybe sell or lease 106.3 out to someone. From looking at the potential coverage maps the upgraded 88.3 should cover what 88.7 does. Perhaps clear channel could lease 106.3 for an FM simulcast for WYGM much like what they do for WFLF on 104.5. I occasionally flip the translator on when I'm not listening to Sirius but I live on the fringe of 106.3's signal and lose them too quickly in my car and I don't have an HD radio.
C
cd637299
Guest
John Holcomb II said:
I'm not Dean, but I think it debuted in 1993 or so as WEAZ with maybe 3 kW. I caught it as DX in south FL then....of course Miami now has its own 88.3 WGNK.
If the Ocala 88.1 isn't shut down, it'd have to be WMYZ 88.7 to upgrade, if it does. A member of RD mentioned 91.7 in Pierson (owned by the Z folk) coming on the air recently---with already a 91.7 in Gainesville, I doubt that it would be heard well in Ocala. With all the translators in Ocala, I'm sure that Z can get one, if they haven't already.
BTW there was WLMS 88.3 in Lecanto (Citrus County), but they were shut down so that Z can upgrade, IIRC. WLMS & WEAZ co-existed for awhile, right?
cd
R
rbrucecarter5
Guest
cd637299 said:
I'm not Dean, either, but I lived in Florida when the station came on the air. I wasn't aware of anything else on 88.3, it was pretty much a blank frequency. I think it was more like 1995. The original WEAZ license, as I recall, was for 100kW but only at 300 feet. In order to go on the tall tower, they had to be only 3 kW and employ beam tilt, which is a bit unusual. Still, even the original signal covered Orlando very well. In fact, this was around the time that WCIE went off the air, so there were a lot of displaced WCIE listeners that would hear WEAZ in Lakeland. They reported that WEAZ was stronger over Lakeland than WCIE formerly was over Orlando. Pretty good on only 3 kW.
I am not Dean either but I have a lot of respect for WPOZ and what they have accomplished over the years.. plus their commitment to severe weather coverage... who else is live at 3am when a Tornado warning happens? other stations you may get the EAS pass thru but POZ strives to ensure their audience is informed and stays on top of things until the threat has passed.
88.3 was probably greatly limited by TV channel 6. (see FCC regulation 73.525)
Since channel 6 moved to a different frequency with the 2009 digital switchover, it's no longer susceptible to interference from 88.3. Indeed, WPOZ also needs to protect (or buy out) other stations at the bottom of the band. But those stations were also limited by channel 6 so there aren't all that many of them & they're not all that powerful either.
Since channel 6 moved to a different frequency with the 2009 digital switchover, it's no longer susceptible to interference from 88.3. Indeed, WPOZ also needs to protect (or buy out) other stations at the bottom of the band. But those stations were also limited by channel 6 so there aren't all that many of them & they're not all that powerful either.
R
rbrucecarter5
Guest
w9wi said:
I think they had a very close and amiable relationship with channel 6. I know a similar situation happened in the Houston area when KSBJ signed on at its original frequency of 88.1. There was a channel 6 in Beaumont, and they spent a lot of time mitigating interference complaints by channel 6 viewers. They could only upgrade by changing to 89.3. WPOZ is 200 kHz further away on 88.3, and I think they phase locked their frequency to channel 6 to help. TVs have gotten better since then as well, even the old NTSC sets used much better ceramic filters for audio than in the 80's. I noticed on a pledge drive they were trying to get on their own tower, I forget whether that was the old channel 6 tower or another tower that was abandoned.
rbrucecarter5 said:
Indeed, they were on the channel 6 tower -- colocation is definitely one way to keep the interference under control. Still, channel 6 would have limited WPOZ's power -- and I would be quite confident it's channel 6's frequency change that made WPOZ's power increase possible.
WPOZ is still on the tower channel 6 used for analog transmission, but channel 6's digital transmitter isn't. (it's very close but a different tower) Other stations on that tower are WMFE-FM 90.7 and WUCF-TV channel 24.
I agree with most of the other comments. From what I've seen, this is a station group that does very well with severe weather coverage - I even see them post about it on Facebook. And, if they are able to upgrade their main signal, I would think the smaller signals would be moved over to their youth formats (Hot 95.9 / 106.3 The Rock). For translators, I think they have done well in the ratings. And in general, Z 88.3 has great ratings, which any station of any format would be thrilled to have.
Yes they do broadcast from the channel 6 tower, I rememger seeing it when they were getting money for the upgrade.
They plan to move to the top of the tower.
Maybe what happens to all these translators is wait and see?
I dont think Orlando stations reach Palm Bey, so the 97.9 would still be needed to translate.
They are always live and local as I can see, except for Christmas day.
They plan to move to the top of the tower.
Maybe what happens to all these translators is wait and see?
I dont think Orlando stations reach Palm Bey, so the 97.9 would still be needed to translate.
They are always live and local as I can see, except for Christmas day.
R
rbrucecarter5
Guest
John Holcomb II said:
I used to live in Palm Bay, they had an interesting problem down there. A local church put an 88.5 on the air years ago. I think WPOZ ended up buying it and taking it dark so they could upgrade.
w9wi said:
73.525 doesn't apply if you get a letter of consent from the affected Six. Z (CFEF)(Jim Hoge) always got that letter. And as long as Bob Deihl was Chief at Six, most noncoms got letters too: WJLU, WPIO, WEJF, WHGS (Haines City), and WKSG (Ocala area) all have letters from Six signed by Bob Deihl, or they wouldn't have the power they have today.
When Z got chummy with Six and Bob was let go, Z continued to get what it wanted (they were diplexing into the Six antenna) and nobody else got anything, forcing them back comply with 73.525. Fortunately, 73.525 allows power increases if you forego some or all of the horizontal component. Six couldn't stop WKSG from going from 2KW H&V to 26KW V and there are others with similar stories.
Also, Z can't close any station down without first purchasing it, and convincing the FCC that there is adequate noncom service to the area. EG, in Palm Bay when they bought and darkened WWIA they had to show that two other services were covering the area (WFIT and WEJF)(WMFE's 60dBu falls short).
Z and the MYZ are maxed out directional's at this point. I.E. they have to go on a buying spree and demonstrate two services for any purchase made to shut down that service.
I hope this clears some of it up for the curious.
PS: Z's top prayer list item: Lord, don't let Salem or K-Love pick up a Class C in Orlando.
John Holcomb II said:
Plan? How so? Do you see an application filed to do that? Currently they're on a tower (I think about 4 miles) south of the Six tower. To move north and to utilize (the top, or any height) of the old Six tower, they'd have to reduce their power to protect 3rd adjacent WKTO. I could run a V-Soft map if there were need to prove what I'm saying.
There is a goal to purchase the tower but it wouldn't be an upgrade to the service footprint they are licensed for currently. The good: they'd be an owner not a renter.
And to the degree that height is always a better trade off than power, going to the top, even with a fraction of the existing watts, is better than less height and more watts. So, I guess in that sense, it's an upgrade.
wpio said:
The tower WPOZ currently uses for its licensed operation (BLED-20081106AJU) is the old "Six" tower, ASRN 1026744 on Lake Pickett Road at the northwest corner of the Bithlo/Christmas tower farm. WKMG's digital operations were never there - they're over at a newer master tower off Brown Road to the east. WFTV also left that "Six" tower at the end of analog, moving to its own new tower on Fort Christmas Road. (Just to add to the confusion, WPOZ has a CP to move to the Cox/WFTV tower, though it's probably not going to happen now that Z owns the "Six" tower.)
The Z transmitter is the only thing now active in the old "Six" transmitter building on Lake Pickett Road. Here are some pictures:
http://www.fybush.com/site-20130301/
(There were separate buildings at the site for WFTV and for WMFE FM-TV; the WFTV building has no broadcast tenants now, and the WMFE building is still being used by 90.7 and by what's now WUCF-TV, RF 25/virtual 24.)
Did you notice the ERP on the licensed tower? 13KW. That's the upgrade you're talking about. Buying, owning and moving the license to the Old Six tower from a couple miles south also included reducing ERP from 100KW DA to 13KW nondirectional. (although they could go directional from there but are held to 13KW in some directions).
And there's a CP to move back to the two-miles-south tower. What do you make of that? I don't know what to make of it.
An ND antenna may make just as much sense as a complicated (85% filled) pattern of a DA where there would be 100KW south but still only 13KW north.
I wasn't aware that the license had moved north...so thank you for that....yet holds a CP to move that license back south. (FCC FM Query data, that's all I'm going by)
And there's a CP to move back to the two-miles-south tower. What do you make of that? I don't know what to make of it.
An ND antenna may make just as much sense as a complicated (85% filled) pattern of a DA where there would be 100KW south but still only 13KW north.
I wasn't aware that the license had moved north...so thank you for that....yet holds a CP to move that license back south. (FCC FM Query data, that's all I'm going by)
wpio said:
I think it's "keeping options open." When they filed for that CP, Z didn't yet own the "Old Six" tower...so they could have paid rent there, or at the WFTV/Cox tower where the CP is located. Once they bought the "Old Six" tower, they weren't going to build out the CP at the WFTV/Cox site, so they just left the CP to expire (which it will, very soon.)
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