As you probably know, only 11 days left of WRGB-TV (channel 6) on standard analog TV until it will go digital until June 12th. On the radio side, WRGB still carries TV audio on 87.7, no word on whether of not WRGB up in Albany will no longer broadcasting on analog on the radio frequency on 87.7, look what they did with WPVI in Philadelphia, they will go digital by June 12th and WPVI will no longer broadcast TV audio on 87.7 on the FM band. All you hear is static. This is what I've mentioned in the HV board on my 2009 predictions thread about WRGB going digital on February 17th, but it was delayed until June 12th which is 11 days away. Any thoughts?
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WRGB Going Digital By June 12th, What About 87.7?
- Thread starter disney fanatic
- Start date
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kenglish
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87.7 is not a radio channel, but is just the aural FM frequency of their analog TV channel.
So, it will go away when their analog TV goes.
So, it will go away when their analog TV goes.
kenglish said:
While that's generally true, WRGB may turn out to be a special case. Their chief engineer has been widely quoted as saying he's going to ask the FCC for experimental permission to continue running the analog audio signal at cross-polarization to the DTV signal. There's considerable skepticism about whether that could possibly work, but I suppose I can't fault them for at least trying.
Scott Fybush said:
I can't find any record they've actually asked for anything. Then again, sometimes experimental applications and Special Temporary Authorities don't make the website.
But you can count me at the top of the list of skeptics. Their plans would actually work nicely if everyone (both FM and TV) had a proper antenna properly installed. (and everyone lived in "free space" with no trees or buildings or power poles) Of course, that's not the world we live in!
As I was mentioned on the HV board that WRGB already went digital as of 11:59 PM. If you are listening to the radio at 87.7, you will hear nothing but static. I have a cable box in my room that has digital only right before the switch, still goes on.
No more analog TV on channel 6 and on 87.7 FM. WPVI out in Philly already went digital as of 12:15 PM, same thing.
No more analog TV on channel 6 and on 87.7 FM. WPVI out in Philly already went digital as of 12:15 PM, same thing.
WRGB's website states that there were technical difficulties with implementing 87.7 companion to digital, but they are saying they will have it resolved in a week. Question: might keeping 87.7 be the reason they only have 6-1 and 6-2? Might they be using less bandwidth so that 87.7 up on one end might not have the digital noise close to it? (I should note that many other stations have 3 or more services on their channel)
THE_KNICKMAN said:
A DTV station *must* transmit a full-bandwidth RF signal, or receivers won't be able to pick it up. If there isn't enough programming to require the full 19.2MB of datastream, the stream multiplexer fills the rest with "null packets" -- the station essentially transmits dead air in between the useful data bits.
From what I've read, WRGB hopes to accomplish this 87.7 thing by using cross polarization - transmitting the digital TV signal horizontally and the analog FM signal vertically.
It should work at the transmitter.
I will be VERY VERY surprised if it works at the receivers.
(I think there's a good reason we've heard absolutely NOTHING about WPVI/Philadelphia trying this)
Thanks for the info w9wi, a further question as I have not studied DTV. A TV channel being 6 MHZ wide, is their any "guard band" at the edges of the channel? If for no other reason, to minimize adjacent channel interference? Are there any good publications that describe the technical aspects of the DTV format being used?
THE_KNICKMAN said:
http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ISSUES/what_is_ATSC.html looks to be a pretty good description of ATSC DTV.
There are very strict "RF mask" requirements for DTV transmitters. In a number of cases, adjacent channels have been used at the same or nearby sites, which of course requires that the ATSC signal be restricted to its own channel! For example, until they transitioned in February, Madison, Wis. stations WHA-TV and WKOW-TV operated digital signals on channels 20 and 26 respectively -- adjacent to their own analogs on 21 and 27.
There are many more examples, some of which don't involve co-siting. Here in Nashville, WKRN-TV operates a digital signal on channel 27 from a site about 5 miles south of Nashville -- while WNPX ran its analog signal (until early last week) on channel 28 from a site nearly 40 miles to the east.
I cannot find a document or rule that explains exactly what guard band is available.....
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