WXXI & The Little Theater Merger

[The Voice of Reason]

Soon it will take a full minute to recite all the station IDs, just like North Country Public Radio. Regional networking seems to be the trend in public broadcasting. I'm not sure of the rules, but is there a practical limit to this kind of consolidation?

Alan Chartock has been adding to WAMC's media empire for years.

http://www.wamc.org/station.html

Check out the number of stations plus translators on their website. Try reciting all of those call letters within a minute without passing out or losing your voice.

 

[aaronread]

I also wouldn't be surprised if WXXI changes the call letters of WVWA, as it did with the Houghton station to WXXY.

I *have* to think they will. The only reason I chose WVWA for the 90.3 CP in Auburn was on a lark to get a laugh out of Scott Fybush. After all, I was as shocked as anyone that we were granted as a singleton (I was pretty sure SOMEONE would MX us) and I had to pick something and quick.

As for what, exactly, they'll change it to...I imagine that'll be determined by what programming goes on it. And therein lies the rub. WVWA's CP was designed around the concept of a single panel antenna on the Cayuga County's e911 cellphone tower just north of Auburn's downtown. It would be aimed right at Geneva, putting 4000 watts that way, and making for somewhat better coverage than WDWN 89.1 has now...so in a car, you'd hear WVWA pretty good from Skaeneateles to Canandaigua. But it wouldn't go much north of Clyde or much south of Romulus. Basically, it was designed to complement WITH back when WITH was slated for the cell tower on Danby Rd just down the hill from Ithaca College.

That was before WXXI LMA'd WITH and before WXXI moved WITH up to the WSQG tower, that changed things; that tower is well-suited for "decent" coverage of most of the Finger Lakes, and it's now sort-of questionable whether WITH's format needs to be relayed in the northern Finger Lakes. Especially after similar-sounding WRUR gets its new CP on the air with 18kW aimed right at Geneva.

So if not WITH, what? One could make an argument to put WXXI-FM on WVWA. 91.5 comes in "okay" in a lot of that area, but WCNY definitely comes in better at the moment.

One could also make an argument to relay WEOS on WVWA...since currently WEOS does not reach Auburn well at all. However, if WEOS builds out its CP, it will both boost power to 6kW ERP and remove the 1st-adjacent interference problems with WRVO, which are the main reason for WEOS's poor reception in Auburn.

(on a related note, WVWA coming on-air will displace W212BA, and that's a translator worth keeping; power upgrade/frequency change or not...it's real questionable that WEOS will EVER come in solidly in Geneva because the hill the city (and HWS Campus) sits on is on the "wrong" side from the tower. Plus proximity of the translator means students and faculty can always hear "their" station even in thick-walled dorms and offices. Fortunately I know W212BA *can* be moved.)

So yeah, there's a lot of variables in play in choosing new call letters for WVWA. Personally, I think WGEN-FM for "Auburn/GENeva" would be a good one. There's a TV station in the southern USA using the call letters that said I could use 'em if I wanted...but I never got the formal letter drawn up before I left HWS. If a relay of WITH is ultimately chosen, I think WITJ is the closest match to "WITH" that's still available. WAUB-FM would be nice but even if the FLRG allowed it, the FCC wouldn't...and it'd confuse the listeners, too. Pity.

Check out the number of stations plus translators on their website. Try reciting all of those call letters within a minute without passing out or losing your voice.

From an engineering perspective, every day it's getting increasingly easier to have local audio insertion at a transmitter site for the purposes of legal ID insertion.

 

[heydaybegone]

every day it's getting increasingly easier to have local audio insertion at a transmitter site for the purposes of legal ID insertion.

Dang Legal Id's!!!

Actually....some of the best jingle packages ever created contained some awesome legals....but who's using jingles anymore? (tongue in cheek)

 

[The Voice of Reason]

I would just like to know how the hell can stations like WXXI go on the air and cry poverty during their fundraising drives yet can afford to (use what ever term you like ) swallow up, purchase, take over, affiliate, with the numerous stations and translators they are now associated with?

 

[heydaybegone]

Insert Quote
I would just like to know how the hell can stations like WXXI go on the air and cry poverty during their fundraising drives yet can afford to (use what ever term you like ) swallow up, purchase, take over, affiliate, with the numerous stations and translators they are now associated with?

That's easy VOR...ask Mr. Obama...he's in charge of the FCC...(or at least in charge of the people in charge of the FCC)

 

[umtrr-author]

Alan Chartock has been adding to WAMC's media empire for years.

http://www.wamc.org/station.html

Check out the number of stations plus translators on their website. Try reciting all of those call letters within a minute without passing out or losing your voice.

There is at least one person here who has the WAMC list memorized, and much to my amazement, recited it to me one day without missing a beat or catching his breath...

and you know who you are...

 

[TheBigA]

I would just like to know how the hell can stations like WXXI go on the air and cry poverty during their fundraising drives yet can afford to (use what ever term you like ) swallow up, purchase, take over, affiliate, with the numerous stations and translators they are now associated with?

What do you care? You don't give them a dime.

All of their financials are posted on their web site, and we've discussed this to death. You know exactly what their financial condition is, so there's no need to invent stuff like they "cry poverty." All they're trying to do is motivate the freeloaders to donating. These days, lots of rich people "cry poverty" and refuse to donate to non-profits.

 

[Play Freebird]

Alan Chartock has been adding to WAMC's media empire for years.

http://www.wamc.org/station.html

Check out the number of stations plus translators on their website. Try reciting all of those call letters within a minute without passing out or losing your voice.

There is at least one person here who has the WAMC list memorized, and much to my amazement, recited it to me one day without missing a beat or catching his breath...

and you know who you are...

When I tune to the Northeast Public Radio stations while traveling to New England, it often strikes me that the hourly legal ID recitation is primarily a waste of time from a public interest perspective, as most listeners simply think of the network as WAMC. Why can't the FCC get with the times, eliminate this confusing administrative overhead, and allow the repeater stations to use RDS for local IDs, much like translators are permitted to use FSK?

Another area where FCC ID rules make little sense: Amateur stations (many of which are mobile or portable) don't need to report their locations in the ID, even though this information would be very useful to DXers. But broadcast stations (which stay fixed in the same spot for decades) must recite the name of the principal community every hour, as if the location has changed.

 

[heydaybegone]

But broadcast stations (which stay fixed in the same spot for decades) must recite the name of the principal community every hour, as if the location has changed

Freebird....haven't we former programmers been saying that for "years"/"decades"
Heck...it only made for creative jingle segues (well back in the heyday) Now it's just rhetoric.
Git yer butt down to Washington and change this lunacy!!
HDBG

 

[SirRoxalot]

When I tune to the Northeast Public Radio stations while traveling to New England, it often strikes me that the hourly legal ID recitation is primarily a waste of time from a public interest perspective, as most listeners simply think of the network as WAMC. Why can't the FCC get with the times, eliminate this confusing administrative overhead, and allow the repeater stations to use RDS for local IDs, much like translators are permitted to use FSK?

Another area where FCC ID rules make little sense: Amateur stations (many of which are mobile or portable) don't need to report their locations in the ID, even though this information would be very useful to DXers. But broadcast stations (which stay fixed in the same spot for decades) must recite the name of the principal community every hour, as if the location has changed.

As AaronReed said,

From an engineering perspective, every day it's getting increasingly easier to have local audio insertion at a transmitter site for the purposes of legal ID insertion.

I think that people should know exactly what facility they're listening to, and should be able to refer to the correct source if they wish to report problems with audio, noise, signal, etc. All of the transmitter sites should have an alternate source of audio in case of emergency, or failure of the link to the program source.

 

[TheBigA]

I think that people should know exactly what facility they're listening to, and should be able to refer to the correct source if they wish to report problems with audio, noise, signal, etc.

Back in the days of tuning dials, it was difficult to know what station you were listening to. Today with digital tuners, you can see at a glance what station you're listening to. No need to use airspace to tell people what they already know.

 

[heydaybegone]

I think that people should know exactly what facility they're listening to, and should be able to refer to the correct source if they wish to report problems with audio, noise, signal, etc.

Back in the days of tuning dials, it was difficult to know what station you were listening to. Today with digital tuners, you can see at a glance what station you're listening to. No need to use airspace to tell people what they already know.

So, I rarely go toe to toe with Rox! But I gotta agree with "A" this time.!

Not that it matters here on the boards...but Digital is a way of life now....even with the "old timers". They know "the numbers" of their favorite radio station!! Nuff said on that.

I'm also curious (Rox) just how many times any average listener has reported any problems with audio, noise, signal, etc.? (Besides calling the station switchboard operator that doesn't have a clue--or the automated system that doesn't acknowledge such events) ??? Hey, you might have info---benefit of the doubt question.

HDBG

 

[Savage]

Rox, my friend! "Report problems with audio?" (Pause for audience to stop laughing) I know market-cluster GMs who aren't even aware of the formats on their HD subs! And most of the station day-to-day operations people hardly monitor their own signals despite all kinds of automated interfaces, dead-air alarms, etc.

In he unlikely event a listener reaches a live person at a station in today's typical cluster, I seriously doubt that person will be able to give any advice or take any action. Most station personnel these days are completely clueless on technical matters. I include management in that statement.

We've come a long ways - and generally not in a positive way - since those days of a generation ago, when "a certain GM I know" had an oscilloscope on his desk to monitor modulation continuously.

 

[SirRoxalot]

First of all, not everybody has a digital tuner...

With that said, it's quite possible that we've lowered expectations by the public so much that they don't really care what they're listening to, and would simply move on if the audio sucked, or went out altogether.

I'd think that the radio geeks in the crowd would at least like to know what they're listening to once an hour without having to look it up on radio-locator.com.

 

[TheBigA]

First of all, not everybody has a digital tuner...

At some point, you really need to come into the present. Dial tuners went away more than 30 years ago.

With that said, it's quite possible that we've lowered expectations by the public so much that they don't really care what they're listening to, and would simply move on if the audio sucked, or went out altogether.

Huh? "We" haven't done anything. Have you seen the devices people use these days? Radio companies don't sell those devices. People listen to radio on cheap crappy devices. That's been the case for a very long time. But the facts are that the people inherently KNOW which stations they listen to, because they only listen to a handful of stations: Their favorites. They don't "spin the dial," because it doesn't exist, and they often don't sample stations outside their favorites, even if those stations flip formats to something those people might like.

As for the "radio geeks," I learned a long long time ago that you don't program a station to the .1%. That ensures you'll lose.

 

[heydaybegone]

I'd think that the radio geeks in the crowd would at least like to know what they're listening to once an hour without having to look it up on radio-locator.com.

And it comes down to ratings. (Here we go again- please no!) If the ratings company (Arb*%&^) is doing their job correctly, the statistical odds of research methodology (been there-done that) says these Geeks aren't going to get that one golden diary!!
So who cares ???

 

[SirRoxalot]

The "scan" button on my car radio has discovered a lot more stations - or new iterations of existing stations - than "spinning the dial" ever did. Studies show that more people listen to radio in the car than in any other place. Surely, car audio systems these days are MUCH better than they were "back in the day". Except for the AM tuner sections, and the antennas, of course.

 

[heydaybegone]

The "scan" button on my car radio has discovered a lot more stations - or new iterations of existing stations - than "spinning the dial" ever did. Studies show that more people listen to radio in the car than in any other place. Surely, car audio systems these days are MUCH better than they were "back in the day". Except for the AM tuner sections, and the antennas, of course

The radio makers are doing their job (OK - so they put CD players & subscription receivers in too!..not to mention MP3 downloadable) SO..........................now what!!

 

[JustPastBuffalo]

This discussion called for a survey, so I sauntered around the house to check the digital v. analog count. Two analog Panasonics in the basement workshop. Receiver in the studio, digital. Bathroom? Analog. Family room? Digital. Garage? An old Sony AM/FM/TV/WX analog that's been dropped, had at least two runaway hose showers, been sprayed with WD40 and survived a close encounter with a Berns-O-Matic. Still, it defies death and I can't throw it out. Cars? Both digital, one with RDS (BTW, there's one radio station in Buffalo that needs to reset its RDS). Personal players, digital. So, at least in my domain, it's about an even split and the analog units are still active. The analog sets seem to have better selectivity and fidelity.

 

[SirRoxalot]

BTW, the only unit I have with RDS is one of my car radios. And, yes, I'm a cheapskate. I generally buy things that work, and use them until they don't anymore. Even my MP3 player is 8 years old - and has FM that sounds pretty darn good via headphone.