ddybas said:
The TRN shows are free. The SRN shows are free and make money for headquarters by adding Chicago to national spot buys. Miller pays them in some form.
ddybas said:
The Fish was FM where expections are higher.
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WYLL and WIND.
- Thread starter StevenGastreich
- Start date
The TRN shows are free. The SRN shows are free and make money for headquarters by adding Chicago to national spot buys. Miller pays them in some form.
The Fish was FM where expections are higher.
D
ddybas
Guest
Radiohawkins...
Back in December 2007... Salem transfered control of (7) stations it owned to an entity it called Salem Communications Holding Company. Some have said that the transfer was merely a tax shelter action. However, since then one of those stations, WRRD, has been announced as being sold. Another one of the (7) stations on that list is WFIA Louisville, KY. You can draw your own conclusion from those facts. But I'd keep an eye and ear on WFIA...
Back in December 2007... Salem transfered control of (7) stations it owned to an entity it called Salem Communications Holding Company. Some have said that the transfer was merely a tax shelter action. However, since then one of those stations, WRRD, has been announced as being sold. Another one of the (7) stations on that list is WFIA Louisville, KY. You can draw your own conclusion from those facts. But I'd keep an eye and ear on WFIA...
D
ddybas
Guest
Re: TRN and SRN shows....Salem had a funny way of charging it's own stations for programming. It also charged it's own stations for Web hosting and E-mail service thru it's Web division, OnePlace.com. In fact it ordered it's stations to use OnePlace.com in spite of the fact that the station could get the same service cheaper elsewhere. Basically taking money out of one pocket to fill the other. Hence OnePlace looked like it was doing well. Though...that practice may have changed in the last year.
I'm no expert on Salem, I just know what went on when I was working (sometimes sleeping) for them.
Dr. Dave
I'm no expert on Salem, I just know what went on when I was working (sometimes sleeping) for them.
Dr. Dave
ddybas said:
For Salem, billing $3.1 million on a news talk station is a big deal. There's only 1 or 2 others that could come close to that.
Trust me, Salem is VERY happy with the Chicago cluster.
ddybas said:
Wow, for a guy who once worked for Salem, you really don't know much about the programming side. Salem doesn't pay anything for their syndicated programs. In fact, some of those shows are comp'ing Salem for clearance in Chicago in WIND.
Comparing The Fish to WIND is like apples to oranges.
ddybas said:
Again, you're speculating. Why would Salem clean house on a cluster that's billing over $10 million? That makes no sense. They blew out Milwaukee because those stations, in a perfect world, would never generate significant cash flow. Chicago will -- and does -- right now.
Sounds to me like you've got some hard feelings about your departure from Salem.
D
ddybas
Guest
Matt...I'm just telling things as I experienced them...hard feelings...maybe...it certainly evolved into a company I didn't care to work for. I watch it from the outside now and there's clarity in some ways from that perspective. Having lost nearly $10K in Salem stock over the past few years I think I'm entitled to a little venting.
And $3.1 mil and 29th place may make Salem VERY happy...but I doubt any other group would be pleased with it. I guess that's why Salems stock is trading for under $4/share. Ouch...it even hurts when I say it.
God Bless you Matt
Dr. Dave
PS: Sounds like you've taken my place on the inside };>)
And $3.1 mil and 29th place may make Salem VERY happy...but I doubt any other group would be pleased with it. I guess that's why Salems stock is trading for under $4/share. Ouch...it even hurts when I say it.
God Bless you Matt
Dr. Dave
PS: Sounds like you've taken my place on the inside };>)
I respect if you have issues with how Salem runs their stations. But I'd hope that you'd address those issues, rather than speculating about the future of radio stations.
If I had lost $10k in Salem stock, I'm sure I'd be upset too. But again, I'd love to hear about the specific things you saw and heard that you think have contributed to the decline of the stock rather than predicting the demise of radio stations.
Salem has always operated by a different set of expectations when it comes to revenue. They run their stations pretty lean, as you probably know. I look at both WIND and WYLL and see two stations that are pretty well-aligned with Salem's goals -- both financially, as well as ideologically.
And I'm as much on the "inside" of Salem as you are. I have friends and colleagues who work and have worked for them. And I've watched this business long enough to get a sense of how companies like Salem operate.
Matt
If I had lost $10k in Salem stock, I'm sure I'd be upset too. But again, I'd love to hear about the specific things you saw and heard that you think have contributed to the decline of the stock rather than predicting the demise of radio stations.
Salem has always operated by a different set of expectations when it comes to revenue. They run their stations pretty lean, as you probably know. I look at both WIND and WYLL and see two stations that are pretty well-aligned with Salem's goals -- both financially, as well as ideologically.
And I'm as much on the "inside" of Salem as you are. I have friends and colleagues who work and have worked for them. And I've watched this business long enough to get a sense of how companies like Salem operate.
Matt
WIND has always had a bettter signal than... I still have to call 1160 WJJD.
When it was WJJD it was a daytimer, and worth listening to. Ever since the country music stopped, it has foundered.
KSL was quite listenable and enjoyable in those days. The 1160 Chicago signal was, and never has been worth putting on the air
after dark. WIND on the other hand, always had a good signal, but Group W postioned the station to appeal to older listeners while
WLS and WCFL fought for the attention of the younger set.
WIND has improved their sound quite a bit recently. They were quite flat sounding, and now they are bright and crisp.
Since iBOC has been added to WGN, WBBM, WSCR (WMAQ) and WLS, they are actually the best sounding "big" AM in Chicago.
When it was WJJD it was a daytimer, and worth listening to. Ever since the country music stopped, it has foundered.
KSL was quite listenable and enjoyable in those days. The 1160 Chicago signal was, and never has been worth putting on the air
after dark. WIND on the other hand, always had a good signal, but Group W postioned the station to appeal to older listeners while
WLS and WCFL fought for the attention of the younger set.
WIND has improved their sound quite a bit recently. They were quite flat sounding, and now they are bright and crisp.
Since iBOC has been added to WGN, WBBM, WSCR (WMAQ) and WLS, they are actually the best sounding "big" AM in Chicago.
D
ddybas
Guest
Matt...without doubt I'm not the first person on this board to speculate on the future of a radio station. It happens all the time. I will agree with you both WYLL and WIND do fit well into Salem's design. But that is where, I guess, I have my problem. The design doesn't seem to perform very well financially.
Maybe it is my "sour grapes" ...losing $10K on Salem Stock isn't something that makes me happy.
I can't really get specific on things I've seen or heard, this board isn't the place to air the dirty laundry...so I won't.
I've probably said more about them already, than I should have.
Maybe WYLL will be sold...maybe it won't ...Maybe WIND will flip format...maybe it won't.
From an existential view...what does it matter anyway?
I just want my damn $10k back...
Maybe it is my "sour grapes" ...losing $10K on Salem Stock isn't something that makes me happy.
I can't really get specific on things I've seen or heard, this board isn't the place to air the dirty laundry...so I won't.
I've probably said more about them already, than I should have.
Maybe WYLL will be sold...maybe it won't ...Maybe WIND will flip format...maybe it won't.
From an existential view...what does it matter anyway?
I just want my damn $10k back...
R
radiohawkins
Guest
ddybas said:
I totally agree with David's comparison of the 560 WIND signal versus 1160 WYLL.
K
karbunkle
Guest
Dr. Dave did a bit of work with WYLLand the transmitter change. We should bow to him for that.
The Fish was doomed NOT for programming but for signal vs. format. I recall the Fish did well in certain places of the market. At one time, a major market line-up.
WIND is strong - and serves the Salem PAC well.
WYLL will remain strong but will need to find NEW ministries as the current ones are (literally) dying.
Dr. Dave and his 10 grand? Welcome to Vegas - er - the stock market.
The Fish was doomed NOT for programming but for signal vs. format. I recall the Fish did well in certain places of the market. At one time, a major market line-up.
WIND is strong - and serves the Salem PAC well.
WYLL will remain strong but will need to find NEW ministries as the current ones are (literally) dying.
Dr. Dave and his 10 grand? Welcome to Vegas - er - the stock market.
Bittersweet reading a thread about WIND....
The station that gave the Chicago the first, or one of the first....
.....Fulltime top 40 format (in the mid-50s, although usually in "toned-down" form). Its where, as a second-grader, I first discovered Elvis!
.....Major morning drive personality (Howard Miller...who also sometimes turned up in afternoon drive and on weekends)
.....Oldies format on the dominant band (which was am in the early 70s)
.....Fulltime Female pop music deejay (Connie Szerzen...and yes Yvonne Daniels and the WSDM girls were there first, but with other genres)
All gone and mostly forgotten.
The station that gave the Chicago the first, or one of the first....
.....Fulltime top 40 format (in the mid-50s, although usually in "toned-down" form). Its where, as a second-grader, I first discovered Elvis!
.....Major morning drive personality (Howard Miller...who also sometimes turned up in afternoon drive and on weekends)
.....Oldies format on the dominant band (which was am in the early 70s)
.....Fulltime Female pop music deejay (Connie Szerzen...and yes Yvonne Daniels and the WSDM girls were there first, but with other genres)
All gone and mostly forgotten.
D
ddybas
Guest
karbunkle said:
Karbunckle...thanks for the props...on WYLL's transmitter site.
The 106.7 Fish signal may not have reached all of the Metro Chicago area like the FM's on the Sears or Hancock do...but...I really think that The Fish didn't generate ratings because it was a format that Chicago didn't care that much for. I say this only because that signal is now WPPN-FM " Passion" which has been in the top 10 for the past year or more. What changed? The format.
Now about the $10K I've lost ( ouch that hurts...ouch...ouch...ouch !) nevermind.
I
intheair
Guest
ddybas said:
I know Salem has a pretty good news/talk station (WGTK-AM) and they also have a CCM station, WRVI-FM... what's the stance on these stations... and isn't WFIA an AM/FM Combo? Are both WFIA's on the block?
D
ddybas
Guest
All I see is WFIA-AM in the list I spoke of earlier. Again...this is a list of stations that has been transfered to Salem Acquisition Holding Company...and one of the stations in this list , WRRD, has recently been sold. You can draw your own conclusion from that. };>)
Dr. Dave
Dr. Dave
Tom Wells said:
I don't know what the old WJJD's signal was like around the Chicago area, but it was possible to receive them on the east coast (at least in the Washington DC area) in the evenings until they signed off, which was about two or three hours after sunset eastern time IIRC.
Old fart memory time. I remember when WYLL, Des Plaines, just signed on and was "all request radio."
As I remember WIND has 2 major lobes. One goes to Milwaukee one to Indianapolis, pretty much straight down I-65. The Indy lobe was shut off at Chicago sunset. My mom loved Howard Miller. I remember on a thunderstormy day, when (unlike wgn,wmaq, wls or wcfl) WIND's signal had TONS of static due to the Belmont Ave. trolley buses. There is a good article about their history on
Wikipedia.
"Radio Chicago, WJJD, a broadcast service of Plough Incorporated" had a strong daytime signal to the Northwest. Top 40 first gave way to beautiful music then to country. When they were top 40 in the 60's, they got many dx reports from Minnesota and into Canada. That station began as a Western music station (lots of Gene Autry records ) at Moosehart, near Aurora/with host Randy Blake and lots of religion.
Then, later, I spent lots of time as a kid in the storefront on Michigan avenue and later, in the house on Ballard Road, ("home of the country gentlemen") where the 50kw xmtr was in the basement.
WJJD had to sign off at Salt Lake sunset (around an hour later than Chicago) to protect KSL. In Summer, WJJD signed on in the 4am hour for a month or 2. Morning dj Ernie Simon used to kvetch on the air about that. I'm not familiar with any of their nighttime service area, (I believe added during their big band format) but I know it is quite limited.
As I remember WIND has 2 major lobes. One goes to Milwaukee one to Indianapolis, pretty much straight down I-65. The Indy lobe was shut off at Chicago sunset. My mom loved Howard Miller. I remember on a thunderstormy day, when (unlike wgn,wmaq, wls or wcfl) WIND's signal had TONS of static due to the Belmont Ave. trolley buses. There is a good article about their history on
Wikipedia.
"Radio Chicago, WJJD, a broadcast service of Plough Incorporated" had a strong daytime signal to the Northwest. Top 40 first gave way to beautiful music then to country. When they were top 40 in the 60's, they got many dx reports from Minnesota and into Canada. That station began as a Western music station (lots of Gene Autry records ) at Moosehart, near Aurora/with host Randy Blake and lots of religion.
Then, later, I spent lots of time as a kid in the storefront on Michigan avenue and later, in the house on Ballard Road, ("home of the country gentlemen") where the 50kw xmtr was in the basement.
WJJD had to sign off at Salt Lake sunset (around an hour later than Chicago) to protect KSL. In Summer, WJJD signed on in the 4am hour for a month or 2. Morning dj Ernie Simon used to kvetch on the air about that. I'm not familiar with any of their nighttime service area, (I believe added during their big band format) but I know it is quite limited.
Just for clarity, "All Request Radio" was 106.7-FM WYEN...a few formats later to become WYLL-FM, and now WPPN-FM
The old WJJD is now WYLL-AM and carries the same Christian ministry format as it did as WYLL-FM.
The 1160 WYLL-AM night signal originally came to be in the early 1980's and wasn't much for coverage, only 5 KW of power. However several years ago the nite signal facility was moved to a separate site in Lockport and is now a 50KW blowtorch aimed straight north. WYLL maintains the DesPlaines site on Ballard road for daytime transmission and switches on the Lockport facility for nite coverage.
The WIND signal is as described, with a minor lobe towards Indianapolis during the day, but not at night. All the power is directed towards Chicago at night.
I was Chief at all those stations at one time or another, back when radio was fun.
The old WJJD is now WYLL-AM and carries the same Christian ministry format as it did as WYLL-FM.
The 1160 WYLL-AM night signal originally came to be in the early 1980's and wasn't much for coverage, only 5 KW of power. However several years ago the nite signal facility was moved to a separate site in Lockport and is now a 50KW blowtorch aimed straight north. WYLL maintains the DesPlaines site on Ballard road for daytime transmission and switches on the Lockport facility for nite coverage.
The WIND signal is as described, with a minor lobe towards Indianapolis during the day, but not at night. All the power is directed towards Chicago at night.
I was Chief at all those stations at one time or another, back when radio was fun.
DD, I'm curious. Did you live on site at the 4 tower 560 site, or were they remote control (as I remember) in the mid 60's from the studio.
WHY was that Wrigley Building studio always so dark?
I remember the "tape delay" achieved by 2 Ampex's the one on the left recording and the one on the right playing. I worked there in the mid-70's after I worked at WCRW.
WHY was that Wrigley Building studio always so dark?
I remember the "tape delay" achieved by 2 Ampex's the one on the left recording and the one on the right playing. I worked there in the mid-70's after I worked at WCRW.
My experiences with WIND are only a few years back, and at that time the transmitter site was remote controlled. The transmitter site doesn't have any "living" quarters though I did spend a few nites sleeping on a cot after working on transmitter problems. };>)
Maybe you worked with Bill Ryan during your stint in the 70's? I understand from Bill Ryan that the studios were built to high acoustical standards back then. Not so now...
Maybe you worked with Bill Ryan during your stint in the 70's? I understand from Bill Ryan that the studios were built to high acoustical standards back then. Not so now...
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