Classic Rock Myrtle Beach

[davideduardo]

This thread is about the plight of Classic Rock at the Beach, and that plight is the same all over....Burnt playlists, and the station loosing(sic) its Ass.

You mean "losing its ass in the Summer book"? The non-existent Summer book?

I wouldn't call 34+ years in the Biz...brief.

There is a difference between one year's experience thirty-four times over and thirty four years of experience. I suspect you are a product of the Groundhog Day model of experience.

Again,...this alleged Troll was never, in 34+ years, fired from any job in either Radio or TV. Again,...it might make you a little Hot, but you still can't match that.

Fired, let go, cut back, reduction in force, laid off, contract not renewed, difference of creative opinion, etc., etc. They all mean the same thing: "FIRED". And I don't know of too many people in the industry who have not been let go or "had to leave" at some point in their career. It's part of the learning process. A friend says, "anyone in radio who says they were never fired is lying".

 

[davideduardo]

...laced with Gen-u-wine "Vidossie" onions from "Vidossie" Georgia,

That has got to be the most bizarre pronunciation of Vidalia I have ever seen, but then much of your spelling is as off as a Papal visit to a Wiccan convention.

 

[davideduardo]

...as I put the Big Stink on still, yet another, California instruction, from Mr.Ed....to us here in the GSP. Hmmmmmmmm?

If you have to be from a place to understand a place, Eisenhower and Patton would not have won on the European front.

Localism and localization are flavors; good radio is universal from Spartanburg to Stuttgart.

 

[Scooter Lesley]

Well, Well, Well,....(hang-on, I got one more)....(wait ferrrrrrr it)...........Wellllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll, if it ain't Pencilneck Consultants, Members of the "Hopefully,...
....Oh, Please God....Hopefully, a 5-share club, it's Mr. Ed, Head of the West Coast HD Squad..."HIGHLY DELUSIONAL"! It's hard to sip coffee, and read this Horse Manure, without laughing so hard that the coffee shoots up your nose. If a city had two CR's, and both were playing the same 300-allegedly tested Classic Rock gems, and then one hit fourth gear into a much larger, less burnt list.....the results after the 3rd book would be enough to convict y'all of Congregating Unlawfully, and Collective Boobism!

 

[JeffM]

Dave, why do you even bother?

 

[davideduardo]

Well, Well, Well,....(hang-on, I got one more)....(wait ferrrrrrr it)...........Wellllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll, if it ain't Pencilneck Consultants, Members of the "Hopefully,...
....Oh, Please God....Hopefully, a 5-share club, it's Mr. Ed, Head of the West Coast HD Squad..."HIGHLY DELUSIONAL"! It's hard to sip coffee, and read this Horse Manure, without laughing so hard that the coffee shoots up your nose. If a city had two CR's, and both were playing the same 300-allegedly tested Classic Rock gems, and then one hit fourth gear into a much larger, less burnt list.....the results after the 3rd book would be enough to convict y'all of Congregating Unlawfully, and Collective Boobism!

Been ther. Done that.

I was programming a classic rock station in a bit larger market a few years back. We had tested several thousand songs and developed a good list of just under 500. We went on the air as the market's first classic rocker and averaged about a 22 share in the first 10 to 12 books (rated monthly). A competitor that had around a 1.8 doing AC switched to "our" format but with a list of 1,800 songs and lots of claims about "three times the variety" of our station.

A year later, their peak was a 1.8 and they switched format. We kept on getting shares over a 20 the whole time.

Oh, and between full signals, suburban stations and LPFM neighborhood stations, the market had over 100 FM signals.

 

[davideduardo]

Dave, why do you even bother?

It is like playing against the JV team. You know you are gonna' win, but it' terrific practice and the other kids learn from the experience.

Well, sccratch any hope of Cooter learning about anything that does not have a high calorie count. But it's still good practice.

 

[DudeFan]

It is like playing against the JV team. You know you are gonna' win, but it' terrific practice and the other kids learn from the experience.

Well, sccratch any hope of Cooter learning about anything that does not have a high calorie count. But it's still good practice.

Well put, Dave. I usually learn at least something from your postings.

I wish I were as honorable or had as much class. I just hate willful ignorance and like bullying the bully back. Not many people that I'd use "piss on their grave" as more than a metaphor. I am, however, saving up a few extra Lasix for an eventual trip to the upstate.

 

[Scooter Lesley]

We won't discount Mr. Ed's alleged accomplishment, but we will use the contents therein, to again, point-out the National fail. "A few years back.....a good list of just under 500 songs". That's just it....the main core, the assumed base, the staples, the nucleus, the (allegedly) "Tested Well"....(Nationally) You have Burnt them to a crisp, and the Pencilnecks are telling you to stay the path...because they don't know past those tests! So,...Dud-doodle, rate 1-to-3, these Bowie hits: "Changes", "Ziggy Stardust", and "Young Americans"....rate these Hits, 1-to-3......it shouldn't tax you, to do so.

 

[JeffM]

All this reminds me of the story about the farmer who hired a trainer to train a stubborn mule. The first thing the trainer did was to pick up a two-by-four and slam the mule over the head, hard enough to break the board in half.

The farmer shouted, "What are you doin'! I hired you to train my mule, not half kill him!" The trainer replied, "Don't worry, I'll train him. But first, I have to get his attention."

Unfortunately, this only works on mules; some creatures are so thick-headed it has no effect on them...

 

[TheBigA]

You have Burnt them to a crisp, and the Pencilnecks are telling you to stay the path...because they don't know past those tests!

Amazingly, they haven't burnt to a crisp. In fact, those songs are getting better response now. I see it every day. The best way to get people dancing is play Sweet Home Alabama. Ask Kid Rock. He used the riff in All Summer Long and had a #1 song.

 

[DudeFan]

So,...Dud-doodle, rate 1-to-3, these Bowie hits: "Changes", "Ziggy Stardust", and "Young Americans"....rate these Hits, 1-to-3......it shouldn't tax you, to do so.

Can you never be an insulting rube?

And to answer your question, without conducting a locale specific music test and assuming the format is Classic Rock, the only cut of those three I would even begin to take a chance on playing is Ziggy Stardust, properly dayparted. At this point in 2015, I am not sure one should be playing David Bowie other than as a lunar. But that is my gut and the limited research I have on hand for that artist.

 

[vchimpanzee]

The story about the 2015 success of classic rock has been in every trade magazine and column about radio.

Last week I made it as far as February in Billboard. So I'm only familiar with what I read here. It is true Billboard is available at libraries in North Carolina using PDF, but seeing the real thing is so much easier. Once I drive 60 miles, walk for an hour, read, walk for an hour, drive 50 miles, have a flat tire, wait for the man to get home who I am told can fix it, go to the garage the next day and find out that because of the holiday they can't give me a new tire ... yes, but I enjoyed my day overall.

Technically, Rock 107 is not "classic rock". Based on what I remember from the last time I heard it, it is a Mainstream Rock station which someone here has saiud is only playing older songs. The songs are louder and tend to be by different artists than the usual "classic rock" stations.

105.7 Man Up in Greensboro, NC is another example. The newspaper article made it look like active rock, but Boston is in the playlist I saw in another source.

 

[Scooter Lesley]

So,...from the Dud-desk, is this "Ziggy Stardust" the only one, outta the three Bowie cuts you deem possible for Airplay? The factors being:
-It Tested Well
-As a Hit single, it Sold Well
-It Charted Well
-It can be found listed in the Aristotle Pencilneck National Classic Rock Bible.
or All of the above?

We'd like to know!

 

[JeffM]

Like I said, you can teach a mule.

 

[davideduardo]

So,...from the Dud-desk, is this "Ziggy Stardust" the only one, outta the three Bowie cuts you deem possible for Airplay? The factors being:
-It Tested Well
-As a Hit single, it Sold Well
-It Charted Well
-It can be found listed in the Aristotle Pencilneck National Classic Rock Bible.
or All of the above?

We'd like to know!

You are wrong in even suggesting most of those are even factors in programming.

As long as listeners today want to hear a song, and there are few or no negatives, and it fits the format, it does not matter what it's sales, chart position or whatever from the past might have been.

Radio is now. It is not a museum. We play today what listeners want to hear today.

 

[Scooter Lesley]

So,...Mr.Ed, as you are stir-frying that morning Toe-Foo out on the left coast, and avoiding a suitable answer, to a question, that was directed at Dudley, we all just have to ask:

Just how do you arrive at a list of songs to Test.....in these Auditoriums...with alleged competent listeners, seated before the scratch pad, that you have supplied?

We'd like to know.

 

[TheBigA]

Just how do you arrive at a list of songs to Test.....in these Auditoriums.

My experience is different. I don't do formal auditorium testing. I do real lifestyle testing. I go to concerts, and put music up on the sound system between the live acts. I watch the people. I see which songs get them singing and dancing. It's not as scientific, but it's very instructive. There are certain songs that get the same reaction the live act gets. I'm not kidding. I have video evidence. And they are those same songs you say are burned to a crisp. They aren't. It's like Happy Birthday or Jingle Bells. You'd think after all this time, people would be sick of those songs. They're not.

 

[DudeFan]

I couldn't care less about any of those "so called" factors. In fact, I don't even give a flying fig about whether I like it or not.

I want to see indicia that people today listening to "my" classic rock station want to hear that particular song by that artist amongst everything else I am playing. Period, end of story.

I am not up on the Classic Rock genre, so I don't have many resources to make a decision as to that format or, more specifically, that format in a specific locale or with a certain competitive environment.

You want to hear hits that are now "non-hits?" Turn in to any classic American Top 40 program. Some weeks, its stiff-city from #40 almost to the top 10.

 

[davideduardo]

Just how do you arrive at a list of songs to Test.....in these Auditoriums...with alleged competent listeners, seated before the scratch pad, that you have supplied?

We'd like to know.

The procedure today to put together a test list can take several forms.

If you are considering a format switch, and have done some form of ATU testing or format search research, you will have a broad philosophical idea of what area you are going to test in.

The next step is to put together a list of songs to test. Since the format you are doing is "new" to your station, you'd probably test many more songs than a station would once it is established in the format. As a start, you'd likely use the playlists of all similar stations, with emphasis on ones in markets that have similar lifestyles, competitive arrays and ethnic makeups. Then you would look at any other lists, depending on format, such as the Whitburn books to see if there is any material you feel fits your station or market that you think other stations have missed or which you want to play "what if" on. After that, you might consider the heritage of radio in your market to see if it might flavor tastes, particularly if your market is less transient than some.

You are likely to come up with more songs than you can afford to test. Keep in mind a 1,200 song test can cost $50 thousand, so the capacity to test is not unlimited. So you may have to break off some songs that were doubtful to begin with and keep the list for a future test (A radio station is not a museum, and you don't have to have a 100% complete collection).

We are assuming that the research company you contracted knows its stuff and gets a good recruit and show, and you get a sample that is very close to "perfect" for your target. Once you have the results, you decide how much consensus do you want, and how much deviation on the lower end from the average score can you accept. This is a programmer's decision and is quite significant. So you may decide that all songs must score over the equivalent of a "70" on a scale of 1 to 100, meaning they are decidedly positive. But to get a 70 average, some folks will score below 70; how far below and how many are acceptable? You might say a minimum average of 70, with no more than 5% below a 60 and no break-out cell (25-34 men, 45-54 women, whatever the pieces of your target are) below a 68 average.

At that point, you have your playlist. The size was determined by the scores.

Obviously, there are further complications such as doing factor analysis or looking at the different overall passion for the total groups of songs, but this is the overview of how it is done.

Each time a station retests, you will of course retest the entire library. Then you try the songs that were just under the passing market the last time, and any songs that have been added to the "need to know" list since the last test. Even songs that may have not tested well before may be tested for several reasons including things like the song may have been too recent in the past and may have matured into playability, etc.