ajmcwhorter said:
NAU has an archive of old KOAI material from 1975 on, but access to it is restricted, and I don't know how many years it spans.
http://library.nau.edu/speccoll/manuscripts.htm (Scroll down to KOAI TV Collection)
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Flagstaff AZ TV stations
- Thread starter e-dawg
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NAU has an archive of old KOAI material from 1975 on, but access to it is restricted, and I don't know how many years it spans.
http://library.nau.edu/speccoll/manuscripts.htm (Scroll down to KOAI TV Collection)
For a brief time --maybe a year or two in the 80s there was a LPTV on Channel 9 in Flagstaff that played music videos, very similar to K61CA Phoenix. Flagstaff has grown a lot in the last few years, I would think that KNAZ as a satellite of KPNX could afford to have local news in the morning and evening, as well as sell local ads.
I believe NAU applied at least once for a NCE station on Channel 16, but decided instead to invest funds in their large NPR/ News / Classical FM network that covers a lot of Northern Arizona. Channel 8 could also use it as a Flagstaff satellite.
I believe NAU applied at least once for a NCE station on Channel 16, but decided instead to invest funds in their large NPR/ News / Classical FM network that covers a lot of Northern Arizona. Channel 8 could also use it as a Flagstaff satellite.
They did that for awhile (1997-2008), and it failed. They tried to sell KNAZ in '08, but there were no takers.
KAET's Flagstaff translator operates on Channel 14. I doubt they're interested in a full-powered satellite or they could have grabbed Channel 16 years ago once NAU gave up.
Either northern Arizona is an almost total cable/satellite market, so OTA stations there are just about moot, or the ad dollars are just not there to support even one television station without help from Phoenix.
The same can be said for Hagerstown MD-Martinsburg WV-Winchester VA, with the failures of FOX 60 WYVN and TV3 Winchester (ABC), and now WHAG having lost NBC. How does Hagerstown compare to Flagstaff?
Reading the entire thread from the beginning, it is clear there are many valid points.
As a 20+ year resident of Prescott, there are a few omissions:
KOAI/KNAZ Flagstaff rarely had a signal that was well received in Prescott/P.V.
or Chino Valley. They operated for many years on reduced power and were
often obliterated by stations like KATU, KTVQ, KBRZ and KPRC to mention but
a few. The local cable company always carried KNAZ AND KPNX. Of the two,
KPNX had the better picture 99% of the time. The KNAZ newscasts were
like watching a comedy show....
KTFL Flagstaff was seldom viewable in Prescott. It was impossible to receive
over KSAZ's translator, also on channel 4. Not sure if it was carried on local cable.
KUSK/KAZT probably had the best chance of success. The timing, as the
Prescott area, Cottonwood, et all, were growing rapidly, was offset by
the vast network of translators which provided lots of expense but no income.
With little worth watching, KUSK was a station without an audience....
KCFG Flagstaff never reached Prescott or anywhere nearby. Not on cable.
KWBF/KFPH used a transmitter dating back to the 50's from KTVT, Dallas.
There was an ever present vertical black line through the center of the
picture. But wait, there's more.... Multipath in the area created a difficult
to watch viewing experience. Not sure if it was carried on cable.
The geography of North Central Arizona necessitates multiple broadcast
points to cover the Flagstaff, Prescott Region. If Phoenix affiliates don't
provide a translator for the N.E. valley, with a estimated population over
500k, then how could it be financially viable for a much smaller market to
provide several of them?
Even though most people here would prefer "local" affiliates, they realize
that the entrenched Phoenix stations would likely dictate what we view
in our area. The Phoenix stations only carry major news story's from
Northern Arizona.
There probably is enough financial support now in Prescott and Flagstaff
to launch a successful station but unless there's a whole lot more financial
backing (very deep pockets) and thought than any of the predecessor's
from the past, they probably should not take that risk....
As a 20+ year resident of Prescott, there are a few omissions:
KOAI/KNAZ Flagstaff rarely had a signal that was well received in Prescott/P.V.
or Chino Valley. They operated for many years on reduced power and were
often obliterated by stations like KATU, KTVQ, KBRZ and KPRC to mention but
a few. The local cable company always carried KNAZ AND KPNX. Of the two,
KPNX had the better picture 99% of the time. The KNAZ newscasts were
like watching a comedy show....
KTFL Flagstaff was seldom viewable in Prescott. It was impossible to receive
over KSAZ's translator, also on channel 4. Not sure if it was carried on local cable.
KUSK/KAZT probably had the best chance of success. The timing, as the
Prescott area, Cottonwood, et all, were growing rapidly, was offset by
the vast network of translators which provided lots of expense but no income.
With little worth watching, KUSK was a station without an audience....
KCFG Flagstaff never reached Prescott or anywhere nearby. Not on cable.
KWBF/KFPH used a transmitter dating back to the 50's from KTVT, Dallas.
There was an ever present vertical black line through the center of the
picture. But wait, there's more.... Multipath in the area created a difficult
to watch viewing experience. Not sure if it was carried on cable.
The geography of North Central Arizona necessitates multiple broadcast
points to cover the Flagstaff, Prescott Region. If Phoenix affiliates don't
provide a translator for the N.E. valley, with a estimated population over
500k, then how could it be financially viable for a much smaller market to
provide several of them?
Even though most people here would prefer "local" affiliates, they realize
that the entrenched Phoenix stations would likely dictate what we view
in our area. The Phoenix stations only carry major news story's from
Northern Arizona.
There probably is enough financial support now in Prescott and Flagstaff
to launch a successful station but unless there's a whole lot more financial
backing (very deep pockets) and thought than any of the predecessor's
from the past, they probably should not take that risk....
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Sounds like KOAI was missing the one vowel it needed most: E, as in E-skip.
As to your point about needed retransmitters even into Scottsdale, I think that's more of a consequence of TV's development and also of the timing of the development of Valley television.
ATSC 3.0 offers broadcasters the idea of basically converting themselves into SFNs to permit geotargeted advertising and boost signal strength to mobile devices and on the edges of a transmitter's coverage area. If Phoenix broadcasters did this, I think there'd be boosters in Pinal County (down by San Tan Valley), in North Scottsdale, and maybe in the White Tanks.
It's technically possible to create SFNs with ATSC 1.0. The catch is that it's difficult (because of the use of 8VSB modulation) and the stations often generate co-channel interference. Mexico is having that problem. The IFT insisted that broadcast translators be co-channel. That's caused some issues as (for now) translators may use alternate PSIP (a guy was angry that instead of channels 6 and 12, he had 13 and 20, though they offered the same service), or instead people get no service at all between conflicting transmitters. In some cases, the IFT has permitted shadow channels (as they are sort of called) to change RFs. There are also some shadows that are using different RF channels in order to prepare for impending repacking and clearing of 600 MHz.
I mean, DTS systems have been done in ATSC (KRBK in Springfield, MO is a five-transmitter SFN), but it's kind of rare. I expect the idea to get more traction with 3.0.
As to your point about needed retransmitters even into Scottsdale, I think that's more of a consequence of TV's development and also of the timing of the development of Valley television.
ATSC 3.0 offers broadcasters the idea of basically converting themselves into SFNs to permit geotargeted advertising and boost signal strength to mobile devices and on the edges of a transmitter's coverage area. If Phoenix broadcasters did this, I think there'd be boosters in Pinal County (down by San Tan Valley), in North Scottsdale, and maybe in the White Tanks.
It's technically possible to create SFNs with ATSC 1.0. The catch is that it's difficult (because of the use of 8VSB modulation) and the stations often generate co-channel interference. Mexico is having that problem. The IFT insisted that broadcast translators be co-channel. That's caused some issues as (for now) translators may use alternate PSIP (a guy was angry that instead of channels 6 and 12, he had 13 and 20, though they offered the same service), or instead people get no service at all between conflicting transmitters. In some cases, the IFT has permitted shadow channels (as they are sort of called) to change RFs. There are also some shadows that are using different RF channels in order to prepare for impending repacking and clearing of 600 MHz.
I mean, DTS systems have been done in ATSC (KRBK in Springfield, MO is a five-transmitter SFN), but it's kind of rare. I expect the idea to get more traction with 3.0.
Sounds like no serious attempts have been made in recent years to add local tv to the Flagstaff area since KNAZ. I know KPNX shut down the KNAZ news operation back in '08 when the economy took a nosedive. I was in Flagstaff yesterday, and found it to be a bustling congested small city, not the sleepy college town I remember. I still say that KPNX should try local news and commercials for the Northern Az again with KNAZ as a semi-satellite. It will take patience some deep pockets and a few years, but is worth another shot. Northern Arizona should be able to support one station providing local content. Cable and satellite coverage is critical however. I would also add KMOH Kingman as a satellite of KNAZ with additional translators in Prescott, Verde Valley, and perhaps Payson.
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KPNX is barely putting together news in the Phoenix area, let alone in Northern Arizona. While I would love to see more coverage of Northern Arizona news, KPNX is not the station to do so at this point. It is so sad that KPNX has fallen from #1 to #5 in the 12 years that I've been in Phoenix.
I don't disagree. Problem is KPNX holds most of (the only) cards at this point. They own a full power station in Flagstaff with a network affiliation contract. I'd like to see someone else like KSAZ do it and run a full Fox station, but all they have is a translator. As a fox-owned station they could do it -- Not to mention the money, patience, and inclination to do so. And why would they do it, the expense of a full power transmitter, studio, and even a small staff probably outweighs just running the translator. Maybe not enough local ad $$$ to make it work.
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While a full service station with local Northern Arizona Newscasts would be nice,
many here would just be happy with more choices. A station carrying ION or
another news-less affiliation along with a good suite of sub channels like Comet,
Grit, THIS, etc, etc and having regional and local commercials makes a lot of
financial sense.......
many here would just be happy with more choices. A station carrying ION or
another news-less affiliation along with a good suite of sub channels like Comet,
Grit, THIS, etc, etc and having regional and local commercials makes a lot of
financial sense.......
I noticed there is no translator for ION in Flag. I thought the translators of the PHX stations already carried the subchannels and of course the whole situation will probably change after the repack. Would be nice to have a satellite of a PHX station with local news / weather inserts though.
I don't remember the details but it seems to me when a local high power Phoenix station gives its list of translators over the air it covers virtually the entire state north of Casa Grande. Are you talking about these or just their digisubs because I don't know of the translators re-broadcast the subs or not.
Unlikely, unless the news/weather inserts were produced in Phoenix. These days the stations don't seem to even spring for a reporter based in Northern Arizona.
All you need do for Norther Arizona weather is push a button on your smartphone and who doesn't have one of those these days?
As far as local news from NorAZ.....what news? Similar baloney that Phoenix airs like house fires and vehicle accidents? The only "news" that anyone needs, and that mostly from Phoenix and Tucson, is when do the ski mountains open up?
But Phoenix stations can spring for three weathercasters and multiple anchors, right?
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