KSL Daytime Signal

[cyberdad]

I do remember reading somewhere that an Iowan said WHO's cancellation zone goes out 40 miles once the corn is harvested.

I never say never, and nothing's impossible. But I've spent a LOT of time in Iowa, and this seems a little tough to believe. Maybe I should track down my old Iowa farmer's daughter girlfriend and see if she knows anything about this.

Seriously, what I can tell you is that where I was in college (with said girlfriend) was about 125 miles southeast of where WHO's stick is located. There WAS cancellation at that location. Nothing serious, but noticeable to the point where KIOA was actually a bit easier to listen to. KIOA's stick was about 15 or so miles south of WHO's site with 5kw directed mostly west, but a narrow spike aimed east-southeast. Right at me.

 

[kevtronics]

The graphic below shows how greatly the daytime field strengths of AM broadcast stations arriving at the seacoast over sea water paths are reduced by their travel over the inland terrain.

880 WCBS from New York City received approx. 1000 miles away in the Bahamas at dusk:

 

[schmave]

I never say never, and nothing's impossible. But I've spent a LOT of time in Iowa, and this seems a little tough to believe. Maybe I should track down my old Iowa farmer's daughter girlfriend and see if she knows anything about this.

Seriously, what I can tell you is that where I was in college (with said girlfriend) was about 125 miles southeast of where WHO's stick is located. There WAS cancellation at that location. Nothing serious, but noticeable to the point where KIOA was actually a bit easier to listen to. KIOA's stick was about 15 or so miles south of WHO's site with 5kw directed mostly west, but a narrow spike aimed east-southeast. Right at me.

From my location, I think WLW's zone is pushed out 15-20 miles during the cooler/cold months from what they are during the summer. Of course, that was before this current work that is impacting their signal into this area after dark. Over the years though, I would hear a little flutter here and there during the summer with serious phasing as close as my parents' place 20 miles east of me.
In the winter, the phasing at their house was noticeably less but still present.
Like I said, I think the "40 miles" thing is a stretch. 20, possibly. If I can find the source, I will.

 

[davideduardo]

880 WCBS from New York City received approx. 1000 miles away in the Bahamas at dusk:

I bought a boat and sailed from West Palm Beach to San Juan back in the late 70's. Except for four brief port entries, we spent 2 weeks sailing 24 hours a day. At night, by best entertainment came from WBZ, followed by 660, 770 and 880 from NYC.

Strangely, WBZ is directional but it had the best signal... starting about an hour or so before my local sunset until slightly after sunrise.

 

[Schroedingers Cat]

I bought a boat and sailed from West Palm Beach to San Juan back in the late 70's. Except for four brief port entries, we spent 2 weeks sailing 24 hours a day. At night, by best entertainment came from WBZ, followed by 660, 770 and 880 from NYC.

Strangely, WBZ is directional but it had the best signal... starting about an hour or so before my local sunset until slightly after sunrise.

Way back in the late 1970s, I called the Engineer at WBZ to ask if he had any explanation why I was getting WBZ in West Central Michigan in the early afternoon. We talked about the directional pattern. He said that it explained the signal close in, but not thousands of miles away. The DA definitely gave WBZ a better signal in Michigan than other East Coast stations. Mr. Savage at WYSL did extensive studies in Western New York which demonstrate this also. Directional 50 kW Night stations definitely have an edge over nondirectional ones in field strength near the maximum direction. WCFL 1000, the old WOWO 1190, and WLAC 1510 all had signals which reached a maximum of 10 mV/m in Eastern Michigan. WLS 890 was rarely above 3 or 4 mV/m, due to being nondirectional and with a 189.3 degree tower and was rarely overwhelming. WCFL and WOWO could sometimes be heard on a Rocket Radio with a decent 1N34 diode (they vary considerably) and a 100 foot long wire antenna.

 

[Schroedingers Cat]

KYW 1060 and WRVA 1140 are two more East Coast stations that are directional and have a major lobe toward Michigan.

 

[schmave]

WRVA was one of the first blasters I noticed as a young DXer. Right there with KMOX and WMVP, etc. as far as being dependably loud every night in central Ohio. I had no idea until recent years that WRVA was directional. Its main lobe is pointed almost directly at my area.

 

[Schroedingers Cat]

WCKY 1530 was actually what I meant that reached 10 mV/m on Night Pattern. WLAC is strong, but quite a bit less than WCKY. WLAC is much further away. WLAC is what all the DJs and aspiring recording artists listened to for John R and rare R & B not played after sign off or pattern change of local R & B stations.

 

[bob_international]

We receive KFI here in Yuma Arizona during the day (208 air miles) although not as well since they rebuilt their tower.
Also KSPN (KMPC) from the SF Valley transmitter location.
KBRT when they were at Avalon, Catalina Island.

 

[Schroedingers Cat]

Many people have said that KFI just isn't what it used to be with the shorter tower, even though with the sectionalization of the tower, it's supposedly nearly identical in the vertical radiation characteristic pattern and horizontal inverse field from the taller tower.

 

[cyberdad]

WCKY 1530 was actually what I meant that reached 10 mV/m on Night Pattern. WLAC is strong, but quite a bit less than WCKY. WLAC is much further away. WLAC is what all the DJs and aspiring recording artists listened to for John R and rare R & B not played after sign off or pattern change of local R & B stations.

Then, in the same "neighborhood" on the dial, you have KOMA which had the awesome skywave signal pounding into Kansas and Nebraska every night. Nothing else even came close. Which helps explain why concert bands and their promoters throughout the great plains are were regular nighttime advertisers on KOMA.

 

[SomeRadioGuy]

We receive KFI here in Yuma Arizona during the day (208 air miles) although not as well since they rebuilt their tower.
Also KSPN (KMPC) from the SF Valley transmitter location.
KBRT when they were at Avalon, Catalina Island.

@bob_international
Yuma.. hotter then satans taint. I have a friend whos worked in radio there for 20+ years and we regularly converse about the weather there and where I am

 

[davideduardo]

Then, in the same "neighborhood" on the dial, you have KOMA which had the awesome skywave signal pounding into Kansas and Nebraska every night. Nothing else even came close. Which helps explain why concert bands and their promoters throughout the great plains are were regular nighttime advertisers on KOMA.

The fun thing to hear were the movie openings... "Opens Saturday at the Lux in Jamestown, the Regis in Waterloo, the Grand in Truth or Consequences and...."

 

[boiseengineer]

Way back in 2005 traveling from Idaho to S. Utah, KSL had a horrible signal.
OK, I'll listen to the FM. South of Nephi 102.7 is getting clobbered by the Ephraim translator.
KBOI 670 Boise had a better signal. This is before 670 LV came on.
Little later that week, back to SLC for a meeting, one of their Engineers says they were on the AUX tower at low power (forgot why)

 

[wildthangjim]

Then, in the same "neighborhood" on the dial, you have KOMA which had the awesome skywave signal pounding into Kansas and Nebraska every night. Nothing else even came close. Which helps explain why concert bands and their promoters throughout the great plains are were regular nighttime advertisers on KOMA.

Not just the plains. My cousins that lived around San Angelo Texas all had KOMA on their presets. They thought it was odd that I didn't, but growing up in Tulsa, their signal was terrible, presumably due to cancellation and being in the null to protect WKBW.

 

[cyberdad]

Not just the plains. My cousins that lived around San Angelo Texas all had KOMA on their presets. They thought it was odd that I didn't, but growing up in Tulsa, their signal was terrible, presumably due to cancellation and being in the null to protect WKBW.

I know all about that null towards Tulsa. I had Phillips 66 as a good customer. I used to fly into Tulsa, get a car, spend the night, and then drive up to Bartlesville in the morning. KAKC on 1300 was a nice alternative to KOMA in those days, but they were rather weak by the time I completed the hour drive up to Bartlesville,