WXNY IDing past TOH

[101.9 La Kalle]

WXNY just IDed 10 minutes after the Top Of The Hour. Is that normal?

 

[Ex-RadioTV]

WXNY just IDed 10 minutes after the Top Of The Hour. Is that normal?

50 years ago the requirement for station identification was within 2 minutes of the top AND bottom of the hour. That requirement is long gone. 73.1201(a)(2) states “hourly, as close to the hour as feasible, at a natural break in program offerings.” That offers a good deal of latitude on the part of the station.
The downsized FCC has bigger fish to fry.
It’s why I’m not holding my breath that they’ll cite WABC for continually mis-identifying their co-owned Suffolk County FM a station as “WLIR Hampton Bays”.
The callsign of that station on 107.1 is “WLIR-FM”.

 

[Identnut]

I've heard Univision's WOJO ID 10-15 minutes before the hour, particularly when they air their syndicated shows like El Bueno, La Mala y El Feo and El Free-Güey Show.

 

[101.9 La Kalle]

I've heard Univision's WOJO ID 10-15 minutes before the hour, particularly when they air their syndicated shows like El Bueno, La Mala y El Feo and El Free-Güey Show.

I have heard WPAT do TOHs at around 40 to 47 minutes into the hour saying "WPAT-FM Paterson/New York! 93.1 Amor, la casa de Romeo Santos", but they do regular TOHs as well.

 

[davideduardo]

WXNY just IDed 10 minutes after the Top Of The Hour. Is that normal?

Yes, the rules say at a natural break in prog

 

[kevtronics]

The rule is basically meaningless. Some stations bury their actual legal ID in a stopset at :45 and then run a "vanity" ID at the top of the hour, which would definitely count as a "break in programming".

 

[gr8oldies]

The rule is basically meaningless. Some stations bury their actual legal ID in a stopset at :45 and then run a "vanity" ID at the top of the hour, which would definitely count as a "break in programming".

I would imagine if a station was ever cited for ID violations, it would only be if the FCC was "throwing the book" at a station for numerous other violations, like some states do when they are charging people with "failure to pay the sales tax on the illegal drugs" as an add-on.

 

[Gregg.]

I really don't understand the concept of NOT giving a proper I.D. near the top of the hour. It seems consultants program the legal I.D. in the wrong place on purpose. But for what reason?

For Z100, somewhere in its last commercial break of the hour, between two commercials, a quiet voice quickly says "WHTZ Newark-New York City." That's usually around :44 or :45. But within a minute or two of the top of the hour, a BIG voice says "Z100, WHTZ New York." Okay, I understand what the station is trying to do, minimize its true city of license, Newark. But in doing that, it gives what would be a true legal I.D. at the top of the hour if it really were licensed to New York City.

So what about stations that REALLY are licensed to the largest city in their markets? Why are they trying to bury their legal I.D.s? It's not that the DJs are making mistakes, playing the legal I.D. in the wrong place. It's programmed into the computer. Why would consultants not want you to know that station WXXX is licensed to Boston or Detroit or Atlanta? Why build it into the system that the legal I.D. goes in an inappropriate place? Sure, the FCC is so busy with other things that you'll never get fined for it. But why not just ID near the top of the hour?

 

[CTListener]

If call letters are no longer part of the station's on-air brand or marketing, having been replaced by a "Bull" or a "Magic" or even a "Z-98," why mention them at all? Well, since the FCC says you have to, then burying and whispering them makes perfect sense. "But what about the city?" you ask? Answer: The regular in-market listeners know that the station is in or near the major city of their area and the people passing through can deduce that through the station's signal strength. Not only that, the station usually runs ads and gives weather reports that tell anyone else who might care to know and has half a brain where the station is. All this TOH ID stuff is mostly a DXer/radio geek concern now, which puts it firmly back of mind or out of mind with the people who program the stations.

 

[Identnut]

If call letters are no longer part of the station's on-air brand or marketing, having been replaced by a "Bull" or a "Magic" or even a "Z-98," why mention them at all? Well, since the FCC says you have to, then burying and whispering them makes perfect sense. "But what about the city?" you ask? Answer: The regular in-market listeners know that the station is in or near the major city of their area and the people passing through can deduce that through the station's signal strength. Not only that, the station usually runs ads and gives weather reports that tell anyone else who might care to know and has half a brain where the station is. All this TOH ID stuff is mostly a DXer/radio geek concern now, which puts it firmly back of mind or out of mind with the people who program the stations.

Yes, in the rest of the world, call letters are an afterthought if anything. DE can attest to the stations he programmed in Latin America.

 

[Gregg.]

>>> All this TOH ID stuff is mostly a DXer/radio geek concern now, which puts it firmly back of mind or out of mind with the people who program the stations.<<<

OK, then why do programmers schedule the I.D. somewhere around 42 to 48 past the hour? It may be antiquated or unneeded. But why purposefully I.D. at the wrong time? As I said, it isn't like DJs are running it wrong or whoever programs the station computer is entering it in the wrong place. The programmer or consultant wants it there. It's in the same place every hour.

I think before PPM, PDs thought the legal I.D. was an interruption in music flow. But these days, there are jingles and promos between almost every song anyway. Few songs segue with nothing else. So why not do a fast ID around :00 instead of :43?

 

[CTListener]

>>> All this TOH ID stuff is mostly a DXer/radio geek concern now, which puts it firmly back of mind or out of mind with the people who program the stations.<<<

OK, then why do programmers schedule the I.D. somewhere around 42 to 48 past the hour? It may be antiquated or unneeded. But why purposefully I.D. at the wrong time? As I said, it isn't like DJs are running it wrong or whoever programs the station computer is entering it in the wrong place. The programmer or consultant wants it there. It's in the same place every hour.

I think before PPM, PDs thought the legal I.D. was an interruption in music flow. But these days, there are jingles and promos between almost every song anyway. Few songs segue with nothing else. So why not do a fast ID around :00 instead of :43?

Because they can run the ID at :43 and no one will complain except the DX/geek contingent. It's already been explained that the FCC no longer cares.

 

[kevtronics]

So what about stations that REALLY are licensed to the largest city in their markets? Why are they trying to bury their legal I.D.s?

Usually the hide the associated HD ID(s) that clutter up the legal ID for the main signal. For example, 710 WOR simulcasts on 104.3 WAXQ-HD2, but they bury the HD2 ID in a stopset and then run only the main "WOR New York" ID at the top of the hour.

 

[davideduardo]

I really don't understand the concept of NOT giving a proper I.D. near the top of the hour. It seems consultants program the legal I.D. in the wrong place on purpose. But for what reason?

To hide it. Few stations that do that use calls as their "positioner" or trade name. In other words, they find the call letters to be a distraction or confusing and hide them.

So what about stations that REALLY are licensed to the largest city in their markets? Why are they trying to bury their legal I.D.s? It's not that the DJs are making mistakes, playing the legal I.D. in the wrong place. It's programmed into the computer. Why would consultants not want you to know that station WXXX is licensed to Boston or Detroit or Atlanta? Why build it into the system that the legal I.D. goes in an inappropriate place?

Again, the legal ID with call letters is distracting when the station does not otherwise use the calls as its identity.

Sure, the FCC is so busy with other things that you'll never get fined for it. But why not just ID near the top of the hour?

They won't fine for it because the definition of "natural break" is vague. A station can say that they "have just two breaks an hour when we run commercials" and claim that between songs is not a break.

 

[davideduardo]

Usually the hide the associated HD ID(s) that clutter up the legal ID for the main signal. For example, 710 WOR simulcasts on 104.3 WAXQ-HD2, but they bury the HD2 ID in a stopset and then run only the main "WOR New York" ID at the top of the hour.

And that is because W-O-R uses the call letters as its only identity. But Z-100 does not depend on call letters for its identity and the calls are a useless and confusing waste of time.

 

[101.9 La Kalle]

And that is because W-O-R uses the call letters as its only identity. But Z-100 does not depend on call letters for its identity and the calls are a useless and confusing waste of time.

I remember being on vacation in DR back in 2018, heard H-I-J-L on Z-100 at the Top of The Hour.

 

[davideduardo]

I remember being on vacation in DR back in 2018, heard H-I-J-L on Z-100 at the Top of The Hour.

All the former NARBA nations seem to have had ID requirements. That may be why Mexico is about the only place in Latin America where strict call letter usage is required.

When I was directly involved with Zeta, calls were never given and not required.

 

[djl]

Sometimes Lite FM says WLTW - New York’s Lite FM and other times they say WLTW New York. I think the first one does not count as a Station ID. Also why does Z100 say WHTZ FM and HD2 New York. They only have an HD1. They don’t have an HD2. That should be fixed.

 

[Weiserguy]

Sometimes Lite FM says WLTW - New York’s Lite FM and other times they say WLTW New York. I think the first one does not count as a Station ID. Also why does Z100 say WHTZ FM and HD2 New York. They only have an HD1. They don’t have an HD2. That should be fixed.

If Z-100 ID's as "WHTZ New York", that can't be their legal ID. It's only legal when they ID as Newark. (And yes, "HD2" is not accurate for their ID, legal or not, unless they're simulcasting on HD1 and HD2, and then where's the HD1 ID?)

 

[CTListener]

If Z-100 ID's as "WHTZ New York", that can't be their legal ID. It's only legal when they ID as Newark. (And yes, "HD2" is not accurate for their ID, legal or not, unless they're simulcasting on HD1 and HD2, and then where's the HD1 ID?)

They're not saying "HD2" but rather "HD, too"? Maybe that's what they can claim as a defense to escape a hefty fine. Oh, wait. The FCC isn't fining anyone for TOH minutiae like this anymore, right?