KSFO To 810

[davideduardo]

There's no protection required to Asia from West Coast US stations.

In fact, neither Central America nor South America nor much of the Caribbean protect (or are protected by) U.S. stations.

There is a rather effective coordination, somewhat like NARBA, between Chile, Brazil, Uruguay, Argentina and Paraguay and, for a while, Bolivia.

 

[Hole in your radio]

So, to wrap this up...

The agreement between CBS and Entercom/Audacy (and in Boston, with spinoff partners iHeart and Beasley) on the use of shared call letters covers/covered the following radio stations, whose call signs are also used by CBS-owned television stations:

• WJZ and WJZ-FM Baltimore
• WBZ (iHeart) and WBZ-FM (Beasley) Boston
• WBBM and WBBM-FM Chicago
• WWJ Detroit
• KCBS-FM Los Angeles
• WCCO Minneapolis
• WCBS and WCBS-FM New York
• KYW Philadelphia
• KDKA and KDKA-FM Pittsburgh
• KCBS San Francisco

Provided the stations don't change format (WCBS --> WHSQ) or are sold, they can keep using the call signs indefinitely–except in NYC, LA and SF, where they can be used for 20 years after the sale (renewals are possible). The clock is ticking, with 13 more years to go for WCBS-FM, KCBS and KCBS-FM.

In comparison, the pact Cumulus inherited between Disney/ABC and Citadel allows the shared ABC radio/TV calls to stay on radio, apparently in perpetuity. WABC kept its call sign after Cumulus sold it. KGO survived after the format change to sports betting. But with the move of KSFO's programs (and perhaps call letters) to 810, we'll see what the future holds for the KGO calls on A

 

[KilowattKat]

Can someone explain how Cumulus is able to own 4 AM's in one market (KGO, KSFO, KNBR, KTCT), when the AM ownership cap is 3?

 

[davideduardo]

Can someone explain how Cumulus is able to own 4 AM's in one market (KGO, KSFO, KNBR, KTCT), when the AM ownership cap is 3?

The cap for either band is 5. You can have at most 8 stations in the larger markets, an no more than 5 in either service.

The caps decline based on market size.

 

[Weiserguy]

Can someone explain how Cumulus is able to own 4 AM's in one market (KGO, KSFO, KNBR, KTCT), when the AM ownership cap is 3?

As David wrote, the limit is 8 total, no more than 5 of which can be in the same band (AM or FM). So 4 AM's is kosher. The real question is *why* any group owner would voluntarily want to own four AM's in the same market? That is like cornering the market on anchor stores in a dying shopping mall. Or having the best collection of Yugos or Pintos of any used car lot in your city. Yeah, okay, but why?

 

[TheBigA]

The real question is *why* any group owner would voluntarily want to own four AM's in the same market?

Cumulus kind of got skunked into this. They came through separate acquisitions of ABC and Susquehanna.

 

[michael hagerty]

As David wrote, the limit is 8 total, no more than 5 of which can be in the same band (AM or FM). So 4 AM's is kosher. The real question is *why* any group owner would voluntarily want to own four AM's in the same market? That is like cornering the market on anchor stores in a dying shopping mall. Or having the best collection of Yugos or Pintos of any used car lot in your city. Yeah, okay, but why?

Cumulus bought Susquehanna, which owned KNBR and KTCT, in 2006. When Cumulus acquired Citadel in 2011, that gave them KSFO and KGO.

KTCT was valuable as a second signal to KNBR for many years, largely for overflow of live sports. I don't know how it looks in terms of profit today, but I can also imagine that there's not much interest on the part of another buyer in picking up 1050 AM in San Francisco.

 

[Weiserguy]

Cumulus kind of got skunked into this. They came through separate acquisitions of ABC and Susquehanna.

If you're playing poker and you can't figure out who the mark is, it's you. Congrats, Cumulus.

 

[TheBigA]

If you're playing poker and you can't figure out who the mark is, it's you. Congrats, Cumulus.

Exactly. If you go back to my posts ten years ago, you'll see I said the biggest mistake Cumulus made (and they made a few) was to buy Citadel out of bankruptcy. Ultimately, when Cumulus itself went through bankruptcy, most of the assets it sold or shut down were related to the Citadel acquisition. They're still dealing with that today, especially in San Francisco.

 

[Mark Roberts]

Failure is said to have no parents, but there were many hands involved in this conglobulation. Don’t forget that ABC sold off 103.7 to the Brown organization in the 1980s.

Current Cumulus management has to live with the Dickeys’ objective of acquisitions at any cost; the Dickeys don’t have to live with it, so the company is holding the bag. I do not think they are particularly special in this regard. The only winners are the investment bankers who walked away with some nice fees before searching for another industry to destroy.

 

[cc333]

They should play Adult Standards or oldies on 560 AM.

Never gonna happen. I wouldn't mind if it did, though.

That's the exact justification that proponents of DEI use for their cause. Yet that concept is under fire by the new administration.

What concerns me is the rather large number of high profile companies (Tractor Supply, to name one) are voluntarily reversing their DEI policies to avoid becoming targets of the still niche, but increasingly mainstream (and soon to be in control of the government) Far Right (F.R.), whose insanely extreme opposition to anything that isn't MAGA has become rather dangerous for what little is left of compromise and moderate civility, and companies capitulating as they are to the F.R.'s relentless intimidation and harassment will only make things worse for everyone – especially ethnic minorities – if it continues on the way it is.

c

 

[davideduardo]

Never gonna happen. I wouldn't mind if it did, though.

Yep, no way in a large market to sell a station that appeals to people in their 70's and80's.

What concerns me is the rather large number of high profile companies (Tractor Supply, to name one) are voluntarily reversing their DEI policies to avoid becoming targets of the still niche, but increasingly mainstream (and soon to be in control of the government) Far Right (F.R.), whose insanely extreme opposition to anything that isn't MAGA has become rather dangerous for what little is left of compromise and moderate civility, and companies capitulating as they are to the F.R.'s relentless intimidation and harassment will only make things worse for everyone – especially ethnic minorities – if it continues on the way it is.

Let's keep this about radio or TV. DEI and MAGA are not radio subjects unless we are talking about affects on radio companies or radio programming.

That said, nearly all the Hispanics in my circle are very pleased with the election results nationally as they were better off 4 to 8 years ago. What masks this huge shift of Hispanics to the Red side is that most of the TV commentators and Hispanic "influencers" are Democrats, so we get their opinions in the media... but not on the street.

 

[cc333]

Let's keep this about radio or TV.

I agree. I only brought it up in the context of conservative AM talk, a good portion of which is becoming decidedly pro-MAGA (and "anti-woke", which includes pretty much all things DEI). Also related because it seems like ethnic formats on radio (AM and FM) may come under more attack by the F.R. in a DEI-hostile administration, though radio sources will probably be less of a target than ethnic media in other places, such as the many social media platforms online, some of which have become very toxic in tone over the past few years (X, for instance).

OK, I made my statement and will now move on to something directly related to the topic at hand:

When the simulcast with 560 ends, will KSFO be rebranded KGO, or will the KGO calls just silently fade into oblivion, with KSFO being reassigned to 810?

I may have already asked this, but I don't really feel like rereading all 16 pages of this thread, so please forgive me if I'm being repetitive.

c

 

[TheBigA]

When the simulcast with 560 ends, will KSFO be rebranded KGO, or will the KGO calls just silently fade into oblivion, with KSFO being reassigned to 810?

You'll find out when we all find out.

 

[cc333]

You'll find out when we all find out.

OK, fair enough.

c

 

[semoochie]

I agree. I only brought it up in the context of conservative AM talk, a good portion of which is becoming decidedly pro-MAGA (and "anti-woke", which includes pretty much all things DEI). Also related because it seems like ethnic formats on radio (AM and FM) may come under more attack by the F.R. in a DEI-hostile administration, though radio sources will probably be less of a target than ethnic media in other places, such as the many social media platforms online, some of which have become very toxic in tone over the past few years (X, for instance).

OK, I made my statement and will now move on to something directly related to the topic at hand:

When the simulcast with 560 ends, will KSFO be rebranded KGO, or will the KGO calls just silently fade into oblivion, with KSFO being reassigned to 810?

I may have already asked this, but I don't really feel like rereading all 16 pages of this thread, so please forgive me if I'm being repetitive.

c

KSFO is clearly the brand. Making KGO the brand for what has been KSFO programming would be akin to KCBS changing its brand to KFRC!

 

[davideduardo]

Appears When the simulcast with 560 ends, will KSFO be rebranded KGO, or will the KGO calls just silently fade into oblivion, with KSFO being reassigned to 810?

It was previously posted that the KGO calls are apparently locked to use on 810 and not transferable in accordance with the sale documents.

 

[Paul]

), whose insanely extreme opposition to anything that isn't MAGA has become rather dangerous

Guess I'm "dangerous" then. I am very pleased to hear the radio programming and news delivery (that I like) moving to 810 in SF. For one thing, 810 has a much better signal into the areas I travel for work. I'm also pleased because I can't hear KSFO at night from my home, but KGO is good day and night.

So, now knowing that someone who prefers news, not opinion, is "F.R." as you put it, I will wear that badge with honor. Thanks! Time to be happy for someone else, open your mind to new ideas, and maybe learn something new. Now on 810 kc.

 

[michael hagerty]

Guess I'm "dangerous" then. I am very pleased to hear the radio programming and news delivery (that I like) moving to 810 in SF. For one thing, 810 has a much better signal into the areas I travel for work. I'm also pleased because I can't hear KSFO at night from my home, but KGO is good day and night.

And this matters at this time of year, when half of morning drive and half of afternoon drive is on the nighttime pattern. So this is a very good thing for you. Whether there are enough people in the same situation to make a significant difference in ratings, we'll have to wait and see.

Since you are a listener, you might be able to tell us: Is there anything on-air other than referring to the station as "810/KSFO" telling the audience to change the dial away from 560?

 

[michael hagerty]

KSFO is clearly the brand. Making KGO the brand for what has been KSFO programming would be akin to KCBS changing its brand to KFRC!

That's right.

You know what, though? If that happened (at KCBS---David has explained why KGO will eventually change), in six months, it'd seem normal. They're already positioning FM first: "News 106-nine and AM 740, KCBS."

I thought I wouldn't get used to it when they retired the late Nick Michaels' top-of-the-hour "What's happening and why" ID. Didn't take long, and it's been five-plus years now.