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EAS and Central Texas flooding

Theater of My Mind

Theater of My Mind

Proponents for the AM Radio for Every Vehicle Act working its way through Congress continue to emphasize AM radio’s ability to to deliver emergency alerts to more than 90% of Americans, even when internet and cellular networks fail. With that in mind, can anyone describe how well the system worked, or point to some examples of how lives were saved by AM Radio and/or EAS during the latest flooding emergency in Texas?

It looks like ground zero for this disaster was around Kerville, which has one AM Radio station, KERV. The nearest large market with signals that appear to reach the area is San Antonio. Were they all on it?
 
I do not speak from authority here but I worked the Kerrville market in the early 1990s. Places like Camp Mystic would not receive KERV. Kerrville is very over-radioed. In fact, it is not easy for any station to bill enough to keep the lights on. The chances anyone was at any of the stations, AM or FM, in that area is near zero. Even when I was in the market, nobody was around after 5pm weekdays. On weekends 7 to 10am there was somebody around. If anything happened, the EAS was it. That was when there were just 7 stations.

Having lived there, anytime the rain gets heavy you think low water crossing and higher ground. Flooding is always a thought when it starts raining. The news articles imply the people had no clue that heavy rain causes flooding in the Texas Hill Country. Everybody there knows this. Sure the water rose very quickly but living there you know that might happen.
 
Theater of My Mind said:
Proponents for the AM Radio for Every Vehicle Act working its way through Congress continue to emphasize AM radio’s ability to to deliver emergency alerts to more than 90% of Americans, even when internet and cellular networks fail. With that in mind, can anyone describe how well the system worked, or point to some examples of how lives were saved by AM Radio and/or EAS during the latest flooding emergency in Texas?

It looks like ground zero for this disaster was around Kerville, which has one AM Radio station, KERV. The nearest large market with signals that appear to reach the area is San Antonio. Were they all on it?
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In cases like this, we can't expect music stations to suddenly have news departments and reporters a good distance away from their market.

This is why EAS exists: to provide information from informed authorities about emergencies. But EAS can not anticipate once-in-a-lifetime flooding or rainstorms. It can give information as it is available and action steps for those caught in floods.
 
Theater of My Mind said:
Proponents for the AM Radio for Every Vehicle Act working its way through Congress continue to emphasize AM radio’s ability to deliver emergency alerts to more than 90% of Americans, even when internet and cellular networks fail. With that in mind, can anyone describe how well the system worked, or point to some examples of how lives were saved by AM Radio and/or EAS during the latest flooding emergency in Texas?
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The main component in the system is the local emergency officials. They are the ones who originate the EAS alert, they are the ones who provide the information. The radio stations are merely the conduit. Right now they're still occupied with the disaster itself. I imagine there will be time to do an assessment of the system on Monday.
 
Here's a video that details more about the flood stricken area and why it floods there. It reinforces my earlier post that sounds rather insensitive to the victims, however this video seems to say otherwise. In addition, two other camps in the area moved people to higher ground before flooding began.
 
I haven’t heard this specifically mentioned, but the flooding in the Kerrville area is a very similar situation to what happened in Asheville, North Carolina last year, as both were caused by the remnants of named tropical storm systems. A stark reminder that such storms can wreak havoc far inland, not just in coastal areas. This year’s Tropical Storm Barry was a non-event…until it wasn’t.
 
I can agree that these 'non-event' tropical systems can sure wreak havoc. I merely have to think back to Allison in Houston. 18 wheelers bobbing in the freeway, evacuation centers flooded, hospitals and 9-1-1 shut down. TV stations fielding calls for rescue, etc.
 
b-turner said:
I can agree that these 'non-event' tropical systems can sure wreak havoc. I merely have to think back to Allison in Houston. 18 wheelers bobbing in the freeway, evacuation centers flooded, hospitals and 9-1-1 shut down. TV stations fielding calls for rescue, etc.
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Having been right in "the thick of things" and having stood directly on the overpasses of Washington Avenue, Patton Street, Durham Drive, and Shepherd Drive at the Katy Freeway, for a solid 36 hours, I will slightly amend this Allison event for you, Bill. It was not the big rigs bobbing up and down on 10, but cases of beer that were being delivered when the trucks became stranded. We watched the guys diving down to the trailers and then suddenly beer cases popping up to the surface of the water from about a half dozen different Jet Skis cruising all up and down the Katy. Houston's finest just had to stand by and watch along with the rest of us.

It sure seemed like we might need Noah to pull up for a rescue that week. Still the biggest rain event I've ever witnessed or covered in my lifetime, and to think, it barely even rained a drop in places like Katy, Brookshire and Sealy, but literally washed parts of Houston away. Tornadoes, of course, are common up here, and are what we typically see during a landfall of a system along the coast. I had never seen rain like Allison before, nor have I seen it since. Anyone that went through that has never looked at a system "only" categorized as a tropical storm the same way since.
 
How did KRNH-92.3 and others cover this devastating flooding? Was there live coverage and evacuation info? Or was it autopilot?
82 people are dead now. RIP to all victims and may God comfort all of the families and friends who lost loved ones...especially their own children. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
 
crainbebo said:
How did KRNH-92.3 and others cover this devastating flooding? Was there live coverage and evacuation info? Or was it autopilot?
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Most local stations these days have no news department. And in the case of an emergency, almost all stations would depend mostly on official information.
crainbebo said:
82 people are dead now. RIP to all victims and may God comfort all of the families and friends who lost loved ones...especially their own children. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
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Absolutely. Well said.
 
secondchoice, you make a good point. Having lived here I have been told water depth has been up to almost 60 feet at some spots during flooding events of the past but normally the Guadalupe is only a few inches to a couple of feet deep. My question is where they draw the line?

Another question: that area of the state typically has low water crossings versus bridges. Just the natural terrain of hills and valleys assures all roads are impassible with only a couple of inches of rain. How do we get roads up to the point emergency personel can get in. With the cedar tree coverage, only a helicopter can get in most places.
 
There's apparently a dispute about the timeliness of the warnings provided by the national weather service

www.nbcnews.com

National Weather Service defends its flood warnings amid fresh scrutiny of Trump staff cuts

Experts said warnings issued in the run-up to this weekend’s flooding were as timely and accurate as possible, but questions about whether the alerts reached people most at risk remain.
www.nbcnews.com www.nbcnews.com

Some local governments said the weather reports weren't early enough. The media reported what the local governments said. Now, DHS in DC is claiming the media purposely lied about the weather reporting.
 
TheBigA said:
There's apparently a dispute about the timeliness of the warnings provided by the national weather service
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And as many or more reports say that they did something unusual which was to predict the effects of the storm, not normally done.
TheBigA said:
Some local governments said the weather reports weren't early enough. The media reported what the local governments said. Now, DHS in DC is claiming the media purposely lied about the weather reporting.
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Since when are "local governments" authorities in weather forecasting?

And what is actually factual is that reports were earlier than ever, considering that it was not former policy to anticipate the results of bad weather. It has been amply seen and shown that there were extra people on duty before the storm, in fact.
 
davideduardo said:
And as many or more reports say that they did something unusual which was to predict the effects of the storm, not normally done.
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If so, why did so many people die?

davideduardo said:
Since when are "local governments" authorities in weather forecasting?
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Aren't the local authorities responsible for triggering EAS?

Local officials have insisted that no one saw the flood potential coming and have defended their actions. “There’s going to be a lot of finger-pointing, a lot of second-guessing and Monday morning quarterbacking,” said Republican U.S. Rep. Chip Roy, whose district includes Kerr County. “There’s a lot of people saying ‘why’ and ‘how,’ and I understand that.”
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Meanwhile, if there's a dispute in information, and the media is reporting both sides, how is the media lying?
 
TheBigA said:
If so, why did so many people die?
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Read the story. There was almost no time to determine evacuations were needed to such a scale.

When the weather authorities saw a big hurricane, María, approaching Puerto Rico in 2017, they knew it was big. It was quite usual for big hurricanes to hit the Island. They said it might be bigger than normal, but never even guessed that it would hit land at 155 miles an hour and carry so much wind and rain that a majority of all bridges would be gone, that all electricity and phones would be gone, in many cases for months. They could not predict that the storm would hit in such a way that about 80% of all high voltage lines would be interrupted. And that was the data from the best hurricane forecasting team in the world.

And with that hurricane, they knew it was coming for days.
TheBigA said:
Aren't the local authorities responsible for triggering EAS?
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Yes, but they don't do weather forecasts.
 
EAS also doesn’t automatically turn TVs and radios on in the middle of the night, and not everyone has EAS alerts enabled on their phone, either.

NWS watches, warnings & non-weather emergencies automatically turn weather radios on, but you have to have programmed the weather radio for your county first using a SAME code:

If the weather radio you have doesn’t have SAME code capability, it won’t turn on automatically.
 
From all I have read, the National Weather Service warned of high rainfall rates a day prior with a flash flood watch. Just like everywhere else when a weather incident is predicted or warned of, most humans think it will never happen to them. Then when it does, according to them, it's somebody else's fault instead of their own. This is not, in my opinion, an issue with any agency but the lack of attention and concern from the public.

From the various stories I read, it seems three camps actually reacted and one moved people to higher ground Thursday. Regardless, this was a flood hst makes the history books. It was in no way typical of the usual Guadalupe River flood events. Despite national, state warnings, Kerr County, Camp Mystic didn’t evacuate (final paragraph supports above comment)
 


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