100.3 Urban AC Pirate

[johnster]

I don't think rapking would listen to a legal urban AC station because he apparently likes only pirate stations and jumps on the bandwagon of popular pirate stations

Interestingly enough, I see both sides of this argument. I cannot and will not endorse breaking the law as these pirates are doing. However, I also recognize the glee with which innovation is greeted. Particularly when a private party takes the initiative to fill a niche (that needs filling) when the big guys won't deign to do it. Urban AC can work in Boston. It may not ever be number one, but it would do ok and be perfectly viable. Besides, I do not see the likes of WAAF, WFNX, WZLX or WBCN at the top of the Arbitron book either. There's too much rock and too little variety in Boston.

An Urban AC (if done right) could do as well on one transmitter as WAAF does on two! ;D

What you're seeing here are people venting their frustrations with this unchanging issue. I don't agree with them, but nor can I blame them. It's about time that someone in Boston has the brains and the schnuts to break out of the box and program something different.

All the stations you mentioned while not being way up in the ratings grossed millions of dollars last years. An Urban AC in Boston probably would not. Sure you could make money if it was done right but no where as much as any of your examples due to a smaller potential market. I know you think these corporations work with blinders on but they really don't. They are continually researching and still looking at the niche's. But besides stock holders they also have a licence that is worth between 30-60 million dollars on the open market. They just can't afford to be playing down in the small markets when they exist in a large market. It's just that simple. Yes the inner city audience is under served if you want them to have their own station but that's what happens in a free market only the strong survive.

Now the idea of non commercial going after this audience is a great idea. But if you think the folks at Touch are doing this serve the community I think you have your blinders on. They are looking at making money with a very low overhead.

 

[dumber than a box of hair]

With 25% of the population black in Boston, how could an Urban AC (if programmed correctly) not work? That does not even include the African-American population in the entire metro area.

The highest 12+ audience share in the last Arbitron was WJMN, with a 7.0. Meaning: 93% of people using radio in the market are listening to something else. That number only increases as you go down the list. Even if you assume (a really BAD assumption) that all African-Americans would listen to an urban-A/C station, you're talking about a miniscule piece of the pie. Add to that the fact that it's already been tried and failed (the details of which are irrelevant...no commercial station picks up a three-time-loser format, no matter how bad the execution was).

 

[Eli Polonsky]

The highest 12+ audience share in the last Arbitron was WJMN, with a 7.0. Meaning: 93% of people using radio in the market are listening to something else. That number only increases as you go down the list. Even if you assume (a really BAD assumption) that all African-Americans would listen to an urban-A/C station, you're talking about a miniscule piece of the pie.

Once again, not only African-Americans listen to Urban AC/Classic Soul!

I'm a white guy from the west and north suburbs. I often used to hear 1090 WILD coming from other white folks cars in the 'burbs back in their Classic Soul heyday when they were pulling around a 2 share on a mediocre daytime only AM signal. I was listening to them on an AM stereo car receiver myself. I also used to hear the short-lived Urban AC satellite Touch 1150 coming out of cars in the suburbs when it was on about ten years ago.

An Urban AC/Classic Soul station that serves the primarily African-American urban neighborhoods AND all others (of all colors) who enjoy the music in the outer and suburban metro could sustain itself if done right. Yes, it wouldn't bill as well as some other formats for a company that wants the highest bottom line, but it could be successful enough for a dedicated owner.

 

[rapking]

The highest 12+ audience share in the last Arbitron was WJMN, with a 7.0. Meaning: 93% of people using radio in the market are listening to something else. That number only increases as you go down the list. Even if you assume (a really BAD assumption) that all African-Americans would listen to an urban-A/C station, you're talking about a miniscule piece of the pie.

Once again, not only African-Americans listen to Urban AC/Classic Soul!

I'm a white guy from the west and north suburbs. I often used to hear 1090 WILD coming from other white folks cars in the 'burbs back in their Classic Soul heyday when they were pulling around a 2 share on a mediocre daytime only AM signal. I was listening to them on an AM stereo car receiver myself. I also used to hear the short-lived Urban AC satellite Touch 1150 coming out of cars in the suburbs when it was on about ten years ago.

An Urban AC/Classic Soul station that serves the primarily African-American urban neighborhoods AND all others (of all colors) who enjoy the music in the outer and suburban metro could sustain itself if done right. Yes, it wouldn't bill as well as some other formats for a company that wants the highest bottom line, but it could be successful enough for a dedicated owner.

well Said .

 

[dumber than a box of hair]

Once again, not only African-Americans listen to Urban AC/Classic Soul!

I'm a white guy from the west and north suburbs. I often used to hear 1090 WILD coming from other white folks cars in the 'burbs back in their Classic Soul heyday when they were pulling around a 2 share on a mediocre daytime only AM signal. I was listening to them on an AM stereo car receiver myself. I also used to hear the short-lived Urban AC satellite Touch 1150 coming out of cars in the suburbs when it was on about ten years ago.

You should know better than to make a "me and all my friends" argument, especially since you are not a normal garden-variety radio listener. The poster I was replying to was saying that since 25% of the city is A-A the format should work. That's what I was addressing. Nothing else.

Just as you cannot pigeon-hole A-A's when it comes to radio listening, neither can you pigeon-hole whites, Asians or any other ethnic group.

 

[ciao99]

The highest 12+ audience share in the last Arbitron was WJMN, with a 7.0. Meaning: 93% of people using radio in the market are listening to something else. That number only increases as you go down the list. Even if you assume (a really BAD assumption) that all African-Americans would listen to an urban-A/C station, you're talking about a miniscule piece of the pie.

Once again, not only African-Americans listen to Urban AC/Classic Soul!

I'm a white guy from the west and north suburbs. I often used to hear 1090 WILD coming from other white folks cars in the 'burbs back in their Classic Soul heyday when they were pulling around a 2 share on a mediocre daytime only AM signal. I was listening to them on an AM stereo car receiver myself. I also used to hear the short-lived Urban AC satellite Touch 1150 coming out of cars in the suburbs when it was on about ten years ago.

An Urban AC/Classic Soul station that serves the primarily African-American urban neighborhoods AND all others (of all colors) who enjoy the music in the outer and suburban metro could sustain itself if done right. Yes, it wouldn't bill as well as some other formats for a company that wants the highest bottom line, but it could be successful enough for a dedicated owner.

Very good point. Urban AC's primary focus is the black community, but that does not mean all it's listeners are black. Kiss-FM in New York has a decidely black edge to its news and format, but you can walk into stores and hear white and Hispanic folks listening too.

Also, urban AC has not been tried in this market on a decent signal. WILD-FM was not an urban AC. And WILD-Am is only a daytime signal. Even with that daytime signal its only a tenth of a rating point below WFNX. So if we can say Urban AC doesn't work because of WILD's current ratings, we can just as well say WFNX doesn't work.

At this point, I think a full time AM signal would do just fine for an Urban AC. The FMs are probably too expensive to come by.

 

[ciao99]

Once again, not only African-Americans listen to Urban AC/Classic Soul!

I'm a white guy from the west and north suburbs. I often used to hear 1090 WILD coming from other white folks cars in the 'burbs back in their Classic Soul heyday when they were pulling around a 2 share on a mediocre daytime only AM signal. I was listening to them on an AM stereo car receiver myself. I also used to hear the short-lived Urban AC satellite Touch 1150 coming out of cars in the suburbs when it was on about ten years ago.

You should know better than to make a "me and all my friends" argument, especially since you are not a normal garden-variety radio listener. The poster I was replying to was saying that since 25% of the city is A-A the format should work. That's what I was addressing. Nothing else.

Just as you cannot pigeon-hole A-A's when it comes to radio listening, neither can you pigeon-hole whites, Asians or any other ethnic group.

And not all black folks in Boston are African American. At least within city limits. Most are immigrants from the Caribbean and Cape Verde. Different history and different tastes.

 

[johnster]

We where talking about the pirates and how some thought they served their community where commercial radio was not. This was not about ethnicity nor Urban AC or any type of AC. These pirates aren't urban AC when caribbean, or salsa or anything that suits them. The whole point I was making was that a commercial station could not afford to program to these numbers. Now I think you can broaden this same problem to the AC thing too since no one is going to use a Boston Class B on anything urban because the entire downtown Boston audience is not large enough to support it. NYC is a whole different picture where the population is as large as this whole state. A Boston station is going after everything inside of 495. This is why even the Hip Hop stations are not targeting Boston but suburbia. They know where the numbers are.

 

[nd2023]

If Touch 106.1 had a 10000 watt transmitter, would it still be urban AC?

 

[Eli Polonsky]

If Touch 106.1 had a 10000 watt transmitter, would it still be urban AC?

And, a license?

 

[ciao99]

We where talking about the pirates and how some thought they served their community where commercial radio was not. This was not about ethnicity nor Urban AC or any type of AC. These pirates aren't urban AC when caribbean, or salsa or anything that suits them. The whole point I was making was that a commercial station could not afford to program to these numbers. Now I think you can broaden this same problem to the AC thing too since no one is going to use a Boston Class B on anything urban because the entire downtown Boston audience is not large enough to support it. NYC is a whole different picture where the population is as large as this whole state. A Boston station is going after everything inside of 495. This is why even the Hip Hop stations are not targeting Boston but suburbia. They know where the numbers are.

I suggest you look at New Haven Connecticut. It's a new England city with similar proportions in terms of white, black (african- american, jamaican, blah blah blah) and hispanic population, with the minorities concentrated in the city. The number one station in that market is frequently is WYBC, an Urban AC.

 

[FPB]

>Maybe your employer (a legal station?) would be interested to know about your open support of
>illegal stations. How long do you think you would remain employed after that? If they do hear about it, >it won't be from me...
>
Back in '03 I had a day job as a news anchor on a legal station and had a weekly show on a pirate. My PD knew all about it, and didn't care. In fact we had plenty of conversations about it. I suppose the fact that I was working 45 miles away from the pirate had much to do with it.

I had another job later on - mainly as board op and fill in. My PD at that station got fired, and we talked about him spending some time at the pirate I was with while he was between jobs. He never came around, but still.

>If you want to hear your favorite tunes, get an IPod...
>
Interesting comment from a station GM. So you admit that radio is not serving everyone's needs?

 

[spilot113]

I suggest you look at New Haven Connecticut. It's a new England city with similar proportions in terms of white, black (african- american, jamaican, blah blah blah) and hispanic population, with the minorities concentrated in the city.

Does the city have similar minority makeup?

...or the market as a whole?

The number one station in that market is frequently is WYBC, an Urban AC.

BTW....From what I see here:

http://www.radioandrecords.com/RRRatings/DetailsPage.aspx?MID=181&RY=2007&RQ=4&MP=0&OTHER=2&MN=New%20Haven&MS=CT&MR=114&12P=417100&UP=1/15/2008%2012:00:00%20AM&SU=S&BPER=14.2&HPER=&OPER=&NSD=&CE=0

Rock, Country and Mainstream AC seem to be beating Urban AC.

It also says the ethnic population of New Haven is 14.2%

While Boston's Black population is: 6.4%

 

[ciao99]

I suggest you look at New Haven Connecticut. It's a new England city with similar proportions in terms of white, black (african- american, jamaican, blah blah blah) and hispanic population, with the minorities concentrated in the city.

Does the city have similar minority makeup?

...or the market as a whole?

The number one station in that market is frequently is WYBC, an Urban AC.

BTW....From what I see here:

http://www.radioandrecords.com/RRRatings/DetailsPage.aspx?MID=181&RY=2007&RQ=4&MP=0&OTHER=2&MN=New%20Haven&MS=CT&MR=114&12P=417100&UP=1/15/2008%2012:00:00%20AM&SU=S&BPER=14.2&HPER=&OPER=&NSD=&CE=0

Rock, Country and Mainstream AC seem to be beating Urban AC.

It also says the ethnic population of New Haven is 14.2%

While Boston's Black population is: 6.4%

Wrong. In the latest book, WYBC is not beat by mainstream AC, it's tied with the so-called "mainstream" AC station. And if you go back 2 books, WYBC was # 2, bested only by rock station WPLR.

 

[radiojay1]

Urban AC station in Boston

I am white but I am a big fan of soul and R&B, especially 70's and 80's soul and R&B. I was just pointing out that 25% of the population of Boston is black, and the target audience of Urban AC stations is the black audience, but I also said that the station should reflect that not only black people listen to it and like soul and R&B music. It should reach out to everyone.

 

[rapking]

WILD-AM 1090 get a 1 share ( better than WFNX ) with no one there,AM daytimer,Urban Pirate stations all over the city, and a owner who does not give a crap about this station. Radio One aka "I see Dumb People" . With good Ownership ( Inner City WBLS NY Owners or dedicated New local Owner ), Boston can support a Urban A/C format.

 

[spilot113]

BTW....From what I see here:

http://www.radioandrecords.com/RRRatings/DetailsPage.aspx?MID=181&RY=2007&RQ=4&MP=0&OTHER=2&MN=New%20Haven&MS=CT&MR=114&12P=417100&UP=1/15/2008%2012:00:00%20AM&SU=S&BPER=14.2&HPER=&OPER=&NSD=&CE=0

Wrong. In the latest book, WYBC is not beat by mainstream AC, it's tied with the so-called "mainstream" AC station.
[/quote]

Well, they're not beating them, are they?

And it looks like WYBC is on a downward spiral.

 

[radiorama1]

Me? I didnt like the fact that there was nothing on the radio that played the music I, and my friends enjoy. I found a legal non-comm that would give me an air shift. I put 10-15 hours a week into making a play list, production, lining up guests, listening to and editing music from new local bands. I spend my own money on the supplies I need to do a good show (blank Cd's, music etc...) I stood up and did something legal about what I didn't like. I invest my time and my money. What do you do? Start ten new threads a week saying "BOSTON NEED A URBAN AC"

Congrats on your show. However (and I am not defending the Pirates here) if I understand correctly you play mostly local, unsigned garage bands (and my apologies if I am mistaken, I have never heard your program).

Not sure if the rules at WMWM have changed at all, however during my time there they prohibited anyone from playing anything that could be constituted as "mainstream" , and they ever went as far as suspending a dj that had a local music show, because he played a song by Boston (Brad Delp, RIP).

I am pretty sure that the format that rapking wants (Urban AC) would fall into that catagory.

 

[NSPUNX]

WMWM has been going in a new direction recently. They have upgraded a lot of equipment and have become more involved in the community even doing live remote broadcasts of salem state baseball games. They are trying to move from a mindset of "we only play music no one wants to hear" to a direction of "we want people to listen"

I play The Dropkick Murphy's which is on a major label and played on every rock station in Boston, I play the clash, the ramones, social distortion, all on major labels and all played on every rock station in the country. We have a metal show that plays a lot of well known artists. The mindset is changing over at WMWM so I think an urban ac show would be well recieved especially as it is an underserved format. The only restriction is you cannot sell advertising and cannot profit from it.

 

[Neanderpaul]

The number one station in that market is frequently is WYBC, an Urban AC.

Wrong. In the latest book, WYBC is not beat by mainstream AC, it's tied with the so-called "mainstream" AC station. And if you go back 2 books, WYBC was # 2, bested only by rock station WPLR.

So...once is frequently then?