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103.1 Signals

Re: Those who can do, those who can't criticize the moderator instead

> I tell ya what. I'll apologize to you right after you
> apologize to Sam for calling him names yesterday. BTW, is
> that why the entire thread was deleted?

The thread was not deleted. It was closed to further posting by one of the other moderators. You must have conveniently missed my comments on that elsewhere in this thread.

> As for my topic
> header, that is merely an opinion. You yourself have often
> clumped people here into labeled groups because they do not
> share your philosophies, so I don't see why you would take
> that topic header so personally. From my experience, radio
> consultants are basically worthless. But again, that is just
> my opinion and not meant to be a personal attack on anyone.

In the context of the header and your attack on me within the post, your explanation fails to hold water.

That is just <u>my</u> opinion.

> You are right---it is quite apparent that you are not always
> speaking as a moderator when you post, because your "posts"
> often instigate people into arguing, and then "moderator
> you" usually threatens to boot them when they do.

You make it sound like I am the only person who people have arguments with here. That is not the case, and your apparent bias against me colors your arguments.

Have you noticed the numerous times that I have stayed out of arguments as a moderator, only to have to step in later because arguments escalated <u>even when I was only commenting peripherally</u>? I thought not.

> That was
> the point I was trying to make, that this board could be
> more informative and constructive if you would be either a
> moderator or a poster---not both. I wasn't questioning your
> right to do both, I was questioning your reason. But in all
> fairness, if you are going to do both, you should hold
> yourself to the same rules, relgulations and standards that
> you demand from the rest of us.
>
> Is that too much to ask?

No, but apparently it is too much to ask that you look at this objectively. I don't know what it is you have against consultants, but it is readily apparent that you are biased against them ... and then, by extension, against me as a moderator.

<u>I'll</u> tell <u>you</u> what. I will neither close this thread nor request that the admins kill your login for rule #5. But I will not make that promise for any of the other moderators.

<P ID="signature">______________


</P>
 
Re: Those who can do, those who can't consult...

>
> I'll tell you what. I will neither close this thread nor
> request that the admins kill your login for rule #5. But I
> will not make that promise for any of the other moderators.
>


TOO SUBTLE!!! lol
 
Re: There IS an Asian FM station in the market

> > KALI 106.3 ... I drive by their xmitter every day on the 5
>
> > in Santa Ana
>
> Forgot about them. Thanks.
>
> Still, thinking about it further, given the high
> concentration of those of Vietnamese descent, a second such
> signal would have potential in OC.
>

KWIZ-96.7 used to be Vietnamese, but I think they changed to Spanish....

There's at least one or two Viet AM signals in OC....1480 is one
(I played it for a couple of Vietnamese buddies visiting from Paris a few
months back...)
 
wow- a brand new angle

Oh, puh-leeze. The same, lame "consultants suck" diatribe.

Will you dry up and come up with something better than that-- most of us who've been in the business awhile instantly recognize "consultant" slams as "wah, wah- I couldn't make it in radio and my wuss of a GM/PD blamed the consultant, so now I go around cutting down consultants" rant.

It sooooooooooooooooooooo old and tired.

>
> I think that is exactly the problem, KM. You are very
> opinionated AND a moderator. The job of a moderator is to
> preside, not to bombard the debate with their one-sided
> opinions. While much of what you bring to the table is fact
> and/or based on experience, too much of it is your opinion.
> Anyone who reads back through the Indie posts can see that
> your bias against 103 goes deeper than Sam and his annoying
> ongoing agenda to promote the station. And your bullying
> ways go beyond the Indie 103 posts. You seem to clash with
> MANY who post here, way more than any other moderator.
>
> You claimed that those who "stay quiet" on this board when
> disputes arise are doing so because they know you are
> speaking as a broadcast professional. That's a mighty big
> assumption on your part, my friend. I contend that many do
> so because they don't want to be unfairly attacked and
> kicked off the board, and/or they have better ways to waste
> their time.
>
> Speaking of "quiet", why can't you be more like the other
> moderators and only chime in when necessary to keep order on
> the board?
>
 
heads-up,

Sam's thread was closed because he's an unreasonable goof who's 2 CDs short of a boxed set.

Wannabees who call consultants worthless (in almost every case) have never, EVER
spent meaningful time with a consultant-- chickens@#t GMs and PDs pass blame for format changes and firings onto the consultant because they haven't had the guts to face the music themselves. And, the sad part is radio people actually buy it.

Sad, sad.

> I tell ya what. I'll apologize to you right after you
> apologize to Sam for calling him names yesterday. (BTW, is
> that why the entire thread was closed?) As for my topic
> header, that is merely an opinion. You yourself have often
> clumped people here into labeled groups because they do not
> share your philosophies, so I don't see why you would take
> that topic header so personally. From my experience, radio
> consultants are basically worthless. But again, that is just
> my opinion and not meant to be a personal attack on anyone.
 
Re: There IS an Asian FM station in the market

> > > KALI 106.3 ... I drive by their xmitter every day on the
> 5
> >
> > > in Santa Ana
> >
> > Forgot about them. Thanks.
> >
> > Still, thinking about it further, given the high
> > concentration of those of Vietnamese descent, a second
> such
> > signal would have potential in OC.
> >
>
> KWIZ-96.7 used to be Vietnamese, but I think they changed to
> Spanish....

KWIZ AM which is now KVNR was Vietnames...
>
> There's at least one or two Viet AM signals in OC....1480 is
> one

1480 and 96. are both Liberman stations.
 
Re: Indie

> Are you done yet?

I like this guy's spunk! There's clearly a thinking brain at work here, despite his ignorance. And all the moderator can do is mock him. Sad. A typical arrogant radio attitude at work.

Sam, don't let them drag you down. Keep asking questions, keep learning!
 
Re: THE OTHER MODERATOR

OK Yall, I see some people in hear who are not following our guidelines and who also like to be a bunch of &*&^%&%&%&. As a co Mod, I have as much right to close a thread as anyone who is a mod on this board. I didn't close the last one, but if I continue to see some Bustas fronting, it's going down(the thread that is). Consider this a PROMISE.

For those of you that ain't fronting, keep it blazin(your radio that is.)



> > I tell ya what. I'll apologize to you right after you
> > apologize to Sam for calling him names yesterday. BTW, is
> > that why the entire thread was deleted?
>
> The thread was not deleted. It was closed to further
> posting by one of the other moderators. You must have
> conveniently missed my comments on that elsewhere in this
> thread.
>
> > As for my topic
> > header, that is merely an opinion. You yourself have often
>
> > clumped people here into labeled groups because they do
> not
> > share your philosophies, so I don't see why you would take
>
> > that topic header so personally. From my experience, radio
>
> > consultants are basically worthless. But again, that is
> just
> > my opinion and not meant to be a personal attack on
> anyone.
>
> In the context of the header and your attack on me within
> the post, your explanation fails to hold water.
>
> That is just my opinion.
>
> > You are right---it is quite apparent that you are not
> always
> > speaking as a moderator when you post, because your
> "posts"
> > often instigate people into arguing, and then "moderator
> > you" usually threatens to boot them when they do.
>
> You make it sound like I am the only person who people have
> arguments with here. That is not the case, and your
> apparent bias against me colors your arguments.
>
> Have you noticed the numerous times that I have stayed out
> of arguments as a moderator, only to have to step in later
> because arguments escalated even when I was only commenting
> peripherally? I thought not.
>
> > That was
> > the point I was trying to make, that this board could be
> > more informative and constructive if you would be either
> a
> > moderator or a poster---not both. I wasn't questioning
> your
> > right to do both, I was questioning your reason. But in
> all
> > fairness, if you are going to do both, you should hold
> > yourself to the same rules, relgulations and standards
> that
> > you demand from the rest of us.
> >
> > Is that too much to ask?
>
> No, but apparently it is too much to ask that you look at
> this objectively. I don't know what it is you have against
> consultants, but it is readily apparent that you are biased
> against them ... and then, by extension, against me as a
> moderator.
>
> I'll tell you what. I will neither close this thread nor
> request that the admins kill your login for rule #5. But I
> will not make that promise for any of the other moderators.
>
<P ID="signature">______________
The old skool show@noon with Jeff G and DJ Rawn
Only on Power 106(KPWR Los Angeles)

JOSH, Moderating the whole Radio-Info radio state of California and Indiana too!</P>
 
HOLD ON THERE BUDDY

Sam's thread was closed because he's an unreasonable goof
> who's 2 CDs short of a boxed set.

-----------------------------
Rule #1

Messages containing personal attacks, slanderous material, and similar nonsense.

-----------------------------


I must chime in here to say that the above comment about me is grounds for being banned from this board and I ask the moderator to consider such action.

Besides, I have more cd's and box sets than I know what to do with.
So keeps your facts straight.
 
Re: Indie

I've never achieved anything by following other peoples preconcieved notions, and I like that Indie is paving new ground.

Despite some posters continual attempt to tell me that Indie is a nothing station, it manages to be hailed as the best rock station in the country.

Maybe the haters can't wrap their heads around why.





> > Are you done yet?
>
> I like this guy's spunk! There's clearly a thinking brain at
> work here, despite his ignorance. And all the moderator can
> do is mock him. Sad. A typical arrogant radio attitude at
> work.
>
> Sam, don't let them drag you down. Keep asking questions,
> keep learning!
>
 
Re: HOLD ON THERE BUDDY

> Sam's thread was closed because he's an unreasonable goof
> > who's 2 CDs short of a boxed set.
>
> -----------------------------
> Rule #1
>
> Messages containing personal attacks, slanderous material,
> and similar nonsense.
>
> -----------------------------
>
>
> I must chime in here to say that the above comment about me
> is grounds for being banned from this board and I ask the
> moderator to consider such action.

In my opinion, that was not a personal attack.

> Besides, I have more cd's and box sets than I know what to
> do with.
> So keeps your facts straight.

In my opinion, that remark was clueless and also proves the first remark was not a personal attack.

<P ID="signature">______________


</P>
 
Re: HOLD ON THERE BUDDY

> > Sam's thread was closed because he's an unreasonable goof
> > > who's 2 CDs short of a boxed set.


> In my opinion, that was not a personal attack.



Well that shows exactly how off base your opinion is.

A guy makes a post to specically name me as being an unreasonable goof who's 2 cd's short of a box set and you don't think that's a personal attack.

Then I guess it's ok for me to say that you KM are a boneheaded fool who is one trend short of a book.



If that gets me banned it will show what a farce this board has become.






"It's George's world now, we just live in it."

Orwell, not Bush









> > Sam's thread was closed because he's an unreasonable goof
> > > who's 2 CDs short of a boxed set.
> >
> > -----------------------------
> > Rule #1
> >
> > Messages containing personal attacks, slanderous material,
>
> > and similar nonsense.
> >
> > -----------------------------
> >
> >
> > I must chime in here to say that the above comment about
> me
> > is grounds for being banned from this board and I ask the
> > moderator to consider such action.
>
> In my opinion, that was not a personal attack.
>
 
We agree on more than you think we do

> Despite some posters continual attempt to tell me that Indie
> is a nothing station, it manages to be hailed as the best
> rock station in the country.

Let's clarify something.

No one is making claims that Indie is a bad format, or that it is not innovative, or that any of the critical acclaim to which you refer is undeserved.

What we are saying is that Indie is -- unfortunately -- on a bad signal and therefore will never achieve the kind of ratings success it deserves.

And this entire thread has been about Sam claiming Indie's ratings are improving when in fact they are not. Any perceived negativity toward him comes from the fact that he does not, apparently, understand that correcting his uninformed statements about Indie's ratings does not equal attacking the format itself.

Add the fact that he does not comprehend the answers, because he keeps coming back with the same content, reworded, and you have a lot of frustrated radio people trying desperately to clear up the confusion.

Indie is NOT a bad station. It is a good concept on a bad signal. There is a lot of difference, but you have to accept BOTH statements as true.

Sam and I have agreed that Indie is a good station. I just need him to understand and agree that its signal limitations cannot be overcome, and therefore neither can its low ratings improve significantly.

In other words, no more grasping at straws.
<P ID="signature">______________


</P>
 
Re: We agree on more than you think we do

> > Despite some posters continual attempt to tell me that
> Indie
> > is a nothing station, it manages to be hailed as the best
> > rock station in the country.
>
> Let's clarify something.
>
> No one is making claims that Indie is a bad format, or that
> it is not innovative, or that any of the critical acclaim to
> which you refer is undeserved.
>
> What we are saying is that Indie is -- unfortunately -- on a
> bad signal and therefore will never achieve the kind of
> ratings success it deserves.
>
> And this entire thread has been about Sam claiming Indie's
> ratings are improving when in fact they are not. Any
> perceived negativity toward him comes from the fact that he
> does not, apparently, understand that correcting his
> uninformed statements about Indie's ratings does not equal
> attacking the format itself.
>
> Add the fact that he does not comprehend the answers,
> because he keeps coming back with the same content,
> reworded, and you have a lot of frustrated radio people
> trying desperately to clear up the confusion.
>
> Indie is NOT a bad station. It is a good concept on a bad
> signal. There is a lot of difference, but you have to
> accept BOTH statements as true.
>
> Sam and I have agreed that Indie is a good station. I just
> need him to understand and agree that its signal limitations
> cannot be overcome, and therefore neither can its low
> ratings improve significantly.
>
> In other words, no more grasping at straws.



I still believe you have to give Entravision props for sticking with it and giving it a shot once the JSA with Clear Channel ended. And, K.M., it has seen some ratings growth since it signed on. But it will likely top out right about where it is now ... But I still believe they can make money with it, if they keep in on the air. Remember, you get about $1 million in revenue for every tenth of a point for English language stations. If they can keep it hovering around a one share - they might be able to do a one share.

I think all Sam has tried to say is that for what its signal is, the numbers aren't all that bad.

Class A frequencies are so challenging to program in a sea of B's - but they give people the opportunity to think out of the box, take a few more chances, and come up with unique niches.
>
 
Re: We agree on more than you think we do

> I think all Sam has tried to say is that for what its signal
> is, the numbers aren't all that bad.

I wish I could agree with you, but his approach has always been "See? See? Indie is going to beat KROQ!"

And that has been what has caused him to come under attack. Despite the ease of being able to point at me as an attacker, the fact is that I am not the only one who has tried to get him to look at this reasonably. But he sees this as "if only Indie can get better ratings, they will kill KROQ off" and that is wishful thinking on his part.

My guess is that -- now that he has attacked me purely as a moderator elsewhere in this thread -- someone will ask for him to be banned. And the admins always uphold rule #5.
<P ID="signature">______________


</P>
 
Re: HOLD ON THERE BUDDY

{moderator mode on}

Rule #5.

<P ID="signature">______________


</P>
 
Re: HOLD ON THERE BUDDY

> Then I guess it's ok for me to say that you KM are a
> boneheaded fool who is one trend short of a book.

Here is the crux of your misunderstanding, Sam.

A trend and a book have, each, as many diaries as a base.

Look at what has come out this year.

Fall Book = data from Oct, Nov & Dec
January Trend = data from Nov, Dec & Jan (one from Winter, two from fall)
February Trend = data from Dec, Jan and Feb
Winter book = data from Jan, Feb & Mar
April Trend = data from Feb, MAr & April
May Trend = data from Mar, Apr & May.

So the trend that just came out has the same roughly 7500 diaries as a book, and has two months from Spring and one from Winter. It has just as big a sample as a book. It is not, however, cross weighted.

Months are extrapolated by math at the stations. Arbitron does not give monthly ratings except as a byproduct when each book comes out. Arbitron cautions that individual month extraps are not anywhere nearly as reliable as trends, since Arbitron does nothing to make each month truly proportional. Proportionality is achieved in the 12 week book, not in each month. This is why an area, for example, may get oversampled in one month, and undersampled the next one and be balanced by the time the book ends.
 
Re: We agree on more than you think we do

>
> I still believe you have to give Entravision props for
> sticking with it and giving it a shot once the JSA with
> Clear Channel ended. And, K.M., it has seen some ratings
> growth since it signed on. But it will likely top out right
> about where it is now ... But I still believe they can make
> money with it, if they keep in on the air. Remember, you get
> about $1 million in revenue for every tenth of a point for
> English language stations. If they can keep it hovering
> around a one share - they might be able to do a one share.

There is no formua for revenue per share point. The big stations get more revenue per point than the big ones, because the big advertisers do not buy very deep in any demo, so most of the money goes to big stations.

Special budgets go to oddly performing stations. Sports marketing money goes to Sports staitons and play by play, even if there is no evidence of ratings because it is marketing money, not ad money... and sports stations deliver key demos. KNX and KFWB do well because of cume delivery and qualitative.

In general, a station that will always be a 0.7 to 1.2 performer will bill about $4 million to $5 million.
>
> I think all Sam has tried to say is that for what its signal
> is, the numbers aren't all that bad.

Yet, in its coverage area, KROQ kills it horribly.
>
> Class A frequencies are so challenging to program in a sea
> of B's - but they give people the opportunity to think out
> of the box, take a few more chances, and come up with unique
> niches.

Simply said, unless you get over a 2 share, you are not even in the running for business unless you are sports or news or an ethnic station.
 
Re: HOLD ON THERE BUDDY

Cutomer mode on.

Rule #1.




So,
I basically made the same comment about you that OldiesCat made about me and i'm in violation of a rule because i'm talking to a moderator.

So, you can defend his statement about me ,which is a violation of rule #1, but when I make it about you Ive violated a rule?

Seig Heil.




> {moderator mode on}
>
> Rule #5.
>
 
Re: HOLD ON THERE BUDDY

Oh boy, does nobody here have a sense of humor?

What you fail to understand David is that a cd box set is a box set whether or not all of the cd's are in it at any given time. The important thing is that the box itself is not missing.

A cd box set will ,depending on the month, be missing some cd's or have extra cd's. That is what we refer to as the "cd box set wobble".

No matter how you slice it, if I have a couple of cd's missing at any given time it is due to the fact that people in southwest LA don't buy box sets and therefore the data is weighted to take that into account. Therefore if I show up a couple of cd's short, they will certainly be there when we count them next month.

This does not apply, however, to cd box sets at Indie because nobody can listen to them anyway, so the point is moot. So if there are some extra cd's in the box sets at Indie it surely is a mistake.


Dispite my levity, David, your information is very useful. Thank you.







> > Then I guess it's ok for me to say that you KM are a
> > boneheaded fool who is one trend short of a book.
>
> Here is the crux of your misunderstanding, Sam.
>
> A trend and a book have, each, as many diaries as a base.
>
> Look at what has come out this year.
>
> Fall Book = data from Oct, Nov & Dec
> January Trend = data from Nov, Dec & Jan (one from Winter,
> two from fall)
> February Trend = data from Dec, Jan and Feb
> Winter book = data from Jan, Feb & Mar
> April Trend = data from Feb, MAr & April
> May Trend = data from Mar, Apr & May.
>
> So the trend that just came out has the same roughly 7500
> diaries as a book, and has two months from Spring and one
> from Winter. It has just as big a sample as a book. It is
> not, however, cross weighted.
>
> Months are extrapolated by math at the stations. Arbitron
> does not give monthly ratings except as a byproduct when
> each book comes out. Arbitron cautions that individual month
> extraps are not anywhere nearly as reliable as trends, since
> Arbitron does nothing to make each month truly proportional.
> Proportionality is achieved in the 12 week book, not in each
> month. This is why an area, for example, may get oversampled
> in one month, and undersampled the next one and be balanced
> by the time the book ends.
>
 
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