2009 Change Over to All DTV

[Markxxx]

Where will the TBN LP stations go when they flash cut? That is if they are above Channel 51. I know our biggest LP in Chicago WWME-CA Channel 23 is trying to get OK'd for digital 39. Which will be a bummer for suburbs because then WCIU which owns it won't carry WWME on it's subchannel

I was also wondering about those coverters. It seems pretty odd the FCC would say they are good for a $40.00 credit. Because it killed the incentive to make it cheaper. Like if it cost $25.00 to make a converter, the company will price it at $40.00 to get the full money or they will price it at $65 (40+25) so they can still get the original amount PLUS the FCC credit.

It'll be interesting

 

[FloydB]

I wish I had fiber to the home.

Get you some Raisin Bran. That should clear it up ;D

 

[w9wi]

Where will the TBN LP stations go when they flash cut? That is if they are above Channel 51.

"flash cut" implies changing from analog to digital on the same channel. You can't do that if you're above channel 51. W57DN, Elgin has a permit for a DTV on channel 30. TBNs elsewhere have generally taken similar action.

I was also wondering about those coverters. It seems pretty odd the FCC would say they are good for a $40.00 credit.

This isn't a FCC action. Congress authorized it and another agency (I forget which one!) has been charged with carrying it out. (that doesn't mean your point isn't valid, though at the same time Congress needs to know how much it's going to be spending on this, and the consumer needs to know what they're going to have to pay out-of-pocket after handing in that voucher...)

 

[dhett]

Where will the TBN LP stations go when they flash cut? That is if they are above Channel 51.

"flash cut" implies changing from analog to digital on the same channel. You can't do that if you're above channel 51. W57DN, Elgin has a permit for a DTV on channel 30. TBNs elsewhere have generally taken similar action.

Actually, LPDTV stations can exist between channel 52 and 59 after the conversion. They will still be secondary, but now there are different primary services in that spectrum than full-service television. It seems to be a lot like channels 70 - 83 before the 1980s. There will be no more television service on channels 60 - 69 after conversion though.

Most LPTV stations have voluntarily vacated channel 52 - 59 though.

 

[JeeperOne]

Hi everyone:

Apparently some conversion is beginning to happen on cable in the Jackson, TN area. I received a letter from Charter yesterday that they would be making changes to some of their channels as of Oct. 17th. GSN, G4, and WE will be going digital. GSN and G4 will stay in the same channel positions in the basic tier, but will only be available with the digital tuners, and cable ready sets won't be able to get them any longer. WE will be changing channels to a channel in the digital tier, and the previous basic channel will be empty. It appears that Charter will be gradually converting channels to digital until they get to a point that all customers will have to use converter boxes, possibly even several months before the conversion date.

That's because they are switching those channels to Digital Cable. That is NOT the same as HDTV.

Cheers

 

[vibe]

Even with 80% cable/satelite pentration, that leaves a bunch of people who rely on OTA. Until there are enough low cost converters (under $25), Congress should allow 1 full power analog channel in each market for people to receive OTA analog for local news/emergency etc.
People's basic right to be informed should not be compromised. It may be a matter of life/death in extreme circumstances. You shouldn't have to die because you are too poor to afford a converter.

 

[dhett]

There is no compromise of people's right to be informed. Television is not the only medium out there; there is also radio. The federal government will be subsidizing converter boxes. Television stations would be crazy not to make converters available to those who cannot afford them. There are still 16 months until the conversion; many will buy new TVs on their own before then, and those will have digital tuners.

Assuming an 80% cable/satellite penetration rate, most people are already set. I don't know the demographic of the other 20% but I don't think they are who you think. A lot of those are middle class who just don't want cable or satellite. I'm one of those. Many of the poor live in urban areas, which are usually well-served by low-power stations which have no mandated conversion date and are required to broadcast emergency information. Urban areas also have an abundance of radio stations. Many of the poorer rural areas aren't even served by full-service TV, but are served by LPTV translators, which again, have no mandate for digital conversion. Even so, there is also radio.

I've been to poorer areas of the country and always see satellite dishes. No matter how poor people are, they always seem to have money for cable TV and/or video game systems.

Government and private industry have done their part to ensure that people are informed; at some point, people need to take responsibility for their own lives.

 

[TexasTom]

low-power stations which have no mandated conversion date

Just wanted to highlight this one piece of your quote -- it is relevant to note that in areas that have LPTV or Class A service, all analog OTA service is not going away in 2009. These stations will continue to broadcast an analog signal for some length of time (a conversion date has not been set by the FCC).

My suspicion is that some of these analog LPTV stations will find a new source of business after February 2009: leasing their airtime to full power broadcasters. The full power digital stations can then use these analog LPTVs to simulcast an analog signal into the core of their broadcast service areas. In a major market, I suspect that this could be a profitable business arrangement for both parties for at least a couple years after the transition.

 

[pabsungenis]

My suspicion is that some of these analog LPTV stations will find a new source of business after February 2009: leasing their airtime to full power broadcasters. The full power digital stations can then use these analog LPTVs to simulcast an analog signal into the core of their broadcast service areas. In a major market, I suspect that this could be a profitable business arrangement for both parties for at least a couple years after the transition.

Don't LPTV's and Class-A's have requirements for original programming?

 

[Markxxx]

It's not always poor areas, I live in Chicago and with the building as they are cable is often your only option, a dish can't work because the big building are lined up one after another in a row.

I think there is going to be a lot of growing pains. Like I hate black bars on my TV be they on the top or sides, but with no standard definition, there are bars all over the place, or you have to use "stretching," which looks horrible.

A lot of people are going to be mad when they lose their TV and what's replacing it is bars on their TV or stretched out distorted images. But this will eventually work itself out I guess

 

[JayR]

Assuming an 80% cable/satellite penetration rate, most people are already set. I don't know the demographic of the other 20% but I don't think they are who you think. A lot of those are middle class who just don't want cable or satellite. I'm one of those.

I knew someone who was like that. They had a tv but no cable or DBS service.

I've been to poorer areas of the country and always see satellite dishes. No matter how poor people are, they always seem to have money for cable TV and/or video game systems.

Very true.

 

[dhett]

Don't LPTV's and Class-A's have requirements for original programming?

Only Class A stations do - three hours minimum per week, which really isn't a lot considering there are 168 hours in a week, so that represents roughly 2% of the programming schedule.

 

[vibe]

I might be wrong but isn't there a direct correlation between income and % of people using cable/satelite?
Yeah, I've gone by my share of run down houses with new pick ups, a bass boat, and a dish but correct me if I'm wrong, I believe the correlation is there.

 

[MikeD]

I usually don't chime in, but what about people that have more televisions that digital tuners? For example, I have a guest bedroom with an extra TV for when guests come over. Its an older TV, isn't hooked up to the dish (not worth an extra 5.99 per month for a d* tuner). Instead I hooked it up to "rabbit ears" and it works great for OTA signals. I know that 2009 it won't work unless I buy a tuner (probably not, my guests will deal with no TV) but I imagine that there are plenty of people who will lose their second or third set because of the switchover.

 

[dhett]

Beginning in 2008, the US gov't will allow each household two $40 subsidy coupons to buy digital-to-analog converters.
Source: http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DOC-277165A1.pdf

I doubt that the impact of the 2009 cutover will be anywhere near as great as people fear. And as I said before, any TV station not willing to help out the poorest with converters is missing a huge opportunity for goodwill in the community.

 

[WPPCProductions]

To Me I'm not happy about this whole thing,As a US citizen, It feels like I'm getting
f^%$ked, in the long run.I can see the cable tv co's running to the bank with millions more and costing broadcaster millions of dollars to upgrade and the public force to buy new tv's and vcr's or a dam converter box to use on a standard tv or vcr.as I've been reading on about this transition.I think it's alot of bullcrap to force the american public to do this transition for to free up the spectrum to narrow down the tv band for more crappy cell phone channels like they did earlier on the UHF channels.I'm for digital tv, It's too bad they are using dictatorship to go this route.and but don't force the entire country to upgrade to a dictated time frame. Who made this decision. I'm not ready for this D Day yet, I have about 8 to 10 cable ready vcr's and 2 DVD recorders plus the computer with a video capture card connected to cable with no cable boxes.Now does this means I have to get at least a dozen dtv converter boxes from the cable company which I well get charge for everyone of those boxes.also includes the free ones Plus I know I'm in the hole with my portable tv collection with this transtion.I guess I can't take my portable tv to the beach and watch the news.nevermind to record with vcr when this Sh2t happens.Ok I apoligize to anyone who I got upset here, but thats my opinion about this changeover.Haha Ha whats next, HD radio only....

 

[R.D.P.]

...Could be.

R.D.P. <><

 

[Markxxx]

A lot of people feel duped but it's really not that way. TV broadcasting in analog is a 1940s technology. It definately isn't the best way to make use of the spectrum.

Unlike a lot of things there is only so much spectrum to go around. TV stations can broadcast even in anolog a lot more efficently today than they could in 1950.
Even if they adopted analog technology they could make better uses of the spectrum.

The problem starts in the early 90s when TV industry wanted to make better use of this spectrum. It would lower there costs. Congress hadn't really thought about cell phones and such. Indeed I remember going to NYC in 2001 and being amazed at how many there were. (There were practically none in Chicago. And those who had them were rich).

Congress and the FCC and the TV people were given a mandate to replace analog with HIGH DEF TV. This is TV that looks really good. Then as the pieces started falling in place someone realized SO?

I mean in order for "Seinfeld" to look good you will have to go to the expensive process of converting film (if the TV show WAS shot in film, which is better than HiDef Standard) to Hi Def. And is "Seinfeld" any funnier in Hi Def. No it isn't.

Then local stations started realizing in Hi Def things actually LOOKED like they were. No more fake wood on news sets. The anchors couldn't get away with second rate make up jobs. Suddenly the costs were going up.

Then somone had the idea. No wait a minute, instead of using our space that were assigned on the TV spectrum for HI DEF TV why not just use it for digital. All HI Def TV is digital but not all digital is Hi Def. (Note there are technologies that can use analog to prodcue Hi Def pictures)

In that spectrum the TV stations could broadcaste ONE analog TV channel, ONE Hi Def TV channel or up to SIX digital channels. This in effect gave each TV station in America FIVE more channels.

FOX originally said "Screw that, we won't broadcast Hi Def," well just upconvert. That is let the TV simulate Hi Def but it isn't true Hi Def. After FOX got into sports big time, the teams said no, you do Hi Def or don't get any more contracts. So they did.

Because digital TV whether Hi Def or not involves sending number over the air which are recognized as pictures, sound, etc. the FCC allowed MANY standards. You can have 1080i 720p you can the screen be long like a movie theatre or like an analog TV. It's easy to do because all that's being sent is numbers.

Then along came the explosion in cell phones. It so happens cell work good on the UHF frequencies that are high (shorter antennas). And Digital TV allows stations to be crunched together. For instance in the same city you can have Channels 9, 10 and 11 all together. (Provided they broadcast from the same antenna location.) You can't do that with analog (exccept Ch 4 and 5, and Ch 6 and 7 which really aren't next to each other on the spectrum)

As you can see this is a lot to cope and I agree that some companies like DirectTV and Comcast are misleading the public, they don't lie but they mislead.

It's like when Rob Petrie says "You jumped to conclusions." And Laura said "You led me to those conclusions." Rob says "I may have led you but jumping was your own idea."

 

[MarcB]

Canada?

Is Canada switching over to all HDTV too? If so when? I heard a commercial on Hamilton's CHML 900 last night that one of the prizes you can bid on on their website is a High Definition TV.

 

[w9wi]

Re: Canada?

Is Canada switching over to all HDTV too? If so when? I heard a commercial on Hamilton's CHML 900 last night that one of the prizes you can bid on on their website is a High Definition TV.

Yes, Canada has set a "drop-dead date" for DTV. It's later than in the US, I don't remember how much later.

There are DTV stations on the air in some of the larger cities. They are relatively low-powered compared to U.S. DTV stations.