94 WIP "huge" announcement Monday 2/6/2012 ?

[RadioPhillyFan]

No one is suggesting that 97.5 is going to change formats I hope? They draw a much
larger audience than with previous format and the demographic is
desirable. I can see getting rid of the AM feed. I flip back and forth
between ip and the fanatic.

WNUW did better income then the current WPEN, not sure about it's profit. GM would rather push its FM numbers to AM then drop it's AM, where WIP-AM would gain. They'd sooner drop the sports talk on FM, imo.

GM could halfass a CHR and do better then they are now, plus WIP-FM would go into the top ten. I kinda think WBEN will turn to CHR because of the stations current playlist edits.

Maybe you can prove it to me but I see now way that station format did better than today's format and in the desired demographic it wouldn't even be close. Please provide some numbers with links.

All I need is ratings from 2009 for WNUW

Well, then let's see those. Both for total and the demograhphic. I am sorry but without proof, I don't buy this.

Can anybody provide them? I don't have them.

 

[MDefl]

No one is suggesting that 97.5 is going to change formats I hope? They draw a much
larger audience than with previous format and the demographic is
desirable. I can see getting rid of the AM feed. I flip back and forth
between ip and the fanatic.

WNUW did better income then the current WPEN, not sure about it's profit. GM would rather push its FM numbers to AM then drop it's AM, where WIP-AM would gain. They'd sooner drop the sports talk on FM, imo.

GM could halfass a CHR and do better then they are now, plus WIP-FM would go into the top ten. I kinda think WBEN will turn to CHR because of the stations current playlist edits.

Maybe you can prove it to me but I see now way that station format did better than today's format and in the desired demographic it wouldn't even be close. Please provide some numbers with links.

All I need is ratings from 2009 for WNUW

Well, then let's see those. Both for total and the demograhphic. I am sorry but without proof, I don't buy this.

Can anybody provide them? I don't have them.

Historical arbitron info is hard to find. Commonsense tellsm that the demo for 97.5 is much stronger than the previous format and I bet the overall ratings are higher as well. You seemed to indicate that you knew for a fact that they were not.

 

[RadioPhillyFan]

No one is suggesting that 97.5 is going to change formats I hope? They draw a much
larger audience than with previous format and the demographic is
desirable. I can see getting rid of the AM feed. I flip back and forth
between ip and the fanatic.

WNUW did better income then the current WPEN, not sure about it's profit. GM would rather push its FM numbers to AM then drop it's AM, where WIP-AM would gain. They'd sooner drop the sports talk on FM, imo.

GM could halfass a CHR and do better then they are now, plus WIP-FM would go into the top ten. I kinda think WBEN will turn to CHR because of the stations current playlist edits.

Maybe you can prove it to me but I see now way that station format did better than today's format and in the desired demographic it wouldn't even be close. Please provide some numbers with links.

All I need is ratings from 2009 for WNUW

Well, then let's see those. Both for total and the demograhphic. I am sorry but without proof, I don't buy this.

Can anybody provide them? I don't have them.

Historical arbitron info is hard to find. Commonsense tellsm that the demo for 97.5 is much stronger than the previous format and I bet the overall ratings are higher as well. You seemed to indicate that you knew for a fact that they were not.

I know for a fact WNUW had been at a 2.7 peak, usually 2.0 - 1.5 however. -Cume was about 500k-600k

 

[MDefl]

No one is suggesting that 97.5 is going to change formats I hope? They draw a much
larger audience than with previous format and the demographic is
desirable. I can see getting rid of the AM feed. I flip back and forth
between ip and the fanatic.

WNUW did better income then the current WPEN, not sure about it's profit. GM would rather push its FM numbers to AM then drop it's AM, where WIP-AM would gain. They'd sooner drop the sports talk on FM, imo.

GM could halfass a CHR and do better then they are now, plus WIP-FM would go into the top ten. I kinda think WBEN will turn to CHR because of the stations current playlist edits.

Maybe you can prove it to me but I see now way that station format did better than today's format and in the desired demographic it wouldn't even be close. Please provide some numbers with links.

All I need is ratings from 2009 for WNUW

Well, then let's see those. Both for total and the demograhphic. I am sorry but without proof, I don't buy this.

Can anybody provide them? I don't have them.

Historical arbitron info is hard to find. Commonsense tellsm that the demo for 97.5 is much stronger than the previous format and I bet the overall ratings are higher as well. You seemed to indicate that you knew for a fact that they were not.

I know for a fact WNUW had been at a 2.7 peak, usually 2.0 - 1.5 however. -Cume was about 500k-600k

That is comparable to what the fanatic is getting currently and there is simply no way the demo's for the old nuw are comparable to this format. I honestly do not believe they are contemplating a switch. Can you provide any evidence?

 

[pab]

That is comparable to what the fanatic is getting currently and there is simply no way the demo's for the old nuw are comparable to this format. I honestly do not believe they are contemplating a switch. Can you provide any evidence?

How much more expensive is The Fanatic to run than WNUW was? Between network clearance, operator wages, and personality salaries? Not to mention publicity, promotion, and advertising?

If the numbers (and the billing) aren't much better for a more expensive format, it makes sense to blow up the more expensive format and replace it with a cheaper one that bills similarly.

 

[imhomerjay]

Wouldn't Missanelli alone be costlier than the DJ lineup they had as Now?

 

[RadioPhillyFan]

That is comparable to what the fanatic is getting currently and there is simply no way the demo's for the old nuw are comparable to this format. I honestly do not believe they are contemplating a switch. Can you provide any evidence?

How much more expensive is The Fanatic to run than WNUW was? Between network clearance, operator wages, and personality salaries? Not to mention publicity, promotion, and advertising?

If the numbers (and the billing) aren't much better for a more expensive format, it makes sense to blow up the more expensive format and replace it with a cheaper one that bills similarly.

You're completely unaware of how poor WPEN preforms - I completely agree with homer.

 

[wprt949]

greater media will put a local morning show on the fanatic before they flip it

 

[pab]

You're completely unaware of how poor WPEN preforms - I completely agree with homer.

I am aware, and that's my point. WPEN-FM is so expensive to operate that they could blow it up for an automated (or even jocked) music format with half the listeners and make more money.

 

[MDefl]

You're completely unaware of how poor WPEN preforms - I completely agree with homer.

I am aware, and that's my point. WPEN-FM is so expensive to operate that they could blow it up for an automated (or even jocked) music format with half the listeners and make more money.

Maybe you guys can tell me more about the ad revs being achieved by 97.5 now as compared to the previous format. The ratings are NOT bad either especially in drive time in the demo. You and I don't have the whole picture yet you seem to be convinced. I am not. Without the full picture, we cannot know either way. You claim that a couple of DJ's on the station have made reference to a format change yet I can find no evidence of this. None. Without evidence, I am starting to think that an agenda is in play.

 

[RadioPhillyFan]

You're completely unaware of how poor WPEN preforms - I completely agree with homer.

I am aware, and that's my point. WPEN-FM is so expensive to operate that they could blow it up for an automated (or even jocked) music format with half the listeners and make more money.

Maybe you guys can tell me more about the ad revs being achieved by 97.5 now as compared to the previous format. The ratings are NOT bad either especially in drive time in the demo. You and I don't have the whole picture yet you seem to be convinced. I am not. Without the full picture, we cannot know either way. You claim that a couple of DJ's on the station have made reference to a format change yet I can find no evidence of this. None. Without evidence, I am starting to think that an agenda is in play.

We'll have our answer in time; at this point, I think we should agree to disagree.

 

[wprt949]

what is 97.5 flipping too ?

 

[RadioPhillyFan]

what is 97.5 flipping too ?

It's not flipping, Mike. We're discussing the possibility and hints / station performance and history.

 

[wprt949]

nothing is happening with 97.5 trust me they just brought tony bruno back to town i think they could be putting together a morning show of some type with him on it mabye tweak the lineup and see how things go from there i just cant see greater media switching right now

 

[aindik]

IIRC from reading here, they would lose their ESPN affiliation if they dropped Mike & Mike in the Morning. Not sure they want that.

It would make sense for them to run Mike & Mike on 950 and something local on 97.5, but I'm not sure ESPN would let them keep running play by play and night/weekend stuff on the FM if they did that.

Also, running Mike & Mike on 97.5 is kind of like what CBS did in New York in the late 1990s with the Hot Talk version of WNEW. When you have two stations seeking the same demo, run a weak morning show on purpose on one of them to protect the other one.

 

[radiophiler]

The same thing occurred to me: Put a stronger sports show on in the morning on 97.5, and you might take audience from Preston and Steve on WMMR and Debella on WMGK. On the other hand, Mike Miss. in the afternoon doesn't pose the same problem because audiences that want "more music" in the afternoon wouldn't necessarily be competing with an all-talk sports show.

Why not bring talk radio back to FM in Philly on 97.5? Actually keep Mike Miss. but make it a general talk station. He'd just be doing a sports program on a talk station, which isn't all that unusual. He's be local talk when WPHT is syndicated with the last hour of Rush and then the now-syndicated Smerconish. (Yes, I know one of his hours is local Philly only ... but it's only one of four hours.) Run the entire ESPN schedule on 950 AM just to be a little thorn in WIP's side.

Then again, Philly has never been a vibrant radio talk city. At least not in the last decade it hasn't.

I've been trying to think of potential format holes that 97.5 could occupy. There really aren't many THAT WOULD BE VIABLE in Philly (emphasis on viable).

Try a more conservative AC approach than B-101. Last time, Now tried taking from the younger end and that didn't work too well. But would that take listeners from Ben FM? Maybe not if Ben was positioned more as the upbeat station and the new 97.5 would be softer, more relaxing, de-stressing.

Or maybe a Hot AC-alternative hybrid as is being done in some markets. A Modern AC that leans heavily toward the alternative side. It could take women listeners away from Radio 104.5 without cannibalizing any of Greater Media's other stations. Might also be a way to take some younger listeners from B 101 and Mix 106.

 

[MDefl]

Sure, we can agree to disagree! I just think that the shows are doing well enough in the demo, especially Mike's show which was reported to be #1 in the male demo, to get enough ad $ to overcome the cost increases.

I do agree that Philly doesn't respond well to non-Philly talkers in general. Mike and Mike is a good show but I doubt many are listening. They do have some type of agreement to clear a certain amount of ESPN programming through 97.5. It used to be more when they had the awful Herd program on.

I suspect they are going nowhere anytime soon. Even though their costs are higher than before, they have a cost structure that is a fraction of what must exist at 94 given the sports programming and the cost of Cataldi alone. I like elements of both stations and I really think competition makes everyone better. Howard Eskin had become a joke and brining Mike in drove him out. Just one example.

 

[aindik]

Why not bring talk radio back to FM in Philly on 97.5? Actually keep Mike Miss. but make it a general talk station. He'd just be doing a sports program on a talk station, which isn't all that unusual. He's be local talk when WPHT is syndicated with the last hour of Rush and then the now-syndicated Smerconish. (Yes, I know one of his hours is local Philly only ... but it's only one of four hours.) Run the entire ESPN schedule on 950 AM just to be a little thorn in WIP's side.

Then again, Philly has never been a vibrant radio talk city. At least not in the last decade it hasn't.

If 97.5 flipped to non-sports talk, the obvious choice for morning show would be Preston and Steve. Instant ratings. Put a good DJ on MMR (probably someone already on the station in a different shift) in the morning instead of a talk show.

 

[RadioPhillyFan]

Sure, we can agree to disagree! I just think that the shows are doing well enough in the demo, especially Mike's show which was reported to be #1 in the male demo, to get enough ad $ to overcome the cost increases.

I do agree that Philly doesn't respond well to non-Philly talkers in general. Mike and Mike is a good show but I doubt many are listening. They do have some type of agreement to clear a certain amount of ESPN programming through 97.5. It used to be more when they had the awful Herd program on.

I suspect they are going nowhere anytime soon. Even though their costs are higher than before, they have a cost structure that is a fraction of what must exist at 94 given the sports programming and the cost of Cataldi alone. I like elements of both stations and I really think competition makes everyone better. Howard Eskin had become a joke and brining Mike in drove him out. Just one example.

I'm a bit biased about WPEN - I loved both of it's previous formats.

What I think WPEN should do, is run a Harder Alternatives - as in bands they won't play on MMR (kinda like MGK is to MMR) but also make it lean towards the talk radio side - sort of like Elvis Durran or Preston, either that or run a CHR (Yet, we have enough - would be a ratings bomb) that can differentiate itself from the current four (IOQ, RDW, PST and STW).

I would say oldies, but it may dent BEN:
The issue with talk radio would be people may not realize it's not Sports Talk anymore (people who don't listen often, or at all) - many average listeners just use seek, and some only stop on songs or an interesting bit)

And the AC? Well, WNUW was kind of an AC.

I also agree that having them go head-to-head makes it more interesting,

I really can't see a format that won't hurt it's current ones (other then CHR or a Talk Format)

I kind of would like to see a punk alternative / upbeat ac / chr format, it could talk away from IOQ, STW, ISX, PST, RFF, MMR (that's the disadvantage, it may take the youger portion from MMR) and RDW.

They could play Red Jumpsuit Apparatus, Third Eye Blind, Cobra Starship, Train, etc. It's draw away from BEB and ISX the younger listeners (but it wouldn't touch the rap they play, or else it pretty much becomes Mix 106.1, they could also play Foster the People and such - almost like WSTW, but mostly like WRFF - as in it plays alternative more then Cobra Starship.

Maybe a 60's - 80's format? BEN could tweak to a Gen X format, but that may hurt MGK and MMR.

There is hardly any viable options, the DJ "hints" may have been concerns about WIP's gaining of the phillies, but nothing special.

They could halfass a CHR and just be done with it, if they get sick of sports.

 

[MDefl]

How about a friendly bet? I will wager $50 to your charity that 97.5 FM (not the AM band) will have the same format they have today on February 17, 2013. Are you game?