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Adult Standards

Hello to Chuck in Chalk Hill! Just curious, by any chance does your play list happen to favor Cat Stevens, Steeley Dan, Rare Earth, or the Doobie Brothers given your "other" rather successful past? :) You should explain to those reading this who have no idea what I'm talking about.

Nice to see you on here and best wishes and greetings to you and Diane.
 
Chuck and Frisco said it very well. It depends on who your sales people are, Sales people can sell it ,if they are very good,plus the revenue can be there. Forget the agencies,use your own instincts and sales pool. It can be done. They are too focus on disposable income -45 crowd,instead of those with thicker wallets. The problem islike programming, hardly anyone wants to inovate. They rather immitate.
 
Frisco Kid said:
Based on the thiking of some there should be no new artist recording the music and those of us who born after world war two are either hopelessly out of it or just crazy.
There are lots of artists recording all genres of music. But that doesn't mean their output is viable as part of a radio format.
Don't forget that first wave of baby boomers are turning 60 and that all the Rolling Stones,the remaining Beatles,Aretha Franklin are over 60, hell James Brown is over 70.
Much, if not most of the past output of those artists are tunes I'm tired of listening to. This reminds me of visiting my parents some years ago, when an Adult Standards station had just gone on in their market. I tuned the radio to the station and let my mother sample it, but her reaction was "I don't really want to listen to all this old stuff." The Standards station flipped to Spanish a couple of years later, BTW.
Why do they continue to use standards in tv spots and movies.
Because the licensing/rights fees for use of old material are a lot cheaper than going with more recent music. Songwriters and performers whose prime years are long behind them are more willing to strike a deal for a lower price.
 
FlyOnWall said:
Hello to Chuck in Chalk Hill! Just curious, by any chance does your play list happen to favor Cat Stevens, Steeley Dan, Rare Earth, or the Doobie Brothers given your "other" rather successful past? :) You should explain to those reading this who have no idea what I'm talking about.

Nice to see you on here and best wishes and greetings to you and Diane.

In fact, you will find these artists are conspicuously missing from our play list. As you point out, those folks all helped me make a decent living. I got involved in the live sound industry in 1970, and started my own company, Crossroads Audio, in 1972. Those acts, and quite a few more were very good clients. They paid a lot of bills. I enjoyed the experience of working with and knowing them, but they don't really belong on an Adult Standards station. They belong to a different format.

Having sold the sound company a few years ago, I have found a new life managing a small radio station. Maybe the fact that I have very few preconceived notions about what radio should or shouldn't do has helped the station to be successful. It is truly "radio on a shoestring," but it is a lot of fun. I know, well paid consultants think we're crazy to do a home grown version of Adult Standards, but quite a few of our East Texas friends seem to like it.

I think one of the keys to being successful with Standards is not making it sound like it is aimed at the Geritol bunch. Even if you really are old, you don't want to be constantly reminded of it. Most of the Standards stations I've heard make me want to go to sleep. Sleep is fine but we'd prefer to make you want to dance, or at least tap your toes. If somebody at the rest home doesn't get enough sleep, I guess they will have to turn down the radio. ;)

Diane says "Hi!"
 
All good points Chuck makes. I will add...Play the hits. Play what's familiar to your audience. You will win. "Homegrow" it between the songs. Hire seasoned talent who know and understand what they're playing and keep the mood naturally bright. Smooth without being loud. Med-Up without fatiguing. Wink Martindale does a great job.

I agree Chuck. I'm 52 and remember my parents playing Sinatra, Bennet, Dino, Steve Lawrence, Etc but i also discovered many other mor artist i never listened to that much as a youngster and in the last 15 years think that music is beautiful.

Ask Chuck Brinkman to play The Carpenters into Jimi Hendrix ;D
 
This is a bit off topic, but…

I found this board when I was trying to find out what happened to Jack Bishop when he disappeared from KAAM.

I would like to see someone grab the “standards” format and run hard with it. With all due respect, the 770 incarnation of KAAM has, from day one, been about half a bubble out of level even for KAAM. Assuming that he didn’t leave of his own volition, them dumping Jack Bishop just reinforces my perception.

Although I don’t live in the Metroplex, I am a frequent visitor and I have listened to KAAM when I am there since the early 1990s. This KAAM is drifting away from standards and toward oldies, and while there is nothing wrong with oldies, I’m sure that there is at least one station in the Metroplex that is devoted to that genre.

Although at 46 years of age, I have slipped out of the coveted <45 demographic, I can still spend money with the best of them and it’s not on Cadillacs, cruises, or investment opportunities either. I don’t understand why more affordable “everyday” products and services aren’t marketed on KAAM – and I don’t mean a plumber who charges $200.00 to change a washer in a faucet. My brother and I tried the Bavarian Grill and an Italian place in Plano, which advertised on KAAM in the 620 era. “Older” people today are not as “old” as “older” people used to be and there must be some entities in the vast expanse of D/FW willing to market to this crowd besides retirement centers and funeral homes.

With eleven million people in the Metroplex and streaming audio on the Internet, if someone could only manage to get a frequency with some respectable coverage, couldn’t a good standards station at least put food on the table for someone with the tenacity to put it together?
 
All very good points. I think advertisers miss the boat by ignoring the "older" demos. Convincing a broadcaster to flip to this kind of format is useless unless the advertisers are convinced it will work. That's the battle that has to be won first.
 
woodyrr said:
I found this board when I was trying to find out what happened to Jack Bishop when he disappeared from KAAM.

I would like to see someone grab the “standards” format and run hard with it. With all due respect, the 770 incarnation of KAAM has, from day one, been about half a bubble out of level even for KAAM. Assuming that he didn’t leave of his own volition, them dumping Jack Bishop just reinforces my perception.
[...]
Although at 46 years of age, I have slipped out of the coveted <45 demographic, I can still spend money with the best of them[...]

I couldn't agree more!! I'm still in the coveted <45 demo, and I regularly listened to KAAM on my afternoon drive home. That was until KAAM dumped Jack Bishop, at which point, I dumped KAAM. I think KAAM blew it when they dumped Bishop and Company. I liked the banter between Bishop, the traffic guy/gal, and Dave Mitchell. The banter and the standards made for a pleasant drive. I've listened to Chuck Brinkman, who does a fine job, but the "lone jock" format seems to lack the energy that Bishop and Company had. I tuned in this afternoon for a little while, and Linda Martin was filling in, as she did when Bishop was there. That time slot doesn't seem to be the best fit for her talents...
 
DavidEduardo said:
The "No 55 or over" dictate comes from the clients, not the agencies. There is no way for a radio statin to get this changed, and there are far more profitable ways of spending sales development time.

Looks like the clients need to get educated. Twenty years ago, Mexican and Black format stations heard
"but your listeners are our shoplifters."
 
It's been my casual observation that a lot of the music you find on an Adult Standards station has a decent following among Baby Boomers. That’s not to say they like the way it is usually presented on the radio. I am beginning to think that radio’s pre-conceived notion of this format is its biggest problem.

Most of us in the Baby Boomer age group grew up watching Ed Sullivan, Dinah Shore, Perry Como, Dean Martin and a lot of others on TV. During high school and college, we listened to many of these people on the radio, and probably even owned some of their records. There certainly were a lot of non-rock hits that got tons of radio air play in the 50s and 60s. It's true, we wanted to party with the Rolling Stones, but we actually listened to a lot of other music as well. For some reason we sort of forgot about it. Out of sight, out of mind, I guess.

For the last 35-40 years, radio has assumed that people of my age group wanted a steady diet of Beatles, Stones, Led Zeppelin and Jimi Hendrix. That's fine, but eventually it becomes very predictable. How many times in a day can you listen to "Stairway to Heaven?" Speaking for myself, I got tired of it. About the mid 1990's curent pop music left me. It no longer had any appeal. Somebody my age isn't supposed to like Rap and Hip-Hop. It worked. I can't handle it. :eek: I tried Smooth Jazz for a while, but it also got very predictable. I even got on a Classical Music kick for a while. In fact, still listen to WRR a bit when I'm in Dallas. It's good stuff, but not very high energy.

One day I rediscovered a lot of what user to be called "Middle of the Road" (MOR) music. It struck a chord with me. I already knew all the songs, but I hadn't heard them in a long time. It was a little like finding an old friend. I have noticed that I'm not at all alone. While it's not for everyone, there ought to be enough fans that someone could make a decent living out of it.

It’s curious that even though the music has a lot of appeal, it isn’t well represented on the radio. I think that has a lot to do with the way many broadcasters think it should be presented. If you make your radio station sound like “only old farts need tune in,” then that’s who you’ll get for listeners. I don’t claim to have any answers, but I’m fairly certain that to succeed, Adult Standards needs a fresh approach. The music has a following, so broadcasters need to figure out how to take advantage of that if they want to be successful with the format.

As a leading edge Baby Boomer, I can tell you that I have not stopped spending money. In fact, I think I spend way more at age 59 than I ever have at any other point in my life. At least in the community I live in, that seems fairly normal. You probably won't get me to switch from Diet Coke to Pepsi, but there are lots of other marketing opportunities pitched to people over 50. It just takes the right people to understand that. I think they are leaving money on the table by ignoring that demographic.
 
Chuck said:
I am beginning to think that radio’s pre-conceived notion of this format is its biggest problem.
A modernized approach to Standards on FM was tried on WRDA "Red 104.1" in St. Louis. Included lots of cover versions of old tunes, and a presentation aimed more at Baby Boomers and Yuppies than those born before WWII. Didn't last long, though.

The audio bandwidth crunching that has become commonplace on AM has also worked against Standards. The genre usually featured full/lush/rich orchestration that sounded good years ago when AMs were engineered for music--and there were quality receivers to match. Most younger listeners these days have no idea how good AM can sound when done correctly.
 
But St. Louis was a poor choice for this to start. Cities like NYC, Dallas, Houston (where I am from and it seems like there would be a market here, our former station KBME had numbers at least rivaling some of our current FMs), Chicago or Boston should of been first. DFW has the social type that would gravitate to a well done updated standards format and WRR would be perfect. Wasn't WRR a MOR format many years ago?
 
WRR was kind of an ALL OVER THE ROAD in the 50's and 60's. It was block programmed .
 
Of course that was WRR-AM 1310 :)
 
Very good points by Chuck regarding presentation of the Standards format!

Regarding KAAM, there seems to be quite a bit of difference between the presentation of the format as delivered by Jack Bishop compared to Chuck Brinkman. I'm just curious to know if there were any noticeable changes in KAAM's share for the afternoon drive after the switch from Bishop to Brinkman. I don't recall reading in this forum any fast and hard resaons for Bishop being cut loose by KAAM, but perhaps the it was an issue of presentation???
 
Mediafrog+ said:
A modernized approach to Standards on FM was tried on WRDA "Red 104.1" in St. Louis. Included lots of cover versions of old tunes, and a presentation aimed more at Baby Boomers and Yuppies than those born before WWII. Didn't last long, though.

I listened to Red for several days while visiting in St. Louis. I'd call it a valiant attempt, but somehow it just didn't click. I'm no programmer, but just as an observer who is musically adventurous, the song combinations seemed awkward to me. To further the problem, they played a lot of stuff I'd never heard of. I'm not saying it wasn't good music, but it was not familiar music.

I think Catfish Jim summed it up fairly well when he commented something to the effect of "Stick with the stuff they know."
 
Personally i prefer Jack Bishop. I once called in up about two years ago and ask if he played his own music he said yes. I think He had a better mix than anyone on the station. The new guy's selection is awful but then again i bet he's being told what to play by some corporate consultant wanting to go more "Oldies".

What a shame. We already have an "Oldies" station and it's on FM!
 
MarvinMiles said:
Personally i prefer Jack Bishop. I once called in up about two years ago and ask if he played his own music he said yes. I think He had a better mix than anyone on the station. The new guy's selection is awful but then again i bet he's being told what to play by some corporate consultant wanting to go more "Oldies".

What a shame. We already have an "Oldies" station and it's on FM!

And we temporarily have another oldies station on AM 1160, and I really like their presentation...no commercials ;D.

I liked Jack Bishop too.
 
Some good friends told me to check out the kind words said about me. Thank you one and all .
Jack Bishop formerly of KAAM
 
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